Krishna Prem on UK Positive TV

Relationship is a Verb

I met Marcia on the hippie trail in the early 70′s, beginning in Venice, California. We traveled together to India on two one-way tickets as we didn’t have enough money between us to buy two round trip tickets… it was simply two one-way tickets to ride, or no way out… in any case, we were living on love. Our first home together in Mother India was under a cashew tree in Arambol, a then virgin beach in Goa, (remember I am talking the 70′s here), before heading north to the Himalayas. Right smack in the middle of the trail, we met Osho and our lives changed forever. Meeting Osho was a happy beginning for me, and equally an unhappy ending of my relationship with Marcia, now Krishna Priya. My gut told me that my relationship was in trouble. I went to Osho to get to the heart of the matter…

I booked a leaving darshan with Osho to say goodbye to him as my plan was to make a complete circle by returning to California to open a commune based on his meditations… Krishna Priya choosing to stay behind until my dream came true – then she would join me. Osho agreed with Krishna Priya, while I simply wasn’t sure which way was up… In front of a burning candle I rehearsed my questions to Osho on what I was going to ask about my relationship until all that was left of me was a wax wave on my wooden floor.

I hadn’t been apart from my beloved for two years and I was nervous about being without her. I wanted to ask Osho whether I could trust that she’d come and follow me to California… could I be sure that she wouldn’t fall in love with someone else? I was simply beside myself… by now I was even jealous of Osho as I was no longer the most important man in my woman’s life…

Darshan in 1975 was in Lao Tzu House on the front car porch. Ten of us were scheduled to sit with him one to one and I was going to be number ten.

It felt like an eternity before it was my turn. Finally he looked at the boy in the ninth position and his eyes were so big, they overflowed onto me and I thought he was gesturing me to come forward. So eagerly I got up. Of course it wasn’t my turn and he told me to have patience and I promptly sat down again.

I was so embarrassed I nearly died.

The ninth boy came to sit in front of Osho and as soon as he sat down, he began to cry. And he wouldn’t stop crying and Osho waited, and finally Osho broke the silence and said to him,

“What seems to be the problem?”

And the boy related this story: “I bought a brand new pair of sandals today and when I got out of Kundalini Meditation at five-fifteen, my sandals were gone!”

And then he burst into tears again.

Osho closed his eyes and when the boy stopped crying, Osho opened his eyes again and he said to the young boy, “I can’t help you with your loss, but what I can suggest is that tomorrow you go MG Road and you buy another new pair of sandals, and when you go to Kundalini Meditation, you take one new sandal off and you put it on the top middle shelf and you take the other new sandal and you put it on the bottom shelf on the far left.” And then he added: “No one ever steals one sandal!”

And then the boy’s tears turned into laughter, and it looked to me like Osho was very proud of himself. He was just beaming with the biggest smile you’ve ever seen in your life. Everyone else was laughing.

And then Osho reached out and held the boy’s hands, they stood up at the same time and, as if music began playing, Osho did a tiny dance with the boy, and then, still beaming, gave a Namaste salutation to his beloveds and walked out, and that was the end of darshan.

I felt like a sannyasin left out in the cold.

And to this day, I don’t know anything about relationship! So you my friend are on your own… I still don’t know anything about relationships except I have learned the hard way that relationship is a verb called relating.

I did, however, found the Geetam Sannyas Ashram in Lucerne Valley, California, for Osho in ‘75, which turned out to become the biggest meditation centre in the States, and my now ex-girlfriend never stepped onto the property once. It goes to show you never can tell… meditation, like love, is not what you think.

And just to point out that ‘not knowing is the most intimate’, Positive TV out of England has invited me to share my knowledge of relationship with its viewers… please feel free me check out on http://positivetv.tv/category/channels/celebrity-shorts/

“Attachment and love never go together; commitment and attachment never go together. Love goes with unattachment. Then love has a purity of the other world. Then love is absolute essence, absolute pureness, innocence. And then there is a commitment. That commitment is eternal.” Osho

Krishna Prem

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339 Responses to Krishna Prem on UK Positive TV

  1. Lokesh says:

    Ah yes, a bit of nostalgia for the old folks. Oh arr, I can remember KP back then, even though my memory ain’t what it used to be. He used to have hair back then. Yes, yes, Iknow it’s hard to believe, but it is true.

  2. shantam prem says:

    Is this the same Krishna Prem of GURU ( gee you are you) website?

  3. Anand says:

    yes Shantam Prem

  4. shantam prem says:

    “Attachment and love never go together; commitment and attachment never go together. Love goes with unattachment. Then love has a purity of the other world. Then love is absolute essence, absolute pureness, innocence. And then there is a commitment. That commitment is eternal.” Osho

    Osho Encyclopedia is full with such far out quotaions.
    Let us face the reality and think about how many of us have voyeged to this eternal commitment, how much we, as a group have helped the relating scene getting more profound and refined.

    “I will be known through my sannyasins”- Osho

  5. sw prem martyn says:

    hello everybody

    i just want to say that synchronicity is getting a bit weird these days…see my last posting on the previous mahabrata posting.. the city of Osh is in flames in Kirgistan ! woops ..oh dear..

    anyway about this relationship stuff..
    There’s nothing higher plane about this form of tralala attachment commitment stuff… its a simple case of negotiated territory…soet your intent and stop the heavy duty complications with added spiritual ‘openness’ ( it wont work if you try to be a good faithful obedient open sannyassin.. in fact the ‘openness’ is guaranteed to fail… )

    unfortunately in therapy it has been given all kinds of wanky investments and arm twisting.. so u end up being ideological instead of straightforward….

    i’m sure Osh meant well, but his methodology was india bullock cart….
    these days people are doing all sorts of swinging ,dating, three way ,s/m, multiple , commitment ,, mating dating that the only benefit of an Osh commune is that its likely to be veggy-hippy soft vibes instead of club disco alcoholised sex… as most western youth experience… but judging by stories told to me by todays youth….this stuff about ‘belonging’ or not …is just being too precious about getting your end away on a weekend ….

    and so i dont sponsor the we really went for it nostalgia.. mostly is was pretty superficial but painful low quality interactions.. that could have done with more than… ooo i’d better do a dynamic then seeing as there’s a problem ..(bhagwans hogwash)…

    and as Osh never was in relationship , then he wouldnt really be able to negotiate the territory effectively either….
    but i loved his eyes and thats why we said yes ok , i’ll give it a try…

    but it needed more than that, and something that you couldnt buy off the shelf in an asram…

    frankly relationships, the better ones, have been my bread and butter and i would recommend giving up all the shenanigans in a commune in favour of a bonded faithful and friendly long term one….the growthful part-time insane ones were just that…. indulgent and often malicious nonsense…
    cheers
    m

  6. sw prem martyn says:

    ## note, 7th line spelling mistake>
    ..set your intent..

  7. Sw prem martyn says:

    ” the person who is in love with their vision of community will destroy community. But the person who loves the people around them will create community everywhere they go.” – Dietrich Bonhoeffer

  8. Alok john says:

    Lovely story, KP. I am gonna watch your video now. We could do with more stories like that on sannyas news!

  9. shantam prem says:

    Martyn, by adding Dietrich Bonhoeffer´s words into , you have increased the net value of this thread.

    Any kind of Church or Bodh Matth or the ashram does not give a fashionable image but their continuity for thousands of years have also given the platform to many souls to play a game changing role.

  10. Sw prem martyn says:

    thanks sp….

    i’m just being myself….(whatever that is :) )

    and i get my inspiration from many different hearts which i also try to pass on ….

    i guess i see myself as being someone who wants to tell it like it ( sannyas.)..is after all these years….maybe something useful for others too….

    I’m no christian in disguise sp.. i am all you assume me to be…but bonhoeffers quote is so succinct in the context of taking your best and giving it appropriately……the idea that we had to be opened (and ‘open’ ran through all of 70′s 80′s asram stuff and often still pops up.)….and without wanting to throwi the baby out with the bath water it is a load of aspirational greedy tosh….

    nobody in the asram ever suffered for anyone elses desire it was not self sacrificing and yet we often talk as if just by being 200 ft from a master we were of great sacrificing service to humanity,,we suffered hah !
    ..we suffered purely because we are human and lost…nothing particularly unique or seeker about that….
    just by being honest about our experimentation helps to remove that candle incense hushed expectant silence bollox that was the backdrop to trying to find love….but it doesnt mean robes candles and beatific behaviour was honest….just clubby…..

    and that doesnt deny osho’s existent energy anything

    its just that….. i’m just not collusional….(it means strategically conspiratorial) because i dont believe or want something by sellotaping my mouth and importantly that involves the human need for love…(relating and this thread)….
    never mind according to Osho that we are all humming birds on the lifeboat of existence and living in pure bliss…..thanks osho but i’ll run my own affairs….according to my needs openly and without coercion… but definitely according to my needs not the bumble bee on the flower type stuff which makes for the ooooo im more open than you shit.. i’ll just use you then…. and yes That ran the Asram for Years and Years…it wasnt surrender .. it was submission…

    cheers osh it was a great ride and might still be…i’m still experimenting..but i dont have a vocabulary to sponsor collective behaviour….but occassionally the inspirations still flow through ..especially though music…soulful intelligent lyrical music…. after that then talk of this attachment non attachment relating stuff is just like sitting in a californian jacuzzi….very bubbly but eventually you have to get out…

    cheers
    m

  11. shantam prem says:

    “and i get my inspiration from many different hearts which i also try to pass on ….”

    If this spread like the I Pad, world will be bit more spicy and juicy.
    Bible readers getting inspiration from Geeta, Geeta readers from Kuran and what a day it will be when Kuran readers get inspiration from Buddhist texts!

  12. sw prem martyn says:

    where’s that list of funky places around the world to visit thru the summer which I asked for…..

    theres the angsbacka festival in sweden which is good for a groupie experience…. and i see that the Osho Gujarat centre near ahmedabad is growing …i cant recommend any UK places… but Tantra seems to have gone ballistic in europe and there’s loads of self realized individuals popping up where one can meet other selfish bastards like oneself to indulge a bit of existential potholing
    ok actually Mooji ….is very pleasant..and refreshing ..nice guy ..recommend catching him live on the internet..and lives in brixton london)….

    any favourite hangouts from sanny ass ins?

  13. Lokesh says:

    Sw Prem Martyn, some funny and observant comments. Try Ibiza, north end of the island, Tribal drums on Sundays at Benarres Beach is always good for a bit of shake your international booty with a bit of crusty Spanish vibes tossed into the bay’s crystal clear waters, as the sun goes down like a big red head. I rarely attend myself. I prefer smaller events.

  14. shantam prem says:

    any favourite hangouts from (Sannyasins) sanny ass ins?

    I think the other sannyas website sannyasworld.com is a notice board for hangouts; 5 days “Neo Dynamic” medittaion event at New York, 3 days “fuck, forget & God” in London.
    and where is the Auervedic Massge with Aura Soma oils, without this the summer holidays are not complete.

  15. shantam prem says:

    I also remember for centuries in India and many other countries, women were walking 30, 40 Kms.to fetch few buckets of water and a bundle of sticks.
    It was not a weekly event but everyday.

    With British Raj came water taps also. One in every quarter of the city than slowly slowly in every house.
    Villages are getting this facility now.

    When one has to travel by air to reach some sannyas hangout to have few casual hugs and a possibility of a date, does not show a growing and prospering movement.
    It is like a Draught situation when for lough of bread one stays in a queue for hours.

    This is the reason my continuous reminder about a strong, popular and continuously growing Poona Ashram.
    The strong roots can create the possibility of a shady tree whose branches are in every city.
    When a tree is called Buddhafield, than branches radiate that Jasmin fragrance too.

  16. Satya Deva says:

    Problem is, Shantam, it’s unlikely to be a genuine ‘Buddhafield’ without the living presence of a ‘Buddha’.

    And you say:
    When one has to travel by air to reach some sannyas hangout to have few casual hugs and a possibility of a date, does not show a growing and prospering movement.

    Is that your actual motive: sex, and as many opportunities for it as possible? Ok, In a nice, spiritual package, with a variety of meditations to while away the recovery time – fair enough.

    But frankly, I always thought that you Indians were focused on higher things. I’m shocked to my very core.

  17. shantam prem says:

    The point raised by you was lurking in the air for a long time and let us clear it in the environment of friendliness.
    I am not writing here as an Indian but as a Sannyasin, who truly believes it was his higher calling to be an Osho Sannyasin.
    And the dating scene around meditation is one of the USP of Osho. If few people feel guilty and shamed and shocked to see the feathers of the peacock, they can change the scenery at the Zoo and look at Donkey or Monkey.
    And my yard stick is that if meditation and prayer does not lead oneself to the level of inner honesty, it is better to go for fitness in the gym.

    it’s unlikely to be a genuine ‘Buddhafield’ without the living presence of a ‘Buddha’.

    So from where one gets the Buddhas, one in Brighton, another in Boston and next one in Bhopal at the site of Union Carbide.

    Have you not seen that “Buddha” of one person is a “Buddhu” for another dozens.
    (Buddha and Buddhu come from the same linguistic roots, May be the awakened one and the awkward one have also the same father.

    So the ways and definition can be taken in the most fluid form. People who have been at the feet of the Buddha can create the Buddhafield.
    And to be at the feet means being their without the contraceptive shields around.

  18. shantam prem says:

    A new Buddhafield has taken the life and is kicking around-

    http://shangrila.sannyas-on.net/information.php

    Nature Holidays Relaxation
    Osho Shangri La Meditation Center is situated in a wild, hilly area close to the romantic spa towns of Marienbad and Karlsbad, just 50 km from the German border, 100 km to the West of Prague. The old farm house was renovated beautifully with lots of love, and a huge garden full of fruit trees surrounds the house and offers plenty of space for relaxing in nature. An outdoor sauna is available for the wellness of our guests. Huge forests and lakes are an invitation for every outdoor fan, in all the seasons of the year. Friendly guest rooms are available, and camping in the huge garden is possible in summer.

    Trainings Groups Individual Sessions
    You are welcome to participate in the group programs or enjoy our wide range of individual sessions, all offered by experienced therapists, who are working in Osho´s Buddhafield for many years, adding a new dimension to therapy. The beauty of the surrounding and the silence of Osho Shangri La provide a perfect space for group participants, and a wild and largely untouched nature around adds another quality of healing to our programs.

    Meditation Life in the Buddhafield
    Osho´s Meditations are the framework of daily life in Osho Shangri La. You are welcome to just relax and meditate here as well as to join the activities of the crew, i.e. cooking, gardening, etc, living and working and meditating together, creating, and living in what Osho calls the energy of the Buddhafield. An energy which is a tremendous support for each person on his way of personal growth.

  19. shantam prem says:

    SD- But frankly, I always thought that you Indians were focused on higher things. I’m shocked to my very core.

    Now SP as an Indian-
    Satya Deva, when you were in India last time?
    I must touch the feet of the foot soldiers of the Queen, the beloved wife of Philips radio for leaving behind English language and democracy in India.
    These two things have changed the moral fibre of India. It care for higher things but does not shun away any more from carnal delights.
    Because democracy was an borrowd idea imposed on the feudal lords, India may not have the Paul Raymond and Color Climax publications on the upper shelves of the shops because of many dumbs and fools in the public life.
    But thanks to the net, revolution is taking shape, you may see many Brown asses living in UK and USA wide spread on the desi sites.These chicks are giving back eye candies to the mother land!

    India of Now is living the vision of Osho, whereas sun is setting on these shores, the continemt i call my adopted home.

  20. Sw prem martyn says:

    Shangri la is in a very lovely place….

    I lived in CZ recently…and the maitreya restaurant / centre in Prague has really taken off in just two years….

    Zahira is coming over from new zealand in 7 days in Prague to do the sufi program she does so well

    shantam are you an indulgent carnivore militarist still …and which part of you is a sannyassin… could you tell me so that we can sponsor each others lifestyle?

    the sitting in front of videos and deciding that you need western military protection/authority structures/the education system that sponsors it and your indian convoluted metaphors that induce hypnosis may not be appropriate for me?…

    I offer excellent vegan dinners plus some natural theatre of everyday life in exchange?

    Ps if you want a lively approach to rebellion i recommend reading the views and approach of ex pres Vaclav Havel.he wanted Frank Zappa to be minister of culture and originally all the presidential guard had suits designed by Phillippe Starck in Purple and yellow.. which were so funny to see that the ‘guard was embarrassed to go on parade……

    and…bhagat is an excellent NLP tutor.

    kisses

  21. Chinmaya says:

    Dear Prem Martyn,

    You have a very good grip on English language to write and express in this thread, but to be very frank, as Osho says always, Sanyas, Sanyasin, Love, God, Enlightenment and living with awareness for the sake of living truthfully and tastfully with taste of inside has no relevance with difficult language.

    God is very simple and it is very easy to walk on and for higher peak of consciousness. God needs no language or cleverness but needs love, simplicity and surrender. Surrender in full without any but s and if s.

    Osho always speaks on the basis of his experience and not with borrowed knowledge, for the sake of impressing to the educated class. Educated class means, the people with many educational qualifications, leading to Doctorate etc. For such people, enlightenment is an ardous job and difficult to understand the easy pattern with more spending of time, to go inside, whereas the contemporaries are teaching so much bullshit. They make so much fuss for nothing but so-called educated class feels pleasure with refined language from such faque Guru with an inaccesible path to walk.

    Good luck in your mission……Aparently Osho looks Royal with diamond studded Hats and Caps with World Class clads but from inside he is very simple and enlightened, believe me.

  22. Kartar says:

    For centuries, Hindu women have worn a dot on their foreheads.

    Most of us have naively thought this was connected with tradition or religion, but the Indian Embassy somewhere has recently revealed the true story.

    When a Hindu woman gets married, she brings a dowry into the union.

    On her wedding night, the husband scratches off the dot to see whether he’s won a convenience store, a gas station, a donut shop, a taxi cab or a motel in America.

    If nothing is there, he must remain in India to answer telephones and provide us with technical support.

  23. Kartar says:

    I want to live my next life backwards:

    You start out dead and get that out of the way.

    Then you wake up in an old age home feeling better every day.

    Then you get kicked out for being too healthy.

    Enjoy your retirement and collect your pension.

    Then when you start work, you get a gold watch on your first day.

    You work 40 years until you’re too young to work.

    You get ready for secondary school: drink alcohol, party, and are generally promiscuous.

    Then you go to primary school, you become a kid, you play, and you have no responsibilities.

    Then you become a baby, and then…

    You spend your last 9 months floating peacefully in luxury, in spa-like conditions – central heating, room service on tap, and then…

    You finish off as an orgasm.

  24. Sw prem martyn says:

    chinmaya

    ..’you have buried me with faint praise ‘

    ..Oscar Wilde… english writer/poet 19 th century…..

    Chinmaya……but i’m not asking you to do anything other than what you do….

    i’m just pointing out. questions and my own answers for my own enjoyment…sitting by my laptop in the comfort of my own lazy self indulgence….

    i dont suppose anyone else is doing the same with more love out there? am i missing ?
    ps
    i’d make a lousy doctor, a crap nurse, a useless farmer, an awful meditator, a stupid sannyassin, a shit lover, a tired therapist, a disenchanted seeker…

    i really have nothing much more than my typing left….
    lucky i dont have cancer….or life would be really shit…

    still, talking about sannyas gives my little heart some feeble joys…

    Chinmaya …. you do great in unprovoked analysis….maybe if you studied you could get a dilpoma and … oh no… you just want to love osho….

    which makes me very…(sniff) go all wobbly inside…
    lets light a candle together….

    shit i caught some lousy perceptive dislocating flu bug and i feel realllly bad about using my insight at random….anyway i’ll just stop being a sannyassin….
    (but how do i do that ? helppppppppp)

    kisses ( and i dont need or want you to love me back…you are freeeeeeeeeeeeee…….non attached and er like a bumble bee…..)

    if you were a woman though things might be different…

    Chinmaya you write very well and have no problem being passive offensive either…so feel good that your intellect is working overtime.. it may not create unity… but who gives a shit.. you will when you need to…maybe in another context you’d risk your life for someone….
    here its just virtual…remember that…

    love

  25. Chinmaya says:

    Martyn Sw Prem

    Simply you are great. Love….and hugs………Yahooooooo

  26. Sw prem martyn says:

    i have just been browsing the osho business sites..oops i mean centres of personal development where they give you money and you give your experience..ooops damn er no the centres of holistic transformation where they make money from other people selling their transformation to other people who sell their transformation to people who seek to transform the transformation in case they hadn’t transformed much..

    actulally i just realised that i have lived a pointless loveless needy non essencey life….and judging by a tendency to be incapable of paying anyone to transform myself ..i guess it was all a bit pointless….

    i blame the dinosaurs….how could they do this to me after trillions of years of evolution… to leave me untransformed.damn damn damn damn

    maybe if i played darts on friday nights i could reduce the horror of untransformation….

    :)

  27. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem

    SD- But frankly, I always thought that you Indians were focused on higher things. I’m shocked to my very core.

    Now SP as an Indian-
    Satya Deva, when you were in India last time?
    I must touch the feet of the foot soldiers of the Queen, the beloved wife of Philips radio for leaving behind English language and democracy in India.
    These two things have changed the moral fibre of India. It care for higher things but does not shun away any more from carnal delights.
    Because democracy was an borrowd idea imposed on the feudal lords, India may not have the Paul Raymond and Color Climax publications on the upper shelves of the shops because of many dumbs and fools in the public life.
    But thanks to the net, revolution is taking shape, you may see many Brown asses living in UK and USA wide spread on the desi sites.These chicks are giving back eye candies to the mother land!

    India of Now is living the vision of Osho, whereas sun is setting on these shores, the continemt i call my adopted home.

    SD:
    Ok then, SP, why not simply declare, “The East is going – or has already gone – West”?

    And you do realise what that means, don’t you?!

  28. Satya Deva says:

    Btw, SP< I’m not sure if you caught the irony in my second last post above?

  29. Satya Deva says:

    Lastly, SP:

    I absolutely disagree that a ‘Buddhafield’ is possible in the absence of a living ‘Buddha’.

    An approximation, yes, something that might look like one, with similar stuff going on, but in essence I’d say no, it would be a delusion.

    Whether or not ‘experienced disciples’ are there or not.

    I wouldn’t necessarily trust those guys further than I could throw them.

    Neither would (or do) you, from all your bitter criticism of the current ashram hierarchy….

  30. Satya Deva says:

    Appreciation, Kartar, for those two posts – good stuff, keep it coming!

  31. shantam prem says:

    When one looks at the reality, Satya Deva, you seem to be right. Oshofield without Osho is almost like a Coca Cola without gas.
    But If we remember and feel, “Thinking impossible before Breakfast”, Oshofield without Osho is a possibilty at least in Pune.

    How it can be?

    Someone like “us” people need to be at the helm of the affairs.
    AMrito and Jayesh kind of people were never part of human race, they seem to be more royal than royals himself.
    An Italian woman Mrs. Sonia Gandhi has her fingers on the pulse of 1.2 billion people´s psychology in India, the people at the steering wheel of a small organisation are lacking this gut connection.

    So i will agree with you fully and totally if i see another generation of managers failing as the first one.
    Till than i will have the faith that once again spring can come at 17, koregaon Park.
    The two three people cannot simply take the glory away from the experiment hundred thousands have put their life into.

  32. shantam prem says:

    SD, let me accept your thesis that Buddhafield exists only with Buddhas.
    So where such Buddhafield is existing in your opinion at this time of the year?
    And are you spending your time, money and energy there?

  33. shantam prem says:

    As SD has shown the appreciation, the 2 posts of Kartar are what they say at CNN, Play of the day*

  34. Sw prem martyn says:

    are six men enough to create a thriving virtual commune……..who’s on wash up after dinner ??

    and the tantra has been cancelled this weekend
    (we’ll have to manage on our own as usual )

  35. Kartar says:

    Awe shucks Satya Deva thanks. Did you know Sannyasnews has a worldwide rank of 2,896,504. The Monthly users on this site are 662 or 22 per day. That relates to this site being in pergatory. Then again someone is bound to get noticed by the few when posting.

    Why do farts stink?
    So deaf people can enjoy them too.

  36. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem

    SD, let me accept your thesis that Buddhafield exists only with Buddhas.
    So where such Buddhafield is existing in your opinion at this time of the year?
    And are you spending your time, money and energy there?

    SD:
    I’m not looking to be part of a spiritual group and the only living ‘Masters’ I’m attracted to at present are both female and both Indian.

    You must have heard of them: Mother Meera (in Germany) and Amritanandamayi (‘Amma’) (based in Kerala, but does a lengthy annual ‘world tour’.

    I’ve received much from both, especially MM. Not through their words, and certainly not from any ‘interpretations’ by their devotees, but through contact with their extraordinary purity of being.

  37. Sw prem martyn says:

    Sw prem martyn..a profile without smarmy photo….

    Trained originally in taking people for a ride with a Phd in psychology and you must be kidding (cambridge). He developed extra sensory perceptionin Poona Oregon and Disney Land and an ability to help people who really didn’t need it. Training in lots of institutes in the art of smiling or not smiling at appropriate moments .Developing group skills in turning up on time and orchestrating various emotions including happy ,sad, not that happy, bored ,sleepy vaguely amused and smarmyarsed and focussing on people skills including talking and listening but not at the same time.. (thats talking but with more volume)

    .Making sure that he got noticed in the 1990′s by breathing noisily and shouting arggghh in the intensive post doctorate i’m alive program of the neo lightzentruth institute (albania)

    Currently running workshops in ‘being more self important and unable to be ironic at all about therapy despite it being a profitable personal business.and having a complete lack of interest in providing any thing less than middle class aspirations for the deluded groupies though it looks good on paper ‘Neo osho therapist world tour.

    Hobbies :
    Watching telly
    Reading the instructions on Aeroplane safety manuals.
    World Peace

  38. Sw prem martyn says:

    ….
    he experienced a profound change in his life when he self realised …that he was overdrawn at the bank…..

  39. shantam prem says:

    Heartly thanks Satya Deva for sharing the names of two living Masters of your choice.

    With due respect to you and all the Living Masters, i want to make one point clear from my heart.

    I may be one of the harshest critique of Amrito and Jayesh, but it is because i love them as fellow travelers, as senior disciples of our common Master.

    My criticism is because i wish not to ignore them, otherwise i know as much about “Living Masters” as i know about Lindsy Lohan or Victoria Posh. Will i go to see them by buying ticket or free.
    Does not look like.
    Meditating, loving and managing conflict with my Dead Master´s people is part of my disciple hood.

  40. Chinmaya says:

    Dear Shantam,

    The body of the Master is dead, since it is perishable, after its use but Master is never dead, if He is really a Master and our Master Osho is never dead, hence, please make it clear as disciple of Osho.

    Love

  41. Kartar says:

    Deer Sannyarsnews,

    I waunt to apply for the editing job what I saw in the paper. I can Type real quik wit one finggar and do sum a counting.

    I think I am good on the phone and no I am a pepole person, Pepole really seam to respond to me belly well.

    I?m lookin for a Jobb as a editor for yor site but it musent be to complicaited.

    I no my spelling is not to good but find that I Offen can get a job thru my persinalety. My salerery is open so we can discus wat you want to pay me and wat you think that I am werth, I can start imeditely. Thank you in advanse fore yore anser. .

    hopifuly Yore best aplicant so farr.

    Sinseerly,
    luvin deecyple of Osho

  42. shantam prem says:

    Chinmaya,
    I am agnostic on this point, How Master survives after His Body, whether His soul merges with the PARMATMA or rests on the tower of Vodafone.

    Though i will say as a Panjabi Indian who has seen “The Living Master(s)” and their Satsangs happening in every city, every village; i am contented with “The dead Master(s)” and count it as enough blessings to be in Buddha Hall, when Osho was living and when he died.( I am also tired from this poetical expression, Leaving the Body)

  43. Chinmaya says:

    Ok, fine, PARMATMA bless you with your contentment.

    Oh dear Shantam

  44. sw prem martyn says:

    Dear Krater..

    Thank you for your recent implication.
    As well as being a copy writer, can you feel and share at the same time as typing? This is an important part of our vision. Have you any other talents? For example
    there are some very experienced therapists out there in Sannyas land who just by suggestion can remove large amounts of money from unsuspecting fellow sannyassins to help them open to the feeling.The feeling of being taken for a long ride of inadequacy over many years.Have you been to the therapy theme park , where everything is marvellous?Some of the typing here sponsors our project ‘Help a starving orphan therapist get on more aeroplanes across the world’.Do you think you could help raise funds for this very worthy project where after some groups we put therapists on planes at our own expense to stop them from being overhugged?
    We encourage our readers to think for themselves too which is unlikely to happen anywhere near a therapist as they never offer a money back guarantee.
    I understand that you may well be intersted in building a community of genuine exchange and an inspiring alternative to the the daily grind of exploiting others doubts and imagined insufficiencies for money.loads of it.So you wont be going any where a sannyas centre soon then?
    It seems you are a genuine kind of a guy which is unlikely to be any value at all in the world of sannyas… still if you keep typing and hugging you wont miss the high levels of spiritual adrenaline released when you pay to keep someone elses lifestyle afloat in the name of community building.

    I heard Osho say once you already have all the love you need whatever and whoever you are to see you through the mess we call life.

    Love and Good luck.

    a finder not a seeker….

  45. Sw prem martyn says:

    spot the spoliing mistooks above and win yourself a residential no expenses paid, retreat and surrender.

  46. Sadhu says:

    This is really so strange, people who are in asharam long time (Some in management) are so insensitive, what has happent to thesae people, they are listening Osho, once in a while they go for meditaion…still…WHY…why they are so cruel…??? WHY??? this is so strange…few peole are in asharam sicne 1975 but still they can not leave asharm, but yes thye try there best to kicked out others…WHY????? And strange enough, I have seen many people who dont know at all Osho, but more loving, caring, sensative….this is really stragne why Osho’s people are so diffrent…I wonder for these people Osho used to say…”My people are only hope for this humanity.’

  47. Kartar says:

    martyn yah kuka wa….yin yang wong ..we sing wong song far too long ! kim tea li gi chi ! dat chinese for muzzletov..you always welcome at my place. ii ii weee have sacrifice last week ! no more speeding tickets ….tee hee….disa country town where i live u know . i tink as a special treat to da members of dis gloop ….dose interested should get a free copy of your marvelous book dont you ? after all u using da gloop to express yourself! fleeeeedom unt lotsa love especially u.

  48. Sw prem martyn says:

    Dear Kartar

    I looky nice place fo yu. I looky yu findy. Nice place see big Osho man..oh yes galantee.. Mr Osho inside .. no-one see him long time but he inside.. Yu pay me ..me velly special plice.. best offa .. Yu looky yu… find Mr osho inside .. yes but fist yu payyee…me… yes he inside yu but yu payee me..
    What yu no undestand… He inside Yu go inside yu find but fierst yu paye me.. Big time lotsa dolla… Yes Me Swami Bourgeois lickarse…. okayy yu no likey black lobe .. so wattttttt! Hey come back best plice yu tell me .. Hey We frens we both looking seekin.. I looking yu money .. !!HE Heeee heee

  49. Kartar says:

    ahrr nahrr first have to get my detective from Fiji! da seaklet to life everlasting iza Tomatoes for bleakfast lunch. u eata many tomies as u like ! slavery vely much alive today unt many many people are slavers ! de oder ting i want to bling up is
    da atrocious spelling on dis site .

  50. Sw prem martyn says:

    …if yu eat tomatoes so much .. yu bring up everyting….
    me gotaa go go… me go lukin fo my frely luving yu fo money terapissed….
    ave a nice die…

  51. Kartar says:

    Take care Swami….

  52. shantam prem says:

    Osho used to say…”My people are only hope for this humanity.’
    Once this sentence was selling like a share of a blue chip company.
    After the founder´s departure, Microsoft of inner world fell like a “Bear Stearns”. WHo buys Osho share now even at the price of peanuts.
    It seems Even in the spiritual world, what goes up sometimes comes down, and if the company is big, the sound of the fall is louder and clearer.

    As a positive note i have heard that in the Ashram, at the place of book store, a new office for Inner Circle will be opened and it will be encouraged that sannyasins go in and share their views.

    I think if it hapens, it will be a first step towrads restoration.

    On the other side, people who don´t know what is happening in the real world, rely upon the expert opinion of Boss´s buddies from New York.
    Few even suggested that resort should advertise in the planes to attract business travelers.

    Same way, many suggestions were propagted how to make Osho Times more common man friendly. Photo of Osho on the cover repulses people, so let us put flowers, rivers, pent up girls.
    Did it help?
    Yes, it helped magazine to die faster than it was thought.

  53. sw prem martyn says:

    sannyassins own the fucking commune…. generations have invested money for what??? a hierarchy run piece of shithole with a non-community non accountable non mutual non commune fucking mortuary … bury the fucking place under rubble..!!

  54. shantam prem says:

    “Sannyasins own the fucking commune”, Martyn, Can you send this as a public interest e mail to your follow country man Dr. Amrito.
    Your British voice will have more weightage.

  55. Chinmaya says:

    Martyn can use such type of language by writing in this thread only and enjoy, to write and face directly to the principal party is not easy. God bless.

  56. shantam prem says:

    I think it will be easy. Informal street language has more raw energy and innocence than the diplomatic and Parliamentarian language and protocol.

    And also we must keep in mind that modern day disciples can not have a wall between a congregation and the holy Papst.

    As Osho was saying many times that in this age it is very much possible that students know better than the professor.

  57. Sw prem martyn says:

    chinmaya you are precise and ‘sort of’ correct in what you say….i havent sent this as an email to amrito….i only met him once at ko hsuan school 12 years ago and i avoided having a group dinner with him not out of malice but that i had nothing to say to him over dinner….and i still dont because i dont need pune in my life…

    although i would say it to him if i wanted something

    and i havent been to Pune since ’96 either

  58. Sw prem martyn says:

    the above was also to you SP too…..i’m not avoiding u !

  59. Chinmaya says:

    Dear Sadhu,

    It seems to be their Love or attachment of Osho and Ashram. They want to get back, perhaps, to what they had done, by spending their youth. Others are not making appropriate efforts to take over, simply crying sitting outside.

    It is their insecurity in old age of the body, may be from inside, they know Osho faaaar above others. They are not insenstive but senstive but this senstive-ness is to their ailing body.

    Old age mind is very clever. They do not kick others to get out, but they create such a situation, by virtue of high entry fee, high cost of food/kitchen, which makes others to be off, from the scene themselves.

    Oh God, please take care of them too.

    There is a great need of hearing Osho, instead litening, there is a great difference between listening and hearing.

  60. Satya Deva says:

    On the other hand, it’s possible – or at least worth considering – that they recognise the truth (if it is the truth) of the situation:

    That the past, however great, is not worth clinging on to, and that the last thing required would be to attempt that, with the inevitable result of encouraging a vastly inferior version of that past, contaminated by the sentimental attachment of ‘devotees’, with all their various motivations and agendas.

    After all, Osho did warn that “the gates will not be open for ever”….
    .

  61. Satya Deva says:

    On the other hand, it’s perhaps worth considering that these people might be standing firm against a sentimental attachment to the past – however great that past – that, driven by various motivations and agendas (however well-meaning) would inevitably tend to create an inferior version of that longing.

    One of these agendas being to create a kind of ‘new religion’.

    Another being ‘as much free sex as possible – with thousands to choose from’, ie a sort of ‘walk-in dating agency’…

    After all, didn’t Osho firmly declare, “Know well the gates of the temple will not be open for ever”?

    Hard, very hard, to take – but who said the way of truth was necessarily easy?

  62. shantam prem says:

    You have concluded very nicely and wisely in your post
    that these people might be standing firm against a sentimental attachment to the past – however great that past(may be).
    It is very true and this is basically a good hearted intention from Jayesh Amrito due, who psychologically represent the upper class white ethos of our time.
    But than this is exactly the same as American hegemony, it breeds more resistance than harmony.

    In the context of Osho, simple thing is to follow the spoken and visually visible imprints of Osho.
    Osho has chalked out the path for his disciples and therefore senior most disciples should have resisted their good intentions. Imposing one´s own values over the others is an act of violence.

    As far as i know, last new religion was created in 1699 by the last Sikh Master. How Osho´s movement will take the shape in the future is unpredictable. He is too big and influential Master of His time, not one of those ice cream sellers who go from suburb to suburb and once they retire or die, someone else replace them in no time.

  63. THE NEW FREE OSHO COMMUNE
    “ with the blessings of our beloved master osho “
    announcing a new celebration

    OSHO COCOM
    osho co-owned commune

    we have acquired 45 acres forest land with river
    in south goa india
    to create an oasis of love
    for meditation and inner science of transformation

    we are creating zen gardens and waterfalls
    for silence stillness and meditativeness
    and offering a free compassionate space
    for growth of awareness and flowering of osho vision

    THE OSHO COCOM PROJECT – 45 ACRES
    10 acres – 40 resident cottages
    4 acres – 40 room guesthouse
    4 acres – buddha hall & waterfalls
    management space / welcome center
    2 acres – mystery school / therapies / group / halls
    4 acres – massage & wholeness spa / swimming pool
    5 acres – arts & crafts village
    2 acres – martial art school
    4 acres – farming & herbal nursery
    2 acres – kitchens & bakery
    medical center / banking / internet / travel desk / laundry / osho boutique / osho book shop
    4 acres – forest sitting / walkways / running track
    4 acres – silence zone

    OSHO COCOM VISION & VALUES
    “ sangham sharanam gachchhami “
    a free space for all osho sannyasins and lovers
    freedom of expression of meditativeness
    and inner experiences
    will encourage and give wings to sannyasins to share and express their love on the path of awakening

    sannyasins and their inner growth come first
    we will strengthen sannyasins freedom of expression
    encourage and explore the values of freedom and growth for all osho sannyasins
    and all seekers of truth on the path

    a space to accept each other
    and bring people together
    to celebrate and create a buddhafield
    in a loving spirit of togetherness and oneness

    we accept all sannyasins
    and their meditativeness and spiritual expressions
    compassion in action is real human growth
    to accept each individual as they are
    without any rejection or judgment

    we accept all spiritual beings and masters of different paths and offer them a loving humane space
    for expression of their being and their realisation
    no one can be banned from entering the osho cocom
    entry to osho cocom will be free for all
    with love and openness
    food at the osho cocom
    will be offered at affordable prices

    FREEDOM OF EXPRESSION
    freedom of the individual comes first
    we will accept the value of the majority of one

    freedom is of the highest value
    and cannot be sacrificed for any group or organization
    we will create the silent circle of friends
    where compassion and wisdom of silent sincere sannyasins will act as gentle guides

    TRANSPARENCY & ACCOUNTABILITY
    spreading osho…not selling osho !!

    earning through creativity and not through therapies
    the osho cocom will earn through
    selling creative art sculpture and handicrafts
    from the arts village the music lab and health food division and not by selling osho therapies or meditations which will be offered freely out of love

    sannyasins loving donations
    for spreading his vision will be welcomed

    all donations and funds collected will be used wisely
    for creating new osho cocoms and growth of sannyasins and for spreading osho vision to the world

    OSHO FREE INNER SCIENCE MYSTERY SCHOOL
    we are creating an inner science mystery school
    where all osho therapies are offered totally free

    the osho cocom will offer all osho groups and therapies and all osho meditations for free

    osho mystic rose
    osho born again
    osho no mind
    osho hypnosis
    osho self hypnosis
    osho painting group
    osho breath
    osho prana healing
    osho primal
    osho tantra
    path of love
    men’s liberation
    women’s liberation
    osho work as meditation
    osho talking to your body mind

    OSHO FREE INNER SCIENCE TRAINING
    osho cocom will offer for free
    all osho therapists and group leader training
    osho bodywork and massage training courses
    and other osho inner science training courses

    OSHO MEDITATION / MONTHLY MEDITATION CAMPS
    offer various core osho methods of meditation
    and transformative meditation techniques free

    OSHO DISCOURSES
    offer osho vision through his daily discourses

    OSHO NEO-SANNYAS
    offering osho sannyas celebration / sannyas name & mala / understanding sannyas as a way of life and living in the world with meditativeness and awareness

    OSHO FESTIVALS
    create osho festivals / carnivals and celebration events

    KIRTAN & SATSANG & DANCE
    expressions of the heart and kirtan dance celebrations

    WORK MEDITATION
    meditativeness in work as a meditation
    understanding meditative work in the marketplace

    OSHO BODYWORK & WHOLENESS SPA
    with a massage training center
    offer ayurveda massage and yoga
    and other healing therapies

    osho wholeness spa
    meandering swimming pools
    sauna and steam
    ayurvedic massage with kerala spa & yoga center
    thai balinese massage spa
    shiatsu acupuncture reflexology reiki aromatherapy
    swedish massage deep tissue
    rebalancing craniosacral

    OSHO ARTS & CRAFTS VILLAGE
    creative arts center
    where arts crafts and creativity are offered
    music dance singing painting sculpture calligraphy

    creative crafts village
    where various crafts are offered
    ceramic pottery wood bamboo crafts
    all creative projects and works produced
    will be sold or auctioned
    for creating wealth for the osho cocom

    OSHO MARTIAL ART SCHOOL
    where various body awareness techniques
    taichi kungfu judo aikido jujitsu
    are available for learning and training

    OSHO MUSIC LAB
    music recording studio
    to create music for meditation
    and to offer space for sannyasins to create music
    and support marketing to the world at large

    OSHO HEALTH FOOD
    to understand food diet and health
    and grow formulate and distribute health foods

    NATURE & ENVIRONMENT
    a herb and plant nursery
    experimenting with nature and learning to understand plants and herbs and various health and healing secrets

    OSHO FREE LIBRARY
    we will offer all osho video audio discourses
    all osho photo and osho art and signature library free
    osho ebooks meditation music osho songs

    for worldwide free distribution
    all you will need is your hard drive to download freely

    OSHO COCOM RESIDENTS
    45 acres in a forest location with river
    in south goa india
    15 kms from agonda beach 10 kms from canacona
    30 kms from margoa 55 kms from vasco airport
    7 kms from national highway NH17

    we have space for 40 meditation cottages
    to be built on 14 acres of the cocom
    the cottage structures will be owned by individual residents and built for them at cost price
    the land will be be owned by the osho cocom
    cottage structures can be transferred / sold to other sannyasins
    those who wish to become residents of the osho cocom; for details please
    visit http://www.oshorajneesh.net
    and facebook OSHOCOCOM

  64. Satya Deva says:

    And who, I wonder, will organise and run this project?

    Not ‘Osho Rajneesh’, that patently fraudulent character, I sincerely hope?!!

  65. development / project time :

    our 45 acre property is within a beautiful thick dense forest with trees and has a small mountain
    with a stream passing though it

    the layout and design work is in process
    modernism styling streamlined
    with a rustic natural look fused together
    zen minimal clean lines
    with an earthy balinese / thai feel of tao

    the osho cocom construction work
    begins october 2010
    we plan to complete the first 40 cottages
    some utility spaces necessary to start functioning of the cocom like kitchens and resturants and important spaces like the main buddha hall within 6 months

    spas will be in nature with enclosures balinese style with proper construction
    blending natural elements with modernism
    and a complete kerela auyervedic spa
    with sauna and steam

    the arts village will be created within the natural landscape environment
    fused with bamboo and thatched roofing thai style

    nature and natural zen spaces are our major priority
    the forest areas will be cleared from wild shrubs and landscaping started with garden spaces to be created before monsoon begins

    as there many plant nurseries with organic herbal plantations nearby our initial farming and herbal nursery will be started before monsoon

    the river on our property will be cleaned out
    and winding watercourse pathways created
    and the waterfalls will be fused together with initial layout of the meandering swiming pools and gardens
    we also plan a small hydro progect
    and solar power for electricity

    we hope to complete the project in 2 years
    but the process of creating the osho cocom
    will continue as we see it creatively
    growing space to space

    the cocom has many creative people
    sharing their ideas
    offering their participation out of their love
    and wish to see this osho cocom vision grow
    with sannyasins from india portugal germany holland spain italy mexico america japan

    this is an organic grassroot movement which is the beauty of the commune process
    we invite you to add your creative ideas to our team gathering in goa this october
    and also welcome your participation
    in the process of its development

    we have now worldwide residents from
    india mexico america england spain holland italy austria germany portugal russia ukraine korea
    and the list is growing daily !!!!

  66. Satya Deva says:

    But, Osho Rajneesh, everything I’ve heard about and seen of you tells me you are a total fraud.

    Why, for example, do you call yourself by this name?

  67. and yes…satya deva…
    judge him as much as you want…
    he is delivering…his way…
    the vision for all
    who only talk and talk…

    spreading osho…not selling osho !!!

    this free osho cocom…
    is being offered lovingly by swami rajneesh

  68. and why do you have the name satya
    which mens truth !!??

  69. Satya Deva says:

    swami rajneesh:
    this free osho cocom…
    is being offered lovingly by swami rajneesh

    SD:
    How many Swami Rajneeshes are there, please?!

    As for my name, well, maybe it implies I can spot a self-deluded fraud, even 6000 miles away….

  70. what i wrote in sannyas news
    swami rajneesh // Oct 3, 2009 at 8:56 pm

    ok…here is the truth of why the website was named
    http://www.oshorajneesh.net

    it was to provoke directly and actively oppose
    the inner circle and their claims to trademark
    and ownership of the title osho and their threats to
    shut down or remove any one who used the osho
    as a prefix or otherwise
    as you know oshoworld has won on this matter
    the name osho connects all in the world of osho
    hence the us courts also decided with a clear and reasoned judgement that everyone was free to use
    the name osho otherwise the inner circle wanted to trademark osho as a sole property and trademark
    infact i had coined the term and name oshoworld
    when i had met keerti after he left poona ashram

    i had wanted my website to be http://www.rajneesh.com
    but all such websites names were taken
    now i feel that http://www.oshorajneesh is perfect
    as i too share my dance and celebration
    my love and gratitude for my beloved master osho

    all who know me simply call me swami rajneesh
    and remember only my wesbite is oshorajneesh
    read my book with an open heart and you will find that
    i am simply a dissolved devotee of my master osho
    i share my love for each sannyasin i meet and have only tears of gratitude to offer

    you can fight me as much as you want…
    i accept defeat
    as i have already won in my love for osho

    i only fight those who oppress and try to dominate
    the freedom of sannyasins…whom i love and care for
    always simply rajneesh

  71. As for my name, well, maybe it implies I can spot a self-deluded fraud, even 6000 miles away….

    satya deva
    if you can even see as far as your nose…
    that would be a miracle !!!

  72. Prem Jashan says:

    Is this Osho sannyasnews forum or something else? When a co-traveler and Osho lover shares about an exciting project in India, all we are doing is throwing mud at him. with my personal experience I can say many people (including 21 circle) are jealous about Rajaneesh.

    What’s wrong in having same name as Osho. There are thousands of examples in India or even in the west, where people get their names from parents or grand parents. Just add Sr. or Jr. to it. I love calling some one Osho Rajaneesh, because I love Osho. Actually everyone who loves Osho should apply for a name change and get Osho added to their name so Osho becomes most popular name in the world. Just out of love, why not.?

  73. prem bubbie says:

    Yo Rajneesh , how it be hangin’ dog? Long time…. filling yo’ pockets wit money and ego? How about starting that commune of yours in Nepal…. just got word that our (U.S.) government has issued travel warnings to those who are thinking about going there. They could use a new face, since those sannyasins with their political connections have failed with their conversion of the local population. I thought that Osho was the newest and hottest thing since the flushing toilet was introduced back in 1980. In one ear and out the other with regards to high spiritual guidance. Give them hell swami dog. Woof, woof!!!!

  74. prem bubbie says:

    Yo Rajneesh baby… Don’t forget to take Prem Jashan as your ass wipe!!!

  75. Chinmaya says:

    Yes Shantam,

    I do not know, who you are and how do you know the Sikh Religion but you have referred correcly about the set up of a new Religion, namely Sikh Religion, lately about 300 years ago, which is now world wide and Dr Manmohan Singh, Prime Minister of India, is one amongst the people of this community and Religion, meeting all Prez and PMs of world countries.

    Similarly, you said correctly, Osho can out-reach at all continents and to each and every one, the need of the hour is that the Principal Secretary and Joint Secretary at Pune should think alike for the spread of Osho-ismand they should forget the biased attitude being acquired and being dictated by some nasty and devastating forces of some country to smash the originality of Ashram, as was seen, loved and lived by us all.

    May God bless them wisdom enough to think on positive terms for the sake of humanity, which is on the verge of collapse, with new version of devastating arms and ammunation. Chances are high that this planet is saved with the spread of the message of our Master – Osho instead of just shrinking it into small well instead of Ocean.

  76. Chinmaya says:

    Spelling mistake – Oshoism and

  77. shantam prem says:

    RAJNEESH
    MAY LIFE ENERGY BLESS THIS PROJECT.

    Not the big and establish names but it is this slow walker Rajneesh, who has been chosen by Life or WHo himself has chalked His path to create an energy replica of The life in Pune.

    I have one request RAjneesh. People are supporting this project otherwise from where the money and man power will come.
    And also Life in us is governed by second to second mechanism.
    So take care that if the founder energy has to die, the Dick of the Tom don´t chase Marie all the time.

    Psychological Corruption is also a very lethal thing.

  78. shantam prem says:

    The other day, i have watched the interview of a 52 years Indian Tycoon Sunil Bharti Mittal, who is the force behind the fifth biggest Telecommunication company Air Tel.
    and now he has entered African Market spread in 15 countries.
    The point is, when he said something, ” We will INJECT the successful Indian Model into the African market.”

    In the context of Osho, world at large rejected and ridiculed Osho´s complete vision. But few of us dared to follow and felt the results too.
    And it is a question of ethics and integrity that people who have to manage the work after Osho, must adhare to the same value system and life, not just in words but in spirit.
    What to say about injecting Poona Model into the new territories and countreis the good willing cowards have turned the creative work of Osho into a sub sect of Hindu Buddhist stream.
    SO when a Organisation fails miserably. Some individual was suppose to come forward.Today Rajneesh is doing this on a ground level, may be tomorrow someone else will bring the seeds to their flowering.
    Why to feel jealous, envious, why not feel motivated?

  79. Chinmaya says:

    Osho Rajneesh………Cheeeers……..

    Many dogs bark, but Elepahnt will walk with its own speed and Masti towards its destination. And your personality and individuality reflects clearly and definitely, the blessings of Osho, to walk on the Path of our Master. We needed that and at least you dared to take first step. And first step taken indicates that the destination is not far.

    Good luck…

  80. Satya Deva says:

    As for ‘Osho Rajneesh’, anyone who can seriously say and believe that all problems, personal and otherwise, can be solved by dancing, has to be a grade one deluded fool.

    Such a belief is irrelevant, impractical, air-head (and, I’m afraid, typically ‘Eastern’) nonsense.

    Even a blind person would see that…
    (But perhaps Rajneesh could enlighten us on this point?)

    I’d say ‘Osho Rajneesh’ is hiding delusions of grandeur behind an affected humility.

    And with such a person at the helm, God help this Goa Project.

  81. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    Not the big and establish names but it is this slow walker Rajneesh, who has been chosen by Life or WHo himself has chalked His path to create an energy replica of The life in Pune.

    SD:
    “chosen by Life”?!!
    Please, let’s not feed this character’s delusions even more.

    “an energy replica of the life in Pune”?
    You can not see or accept that this is simply impossible, that Pune as it was is OVER, finished, the past, done!

    Are you really that desperate, SP, for something you never had? Where’s your discrimination, your common sense even?!

    Anyone can try anything they want, but it won’t be a “replica”, it’ll be something else.

    And I certainly wouldn’t bet on ‘Osho Rajneesh’ to deliver the goods….

  82. shantam prem says:

    Satya Deva, the path of truth is full with illusory flowers, sometime they have intoxicating fragrance.
    I will prefer not to judge Rajneesh exactly the way i won´t do for two pious ladies you mentioned in the previous post or other thousands who are delivering the product, in the supply line of famous historical and mythological figures.

    But being connected with Osho´s school of thought, i will not hesitate to say that where the 21 inner circle members failed for any reason, Rajneesh has filled a certain vacuum with his gusto or Chutzpah.
    i admire such non-conformist but gutsy audacity.

    Are you really that desperate, SP, for something you never had? Where’s your discrimination, your common sense even?

    No it is not my desperation but love for humanity and Osho that i wish people to try the fruit, i tasted and felt amazed.
    Naturally in the Goa project, Rajneesh will bring his idea, his imagination, it is His homage to Osho and He dares to try to bring that Poona Fragrance,
    I respect that, when the others in the position have downgraded Master´s recipe.

    If JAyesh creates what so ever in any part of the world, i will have the same respect.

    And you can see, many new people have the hunger to feel the Poona vibes, these people want to bow down before Osho´s picture and want to dance when Osho comes on the screen in the evening meeting called white robe.
    My effortless effort is to see the situation as it is, with my VIVEK( What is the exact English meaning?) therefore i have my best wishes for Osho Cocom.

  83. shantam prem says:

    What one think is in the category of deluded fools, here is the video i posted in the previous post too.

    http://abcnews.go.com/Nightline/video/son-god-10894617

    As i mentioned earlier, “Buddha and Buddhu” are twins in arms with different destiny but with similar ways.
    One person´s Buddha is another person´s Buddhu, just a small difference in perception with life altering consequences.
    Inner search is also like Oral sex, Little slip of tongue and one is in shit hole, but the journey continues, step by step towards Wisdom
    .

  84. I have observed that most people who criticize Rajneesh have never actually met him personally or they are already too much conditioned by the opinion of power hungry people about Rajneesh.

    Swami Rajneesh is certainly a threat to all those people who have vested interest in Osho legacy.

    Those seeking souls or lovers of truth who have really come across Rajneesh or those who have attended his camps with a open heart are no more the same person.

    Many of them have become Rajneesh lovers, friends or fellow travelers.

    I am one of them.

    I request to those people who criticize Rajneesh with out knowing him to give themselves a fair chance and meet Rajneesh at least once or attend his camps or at least read his ebook “Tears of The Mystic Rose”.

    Human life is hard to attain but easy to lose.
    remember: the pilgrimage starts from http://www.oshorajneesh.net and ends at oneself.

    love
    Swami Amitabh

  85. Sadhu says:

    Freinds, Once some one asked Osho about UG Krishnamurti….in this talk Osho gave simple answer that only fack parson copy other, imitate others…exitance never make two persons same…this Rajnessh is totally zerox copy…this is enough for me that he is fraud, and I have seen him, I met him…I have seen all his drama…totalu joker…please forgive me if it hurt…but what to do…to me He is joker…just joker…I hate all those people who are imitating Osho…all are fraud….FRAUD

  86. Satya Deva says:

    My feeling entirely, Sadhu. Admittedly not based upon having met the man, but based upon his youtube videos (absolutely unimpressive), certain absurd statements (eg the one about dancing I mentioned above, today), and the very fact of hijacking the name, even the appearance of the ‘real’ Rajneesh.

    Worst of all, of course, is the assumption of being a ‘spokesperson’ or ‘substitute’ for Osho himself, or even some sort of ‘vehicle’ for the original Master’s work.

    Still, if people are so desperate to believe in and trust such a false priest then they deserve to be disillusioned, as they surely will, one day.

    And btw, Amitabh and SP, I’m certainly not ‘brainwashed’ by the ‘Inner Circle’ & co., in fact I take little or no interest in the Poona situation and the controversy around it.

  87. shantam prem says:

    Satya Deva, i hope you get my point.
    I agree with you totally about Rajneesh you tube videos and his book etc.
    After few seconds on them and feels like torturre.
    The point is, why thousands and thousands of people admire and follow him.
    He must be fullfilling some important space in their life.
    Same is why thousands of people stand in the queue to get a hug from Amma?

    Why in A poor country like Philipines, someone claiming to be a Jesus, has the private planes and live like an Arabian Sheikh, stillt people around him has tears of gratitude.

    There are numerous examples.

    My simple answer is and there can be many, “People want to relate to something higher something sacred.
    We human beings need a sense of belonging.
    When we feel old is not good enough, we search for new, this way people came to Osho.
    Osho gave a complete and new frame work to many.
    And also accepted this freedom too, that in case you feel it is enough here, leave me and the place without guilt.

    With this kind of ashram and attitude, millions of other people could have enjoyed and appreciated the NEW in their life.
    Unfortunately, few close hearted Idiots simply narrowed the Vision and the end result is some one like Shailandra, something like Rajneesh.

  88. shantam prem says:

    And let it sound rude, it is not just the managers of the ashram but those multitude of the people seem also thankless creatures, who spend years and years around Him and the ashram to get all the benefit and once the Man died simply left for the new pastures or started behaving indifferently.
    Where is the rebelliousness, where is the paying back, where is the gratitude in action?

  89. shantam prem says:

    PS- I have not stand in the queue to get a hug from Amma, bu the way i see the photos and her work, read the reviews and feel her energy, Huggy Amma is one of the treasures on this earth.
    And the same is true in my heart for late Mother Terresa.
    (I understand Osho´s points too)

  90. shantam prem says:

    Great link, Alok John.
    There is much psyhcology about Gurus and disciples in the article of this link.
    We will point the fingers towards other cults believing with Osho it is different, exactly the way Christian writers point their fist towards every one but not towards their infantile believes.

    it seems, it is like-
    Once someone start believing and propagating that his spiritual machinery is bigger than 8 inches, many people simply take their underwears off!

  91. All the 24 Jain tirthankara look alike…
    but this does not mean they were imitators.
    According to Osho, it was because they had followed same meditation techniques.

    I think, Rajneesh is the only person who is not an imitator because he has realized his authentic nature.

    and rest all who are not enlightened are imitating someone or other…. in one way or another.

    Authentically speaking, only Rajneesh has the right to say to us that we imitate… but this is the paradox he will not say it.

  92. Satya Deva says:

    Sounds like more Eastern gobbledegook there, Amitabh, I’m afraid! So I really can’t take any of that seriously.

    As for the ‘darker side of Amma’ site, it’s certainly a big surprise to me, especially as I have always enjoyed and felt benefited by being at her gatherings in London.

    The ‘hugging darshans’ invariably put me into a state of meditation for quite a while, but I found simply being there was enough to ‘lift’ my energy. I was perfectly content just to sit for hours, doing nothing except watching, waiting and listening to the music.

    And her devotees and disciples seemed fine to me, perfectly healthy, helpful, pleasant and self-giving.

    I have no idea how it is at her Kerala ashram, but for me and, it would seem, many thousands of others, the annual London events are uplifting occasions. Having missed the last two, I aim to get there for a day or two next time, in October.

    There are one or two critical responses to negative articles at that site, which should be read carefully as much of what they say rings true for me.

    It may be though, that Amma’s way is simply not ‘right’ for a number of people who go there, and/or that such a relatively Eastern ‘devotee trip’ doesn’t fit the bill for many of us westerners. Especially those who are deeply psychologically wounded.

  93. shantam prem says:

    Such a relatively Eastern ‘devotee trip’ doesn’t fit the bill for many of us westerners. Especially those who are deeply psychologically wounded.

    Whether the eastern devotee trip fit the bill or not, first prerequist is to be a deeply psyhcologically wonuded person, otherwise why someone will go and have a Mama for a sec.

    There is nothing wrong to be wounded. It fuels the search for the remedy.

    Yerterday i was in a church for more than 90 minutes where after the mass two priests were giving the blessings, something like Energy Darshan to around 125 people.
    One young priest was ordained five years ago and said, ” He cacnot ask for more when his hands are used by Jesus Christ.

    As far as i have seen, people in the Church and the priests in average show much more sincere a being than the cults and sub cults coming from Hindu streams.

  94. shantam prem says:

    There must be some answer to this puzzle, ” Osho did not fathered any child but in every city from Kashmir to Kanyakumari some child is saying, Osho is his/her Dad!”

  95. Satya Deva

    You could not have found a better teacher than Amma.
    She will never hit at your ego.
    may be because she herself needs a hit.

    read her biography first and then waste your time here.
    Even after her so called enlightenment her (amma) decisions were influenced by her father.

    I have also got a hug from amma but there was no energy in that hug.. it was just a formality from her side.

    I do not know what to say to you.
    May be Lord Buddha only can guide you.

    love
    amitabh

  96. the new age of freedom

    from the priests / therapist / group leaders / politicans who charge huge amounts for personal gains
    and cheat thousands of innocent new seekers

    i have cut these power greedy money hungry people
    and their vested interest
    in making a business out of osho

    spreading osho…not selling him !!!!
    we offer osho for free…his vision free
    out of our love joy and celebration

    and each individual freedom to express themselves

    so be it…
    even your expressions of hatred
    i accept as part of your freedom

    as i am free to create out of my love
    for my beloved master osho

    you are free to criticise me !!!

    and i walk my talk…so lets see who wins !!!

    rajneesh the rebel who dares

  97. and all those who continue to criticise everything
    that includesmyself rajneesh
    or even the retarded poona inner circle ect ect

    let me see other than your empty blah blah blah
    what you are doing for yourself or your master osho

    what are your actions and creative solutions
    other than blind judgments and criticisms

    i challenge anyone anytime to face me
    and see if they have the courage to look me in the eye
    anytime anywhere openly i offer this challenge

    rajneesh

  98. Chinmaya says:

    Bravo Swami Rajneesh

  99. Satya Deva says:

    Amitabh, you really should read what people actually write, rather than what you think they have written.

    Where, for example, have I written that I am a devotee or follower of Amma?

    I only said that I have enjoyed her events in London.

    As for your:
    I do not know what to say to you.
    May be Lord Buddha only can guide you

    If you’re not being ironic here, then that’s another piece of Eastern tosh.
    I didn’t ask for and don’t need such condescending claptrap, thanks.

  100. Satya Deva says:

    Rajneesh,
    your youtube videos are utterly unimpressive,
    your statements are just pseudo-spiritual tosh, perhaps the most stupid being the nonsense that dancing is the way to solve problems,
    you affect a false humility while ‘bigging yourself up’ at every opportunity,
    you bask in the reflected glory of Osho in various ways, the most obvious being taking on his name.

    You are a fraud, sir, you’re about as ‘realised’ as the guy who delivers my letters.

    (In my humble opinion)

  101. Satya Deva says:

    rajneesh:
    what are your actions and creative solutions
    other than blind judgments and criticisms

    SD:
    Actions and creative solutions for what?

    It’s your problem, certainly not mine.

    But I do have a problem with your fraudulent self-hype. I wouldn’t trust you a single inch.

  102. you…and have a humble opinion !!!

  103. for the record in the past 30 months

    i have been invited to over 80 cities / events worldwide
    the past year alone i visited 40 cities / events

    i have met over 4000 sannyasins
    and osho lovers and seekers on the path
    no one has spoken against me till now !!

    and all those i meet are with me and offer their love
    and gratitude for opening their eyes towards osho

    over 350 have taken sannyas

    ofcourse all these are simply deluded fools
    and you the wise one here !!!

    look at their eyes and their dance and celebration
    and only the blind will not see love showering
    and feel their celebration
    and the presence of osho
    in all my events…

    http://www.oshorajneesh.net
    http://www.oshorajneesh.com

    all this celebration and love
    inspite of all the attacks against me
    by the 21 baboons and people like you

    i celebrate and offer my love
    and you can stone me…

    love will win…
    and i am open
    and remain available to all !!!

  104. Satya Deva says:

    so be it…
    rajneesh:
    even your expressions of hatred
    i accept as part of your freedom

    as i am free to create out of my love
    for my beloved master osho

    you are free to criticise me !!!

    and i walk my talk…so lets see who wins !!!

    rajneesh the rebel who dares

    SD:
    Some examples there of what I mean – this guy’s self-hype, his grandiose manner and view of himself. Placing himself upon a pedestal, as if he actually knows or is anything.

    As if anyone cares whether rajneesh accepts criticism or not!

    Just another self-deluded priest. Thank God he’s in India, best place for such a phoney, frankly.

  105. and you can see me 6000 miles away…

    and i thank god rajneesh is in india !!!

    i am now in barcelona spain…
    coming to italy austria holland..
    ukraine latvia portugal madrid…

    if you are close by i dare you to come…
    but you do not have the guts to face me…
    just chatter behind my back…and chatter on…

    rajneesh

  106. Satya Deva says:

    rajneesh:
    no one has spoken against me till now !!

    SD:
    On the contrary, Mr Priest, I’ve read plenty of criticism of you in the past.

    Perhaps you have a selective memory, like most phoneys?

  107. perhaps a dance will take away this desperation
    and dark space you seem to be enveloped in…
    so come join the dance !!!

  108. please kindly name a few
    who know me and have spoken against me !!!
    and that too in the past…you state…
    refresh your selective memory please
    for all to read here

  109. Satya Deva says:

    There’ll always be a market for an apparently plausible con artist, rajneesh, as you’ve clearly noticed. Especially in the world of so-called spiritual seekers, where so many are ready to abandon all discrimination and common sense.

    I wouldn’t go out of my way to see you, why should I bother spending my money on such a pointless mission?

    Unless you’re coming to London or to South-west France, ie to my neighbourhood, when I might give you the once-over.

  110. waiting for the names of the disgrunteled !!

  111. waiting for the names of the disgrunteled !!

  112. still waiting for the names of the disgrunteled !!

  113. Satya Deva says:

    You imagine I keep a list of names of people who post comments online, or who share their opinion with me, or who perhaps write in a magazine?

    And do you really imagine you’re that important to me?!!

    Have you no grip on reality, rajneesh?!

    You sound like some paranoid fool.

    I suggest you enquire, for a start, of the editors of ‘Sannyas News’, as to which threads here carried discussions about you.

    Then, if possible, go and read them, if you’re that interested.

  114. Satya Deva says:

    Yes, you do sound like an impatient f…er too.

    Calm down, old boy, you’re supposed to be at the cutting edge of consciousness, aren’t you?

  115. so you state that you read comments online
    those who share opinions with you
    or you have read in a magazine

    wow…for a while i thought you were serious
    and really had a list…

    seems i am off your stupid judgmental hook

    am curious who would share opinions
    with you….as you qualify as a baboon !!!

  116. Satya Deva says:

    And that is more than ‘enough for today’!

  117. if you really have the guts
    face me
    and you will understand
    cutting edge
    razor sharp

  118. Satya Deva says:

    Oh, hadn’t read the latest bullshine from you, rajie, babe…

    Sorry, sunshine, you can’t just squirm your way out of it like that…

    As I said, if you really expect anyone to produce a list of people writing against you it’s further evidence of your delusions of grandeur, with more than a touch of paranoia.

    But of course, it wouldn’t really look too good, would it, if you went and asked the SN editors to find threads about you, where you were criticised?
    I guess, like all very important ones, you have to look after your image…

    Meanwhile, it’s truly an honour to be insulted by one so Great as yourself, Mr Rajneesh-Priest.

    Great consciuousess, very admirable!

  119. Satya Deva says:

    Now, it’s 2am and way past my bedtime.

    Definitely ‘enough for today’.

  120. Satya Deva says:

    rajneesh:

    if you really have the guts
    face me
    and you will understand
    cutting edge
    razor sharp

    SD:
    Well, if you’re so bothered by my criticism, go out of your way to come to either London or south-west France, arrange a public meeting, so plenty of people can put you to the test.

    Frankly, I’m ultimately not that concerned or interested in you and your schemes to disrupt my life any more than I have tonight.

  121. Prem Jashan says:

    SP: There must be some answer to this puzzle, ” Osho did not fathered any child but in every city from Kashmir to Kanyakumari some child is saying, Osho is his/her Dad!”

    I would rather say Osho is like my Mom. Its in his womb that we grew.. I heard when Krishna died, Arjuna came to know about it first, he goes and tells rest of the family ” Our mother is died” . Master is such an embodiment of love, care taker and everything. River Ganges takes away all the filth and mortal remains of the people when they die,but the master takes all that unnecessary things away from you while you are alive and leaves the real self..Master is unparallel to any thing that you can think of. once you connected with his grace he will not leave you until you are enlightened..such is the power of his grace, if you really understand..

  122. Sadhu says:

    Whe I read these words from Rajneesh…”i challenge anyone anytime to face me
    and see if they have the courage to look me in the eye
    anytime anywhere openly i offer this challenge…”…it is enough for me He is fraud…no one with inttelgence wil talk like this…

  123. shantam prem says:

    o s h o
    never born
    never died
    only visited the
    planet earth between
    dec 11 1931 – jan 19 1990

    rajneesh

    born january 20 1961
    died january 19 1990
    reborn january 19 1990

    will never die

    With such epilogue in the book, Rajneesh, you give the impression as if Osho is embodied in You, as you are the unchosen successor, The best archer-Eklavya.

    Those who are in the need of a Living and loving presence, such kind of FALSE AND DELUSIONAL statements create securtiy.
    YOu do it in the name of Osho, when someone does in the name of Jesus, Durga and Sai Baba it is is even bigger market.

    It is everybody´s fundamental right to play the game in their way. Who i am to judge.
    But the way i see the world, someone like Osho who radiates and speak intelligence is a rare happening, rest is an expression of gutsy and Chutzpah state of being, this has its own immense power.

  124. shantam prem says:

    It is a common referance in electoral politics, that the Party A could win because of the NEGATIVE VOTES it received as a protest against the ruling party.

    The way Osho´s wings has been chopped by the Moarchy of 17, Koregaon Park; and therefore amputated Osho cannot fly more than few laps on the terrace, in this situation, for many, rising of Rajneesh is a new chapter.

  125. Lokesh says:

    I’ve never met Swami Rajneesh but I have it from friends who have that he is very funny. Anyone with a bit of intelligence who reads his comments posted here has to admit he is good for a laugh. I mean to say………….waiting for the names of the disgrunteled !! Ha ha haa! Brilliant. The man is a hoot. Now that is something at least that he shares in common with Osho. He did afterall enjoy a good joke. How could any self-respecting sannyasin take anything that Swami Rajneesh says seriously? Just the name alone gives a huge hint that the man is a cosmic joker in the pack. Osho must be laughing about the whole carry-on right now, Yes, yes, just past the sound of the wind blowing the hollow bamboos I can swear I hear the sound of one hand wanking.

  126. Hey Sw.Rajneesh!Hey hello!
    I]m the one or very few black sannyasins in Pune those days and I remember you and your slowly awareness walk…which I must say was a bit of joke seen from my unconscious side,but never the less I felt you were very serious about discovering slowness in life as for me everything had to be on the fast lane…!
    I lived in south India for couple years ,basicaly in TIruvamalai,by the Sri Ramana ashram as our beloved Osho took me over there!For over twenty I never could get to see the Mountain of fire but,it came the day and Im greatful for the fragrance of the place!*Lemon grass fragrance blown by the wind and love smell from people living in those surroundings!
    South India where exactly your commune or rather another Osho]s comune will be in South India_/
    Regards Amrit!
    PS./ we have a new Bodichitta of compassion,The Fairysaint!

  127. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem:
    Yerterday i was in a church for more than 90 minutes where after the mass two priests were giving the blessings, something like Energy Darshan to around 125 people.
    One young priest was ordained five years ago and said, ” He cacnot ask for more when his hands are used by Jesus Christ.

    As far as i have seen, people in the Church and the priests in average show much more sincere a being than the cults and sub cults coming from Hindu streams.

    SD:
    Well, sp, if you’re keen on that sort of thing, maybe they are “sincere”..

    “Sincere” enough to be followers and standard-bearers of a religion that has wreaked enormous havoc over the centuries, ‘holy wars’, support of temporal powers-that-be, tyrants and so on, the list of their devious and destructive political machinations is almost endless…

    There’s really very little point in arguing the toss over these established religions, comparing one with another, they’re all in a similar game, on a similar power trip, are they not?

    So please, no more of this sentimental nonsense about how “sincere” they are. The world is full of well-meaning fools (a minute or two of reading swami rajneesh’s claims of recruiting large numbers for his project is enough to demonstrate that), perhaps even more unconscious than you and me….

  128. Bashir says:

    Teleprompter? 2 bad!

    An moreover – why it’s so serious???

  129. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem:
    Whether the eastern devotee trip fit the bill or not, first prerequist is to be a deeply psyhcologically wonuded person, otherwise why someone will go and have a Mama for a sec.

    There is nothing wrong to be wounded. It fuels the search for the remedy.

    SD:
    Agreed, sp, no problem with you on this, I know it very well from my and others’ experience.

    But what I was getting at that I’m afraid around some teachers who encourage ‘devotion’, there is too much ‘infantilism’, too much scope for imagining that ‘the guru’ will ‘do it all for me’, together with all manner of useless psychic mumbo-jumbo.

    All emanating from a deeply wounded and thus still profoundly immature psyche.

    Such people may well be hindered rather than helped by attaching themselves to a certain type of teacher, which might well be behind the complaints about psychological/emotional damage found at the anti-Amma site.

  130. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem:

    o s h o
    never born
    never died
    only visited the
    planet earth between
    dec 11 1931 – jan 19 1990

    rajneesh

    born january 20 1961
    died january 19 1990
    reborn january 19 1990

    will never die

    With such epilogue in the book, Rajneesh, you give the impression as if Osho is embodied in You, as you are the unchosen successor, The best archer-Eklavya.

    Those who are in the need of a Living and loving presence, such kind of FALSE AND DELUSIONAL statements create securtiy.
    YOu do it in the name of Osho, when someone does in the name of Jesus, Durga and Sai Baba it is is even bigger market.

    SD:
    I think you’ve nailed it there, SP.

  131. shantam prem says:

    More than 12 hours and no further post from anyone.
    Has the nail gone too deep.

    Here i must mention that all this exchange is between seekers to seekers, almost like a family discussion and the intention is to rise together.
    By nailing kind of sincere and honest mail, it is not intended to hurt Rajneesh, defame him, put him down and therefore feel a kick of ego.

    No Brother, Mere Bhai Rajneesh, you are as precious as to share the same Chappati.
    (The conflict can arise only when someone of us brings Dalda ghee in a box marked as Desi ghee)

    I wished the same with Ashram managers too,
    but they are too much focused on the hygiene Fanda.
    I wonder when was the life time, some one from them licked the XXXXX!

  132. the implications i have set in motion
    in the vision of the osho cocom
    will speak from themselves

    all i hear is complaints
    and no real actions

    free osho groups and therapies
    free osho training for therapists
    and all osho training courses
    free meditation camps
    free entry into the cocom
    and freedom for the individual

    transparancy and accountability
    will create a new momentum
    and freedom
    in the osho world

    this will have vast implications

    the vested interest
    and those who misuse power
    and the middle men who sell osho
    and make a business out of his vision
    will understand what is coming soon

    i wait silently
    watching
    and walk my talk

  133. and any comments against me
    or even for that matter in favour of me
    have no meaning

    actions speak louder than words !!!

  134. Satya Deva says:

    Fine-sounding words and plans, perhaps…

    Yet coming from one so evidently self-deluded and flawed, with such a laughably grandiose image of himself, hardly fills me with confidence in the outcome.

    rajneesh, you’re simply a fool.

  135. Satya Deva says:

    And goodnight, btw.

  136. reflex says:

    * Factuality alert *

    It has been questioned whether dance can solve problems. Problems are not always solved in their own terms: the one who lost his shoe and then is given a motor-cycle did not solve the problem of the lost shoe.

    For the right person – and there are many right persons – dance is the complete solution. This is simply because it is an occasion for surrender. One suddenly finds oneself hara-centred – this is the same as “svadisthana chakra”. Unconscious and conscious are aligned, there is relaxation-plus-consciousness. From the depth arises a constant stream of bliss – therefore there is non-attachment as regards the “problem of the lost shoe”. So Osho introduced some kind of movement into all his meditations.

    Surrender is the root of life – without it one cannot dance, cannot love, die or be born, enter meditation or orgasm. Surrender is the disappearance of boundaries.

    There has been a concerted effort on the part of some sannyasins to recast Osho’s message as “only awareness”. If “only awareness” is right for you, if it brings you enlightenment, then that is very good, of course, but it is not Osho’s whole message, not at all. Rather, it is a kind of a consolation prize for those who cannot move in love and in bliss and who might, unfortunately, otherwise find nothing better to do than bitch at each other in blogs.

    Cheer up!

  137. Amano says:

    satya deva, and prem bubbie,

    you are nothing but jealous with rajneesh…….if you can not support him atleast show some respect to him……..i do not know you guys personally , but from posting looks like you are abusing this beautiful space by writting non sence.
    i do not find anything wrong with name. or other mundane stuff

    point is rajneesh is trying something for all of us to breath in the atmosphere of freedom and love . lets wish him best and i hope success for him in making a nice osho place for lovers to meet and meditate and celebrate………
    do not try to spread lies through your comments.

    first find a guts to do what rajneesh is doing , then come and talk ,
    it is easy to post message from your laptop and say bullshit ,but hard to go goa and try to live osho vision and try to create some nice place for all of us

  138. Amano says:

    RAJNEESH, please keep us posting about your new osho center in goa and ignore peoople like satya deva and prem bubie……….

  139. Amano says:

    satya deva and prem bubie,

    do us favor and stop posting for a while. your postings are very distrubing because they do not contain any meanings… please i have humble request for you both guys to write meaning ful and think twice before posting.
    you are doing nothing but misusiing freedom of speech….. both of you have learnt any creativity with osho

  140. shantam prem says:

    Actions speak better than words, in this respect, i wish all the success to Osho Cocom.
    May be this will wake the Ashram energy up.

    As i see, to continue the flowering accordance with the flow Osho left, Osho Friends International should have taken the initiative.
    Collective initiative, efforts and money poured together would have a lasting and far reaching effect.

  141. prem bubbie says:

    Osho charged for groups since the beginning of Pune 1 and earlier. He charged for his books, for camps, for festivals, for working at the ranch(most of the time) except for the last year. Who are you shitting, rajneesh-dog? You say…”no one has challenged you until now”. Bullshit we’ve been challenging and criticizing you since I’ve been posting here, last August 2009. If you can’t take the heat get out of the kitchen… Are you that much of a pussy to get upset at justifiable critiques of your integrity? You MAY have had 4000 sannyasins visit you, then again I think you’re delusional and it ‘s actually 40, and wannabe’s at that. Time for your Thorazine shot rajneesh-dog, bend over baby!!!

  142. prem bubbie says:

    Amano, there is no such thing as misusing freedom of speech… You’re also a delusion chap…. so many delusional people here…. something’s in the air… just rajneesh!!!!

  143. prem bubbie says:

    Amano, under your rules, you would consider Osho a misuser of his freedom of speech… all of the insults he passed on to others, no matter who they may have been…. You have a very selective memory….. some brain damage I’m afraid!!! Cheers!!!

  144. prem bubbie says:

    …”Go to Goa and try to live Osho vision”. Amano, you have no idea what that is sir…. so zip it!!!!! If you knew you wouldn’t have to go to Goa…You fool!!!

  145. prem bubbie says:

    You like to give orders amano… Are you German?

  146. Prem Jashan says:

    SP : this is, “almost like a family discussion and the intention is to rise together.”

    To me, SP is like a news reader intelligently analyzing oil spill situation and Rajneesh is like a guy working 1000s of feet deep in the water fixing the spill. The quality of experience is beautiful in both cases but yet they are not same. Masters hand is handy to the people who dive deep. Goa will be successful without any second thought.

    By the way, I never met Rajneesh and I don’t even know at this moment,if I ever meet him . I heard about him and watched him on Zouddha.com interview . In some places he did not look impressive during the interview. But it has no relevance at all how Rajneesh looks and walks. It is not about him but it is about his intentions..he is just instrumental in making some thing good..

  147. Satya Deva says:

    Amano, if you can’t perceive how delusional this rajneesh character is then what to say about your time with Osho?!

    It seems it’s made you into a naive fool. Perhaps you were that at the start, however?

    And you really think I could be “jealous” of such a joke of a man?

    Perhaps a cold shower might help you to wake up a bit….

  148. Satya Deva says:

    Prem Jashan:
    I heard about him and watched him on Zouddha.com interview . In some places he did not look impressive during the interview. But it has no relevance at all how Rajneesh looks and walks. It is not about him but it is about his intentions..he is just instrumental in making some thing good.

    SD:
    That’s where I’d take issue with you, PJ.

    I think it’s extremely relevant the kind of person rajneesh is, as something truly good and right is unlikely to flow from the efforts of such a delusional character.

    If you can’t see the extent of his foolishness and build up hopeful expectations of something wonderful, then unfortunately you’re going to be very disappointed when it all goes belly-up.

    Still, it’ll be a learning experience for you and for the rest of the naive ones seduced by this impostor’s delusions of grandeur.

    And

  149. Amano says:

    satya deva and prem bubie,

    you both are dodos , and jealous with rajneesh, it is not only my personal feelings. so do not get personal , here on this site everyone knows how much vomiting you have been doing against rajneesh. for nothing

  150. Amano says:

    jashan, you are right. it is not about rajneesh ,but his intensions.

    his intensions to give shelter to osho lovers and offer meditation and celebration in goa , it is also going to shake pune management who has been very cruel and harmful to osho and his lovers.

    i know rajneesh and know people around him , . he has quality people and educated people with him……..Above all he has creative osho sannyasins with him. What more do you need………..osho left 17 koregaon park long ago when they broke budha hall and turn nice commune into five star resort.
    all the beauty was gone .. without budha hall is like man without head .

    of course osho cocom is not going to be 24K gold osho place, but someone is trying to gather some osho sannyasins without any expections is great .

    goa itself is beautiful than pune city . that is why so many goes there ..

  151. Satya Deva says:

    I suggest, Amano, that you also read (or re-read) the posts of Lokesh and Sadhu re this fraud rajneesh. And also note the reservations of Shantam Prem.

    And kindly take note of Prem Bubbie’s comments on freedom of speech.

    Unless, of course, you’re happy with having a ‘fascistic’ mentality….

  152. Satya Deva says:

    Amano:
    you both are dodos , and jealous with rajneesh, it is not only my personal feelings. so do not get personal

    SD:
    I suggest then that you take your own advice.

    Unless you’re the type that declares, ‘Do as I say, not what I do’…

    Kinda ties in with your wish to ‘censor’ my and others’ views here.

    Fine advert for rajneesh you are…

    Who do you think you are – Chairman Mao?!

  153. Satya Deva says:

    Amano:
    i know rajneesh and know people around him , . he has quality people and educated people with him……..Above all he has creative osho sannyasins with him.

    SD:
    Like you, perhaps, Amano?

    Oh dear….

  154. some people behave in a weird way.

    some people do not feel much pain because of their own problems…. but they feel more pain knowing the fact that someone else is in bliss.

    These people are not interested in solving their own problems, pains or miseries.
    but they are more interested in stopping or criticizing the creative or constructive work of others.

    When Swami Rajneesh experienced Samadhi in 1986, then people were not inspired by him,
    On the contrary they were jealous and they started harming him.

    now also the same trend is continuing…

    people are not hurt or angry at those who are harming Osho work.
    but they are angry at Rajneesh who is trying to help Osho lovers and Sannyasins..

    Conclusion is simple: few people are only interested in destructive works.. they delight in destruction, criticism and jealousy.

    These people really get upset if someone does any creative work like Rajneesh and his friends are doing.

    Now it is up to every sannyasin to choose his way of living.

    As I see the young generation is smart and can clearly feel the difference in creative and destructive works
    and soon osho cocom is going to be a place for osho lovers from all over the world.

    love
    amitabh

  155. prem bubbie says:

    Amano: no wonder the world and humans are in such dire straits, you need to sign up as the poster child representing stupidity, naivety, foolishness, idiocy and mental impairment. I really don’t know how you can actually take time and type out your words to be posted… Just boggles the mind and heart. What thought processes occur up in your numb skull I’m afraid to find out, if what you post is just a taste. Are you Herman Goerhing reincarnated? I’ve met the likes of your kind over the years in the sannyas community, you guys give Sheela the run for her money…Yeah rajneesh with your dancing to nirvana techniques, with Amano leading the troupe doing the “two step, to the goose step”…… Please some one send for the rubber truck for these guys!!!

  156. Satya Deva says:

    Amitabh, can you not understand that for me (and for plenty of others) this rajneesh is a deeply unimpressive figure?

    I’ve already listed reasons why (see my posts a couple of days or so ago), so I suggest you read or re-read them.

    Even just on a very basic level, how you people can accept that utterly self-important claptrap in his autobiography – the notes on birth/death etc.) and his self-aggrandising taking of the name, is simply bewildering.

    You lot seem to have abandoned your common sense and powers of discrimination, out of desperation to promote his or your version of Osho’s work.

    Moreover, trying to create a carbon-copy – “replica” someone (Shantam Prem?) called it – of Poona 1 or 2 is doomed to failure. Don’t you have the intelligence to see that?!

    My sense is that at some level you’re actually trying to create a ‘religion’ and it wouldn’t surprise me if it turns out that this rajneesh is far from having relinquished any personal ambition in this context.

    As I have said here before, I just wouldn’t trust him a single inch (or millimetre).

    ‘Dancing is the way to resolve any problem’ :
    Oh yeah?! That alone is more than enough evidence for me of his foolishness.

  157. shantam prem says:

    Jashan, i am smiling to see your example,
    ” To me, SP is like a news reader intelligently analyzing oil spill situation and Rajneesh is like a guy working 1000s of feet deep in the water fixing the spill. The quality of experience is beautiful in both cases but yet they are not same. Masters hand is handy to the people who dive deep. Goa will be successful without any second thought”.

    Only time will tell whether Osho Cocom gets its wings.
    I wish it fly high and flourish, not because it will serve my needs but because it will be a wake up call to old and stale sannyasins to bring Ashram back in Resort.

  158. shantam prem says:

    Same way Satya Deva, only time, not just years but decades will tell whether Osho turns into a religion, cult, a movement flowing like a river or ends up just a Boutique.

    What so ever, Poona Ashram will DEFINITELY take the shape of Bodh Gaya. The Macca, The Kashi, The place of meditation and pilgrimage for His people with the rituals as one sees in the Osho Videos.
    Present day Resort has a life span 1 to 3 years more than Mr. Chairman´s remaining years. And with sincere love i wish longevity and good health to the Chairman of Osho Resorts Ltd.

    And this i am saying not as an astrologer,as a news reader but say like social scientist.
    The Human race has the inbuilt intelligence and rebelliousness to throw away the imposed changes.Leningrad has to become Saint Petersburg, the way Mumbai has reclaimed Bombay.
    When sannyasins like humans, like Monkeys have to follow someone, undoubtedly they will follow Master rather than the managers.
    When something goes in, it is the Banana not the hanging apples. Simply, laws of nature.

  159. Satya Deva says:

    This guy rajneesh has not only copied Osho’s name, he’s imitated his appearance, manner of speaking and gestures.

    Again I ask:
    Where is his acolytes’ common sense and discrimination?

    Are you all completely stupid?!

  160. shantam prem says:

    This guy rajneesh has not only copied Osho’s name, he’s imitated his appearance, manner of speaking and gestures.
    It is totally true.
    Yet SD, yone must not forget that it is the MARKET WORLD, which decides the shelf value of a product.

    In India during 1977, some Comrade in Power banned Coca Cola, so new products “77″ and Pepsi Cola with similar taste got the shelf space.Few years later Coke entered again with the bang once the Minister was out.

    People in mid forties to sixties have spend more than 30- 40 years around Osho. yet these rebellious souls did not squeek enough, when Chairman imposed His interpretation on the community. These people simply shift their direction to here and there and are living in a meditative indifference, thinking existence decides.
    The people who were in the primary school when Osho died are now the young seekers of this time.
    Also the vast population of Russian belt could not get the taste of real Osho, these people will follow instinctively someone who is coping the original.

    To Avoid these copy cats, solution was to keep Osho´s memory alive as an enlightened Master who left behind a sparkling way of life.
    BODY OF THE MASTER DIES; YET VISION, SPIRIT AND FOOT PRINTS REMAIN.
    Those who think it is a fucking eastern Belief, should think first, under what circumstances they went to these eastern belief mongers.
    Is it not the time to find way back home for Mr. O´ Leary, Herr Müller, Miss Carpenter!

  161. shantam prem says:

    Mr. Editor,
    Would you like to send the link of this thread to Krishna Prem for his concluding remarks.

  162. Satya Deva says:

    Why end the thread, SP?

    What are you concerned about/!

  163. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    To Avoid these copy cats, solution was to keep Osho´s memory alive as an enlightened Master who left behind a sparkling way of life.

    SD:
    Whether or not this is true, SP, nothing excuses rajneesh from taking on this false mantle.

    Because he’s not the ‘real deal’, he’s ‘false coin’, he will inevitably lead people astray.

    No matter how sincere he might be in his delusions of grandeur, no matter how spiritually hungry might be all those people you mention.

  164. shantam prem says:

    Because he’s not the ‘real deal’, he’s ‘false coin’, he will inevitably lead people astray.

    No matter how sincere he might be in his delusions of grandeur, no matter how spiritually hungry might be all those people you mention

    Satya Deva,

    What to do?
    This is part of every industry.
    Video Piracy, Brand Piracy.

    Lacoste T Shirt in 3 dollers, Rolex watch in 9.
    Indian gurus- Only on donation basis.

  165. Satya Deva says:

    Yes, rather well put there, SP…That’s actually how it feels.

  166. shantam prem says:

    Other countries have their own, Let me share slot one position in the catagory Copy cat Indian gurus.

    “Dera Sacha Sauda”
    (Truth Dealing Ashram)

    Please click on the images in Google of this title.
    Just feel what the pictures convey.
    The guy has followers in millions, willing to live, love die and kill at his command.

  167. Anand says:

    Let Swami Rajneesh go to Goa, start his cocom and give away all Osho meditations, Osho groups, trainings etc. for FREE.
    I guess he will be selling his bungalows with some profit and 40 acres is not such a big property.
    If the property is near the ocean it will attract a lot of people in Goa, so where is the harm?
    Rajneesh I heard inherited a big bunch of money and he likes to spend it on this project, great.
    Live and let live guys.
    Maybe he is nuts, or maybe his slow walking tuned him into something. When the pendulum swings too much to one side, then people appear on the other side too.

    Life is not only a mystery, but a comedy too.

  168. Prem Jashan says:

    SP: “Dera Sacha Sauda”

    I could not stop laughing looking at those pictures.. Sikhs can copy even a Roles Royce and make a Indian version of it..In a way they are making enlightenment as simple as possible..:) ha..ha..Sikhism seems to be better than many sick spiritual paths..

    SD:
    That’s where I’d take issue with you, PJ.

    Well, I hear what you are trying to say, SD. My point is the son of Warren Buffet doesn’t have to be as shrewd and dedicated as his dad. He just needs to make sure the values set by his father are followed so he can also retire as one of the richest guys. Same way, we have a foundation already set by Osho, people just need to have the right integrity to carry on the flame….

    PB: you guys give Sheela the run for her money..

    Aren’t we giving the fanatic religions and stupid politicians the run for everything now – the ecological system breakdown to nuclear power misuse to ethnic killings on enormous scale, mass conditioning of society by religions and jihadi vs crucades on and on..

    Aren’t we giving the Poona management team the run for self destruction..

    may be we need another Sheela but who has love and understanding for meditation. I will support even if Joseph Stalin comes back provided he understands Zen qualities . In order to accomplish classless society, communism had to create a class of leaders..but that should be only temporary..We need people who can step up and take the leadership..those who cannot, at least support them and the same time, make sure the leaders don’t rule the things as it happened with Sheela and Poona management..May be you should step up and write a book like Encyclopedia of SHITanica and dedicate it to Osho for a change. (:

  169. prem bubbie says:

    Amitabh—”achieved Samadhi in 1986…”, says who-you? speak for yourself…. S.D. Dawg… even more to tear down or burn down the Ashram… all of these dysfunctional religions have a physical center… Christians, jews, it’s Jerusalem, Muslims, Mecca; Hindus, one can say all of India/Ganges. Buddhists, depends which sect…. Get the point? Once you attribute a physical place or object to a religious person, people get attached to that place, that becomes their universe NOT the inner universe… What was Osho’s repeated discourses about attachment…. have you forgotten? But people with low self esteem and great desperation will attach themselves to almost anything– being gullible is a great character flaw for us humans. Common sense seems to be an asset that humans don’t want to use, go figure.. I think rajneesh is a demented fool, some things are so obvious…. the rest of you can find out the hard way…. Nature always weeds out the nimrods…not to worry!!! Who loves you rajneesh baby?!!!! Ciao Bella.

  170. prem bubbie says:

    Prem Jashan, Don’t you understand that one cannot force things to happen. A Josef Stalin?? You’re more demented than rajneesh.. you didn’t learn from the past mistakes, nor from Osho- not to force things, be loose and natural… another bonehead who forgot his masters words of advice…. brain damaged indeed!!! A great dictator with Zen qualities to subdue the animal like, unconscious masses, “another Sheela who has love and compassion”… HUH? That’s a contradiction in terms, an oxymoron….. What you are saying is we need a psycho with a heart of gold…. What a douche bag!!! Keep on meditating though, you might get it one day- once you meditate without your head up your ass!!!

  171. Chinmaya says:

    Dear All at this thread,

    You all are enlightened, having tasted and lived with Osho. Physically He is not available but in heart and mind, He is always with us.

    The topic of the thread is different than to what is coming up from the heart about each other. Mud- throwing on each other conveys lot of meanings to general readers and non-sanyasins and make a mockery of the messages.

    Each and everyone at this thread should make efforts to create Osho Centres in their respective cities, as is being created by Swami Rajneesh in Goa for the sake of Osho and Humanity at large, for this millenium and thereafter.

    What Swami Rajneesh is apparently to fellow travelers of Osho, on the Path of Meditation is not the question, the fact is that he has initiated to thoughts by taking First Step with the Foundation of Cocom. Forget all about his qualities; and appreciate him, with his this action and quality. At least, he has a large vision. In relationship, he is our brother, Osho being father of us all, on the path of Meditation.

    Let us be part of this new project, with the expansion of Osho disciples, being too much, being a large family, and needs another Ashram in India other than Pune, like the need arises with the expansion, from one couple to Parents, Grand Parents, and Great Grand Parents, so on and so forth.

    White Robe Brotherhood……….Long Live

  172. Prem Jashan says:

    PB: Osho-not to force things, be loose and natural

    You are going off tangentially again..No Osho meditation leader ( Rajaneesh et al) is forcing any thing ..they are loose and natural. If no one turns up at their event, they are not going to spoil their sleep as long as the local host turns up..

    I would like all the people who are condemning what meditation leaders are doing, to tell us what is the alternative way.. You cannot just keep on condemning.. you need to voice your alternative..

    if you listen : Communism, Zen Wind Zen Fire series, Osho talks about Utopia . Carl Marx doesn’t have any idea of spiritual equality, all he knows is economical and social equality. the missing piece of the puzzle is the spirituality..Yes, you are right. Osho did not support Stalin, but he also said without people like Stalin the real Utopia is a far away distant and final final thing that may happen .

    My Stalin does not have to kill anyone. he will make every one realize the dirty games of priests and politicians. he will make them aware that borders on the earth are drawn by the selfish murderers. if people wake up, borders will be wiped out, if borders are wiped out, all the money that is spent on military can be diverted for economic development. if global economy is good, majority of crime will be gone..then the invisible border around the man which is paralyzing him, the MARRIAGE is wiped out slowly too..then comes the stage where we need no uniformed person to control things ..the world becomes a commune, a utopia..

  173. Lokesh says:

    This guy rajneesh has not only copied Osho’s name, he’s imitated his appearance, manner of speaking and gestures.

    Yes, this is true and that is what makes Swami Rajneesh such a unique individual.

    Another quote………for the sake of Osho and Humanity at large, for this millenium and thereafter.

    It’s easy to say Swami Rajneesh is delusional, but this kind of statement is just that also. For the sake of Osho? The man has been dead for twenty years. How can any of this nonsense affect him? And the sake of humanity at large.zzzzzzz! What a load of absurdist rubbish…as if a wee meditation scene in Goa is really going to affect humanity at large. A change in the euro/dollar exchange rate might acomplish that but not a bunch of fools arguing the toss about what Osho’s vision incorporates when the master himself is discorporate.

    Now then, what has any of this to do with KP’s revelation that came about back in the early seventies, anyway. I mean to say positive TV has asked KP to share his knowledge of relationships with humanity at large and to quote KP he says, ‘And to this day, I don’t know anything about relationship!’
    Ehm…would somebody mind telling me what is going on around here. Not that I don’t know, but simply to satisfy my curiosity as to how other more enlightened beings see it.

  174. shantam prem says:

    Jesus was around three years in public line. No televison Cameras no still photography, no audio recordings, where one can hear Him cleaning the throat before speaking.
    Few people good in writing skills compiled his sayings and surrounding soical atmosphare and these notes put together became no. I best seller for centuries.
    Around Jesus´ image there are reported to be approximately 38,000 Christian denominations.

    It is inevitable. Many many many such denomination around Osho started up, the day Master´s body was taken to the burning ghat.
    Many are on the way.
    Who will create the best chartered way towards truth; nobody can say, after all comedy, tragedy, drama intrigue all are part of MYSTERY.

  175. shantam prem says:

    ‘And to this day, I don’t know anything about relationship!’

    Many of Swami´s who charted the Osho boat from the bigining will say something like this.

    MAy be one can modiffy such statement of 60, 70 years old in a more honest yet crude form.

    “To this day, I don´t know anything about relationships, but have love and sexual relations with numerous partners.”

  176. shantam prem says:

    Before i could know anything about relationship, A new and younger face entered the gateless gate, and inner life got the glimpse of flowering during the remaining months of the high season.

    She has to go to her bank job in Australia. I had a room in the ashram and was fully commited to my search.
    She wanted to leave her job and join me. I told her, no sweety, the path is two narrow for two.
    May be i miss the meaning but again a new and younger face entered the gateless gate*

  177. shantam prem says:

    Swami Prem Pujari, you have seen all the phases of Osho´s work.
    What you will suggest to the new comers?
    Meditate meditate meditate.

  178. Osho Cocom is not related with Rajneesh.
    Although its a different fact that its a brainchild of Rajneesh.

    Osho Cocom is going to be a center not only for Osho lovers but for seekers from all traditions.

    and as i have heard, The Commune functioning is going to be completely transparent and everyone will have the right to speak freely and contribute their ideas and energy creatively.

    In short, Rajneesh won’t be running this commune but the people who are part of the commune will be taking collective decision to run the commune.

    Teachers from any tradition are welcome to come there and speak or share his energy with seekers.

    All creative people and artist will be welcome there.

    So i say again, the commune is not about Rajneesh but it is more about creativity, freedom, love, meditation , samadhi…
    and where all these qualities will be there, Osho, Buddha and J Krishnamurti will be bound to be there.

    So lets look beyond small differences and work together to create a meditative and loving space in the commune.

    and if someone thinks that Rajneesh is an idiot then that guy is very much needed in the Commune to correct Rajneesh Vision and share his vision and valuable comments.

    As I heard, All sort of creative people are needed and welcome in the Osho Cocom Commune.

    love
    Amitabh

  179. shantam prem says:

    Criticisms apart, Amitabh tell Rajneesh, not to stop this project even for a second.

    Criticism is creative, Insults are destructive.
    I think those who want to share their voice on public platform can keep this in mind.

  180. Chinmaya says:

    Dear Swami Rajneesh

    Now, our Caravan is established.
    Ek Ek Kadam by Osho
    Here, Amitabh, Shantam, Me – Chinmaya

    Many more are joining soon……….

    Cheers……..

  181. criticis needs intelligence and sharpness
    to create deeper understanding
    then it is constructive and meaningful

    you can now decide about the caliber
    of those who are placing their vomitting
    comments and noise here of their own confusion

  182. Satya Deva says:

    Presumably, SP, the above advice re insults also applies to ‘enlightened one’ rajneesh and Amitabh.

    As according to them, both PB and I are “baboons” and “dodos”.

    Hilarious, eh?!

  183. Satya Deva says:

    swami rajneesh

    criticis needs intelligence and sharpness
    to create deeper understanding
    then it is constructive and meaningful

    you can now decide about the caliber
    of those who are placing their vomitting
    comments and noise here of their own confusion

    SD:
    One man’s “intelligence and sharpness” is another man’s “vomiting”, rajneesh.

    And, as I noted above, you’re not averse to the sick-bag yourself at times, are you?!

  184. Satya Deva says:

    Amitabh:
    and if someone thinks that Rajneesh is an idiot then that guy is very much needed in the Commune to correct Rajneesh Vision and share his vision and valuable comments.

    SD:
    However, rajneesh has corrected this noble tenet, adding:

    ‘If rajneesh approves of that person’.

    I suggest you ultrra-idealists go away and read Orwell’s ‘Animal Farm’ before you get too carried away with this dream of yours.

    And, btw, remember who will hold the purse-strings….

  185. Satya Deva says:

    Lokesh:
    And the sake of humanity at large.zzzzzzz! What a load of absurdist rubbish…as if a wee meditation scene in Goa is really going to affect humanity at large. A change in the euro/dollar exchange rate might acomplish that but not a bunch of fools arguing the toss about what Osho’s vision incorporates when the master himself is discorporate.

    SD:
    You got it, Lokesh!

    These guys are well-meaning, but basically deluded fools.

    Desperate too, as otherwise why should they take this fraud rajneesh at face value?

  186. Satya Deva says:

    Lokesh;

    SD:
    This guy rajneesh has not only copied Osho’s name, he’s imitated his appearance, manner of speaking and gestures.

    Lokesh:
    Yes, this is true and that is what makes Swami Rajneesh such a unique individual.

    SD:
    Or rather, perhaps, this is what makes rajneesh an extremely good actor?

  187. Satya Deva says:

    prem jashan:
    I love calling some one Osho Rajaneesh, because I love Osho. Actually everyone who loves Osho should apply for a name change and get Osho added to their name so Osho becomes most popular name in the world. Just out of love, why not.?

    SD:
    My God, what a pathetic, sheep-like statement.

  188. shantam prem says:

    Before Osho and after Him, i have not visited any Guru, any Shitsang, any thing with someone who is raising “Human consciousness.”
    If i have time and extra money, i will prefer Lap Dance!
    When life is tough and hard, why not use Prozac and Co. rather than looking pathetic and dumb before Ammas and Dadas.
    To free from ego does not mean to look like crumbled eggs.
    But there is a deep longing to share few laughter’s, jokes, friendly vibes and non formal suggestions with fellow travelers, who have shown a bit of opening towards the most misunderstood Master of our time, Osho.

    Poona was such a place and it was destined to be.
    But nobody thought cooks and pot cleaners will put their Nosy fingers in the soup. Interference of lower contaminated the higher.
    So if Rajneesh is trying to create something on the lines, it is worth appreciation. He may be clown but He is also one of those sannyasin who has got so much adoration in these years and has raised His fist against the well intentioned people at the base camp.
    Therefore If i am in Goa, i will not hesitate to visit Osho Cocom to show my appreciation.
    But goalless goal for me is to change cooks at Osho´s inner kitchen in Pune. Not because this 24 acres of real estate can change the world destiny but simply for the reason its uniqueness can inspire other cults,religions and social trends.

  189. Satya Deva says:

    Prem Jashan:
    may be we need another Sheela but who has love and understanding for meditation. I will support even if Joseph Stalin comes back provided he understands Zen qualities . In order to accomplish classless society, communism had to create a class of leaders..but that should be only temporary..We need people who can step up and take the leadership..those who cannot, at least support them and the same time, make sure the leaders don’t rule the things as it happened with Sheela and Poona management..May be you should step up and write a book like Encyclopedia of SHITanica and dedicate it to Osho for a change. (:

    SD:
    “Another Stalin” who “understands Zen qualities”, eh?!!

    A ‘Great Dictator’ who tells his millions of victims that life is only a dream anyway, as they stand in front of the firing squad, perhaps?!

    That has to be one of the most stupid comments I’ve ever seen in my life – seriously.

    Absolutely zero understanding, absolute childishness.

    You people seem to think all can be solved if only you have a place to congregate at. Another childish delusion…

    Perhaps you’ve learned very little from Osho, I don’t know…It certainly sounds that way at times, I’m afraid.

    Not saying you don’t mean well, just that you seem out of touch with ‘reality’.

  190. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    If i have time and extra money, i will prefer Lap Dance!
    When life is tough and hard, why not use Prozac and Co. rather than looking pathetic and dumb before Ammas and Dadas.
    To free from ego does not mean to look like crumbled eggs.

    SD:
    Rather a ‘self-ish’ statement there, SP!

    (‘self’ meaning ‘ego’, in your terms).

    Disapointingly superficial too, as if sannyas is a superior sort of ‘social club’. Maybe it is, for you and many others….

  191. shantam prem says:

    You can call it selfish, SD, I will say compassionate.
    I have time and money but do you think i go for Lap dancing?
    i am showing my appreciation for the people in non honourable profession, every time i visit my friend in Hamburg, religiously i make a round to Saint Pauli.

    And it is my firm conviction that the journey of spirituality is wide open and no one can say whether prostitute is closer to God or the Nun in Sarees!
    in this sense, i also don´t know whether Osho is a liberated soul or is send back to tilt the land in Central India.
    The way i understand sannyas, it is neither a social club nor dry fish Zen, neither it is a religion or a Bhakti or Shakti cult… may be it is all and yet nothing.

    Sannyas is a class act directed by Osho.
    (and now the light boys are holding the Camera.)

  192. Satya Deva says:

    “Compassionate”, SP? Condescendingly superior, perhaps?! I wouldn’t know, naturally…

    Whatever, your comment about meeting “hard times” with “Prozac & Co.” rather than Amma, for example, is foolishly shallow, frankly.

    You wouldn’t be one of the many who used and apparently still use, ‘sannyas’, simply as a vehicle for self-indulgence, ie ‘indulging the self’ (‘ego’, in your terms), would you?!

    Not that there’s anything ‘wrong’ in that, of course, but please don’t fool yourself you’re on some ‘grand spiritual quest’, just because you happen to have a ‘different’ name or call yourself a ‘disciple’ of Osho.

    Easy trap to fall into, don’t you think…?

  193. shantam prem says:

    Satya Deva
    Just thought while watching football that i am not against religious leaders per se, it is the Hype around them, the belief factor which not just turns me off but also it does not serve the purpose of taking spirituality to the level of science.
    If you see around, most of the people in this branch does not show much intelligence,cannot read beyond their family owned scriptures and by gathering few people around behave like world saviour.

    Naturally Jehovah the witness kind of concentrated energy has its own benefits; but lacks wider impact.

  194. Lokesh says:

    SP is still coming away with the usual exagerrated mumbo-jumbo. Quote: the most misunderstood Master of our time, Osho.
    Osho was relatively well understood. One of his main themes was express as opposed to supress. i.e. if you have a healthy sex life there will be no need to visit the Reeperbahn in Hamburg.
    Or was it that Osho did not do a very good job of making himself understood? Who knows and indeed who really cares? It is afterall history.
    My wife gets on to me, as wives do, about me wasting time on this blog, very little of late. She says, (sannyasin for 35 years), ‘Most of those people on there are the anti-thesis of what Osho was about. It’s all a mind trip. Talking about the past, like that silly old fart KP, who wants everyone to think he’s enlightened when in reality he is nothing more than some old guy reliving his past glories and parroting Osho’s words, which aren’t even that interesting half of the time. Don’t they ubderstand that Osho was coming from a place beyond the mind and that he wanted us to join him there? Bunch of losers…
    Oh oh….I have to go….here she comes and she’s swinging that zen stick of hers………….ouch!

  195. shantam prem says:

    Dear Lokesh, Who knows when i visit you people in Ibiza, may be your wife puts some salt in my Coffee to shake my status quo.

    Looking forward.

  196. Lokesh says:

    SP…Shake it baby, shake it! XXX

  197. shantam prem says:

    Not just the football, but the ritual before the game are quite interesting. For example, how the flags are brought in the stadium and tune of national anthems.
    I know many Sannyasins will show quite skepticism to such things.
    i also know there are many people who say what is the need to put candles etc. before making love.
    Billions of people in India make love in darkness and still the sperms hit the right target.

    Aesthetic has its own value. Rituals when become dogma has their own danger.

    i just want to refresh the memory that in 1988-89, Osho has invited the designers to create ashram Logo. The symbol of two swans flying high was chosen and this as a flag was raised at the doors of Lao Tzu.

    What happened to this flag?

    Has Osho specifically instructed to take this piece of cloth?
    Has this symbolism was withdrawn the way “Buddham Sharnam Gacchami” mantras were chosen during the ranch time and later on withdrawn.

    Point is when His people and the custodian of His work don´t like cut and paste with meditation techniques, than why to cut off those lamp post signs on the way.

    My suggestion is to Rajneesh and others who are going to create centres and ashrams to raise this Osho flag again as a token of GRATITUDE.
    To avoid the hysteria from those who think it is creating religion and religion is Scheisse, one can add disclaimers with many things connected with Osho.

  198. prem bubbie says:

    Prem Jashan: “My Stalin will not have to kill anyone, he will MAKE them realize the dirty games… he will MAKE them aware…”, sounds like forcing people to me!!!! How about giving it some thought before you write something? Or are your true intentions being exposed?

  199. prem bubbie says:

    shantam prem: Insults are creative, unless you are not aware of your true self. We are ALL jokes created by the cosmos. Insults bring a sharp swift answer to stupidity and unconsciousness. Since you are a supposed expert on Osho, you would know. Or are you?

  200. prem bubbie says:

    I’m glad these characters are posting, it’s nice to expose them for who and what they are… Too bad we didn’t have this venue back in the good old ’70′s and 80′s!! It would have saved many lives!!! OK… back to the present….. Who’s next?

  201. prem bubbie says:

    SP: Still suck on objects!! Who gives a shit about this “flag”… Wake up you bonehead!!!

  202. prem bubbie says:

    SUCK= STUCK……

  203. Satya Deva says:

    This apparent fixation on outer forms, rituals, symbols: flag, ashram, mass celebrations, and so on…

    Isn’t it evidence of a wish – surely born from insecurity – to belong to something, something ‘meaningful’, something altogether greater than one’s little self…

    Such minds would very likely rather start a new religion than cultivate ‘religiousness’.

    But would be unlikely to agree with this, of course….

  204. shantam prem says:

    SD, it is an exploration to see different points, inspirations and apprehensions.
    Also the impact of our collective DNA. Lotus will be lotus where ever it is, kind of examples.

    The managers in the ashram are not writing communicating, so when few people like you share their thoughts, it gives a hint how the refined western mind thinks.

    Let us say this paragraph of yours, “Isn’t it evidence of a wish – surely born from insecurity – to belong to something, something ‘meaningful’, something altogether greater than one’s little self…”

    Have you not seen that it was used hundred thousand of times whenever someone from the west went to take sannyas.

    If few people want to create fragrance without flowering, they must go for it but why to play big daddy for others. Many of small minded people,the way seeds are, would like to grow, branches throans, leaves etc. so that rose grows and with it the fragrance of religiousness.

  205. shantam prem says:

    And Bro, may be you can see the fact also that Huggy Amma and other few dozens are humbly proud HINDUS.
    Their terminology, their psychology is loaded with Hindu myths and thoughts. You must have seen the photos of gods and godesses around them.

    Dalai Lama belongs to Buddhist religion.

    And i have no intention to influence your or anyone else mind but the way human race has devleloped, freedom of different kind of ways and thoguhts need to be accomodated.

  206. frank says:

    well,i`m glad that lokesh`s wife has finally stepped in to offer a bit of much-needed commonsense.

    i have said it before and i`ll say it again,that if osho ,instead of pulling a wafty southern softy chick,had got himself a proper down-to-earth no-nonsense,no-frills,bread and dripping,grit butty munching,does-what-it-says-on-the-tin northern girl,things could have been so different:

    “and what time do you call this?and where the bloody `ell `ave you been?
    the dentist? pull the other one.
    what do you mean,he did?
    that`s the third time today,and you were there at 6 in the morning yesterday.no-one `s got that many teeth in their `ead.
    d`you think i was born yesterday?
    your curry`s in the bin,now sit down and watch some telly.
    “dynasty” `s on,you like that,thats where you get your wardrobe tips isnt it?
    what`s those videos you`ve got there?
    patton? the ten commandments?
    what,again?
    bloody `ell what is it with you and macho overbearing leading men?
    and what`s that you`re reading?
    the rolls royce catologue?
    bloody `ell,have you seen the gas bill?
    it`s 55 million dollars!!
    and don`t you “dont be vorried” me,or you`ll hear the sharp end of it,i promise you.
    by the way, that secretary of yours called by today when you were out with her mate that fat blonde slag.they wanted to fix the wiring or something.i told them to booger off,bent as nine bob notes, those two,wouldn`t trust `em as far as i could throw`em .i don`t know what you see in her.
    if you listen to her ,it wont be just the tibetans putting you away for the next seven hundred years,i can tell you.
    saw your doctor today.he was flat on his face in the street clutching an empty bottle of bombay gin .he didn`t look very healthy to me.are you sure he`s got your pills right?
    i heard that you said its good that you dont have to pretend to be enlightened any more.that`s nice,so now you`re back to unenlightenedness maybe you can remember to stop leaving your dirty towels and socks around the place…..a bit of awareness would be nice.
    oh,i heard you were on telly bosting about how manybirds you`ve shagged.
    who do you think you are?,dick rambone,or what?
    well,you and i know its bollocks,but i wouldn`t encourage those daft disciples of yours if i were you….they already think they`re god`sgift to women,and if you egg `em on ,they`ll justend up as bald geezers still on the pull at seventy and writing stories about “hippy chicks i shagged on the hippie trail”, and trying to pass themselves off as wise old owls…
    how sad would that be..? “

  207. Satya Deva says:

    Welcome back, Frank!

  208. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem, are you wanting to start a new religion?

    At least the Poona management seem intent on avoiding that sort of disaster.

    I recall Osho saying he’d prefer to be remembered as “a nobody”….

  209. Chinmaya says:

    Satya Deva

    Please………your intention is pure and good to refer to the statement of Osho, but you analyse, it says -

    prefer to be remembered……means, He does not want to be forgotton rather He goes deep in our heart to remember Him, day in and day out. In your above message, in this thread, you mentioned -

    a nobody…….includes a body, because without a body, there exist not a nobody. And when you refer and say, ” I recall Osho saying he prefers”………means He is first all else are afterwards, unless they are (we all)enlightened. And definitely, for us, He is first………because He is our Master………you have expressed the Truth, it means, you are a man of Truthful nature and nearing Enlightenment. Who knows, you are enlightened already.

    Love……….

  210. Amano says:

    Jashn, Other day you asked me good question if sannyasnews has any impact on pune management.
    As long as i know pune management , Its a body of few very un senstive , money minded people . all they care about money. and here on this websites we ,most of time talk about feelings and osho and meditation.most of time

    i do not think they care a bit about what goes in sannyasins heart and being, otherwise thinghs would be so bad there right now.
    if our site has little impact on them, thinghs would be diffrent. and better now.
    those ruthless ,cunning people has turn a beautiful place into some third rate resort . so my feeling is no, sannyasnews has no impact good or bad whatsoever

  211. Satya Deva says:

    Chinmaya – hello!

    That statement by Osho was made, apparently, on his deathbed (ok, his ‘leaving the body’ bed!), and was reported by someone there at the time (Amrito?), as Osho’s response to being asked how he’d like to be remembered.

    Whether he said “I’d prefer”, I’m not sure, that would have to be researched, but maybe it doesn’t matter that much anyway, if at all.

    But surely Osho was directing us to the fundamental truth, of him and of everyone, ie that ultimately he was/is ‘nobody’, ‘no body’, arising, most mysteriously, from ‘nothing’, ‘no thing’…

    Otherwise, how could he possibly be ‘dissolved in his sannyasins’ ( which only means that he goes, after his ‘death’, wherever he is loved, as we all do, I’m told)?

    Or be ‘dissolved in the sky, trees, flowers’ etc. ie in God-made Nature’?

    So, I’d disagree with you that he was suggesting that we remember him primarily as a person, as a ‘personality’, in fact I’d say that he was tending the other way, to remind us of reality, to loosen attachment to the body, whether his, other people’s, or our own

    Lastly, I’d like to make it clear that I am utterly ‘unenlightened’, very likely the least ‘enlightened’ on this forum/blog, so please don’t burden me with that nonsense!
    Such misplaced flattery will get you nowhere, I assure you!!
    (But hopefully you were being ironic?!).

    Lastly number 2: You’re not Swami Yoga Chinmaya, by any chance, one of Osho’s oldest disciples, one of the very first Indians I met when I first entered the ashram in July ’75?
    (I bet you’re not, but have to ask!).

  212. frank says:

    amano,
    of course all kinds of sannyas vips secretly read jackassnews.
    they quietly giggle and thrill to portrayals of amrito as the pantomime drunk,pulling up his robe and waving his buttocks at hard-core neo hindu neo sannyasin marble kissers,slurring:
    “i`ll give you something to kiss”
    while his mate jayesh stands in the background waving wads of 100 dollar notes and taunting the complaining losers still stuck in poverty consciousness.
    and why not?
    how else would you run a religionless religion?

  213. shantam prem says:

    Satya Deva, think in this way, you have borrowed money to someone. few days later when you ask the amount back, comes the sutra,” My God, SD, you are clinging with the past. The past which is no more. why can´t you live here and now”

    We as a people can be very clever. Some one wants to fuck in the ass but give the excuse, “Just trying unexplored ways of procreation.”

    If i have heard Osho saying, “i want to be rembered as nobody” and believe this is the zist of His messgae, ” I will try not to mention even the spellings of OHSO.

    If Amrtio has heard this, why two decades of His precious life he has wasted around Poona, specially when UK requires many GPs.

    Out of context words and meanings are good for comedy but not as remedy,

  214. frank says:

    comedy is the remedy.

    so bring on the doppelganger……..

    brian rajneesh

    he`s not the messiah…..

    but that video of him doing the silly walk with the inmates of the lithuanian electro-shock hospital is a cracker.

    lmao

  215. shantam prem says:

    Shantam Prem, are you wanting to start a new religion?

    At least the Poona management seem intent on avoiding that sort of disaster.

    I think that part of western intelligentsia need collective therapy which is still hooked with the idea of disaster with the world Religion.

    Religion as per se is inspiring, too much power in the hands of the priests was the problem.
    And as west and its intelligence has always found the ways to sort out the problems in creative ways, religion and religiousness can embrace each other.Priests and their doctrines are no more powerful. Advent of Bikini has put the Burqa over the priesthood.
    First prerequisite of frigid religions is, a set of frozen rules and rituals.
    Pundits in resort have done this.
    Many of us have seen a jungle turning into a garden.
    These words of mine are the cry of someone who has seen Amazon Forest getting robbed by the local land Mafia and foreigner timber traders.

  216. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    If i have heard Osho saying, “i want to be rembered as nobody” and believe this is the zist of His messgae, ” I will try not to mention even the spellings of OHSO.

    If Amrtio has heard this, why two decades of His precious life he has wasted around Poona, specially when UK requires many GPs.

    Out of context words and meanings are good for comedy but not as remedy,

    SD:
    I don’t think you understand what I wrote there, SP. Suggest you re-read it.

    To assist you:
    To remember Osho as a “nobody”, does not mean to abandon his work or inspiration.

    On the contrary, it brings the truth to the forefront, rather than any attachment or even ‘addiction’ to the personality or man he appeared as.

  217. Satya Deva says:

    Well, my question to you would be:

    Why can’t you live whatever truth you’ve gained (if any) from sannyas and Osho, just living an ordinary life ‘in the world’?

    Why this clinging to the past, this attachment to a place, however great it used to be?

    Ever thought you might be up against that in yourself, ie up against a sort of death and your unwillingness to deal with it, except by denial?

  218. Satya Deva says:

    frank (re ‘brian rajneesh’):
    but that video of him doing the silly walk with the inmates of the lithuanian electro-shock hospital is a cracker.

    SD:
    Could you provide a link for this comic masterpiece, please, frank?

  219. shantam prem says:

    Frank, why just to foucs on Rajneesh.
    it may sound academic bullshit, my idea is to write an article, ” Comparative study about the neo Oshoists in the public life.”
    Something like Amrito, Neelam, Keerti, Chitanya Bharti, Samdarshi, Samarpan, Dolano, Tyohar, Pyar, Akhil, Shailandra and the best seller and favouirte of many like You, Mr. Rajneesh. Their methodology in one pot can be a good soup.
    If you have reverence for any of such,please, let me know. As a courtesy i can write HH (His holiness) with their name.

  220. shantam prem says:

    ….Just living an ordinary life ‘in the world’?

    Not just in the world but in a very foreign world i am living this ordinary life. I will say, it is His blessings that nothing looks foreign any more. The marvelous churches in their glorious emptiness are not less inspiring than the Buddha Hall.
    Most of my friends are man and woman without esoteric Indian names. If i ever speak about Osho it is only when they toss some name.

    And also I don´t think writing at Sannyasnews is a very heroic act or great spiritual seekers are better than the teachers, post people, farmers, labourers etc.

    whatever truth you’ve gained (if any) from sannyas and Osho, just living an ordinary life ‘in the world’?

    May be this is one of the truth i have learnt therefore i am writing.
    Should i be like Primal or Turiya, Miten or Milarepa to get high marks from you?

    Perhaps this is one of the truth that i have learnt that Shantam may not be as ordinary or remarkable as SD think it could be, but it must not stop us to hug when we meet.

  221. Satya Deva says:

    No, SP, I wouldn’t have any such exalted expectations of anyone, not at all.

    All I asked there concerned living an ordinary life ‘in the world’ and you’ve answered it satisfactorily. Many cogratulations (certificate in the post).

    But you haven’t addressed my other query, re “clinging to the past”, have you?

    Why is that, please?

  222. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:

    Satya Deva, think in this way, you have borrowed money to someone. few days later when you ask the amount back, comes the sutra,” My God, SD, you are clinging with the past. The past which is no more. why can´t you live here and now”

    SD:
    So, you feel cheated, as if something’s been stolen from you, something precious that you loved and were ‘attached’ to?

    Well, SP, The Grim Reaper, in all his various forms, does tend to have that sort of effect on people….

  223. Chinmaya says:

    BEAUTIFUL OILY PITCHERS

  224. prem bubbie says:

    Lokesh, Sounds like you’re a bit pussy whipped!!! Did your wife get her expertise by working as a dominatrix during the Pune 1 years? Amazing to still find out what the Gang at Pune 1 made women do to pay for their stay at the ashram!! When is your birthday? I’ll send you a diamond studded collar and a 18 carat leash…Makes for one hellava picture!!! Just a note: We’re all a bunch of losers, what else could we be for choosing our current life as humans? Anytime we write, speak or whatever else we use our minds, that’s where we are, in the head. so, your wife telling you her opinion is also a loser! 35 years as a sannyasin-all wasted time!!! Phew!!! Tell her I said that, Bring her on!!!

  225. Anand says:

    hey Bubbie the old fart brain is on the loose again. He must have got some days off from his jail time in Portland.
    Still trying to educate the left overs from the neo sannyas
    to let go of their devotion to Osho and follow him into the Oregonian wilderness and pick ants for breakfast.
    Huuh how ghastly, we are soooo insulted by his foouul language.

  226. shantam prem says:

    To continue the discussion further, “Clinging to the past”.
    Hardly one hear such thing in connection with Buddha, Jesus, Krishna, Nanak Etc.
    I will add Osho in this category of people, not because i wish to add, but whenever He spoke about such people, as a gentleman He was leaving the space for His presence.
    Few dozen others want also to join this club. Their disciples have the same right though i am not interested.

    The two gentle ladies you mentioned are the end product of clinging to the past from head to toe. it gave them the foundation to be flowered in their own right.

  227. shantam prem says:

    http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/top-vatican-priest-accused-sexually-abusing-sons/story?id=10968647

    A prominent Catholic priest, praised by Pope John Paul II as “an efficacious guide to youth,” Father Marcial Maciel, sexually abused not only young seminarians under his control but also abused his own children, according to a lawsuit filed today in Connecticut by a man who claims to be Maciel’s son.

    May be such kind of news have created a deep repulsion in people´s mind about the religions.
    But again it is not the religion but the Custodians of that school of faith.

    Therefore the control mechanism, the remote controler of check and balance should remain in the hands of the people.

    In Sannyasins case, it is even more important because these people came with the idea of new and better world, also are quite intelligent and not blind followers type.

  228. shantam prem says:

    Anand, it seems you are liking your job to tighten the screws of Bubbie whenever they go nuts.

    On the other side, i am curious how a day passes in Bubbie´s life. What he does for living, what he reads, what kind of friends he has and when was the last time Bubbie used the drill machine to make hole in the wall.

  229. Lokesh says:

    Love Bubble (Prem Bubbie). You really hurt my feelings, boohoo. More, please more, I love it, I love it, ooh YES!

  230. Lokesh says:

    Anand, leave Love Bubble alone, he’s mine, all mine!

  231. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    May be such kind of news have created a deep repulsion in people´s mind about the religions.
    But again it is not the religion but the Custodians of that school of faith.

    Therefore the control mechanism, the remote controler of check and balance should remain in the hands of the people.

    SD:
    A very flawed point, SP.

    The religion and its “custodians” can not be separated so easily (except in the mind!).

    I strongly suggest you review the history of religions, how they have inevitably and thoroughly degenerated from the original inspiration, the original Master.

    And btw, Masters don’t create religions, that’s the domain of
    well-meaning, but ignorant, desperate followers.

  232. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    The two gentle ladies you mentioned are the end product of clinging to the past from head to toe. it gave them the foundation to be flowered in their own right.

    SD:
    On the contrary, I’d say these “two gentle ladies” went straight to the Source for their inspiration, certainly not to any priests.

    Mother Meera, for example, began to have spiritual realisations as a small child.

    And Amma caused much upset among her family and village by being ‘different’ as a child and teenager. So much so that at one point she contemplated suicide.

  233. Satya Deva says:

    Chinmaya:

    BEAUTIFUL OILY PITCHERS

    SD:
    What’s baseball got to do with this, please?!

  234. Satya Deva says:

    Chinmaya composing homo-erotic fantasies in his sleep, perhaps?!

    Maybe on the wrong blog…?!

  235. shantam prem says:

    Just the other day i have seen a video of 8 years girl in Andhra Pardesh, who is worshiped as a goddess Deity. She is well versed in religious scriptures and can speak in English and French and thinks she was a best friend of Dalai Lama.
    She was on the news because city administration wants to put her in the school as a part of compulsory schooling.
    Famous sex guru Nityananda is just in early thirties and rules the religious empire. He has also from the childhood direct line with divine.

    Make a tour of South India and you can see after every one million some soul like this.

    Past life seeds getting flowered now or one can say; god, Goddess have got incarnation to help man kind.

    Who knows many sannyasins will get birth in wholesale and one can see their youtube videos when they are in their Pampers, ” Few minutes laughing, few minutes crying and than sitting silently.”

    I am not doubting the contribution and higher connection of these people, but for majority of Indians it is an every day event, therefore the tours of such people in the western market.
    For India it is as normal as for Switzerland to have 221700 Dollar millionares and for USA, 2.87 Million such people.
    Still founders of IKEA; Wallmart or Aldi will remain class apart. Same is about Tagore, J Krishnamurti, Osho.

  236. shantam prem says:

    SD:
    So, you feel cheated, as if something’s been stolen from you, something precious that you loved and were ‘attached’ to?

    Well, SP, The Grim Reaper, in all his various forms, does tend to have that sort of effect on people….

    As of now, i feel cheated only by one of my cousins, who mismanaged my parents assets in my absence and resulted in big loss. My heart bleeds as i trusted him more than his children can trust him, still i will not go on pressing key board for this reason,

    May be i was looking for some justified cause to relate, stand for and fight and here is The One.
    May be i was looking for deeper friends in the sannyas circle and through our sharing, i am getting few. May be You, me and others will never agree for a single point, still it has a bonding value.
    It is out of this feeling, whenever i listen Osho in Hindi, a deep desire arises that His western people could also enjoy that height what one can express through words.
    Just today, i heard the discourse saying somthing like, ” friends you can choose any but chose opponents(enemies) carefully and preferably the stronger ones because this kind of conflicts will sharpen you”

    So the idea is very clear.To change the strategy of Supply chain Management at 17, Koregaon Park. The intention of the people running the business there is very Nobel,
    But with my kind of interpretation, end product will touch people´s life just like cool breeze, just like poetry, The melody will be closer to the original.

  237. Lokesh says:

    Shantam Prem. Do you have a life that extends anywhere beyond these web pages?

  238. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam Prem:
    But with my kind of interpretation, end product will touch people´s life just like cool breeze, just like poetry, The melody will be closer to the original.

    SD:
    Just like Osho, eh, SP?!

    That’s your basic mistake: It can not be done…

    Only an inferior version is possible. And for evidence, just look at rajneesh….

  239. shantam prem says:

    Thanks for asking about my life, Lokesh. It is slow like an art movie yet emotionally it is expanded in five cites of 3 countries.
    Because i am passionate about Osho and sannyas, so at present sannyasnews is a right channel to go on writing my commentary.There are people who spend their whole life watching stars or hitting some kind of ball with some kind of stick or writing columns in the web pages.
    And also you know, the saying, “People who are busy have more time.”

  240. Satya Deva says:

    Shantam P{rem:
    Who knows many sannyasins will get birth in wholesale and one can see their youtube videos when they are in their Pampers, ” Few minutes laughing, few minutes crying and than sitting silently.”

    SD
    God help us all, SP!!

    Very funny!

  241. shantam prem says:

    SD, this no one can say whether you are on a higher lane than Rajneesh or shantam is not even, in the waiting list of higher Chakras, yet we all have our approach towards the Master.
    As i see, Rajneesh wants to open a new unit of a product, he has seen and was part of this in Poona.
    Shantam just wish to revive the dead unit which has lost its shine.
    In the ashram everybody is one among the thousands, as super star is only Osho. More or less, this is true even in resort.
    May be in Osho Cocom, Rajneesh will be a supportive star with Osho. And i am not jealous about this. Let thousands of people open their centers, ashrams, communes.
    And also i will say, it is blessing for those, who are willing to create a hut for the Master who is used to the Royal comforts. Inferior version is still much better than the indifference.

  242. shantam prem says:

    SD, I think you have seen this you tube hit. Brazilian boy in Pampers doing Samba and same aged Indonasian boy chain smoking.
    Life is a funny game. Who knows this smoking boy in the past life was a CEO of Phillip Morris.

  243. Satya Deva says:

    As I’ve said here before, SP, I wouldn’t trust rajneesh an inch, he’s self-evidently a fraud.

    You too have expressed reservations about him, so how you can remain optimistic about any scheme in which he plays a major role is completely beyond me. You must simply be ‘desperate’. Well-meaning, of course, but deluded.

    And anyway, any hope of ‘recreating the energy of Poona 1 or 2′ is necessarily doomed to failure. Something roughly similar might be set up, but in essence it’ll be lacking.

    But I guess you lot will have to discover this the hard way….

  244. Satya Deva says:

    But maybe you and a lot of others will be satisfied enough with just a sort of ‘spiritual social club’…?

  245. shantam prem says:

    Ok Satya Deva, let us cross fire.
    When was the last time you were in Poona?
    in 1975, 85, 95 or 2005?
    I have never used this term, recreating the energy of Poona 1 or 2.
    Ashram in the form of resort is still existing. My purpose of criticism is to make it even more people friendly but the way it is; Is still the Master´s garden.
    You are very much used to the concept of living Master.
    Experiment sake Check in Google
    (1) Oneness University
    (2) Gurumaa
    Both these places are hugely successful, and surely living masters are there.
    Spend few days in the three places. Join all the activities. And tell sincerely which place has the atomic potential, which place is truly a Buddhafield.

  246. shantam prem says:

    Even if you say, Poona has no magic because the master is gone and the cool godly motherly breeze makes your heart heal, when you are with this or that mother, won´´t it be appropriate to ENJOY the mama and get nurtured and find the interesting group in your brotherhood.
    Why to hang around with the people who are past focused. Once a child has found new parents leaves the orphanage too.
    Do you as a senior sannyasin who has spoken personally with Osho in Poona 1 days, what you will prefer to offer to young people who want to make their own experiences, who want to chase their inner pictures and longings and get robbed or rewarded on the way.
    Rajneesh may be fraud in your experienced eyes but look at the photos of people around Him, do you think they are all Kaput brains?
    if you are not feeling hungry does not mean new restaurants should not get open. Just because you have no fever does not mean, chemists shops are not needed.

  247. Satya Deva says:

    Look SP, I’m not stupid or mean enough to want to deny anyone their opportunities, but I’m simply pointing out certain things I regard as true and others I regard as sentimentally false. Understandable maybe, but still false, misguided.

    And as far as I can see, anyone who sticks around rajneesh and takes him seriously has to be lacking in discrimination and common sense, whatever they may look like, however ‘intelligent’ they might otherwise be.

    The idea of ‘re-creating the energy of Poona 1/2′ was put forward here a few days ago, by the way. Fair enough if it wasn’t by you. Good for you if you don’t adhere to this foolish notion.

  248. Lokesh says:

    Anyone who has a notion to try and recreate the energy of Poona One was obviously not there. Having experienced over six years of it, I can assure you that it was something which does not require a repeat performance. Once was enough.
    You can’t stand in the same part of a river twice, let alone the gulf stream.

  249. shantam prem says:

    Once was enough, may be for those who were part of it.
    Any way the time and social trends are different.
    Will the bell bottom ever come again. Will there be again a movement called burn the Bra, will there be again a time when men feel to rebel against too much materialism and drop their business suit for Lungi and women show their arm pits hair as a sign of identity, “So i am.”

  250. shantam prem says:

    Lokesh and Satya Deva are the senior most sannyasins here wih no non sense appoarch.

    I request them to share their expertise, their consultancy skills, how to make Osho´s work more effective, what they will suggest to Mr. Chairman.

  251. Lokesh says:

    Ehm…well…how about being here now for a start. Sounds easy, yet it is for many the most difficult.

  252. Satya Deva says:

    Good start (and end) there – sorry, here – Lokesh…

    Meanwhile, as Paul Newman once said, “just getting through the day” is the limit of my expertise on this matter…

    ‘Business’ has never been my forte….

  253. shantam prem says:

    Teacher asked the first graders, ” Let me see who can tell Alphabets without mistake.
    Only Chota” Lokesh could answer correctly, ” A to Z.”

  254. Chinmaya says:

    We should never be proud for what we are and the position we hold. Because after the game of chess, the king and soldiers go into the same box.

  255. Anand says:

    I agree with Lokesh that Pune 1 is going down the river of time and needs no repeat. The seventies were just that, the seventies.
    Pune 2 was a much different experience of a more evolved sannyas community around Osho, we all did grow through the years with Osho.

    Now it is even twenty years later. Many of the old sannyasins went with other masters (see Lokesh), like Ramana Maharshi, Lucknow. Miracle of Love etc.

    Where are we standing now? Many of the old sannyasins have been dying or are getting closer to it.
    What are our challenges now?

    Dwelling into the dead past does not bring us anywhere.
    The past is dead. We can look at old pictures and videos and get nostalgic, but being alive Here-Now as an Osho sannyasin is in my opinion the only way to BE.

    And Shantam Prem, as much as I enjoy reading your attacks on the Pune management to wake up, why not accept the situation at the Resort as what it is. It is there for new people to experience. We had our time there, and it was beautiful.

  256. Lokesh says:

    Anand, you ask, What are our challenges now?
    In regards the world there are many bur as for yourself there is only one.
    In the early days of sannyas there was much emphasis on witnessing. Osho was right to point in this direction. He was right because witnessing is essential in recognizing the self from the not-self. Okay. so far so good.
    If you keep witnessing a day will arrive when the question arises, who or what is it that is witnessing the witness?
    To answer that question is the only thing that ultimately matters and, if you care about such things, the only real challenge.

  257. shantam prem says:

    It seems, here and now and witnessing is the latest discovery, just one before the I Pad.

    OSho has spoken intensively about it, not one but dozens of active meditations were designed for this specific purpose.
    Any casual reader of Osho can find out within a week that with meditation Osho is making us aware about our social system too, its power hierarchy in religious and corporal matters .
    It should not be forgotten that other than speaking on mystics, He has spoken also about basic human right charter.
    and also he lost the worshiping of millions of Indians, the moment he spoke about the relationship matters.
    This multi dimensional approach is a quite challenging work, easy is to dilute Him so that He fits with Shri Raman or Punji ji kind of advaita Masters or as a sub sub sect of Zen.
    Watching watching watching and than to be free from the wheels of life and death.
    It is one of the non violent and aesthetic approach to reduce the population on earth.

  258. shantam prem says:

    And Shantam Prem, as much as I enjoy reading your attacks on the Pune management to wake up, why not accept the situation at the Resort as what it is. It is there for new people to experience. We had our time there, and it was beautiful.

    Yes..Anand it was beautiful and through my writing i am trying to pay back, a fraction of that.
    On one level we have come quite forward from cassette recorder to MP3 players, yet on other level, things have taken a retro turn.
    Someone has to open the mouth shamelessly.

    May be my approach is too emotional, too Indian-ised, But the intention is to record the Post Osho days without malefic and favour.

  259. Chinmaya says:

    Dear Shantam,

    Your expression are grandeur
    Your thoughts are original for Pune
    Your heart bubbles by recollecting Pune-1
    Your contributions memorise you
    Your sitting with Osho echo you
    Your love for friends cherish you
    Your duties done have great impact

    But some people are born with stony heart with Oily Pitchers Mind and will have least effects, that is why

    Osho said, in China, the Chinese Master used to sit with his disciples, facing wall instead of disciples, with a notion that chances are that Wall may listen whereas he had no hopes that his disciples would listen.

    Yahooooo……….

  260. shantam prem says:

    Thanks Chinmaya,
    When generals are sleepong over the Book of Tactics, foot soldiers have to take the command.

  261. Lokesh says:

    ‘Osho said, Osho said, Osho said….’ This mantra has proved over time to be entirely ineffective.

  262. Chinmaya says:

    Leave the thread, go home because your mind needs rest. This forum is for Osho people. God bless.

  263. frank says:

    god?
    f***ing hell
    how did he get back in?
    surely we got rid of that waste of space long ago?

    i`m outahere.

  264. shantam prem says:

    Osho said, Osho said or we are hearing for many centuries….” It is written in Bible”, Krishna Says in Geeta…” or It is written in US constitution….. Fact is when one plays the game few rules and coaching guidelines are there to follow.

    In Bible and Geeta, there is much room for thousands of interptations, But with Osho because of clear prose and public life recorded in Videos, there is not much space to match and Mix.

    Chinmaya, When you write, this forum is for Osho people and rest should go home, keep in mind, most probably you will also not be here.

    If you have not seen love for Osho in Lokesh, Frank or even in Prem Bubbie´s comments, i think it is time for you to work or get Macdonald´d Franchise; every day every where burger and the people taste the same.
    For expansion of business, get the colobration with Osho friends or Osho foundation International.

  265. BeLoved Krishna Prem, as so often you leave me behind with sweet tears behind my eyes, love in my heart and a smile from cheek to cheek…

  266. Satya Deva says:

    shantam prem

    Thanks Chinmaya,
    When generals are sleepong over the Book of Tactics, foot soldiers have to take the command.

    SD:
    You mean, a bit like when John Terry publically questioned Fabio Capello’s tactics and selection policy the other day? (Re England football team in World Cup, for the uninitiated).

    Well, it don’t always work, son, does it? (JT had to apologise, after none of the players was prepared to support him!).

  267. Satya Deva says:

    Chinmaya:
    But some people are born with stony heart with Oily Pitchers

    SD:
    My God (sorry, Frank), are you still going on about baseball?

    Sorry, Chin, if you’re going to pollute this serious, spiritual forum with your homo-erotic fantasies, it’s time you turned round and went home yourself.

    But, hang on – your English isn’t exactly perfect – maybe you’re talking about inheriting oil paintings?

    Nice work, if you can get it….(And you can get it if you try)….

  268. Chinmaya says:

    Hahahahahaha.
    Thanks dear Satya Deva.
    You are very interesting person.

    Shantam dear,
    Alas, you could read the msg in good spirits.

  269. Satya Deva says:

    I do try very hard to be “interesting”, Chinnie, it’s hard work for folks like me…

    Anyway, good on you!

  270. frank says:

    god
    and then football…?
    actually there are some simlarities between meditation and football.
    indians,like the english with football,think that because they invented it,have got some god-given right to be good at it.
    actually they`re crap
    ,in fact,they haveboth been in terminal decline since the 1960s, clinginging to worn-out useless formulas and hackneyed training excercises.
    sure,you get guys going on about ramana maharshi and so on,but arenet they just like those old guysyou get in pubs going on about stanley mathews?
    its time indians woke up to the fact,like the english with football,that other countries simply do better than them and stop clinging to the past…..

  271. frank says:

    and don`t forget the legendary georgie gurdjieff.
    he never got to strut his stuff on the world stage,but he was the tacical mastermnd whose ground-breaking tactics really preceded and made possible oshos worldcup,or was it universe cup winning sides of the 70s and 80s.

  272. frank says:

    let`s face it,the modern day osho movement just doesnt get through the qualifying rounds.
    the all-white kit never fired the imagination
    and that really doesnt look set to change…
    the only candidates for manager are drunks,guys with psychiatic delusions…

    time to find a new game?
    yeah

    “football is dead”
    —nobby nietzsche

  273. Lokesh says:

    It has by now been established that ‘Osho said’ just about everything that a man can say. I’ve been listening to people say ‘Osho said’ for over 30 years and all they succeed in doing is make themselves look dumb. Why? Because whatever Osho said you can find something that more or less contradicts it. Please don’t ask me to proove that because it would be too boring a task.
    My point is that for a master who constantly indicated that the real message he had to convey was contained in the space between his words, no matter how fascinating they might appear, there are a hell of a lot of parrots around on the Osho scene today.
    Osho’s discourses were principally a device to draw people into an inner space where silence might happen. Any real seeker understands that. It is only a fool who becomes attached to the finger pointing at the moon. Osho actively encouraged his non-Hindi speaking sannyasins to attend Hindi discourses so that the message could be understood because his real message had nothing to do with words and the real language he communicated in was one which could be understood universally.
    When I read self-righteous comments such as Chinmaya’s: (Leave the thread, go home because your mind needs rest. This forum is for Osho people. God bless.) I do indeed see how some people who are attracted to sannyas today understand so little about what the game was originally about. So to speak such peoples’ language I will share a little something which Osho once said to me personally. ‘When I am gone the people who were afraid to approach me while alive will begin to show up.’ He never spoke truer words. Osho lovers my hairy Scottish ass!

  274. shantam prem says:

    SD, i am not afraid to apologise, but many times commander in chief and his generals are sleeping.
    Football is an interesting game, but to look for psychology of players, WAG and their tantrums is not my subject.
    I will choose the example of Iraq and Iran and their commander in chief. When was the last time that commander in chief of these countries were awake to the world around them. Out of their sleepy blindness and control over oil money, they have destroyed their countries.
    Also if you look at the pictures of the supreme religious leader of Iran and our own Dr. Amrito, you can find the similarity in their aura and their talk, other than the fact Iran leader is too primitive and our one is too refined.
    Since the time of Khomeini and Saddam Hussein, it is not allowed to speak a word of sanity. The brutality and the ferocity of wounded animals can be too strong.
    Most probably i will also remain silent under such regime, but in the world of OSHO; if i am proven wrong, without hesitation i will touch the feet of people concerned.
    Osho´s words are also like natural resources. I think you too have read the news other day, Afganistan is sleeping over Trillion dollars worth of natural resources.
    These natural resources of wisdom or power generation in the hands of sleepy regime is No good but evil for the environment.

  275. shantam prem says:

    “actually there are some simlarities between meditation and football.
    indians,like the english with football,think that because they invented it,have got some god-given right to be good at it. actually they`re crap
    ,in fact,they haveboth been in terminal decline since the 1960s, clinginging to worn-out useless formulas and hackneyed training excercises.”-Frank

    This is a goal of the day.

    Also i think there is a similarity between gurus and the doctros from India. Both think, people in the west are needy and sicker than in the home country. See, once they get the degee from university or God or from oneself, first thing is to look for employment opportunites in the west.

  276. shantam prem says:

    PS- Just the other day, i was checking the site of “gurumaa” (www.gurumaa.com)

    This north Indian charming and articulate woman guru has built her Buddhafield on the outskirts of New Delhi.

    And she will be soon near Birmingham.

    Those who need to find the new shelter, after the crash of Osho roof, this is a public service message.
    (Lol, Lot)

  277. Lokesh says:

    Thanks for that public service message, Shantam Prem. You can go back to sleep now.

    PS The search for enlightenment is an illusion. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

  278. Lokesh says:

    The thing about worshiping or simply hanging out with a dead master as opposed to an alive one is this.

    Without a living master your mind and ego can play all kinds of tricks, including the one that says you are relating to the master even though he is no longer in the body. When you are with a living master he can lend a hand and show you when you are going wrong.
    Being with a living master is not comfortable because the master’s efforts will be to shake you out of your eternal sleep. With dead masters this is not really possible. If a person is sincere in their search they will eventually find a living person that can help move them closer to the possibility of awakening. Those who speak to god are spiritually schizophrenic, because gos has manifested as you. There is nothing to be done or experienced.
    Now, if you will excuse me, I’m off to watch the football.

  279. shantam prem says:

    The search for enlightenment is an illusion. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ

    Dad, is this thing called Living Master not part of this illusion?

    Those who speak to god are spiritually schizophrenic…
    Those who sit in Satsangs are….
    …….what?

  280. shantam prem says:

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1289194/Marina-Bay-Sands-resort-opens-Singapore.html

    Just seen this.

    Our Osho Resort looks pale like an Anemic child compared to this and so many other resorts.

    Bring people´s longing for some thing undefinable, and the grace of the Master and one has something no one with just money can create.

    Places are not sacred, people´s love make them sacred.
    Surely there are people afraid of love, afraid of sacredness, for such it is easy to deal with customers, who buy the things and services.

  281. Satya Deva says:

    But SP, the Master has gone, and as Lokesh said, opening the way for all manner of mind-manipulation and self-delusion.

    For a great example, just contemplate rajneesh…

    And for love, substitute one of its prime contaminating agents: sentimentalism.

    Another being power-tripping, however obvious or subtle.

  282. Anand says:

    yes Lokesh I agree, to experience the No_Self is the only
    truth there is…..

  283. shantam prem says:

    Lake has gone dry. Many immigrant birds have flown away to other far away lakes.
    Few dead birds one can see lying on the base of the lake.
    Was this an environmental disaster?

    “I AM the resurrection and the life. He who believes in Me, though he may die, he shall live.” John 11:25

  284. Satya Deva says:

    Belief is for fools, SP.

    How about simply ‘knowing’?

    EG, I don’t ‘believe’ it’s a nice, sunny day, I know it!!

  285. Lokesh says:

    SP you ask, Those who sit in Satsangs are….
    …….what?
    Well, going by the one I went to last week either, meditating, spacing out, getting lost in the mind or continuing in a direction that could only be described as utterly lost. As for the teacher, he was providing a convenient screen for his audience to project all manner of spiritual concepts upon his serene face, while obviously straining himself by pretending to be self-realised when in fact he is not.
    As Satya Deva says… substitute one of its prime contaminating agents: sentimentalism.
    Setimentalism is just that and has nothing spiritual about it. It is particulary easy to become sentimental around a dead master, because he is not around to pull you out of the stick mental quicksand that it represents. There is evidence of much sentimentality on this blog. The reality of sentimentality was so remote from what Osho taught that he rarely used even the word. Why? Because sentimentality is rooted in the past and as anyone who knows will tell you….’The past is a graveyard.’

    This thread began with a story by KP, an old friend and a lovely man who just so happens to be a sentimentalist. Go back and read his story again and you will see that KP provides us with an excellent example of the good old days that reminds me of old hippies rattling on about their far out acid trips.
    I will leave you with an aproppriate adage…….’The known has to go for the unknown to appear.’

  286. Satya Deva says:

    Sounds good to me, Lokesh.

  287. shantam prem says:

    Ok, When you two gentlemen Satya Deva and Lokesh; know” so much about unknown, are out of the belief based religions and know quite well the distinction between Love and Sentimentalism; i want to know; ” for what you go to Satsangs of This or That.
    To make it more refined?
    I cannot imagine a person who is healthy and still goes to Doctor´s chamber.
    Please, share a sincere answer, and preferably without reading the version of each other.
    It is a request.

  288. Lokesh says:

    SP You ask…for what you go to Satsangs of This or That.

    I go mainly for entertainment. I also enjoy the meditative vibe of people who close their eyes and go in. I find it easier to move into meditaion with other meditators around, something which you appear to do also hence your talk of ten thousand Buddhas etc.
    Being a bit of a troublemaker and spiritual rebel I also enjoy to stir things up if an opportunity presents itself at a satsang. This is something that happens quite easily these days because many so-called teachers are bogus. I personally don’t see any harm in this because phoney gurus provide a social service. That sevice allows beginners to live out fantasies about being a disciple with a master. Good teachers are quite rare until you come in touch with the real master who in Hindu terminology is the satguru, in other words ‘true teacher.’ Any master who tells you that the teacher is external to you is a deceiver.
    So, to conclude, I occasionally go to satsangs for fun. I am open to learning something new but rarely do because the realization that the real teacher is with me all the time and is in fact my true reality is something which is with me most of the time, although in saying that I do not in the least profess to be enlightened, something which I am not.
    Most peoples’ accounts of nearing the enlightened state are quite frightening, it is afterall the ultimate death we are talking about and I am still quite content to live in the illusion that I am an individual who has an illusionary existence apart from the whole, that singular continous movement we know collectively as life.
    I write on this blog for much the same raesons as I attend the occasional satsang. It’s fun. That is something that I always enjoyed about Osho….he said yes to a good bit of fun and many times I experienced him as fun to be around, for he was as playful as Lord Krishna and as tricky as a fox….a good allrounder you might say who knew how to deliver a joke well. Ha ha!

  289. Satya Deva says:

    I don’t go to Satsangs, SP, although, similarly to Lokesh, I might possibly go, maybe, for ‘fun’…

    If I go to Amma, once a year (haven’t been to the last two) or Mother Meera, it’s because it is simply wonderful to be in their presence, for me MM in particular.

    In MM i find a ‘reflection’ of great purity, impersonal yet deeply touching, it is so rare to find someone of such quality.

    Also, she has helped me in several important, practical ways, so I feel somehow closer because of that It’s a precious connection, which I really should nourish more than I do.

  290. Satya Deva says:

    So, have we passed your most stringent test, SP?!!

  291. Satya Deva says:

    Sorry, it wasn’t a ‘test’ it was only a “request”…

    Btw, re love and sentimentalism, love and emotion, I didn’t get anything like that from Osho, but from Barry Long (Aussie Master – as genuine as they come – who passed away in 2003).

  292. shantam prem says:

    Dear ones, through this process of honest sharing we are making our own Satsang. Writers and readers are on equal platform, in the eternal sky, few steps ahead or behind, compartment no. 3 or 9, and if it is not the trains of third world, it makes not much difference, first class or second class.
    I forsee such kind of religiousness over taking the world in the next step of evolution, age of someone on the pedsatal or on a chair with folded hands is over or look copy of the copy of the copy.
    Yet billions of other people who have not even seen their personal car yet, someone can get their attention and love on unspoken commission basis, when your wishes are fullfilled, 10percent are for me or for my energyfield.
    Just 20% such good deals and life is Bliss for the little Dick under the magician´s robe.

  293. Satya Deva says:

    SP:
    Yet billions of other people who have not even seen their personal car yet

    MN;
    Glad you’ve included me, SP. (Not a joke, I’ve never bought a car in my life).

  294. frank says:

    you old-timers here at the jackasnews nursing home for the spiritually challenged have got it just about right.
    enlightentertainment(tm) is certainly the name of the game.
    from the iconic underpantsman shenanigans of ramana and his immortal catchphase “who am i?”
    down thru barry long`s sidesplitting barry-humphreys-does-krishnamurti (i am guru,who areyou?),
    mr beans enlightened german garden gnome routine,
    even the tribute-band-style guys like” rajneesh too”
    and the three stooges with their tea-cosies on the head gag.
    and countless others who are shagging,drinking,smoking,eating themselves silly just so out of compasion they can linger a little longer on this shore and deliver a few more punchlines….

    groucho,harpo,coco,osho,amma,baba,bubba,dada,papa,gaga,gagajiji,googoo…..
    spinning on their karmic carousels
    with their zensticks
    shitwiping sticks
    slapsticks,
    pies-in-the-original-face,
    egos doing pratfalls
    these guys bypass the cortex and hit the diaphram all the way….

    may the road rise up to meet them…….

  295. Lokesh says:

    Half time in the Spain versus Chile match. It is really remarkable how silent it is outside during the match when you are in Spain, which is normally a very noisy country. Not a car on the road. Even the birds go quiet as if they know something really important is taking place. Are football stadiums the new buddhafields? Viva España!
    That is something I enjoyed about Papaji. If there was a cricket match on TV satsang finished early.
    Now that is what I call truely enlightening.

  296. shantam prem says:

    I think In Punja ji´s case, Satsang business came to him circumstantially, Cricket was his passion like billion plus Indians.

    Just yesterday, you have written-
    The search for enlightenment is an illusion. ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ!

    How than someone from Lucknow´s life style can be termed as truely enlightening!!

  297. Satya Deva says:

    Ah, cricket…

    Went to Lord’s last night for a new-fangled 20/20 match…”Baseball with stumps”, as someone said to me today…

    Large crowd (50 times bigger than for a County match) – they made so much noise we couldn’t hear the loudspeaker announcements…a whole lot of beer going down…and a whole lot of burgers ‘n’ chips…

    A troupe of teenage girls cavorting around to loud music at every boundary and wicket…

    Loud music between every over…

    And an actual result in less than 3 hours!

    Further evidence of ‘the end of the world’, surely?

    We’re doomed, I tell you, doomed….

  298. Satya Deva says:

    Strange sometimes, the people who are big cricket fans – Mick Jagger, for example, Bill Wyman and/or Charlie Watts too (Rolling Stones, in case you Indians can’t place ‘em).

  299. shantam prem says:

    Cricket is like EnLIDLment.
    once there was five days match, i think one of the longest sport.
    Than one day, each team has 60 hours, now it is 20/20, and soon game will be decided by the toss of a coin.
    Sure it is like enlightenment.

  300. Lokesh says:

    SP: You ask….How than someone from Lucknow´s life style can be termed as truely enlightening!!

    I’ll put it like this. Being in the now is a thoughtless state whereby there exists an experiencing as opposed to an experience which needs an ego to experience it. You can say this and you can say that but that is the essence of it. Enlightenment happens and there is nothing you can ‘do’ about it. It is therefore that I say that the search for enlightenment is an illusion.
    Howzat.
    PS I don’t enjoy cricket but I do enjoy the idea of an enlightened man sitting down in front of a TV to watch a match.

  301. Rit says:

    I am my whole life around Osho and yes totally involve in his work…have seen all ups and downs…now Today how I see Osho’s work is, yes people all over world reading his books as a great writer, not as a mystic, and Osho’s real work is meditation, awaking people…I think here things are so sad…so to me Osho is gone….no more Osho any where….SAD…SAD….SAD…

  302. Satya Deva says:

    Well played, sir! Fine stroke!

  303. Lokesh says:

    Satya, thanks.

  304. Satya Deva says:

    Barry Long used to enjoy playing golf and was a licensed pilot.

    And why not?!

    Osho was a keen wrestler in his younger days (post-enlightenment)…

    Just ‘ordinary men’…at that level, same as anyone else, you and me even…But not so ‘ordinary’ in their consciousness, apparently….

  305. Lokesh says:

    Yes, that is the point. Osho used to claim he was the most ordinary man in the world, but then again he did enjoy a joke.

  306. shantam prem says:

    Just ‘ordinary men’…at that level, same as anyone else, you and me even…But not so ‘ordinary’ in their consciousness, apparently….

    Is Lady Gaga ordinary in her consciousness; Just in her early twenties and one million tweet followers waiting for her one liners!

    (And these tweeters are not birds but human beings, educated &computer savvy)

  307. frank says:

    these cricket loving gurus are real rib-ticklers
    most of `em seem to like to bung it in when they can,altho some of them get caught in the slips or behind the sightscreen.
    saibaba liked to get the feel of a new ball.i hear..
    his disciples needed to wear a box,or they were liable to get the full toss.
    i heard barry long liked placing his third leg around the field a bit,as well.
    well,the gurubiz is perfect for flat-track bullies who can use a bit of sledging to intimidate their disciples and get a few extras…..
    and what about oshodhara–hat trick or what?
    bunch of match-fixers,if you ask me.

  308. Satya Deva says:

    SP:
    Is Lady Gaga ordinary in her consciousness; Just in her early twenties and one million tweet followers waiting for her one liners!

    (And these tweeters are not birds but human beings, educated &computer savvy)

    SD:
    Don’t know about Lady Gaga – but are you absolutely certain her “one million tweet followers” are in fact “human beings”, SP (never mind about how “ordinary” are their consciounesses)?!

  309. Satya Deva says:

    Is even Lady Gaga a “human being” would be my next question….

  310. Lokesh says:

    Personnally, I think Lady gaga is a pretty good artist. I mean her music is absolute crap and she is making millions. I take my tartan bonnet off to the girl.

  311. shantam prem says:

    “But, my own understanding is this, that whenever commandments are given they create difficulties for people, because by the time they are given they are already out of date. Life moves so fast; it is a dynamism, it is not static. It is not a stagnant pool, it is a Ganges, it goes on flowing. It is never the same for two consecutive moments. So one thing may be right this moment, and may not be right the next. Then what to do? The only possible thing is make people so aware that they themselves can decide how to respond to a changing life……” Osho

  312. shantam prem says:

    http://www.ndtv.com/news/videos/video_player.php?id=149260&from=homePageWatch

    Interesting interview with Goenka Ji, the man who made Vipassana popular in India. Celebrities and intellectual both feel humbled to do Vipassana at his Centre, not far away from Bombay.
    The way Osho was, like a sun in the sky, and was not easy to take other people´s spiritual work getting popularity, Osho has broomed him off.

    If we use the same yard stick, one wonders where the “Enlightened” teachers of our time will stand.

    I am sure, If someone brings the group photo of 3 Oshodhara founders near Osho Samadhi, believe it or not, Samadhi marble will start cracking.

  313. Lokesh says:

    SP You say, one wonders where the “Enlightened” teachers of our time will stand.

    You can wonder all you want, but rest assured the enlightened always stand in the same place: silence.

  314. shantam prem says:

    One wonders where the “Enlightened” teachers of our time will stand, on the yard stcik OSHO USED FOR HIS CONTEMPRARIES?

    Please, watch the above link.

  315. Satya Deva says:

    Nothing wrong with Vipassana, but like everything else, ‘the readiness is all’, no point doing it if ‘grosser issues’ remain unadressed.

    Couldn’t help thinking that, looking at the unhappy-looking woman sitting next to Mr Goenka, while he was talking about how happy meditators were after one of the courses…

    Otherwise, I have to say I found the interview rather tedious (all that talk of Buddha, relics of Buddha, Ashoka, Gita and so on – God save me from such irrelevance!) and the man not particularly inspiring.

    (But maybe that’s just my weariness talking this morning…).

  316. Chinmaya says:

    Not a single glimpse of happiness or sielnce is noticed in the Youtube and he – Goenka -preaches meditation……..hahahahahahaha

  317. Lokesh says:

    SP I watched the Goenka interview and enjoyed it very much. I believe he is a wonderful man who has helped tens of thousands on the way. Ten days vipassana is the real thing, getting right down to it.
    I also enjoyed the Indianess of the interview. Even the most evolved Indians have a childlike playfullness about them. Really charming.
    Chinmaya I have to say your comment comes across as brash and egotistic. Perhaps it is time to try a little vipassana. It would certainly help. Does it occur to you that perhaps your comment is purely a reflection. Mr Goenka came across as a man with a healthy sense of humor that stemmed most likely from feeling happy, that is if you equate happiness with contentment, which I do. The point is that Mr Goenka is the same while our perceptions differ.
    As for Mrs Goenka, who knows? Certainly not I.
    Thanks to SP for posting the vid in the first place.

  318. Chinmaya says:

    Lokesh dear,

    You talk for ten days Vipassana sessions but I referred seeing Youtube, as suggested with his appearance and nothing else. Analyse as you like.

  319. Chinmaya says:

    Lately, I happened to visit Golden Temple, one of the seven wonders in the world. More than Hundred thousand people attend daily Keertan, prayers and Sewa, Free kitchen for everybody. Everything goes in smooth and silence with serenty, without any invitation to any one and people throng from all parts of India and abroad. They spend their own time and money to reach. It is the best place in the world on Bhakti Marg, fully magnetized and charged with ascetics, Rishi and Munni. There is no fee charge as for Meditation session in Pune, Goenka, Patriji or by others.

    I have written without any ulterior motive and with no thoughts of recommendations.

  320. shantam prem says:

    “Walk the Talk”is certainly the best interview programme on Indian television with one of the finest journalist editor.
    It is first interview i have seen where both the people are sitting, other week it was a walk an Interview with Bill Gates.
    This is clear, it was done keeping in mind old age of Shri Goenka ji (Bor -February 7, 1924), one can see man is on the rolling chair.
    He may not have this Magic to create rhetoric; India is full with such speakers, but the man is as it should be, just natural.
    Moreover, does not think himself as Enlightened, when the spiritual market scene is full with Silicon planted breasts which still feel like titties.
    What to do when few people get interested only when someone is like Mike Jagger or Amitabh Bachchan.

    And for me the touching aspect is how some one keeps alive Buddha´s flame and through just one so called relic´ motivates the inner work.
    Here In Pune, Osho´s Real bones and ashes; The relics are freezing.
    The surgeons have all the tools, all the lights, yet….

  321. shantam prem says:

    I remember i was in the discourse, when Osho broomed Goeneka ji. It also means Goeneka ji were successful enough to get Osho´s attention. Many other names got limelight only once Osho left the stage.
    Osho is 100 % right in the sense that active meditations and Catharsis can help the ground for Vipassana.
    What to say about His Mystic Rose….. The package is just top of the brand.
    This package can help our fellow human beings, once the people around Osho does not feel hesitation to give due recognition to their own Master.
    Osho is not less important a figure than Buddha, Jesus and the Master behind the Golden Temple.

  322. shantam prem says:


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

    Above is one of my favourite song, as a Hindi translator in one of the Mystic Rose at Osho Smadhi, i chose this song for Sentimantalist Indians to cry.

    It will be nice for Lokesh too, after this English-Scotish versus German football match.

  323. shantam prem says:

    What frank has to say about-

    What sort of hippy pays £200 for Glastonbury, the repository of Aquarian ideals”?

    Answer: the sort of middle class hippy that for the rest of the year is a mortgage adviser or something.

    Remindes me of Sannyas.

  324. Satya Deva says:

    SP, that’s ‘old ‘news’, man…Glastonbury lost its ‘grass roots hippy/alternative’ status many years ago…

    It’s just another on the summer festival circuit in the UK, a holiday weekend, no more, no less.

    The Biz guys took over long ago….

  325. Satya Deva says:

    Anyway, SP, what’s wrong with being a mortgage advisor and going for a good time once in a while?!

    First priority in life is to somehow earn a living, isn’t it?

    Apparently, loads of young-ish people hold down ‘straight’ jobs while doing all manner of stuff, drugs etc. at weekends.

    Never been my cup of tea, it would have killed me, but that’s the deal such people make with western (global?) materialist society these days, I guess.

  326. Lokesh says:

    It was going to the very first Glastonbury festival with fifty hits of California sunshine acid in my wallet to spend that spurred me to go to India. Well, I can remember…………..
    Oh, sorry, I must have dropped off for a few minutes there.

  327. shantam prem says:

    Just football and so much emotions it generates. One can be a watcher but without taking sides, without getting emotionaly involved, WATCHER will also not have the fun, the highs and lows.
    Photos of English fans are worth watching for the watcher on the hills.

  328. Satya Deva says:

    Thing about going for the highs and lows is surely not to complain about the lows? (German manager’s name is Low, of course!!).

    But that seems too much for football fans to grasp.

    As Dylan sang:
    “You shouldn’t let other people get your kicks for you….”

  329. frank says:

    if lady gaga had been born in south india instead of new york,she would have been known as gagaji by now,discoursing on the pitfalls of love games and bad romance.

    and if nityananda had been born in new york,he could have been onstage at glastonbury,having as many groupies as he likes,and making his own home movies of him cavorting with tamil and american actresses and selling them on the net!

    but,i dont agree about these characters being “frauds.”
    to judge fraudulence,there has to be a consensus about the genuine item.
    it doesnt happen.
    in entertainment or music,people just do their act.
    you like it,or you dont buy it.. simple.
    do you think that chinese music is a “fraud” because it sounds like a bunch of cats being strangled?
    and boy bands and lady gaga are shite,you think,but can there be stuff you like without there being shite,too?
    i doubt it.
    its a bit f the old black/white,yin/yang mullarkey going on,i would say.

  330. frank says:

    footie.
    its all just what the romans called panem et circenses–bread and circus to placate and occupy the plebs,the masses.
    then you get the “masters” who try to point out this collective hypnosis,but they and/or their followers get caught in another collective hallucination of being the chosen few,which is,in fact contingent and dependent on the previous hypnotic trance…
    checkmate.

    then they are forced,deliberately,or otherwise,to give it the old “i`m just an ordinary guy” schtick and go to cricket games,golf courses,their disciples bedrooms,the off-license,whatever,just to try and re-balance the whole game again.

    “that`s enlightentertainment”

  331. Satya Deva says:

    Well, frank, that might sound how it is, but it ain’t so for those of infinitely advanced and superior perception (not to mention consciousness, of course) – born of many thousands of hours dedicated to deeply (not shallow) meditative and other, ‘supporting’ pursuits (damned of course, by the lamentably unconscious majority).

    Such ones make a point of being completely aware – like your good self – of whatever games their minds are playing – golf, cricket , sex, alcoholic – and are therefore ‘free’.

    Unlike the fools (for whom such a one is profoundly compassionate, of course, that comes with all the meditation) who are unfortunately completely ‘identified’ with whatever occupies their (necessarily rather limited) attention spans at any given moment.

    Still, I guess it’s all karma, of course…

    Guess I, you and others here, must have worked pretty hard in our previous lves to have such an advantage, compared to the rest of the unfortunates. Guess it’s simply ‘our time’….

  332. frank says:

    maybe…
    but those infinitely advanced and superior perception guys are no less entertaining than their lumpen spiritual proletariat brothers,
    when they`ve got their trousers wrapped around their ankles with total consciousness,and complete dis-identification
    more so,i would say….

  333. Satya Deva says:

    Won’t necessarily argue with that thoroughly irreverent insight, frank…

    Danger of using it as a ‘defence mechanism’, of course…

    Don;t reckon you’re one of Life’s natural devotees though somehow….

  334. Satya Deva says:

    Frank:
    but,i dont agree about these characters being “frauds.”
    to judge fraudulence,there has to be a consensus about the genuine item.
    it doesnt happen.

    SD:
    Ok, it’s all subjective (what else could it possibly be?!)…

    But when you have a virtual carbon-copy of the ‘real deal’, as rajneesh has made himself, then ‘fraud’, ‘deluded’ and ‘stupid’ are three words that instantly come to the mind of anyone with a vestige of common sense, let alone ‘spiritual discrimination’.

    Surely?!!

    If they were ever into it, ‘Private Eye’ (British satirical mag.) would have an absolute field day on this character….

  335. frank says:

    in old india,a disciple who was a carbon copy of his master was looked upon highly.
    in fact,remember old teertha?
    he boasted that he had only read osho books for years and had the hair and beard to go with it………
    okay,the large protrusion jutting out from the middle of his robe was a giveaway,but there was a strong lookalike element…..
    and nobody called him a third rate impressionist at the time…..

    in any case,people will pay to see tribute bands,whether it is
    retro tull
    think floyd
    mamma mia
    or
    rajneesh too.

    but i can sympathise with you,.
    hating and slagging artists you dont like has always been a part of the enlightentertainmant scene.

    just like mods and rockers or
    arsenal versus tottenham.

    enlightenment is just the same…..
    its the oshoites rucking with krishnamurtites
    barrylongers squaring up to bwronskinned gurus
    or andrew cohen`s firm marching into papajis manor,ready to rumble…..

    same same,baba….

  336. Satya Deva says:

    frank:

    in old india,a disciple who was a carbon copy of his master was looked upon highly.
    in fact,remember old teertha?
    he boasted that he had only read osho books for years and had the hair and beard to go with it………
    okay,the large protrusion jutting out from the middle of his robe was a giveaway,but there was a strong lookalike element…..
    and nobody called him a third rate impressionist at the time…..

    SD:
    Maybe, frank…But look where Teertha’s at now! Must be the most disliked, disrespected member of the entire pantheon of Osho’s former ‘high-rollers’…Among sannyasins, that is…

    Took a while for everyone to grow up, I guess.

    Perhaps rajneesh will meet a similar fate amongst his Indian fans…Wouldn’t necessarily bet against it….and yet…

    If it’s true that carbon copies of the Master were revered in “old India”, and Indian sannyas people are desperate for, er, ‘something’ (anything?!) I guess this rajneesh knows he’s onto a good thing and so he might have a fair bit of mileage left.

    My God (sorry, frank!), is there any limit to human foolishness?!

    Time for another green tea, I’m feeling rather faint….

  337. Chinmaya says:

    All Time Pass