Towards a Real Samadhi


REAL SAMADHI IS WITHIN YOU; THAT ONLY CAN LIBERATE

Some comment from SN

“While in Pune, Osho used to reside in ‘Chuang Tzu’ House. As per Osho’s instructions his ashes after his death were kept in his bed room. His instructions for the use of his bed room were simply that it would be “a place for people to meditate”, and nothing else. Some people’s idea that Osho would want people to “pay tribute” or seek “blessings” from his ashes is a pure fantasy of the Indian traditional spiritual mind against which Osho spoke for 35 years. Osho had said, “Except for this existence, you don’t have any sacred place. This is the only holy, sacred temple. There is no other temple. All other temples are false, substitute to deceive and cheat you.”Osho’s interest was only in awareness, and not at all in these traditional substitutes presented in the guise of “spirituality”. As Osho has put it, “It does not matter where awareness happens, what matters is that it happens. If it happens in a casino, then the casino has become a temple, a sacred place.”

images

In India Samadhi is also called the place where the body of an enlightened person is buried. This has caused confusion in the minds of some persons. The word has also been corrupted being associated with absurd rituals which have no spiritual significance. That is why even Buddha avoided to use the term Samadhi and instead used the word Nirvana for ultimate realization.

“In Sri Lanka, in Kandy, they have a great temple devoted to a tooth of Buddha. Every scientific test has proved that it is not a tooth of a human being, it is too big; it can only be that of an animal. But who cares about it? Kandy attracts more pilgrimages to Sri Lanka than any other temple because it has a tooth of Gautam Buddha.”

Such is the simple-mindedness of human beings.
Osho never gave any significance to the place where he remained for a long period. Many times his disciples asked to keep such places as a spiritual heritage but every time the proposal was refused.

Osho’s own approach to “sacred places” in relation to his own life is revealing.  When his own family had asked Osho if they could turn his birth place into a sacred place and a shrine, he declined. Then after he had spent some years in his flat in Bombay, his Secretary had asked if they should buy the flat as a memorial, which he again refused. Further, when Osho was designing the old meditation hall called Chuang Tzu so that it could become his new bedroom. The exact spot where he had sat on and spoken from than any other place and which was again the exact spot where he had given sannyas to thousands of meditators was the spot he turned it into a cupboard for cleaning materials. He did not preserve that spot for posterity .

Sannyas is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.

 

 

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73 Responses to Towards a Real Samadhi

  1. Kavita says:

    If there were an observational study on the history (I can only use this word as I have not been a witness to both of them in their physical presence) of Buddha & Osho, one would observe based on the recordings:

    Buddha was not for any idol worship & a physical samadhi but there are maximum idols/statues & Kushinagar is now a revered place for his faithful (the place of his Mahaparinirvana was rediscovered by the East India company, only if these records can be trusted on the basis of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kushinagar ).

    Osho has given a lot of his time to self-portraits and also original castings of his feet, his paintings, hand-written letters etc. & his personal items of use have been preserved/passed on by many of the faithful. He himself instructed for the construction of his physical Samadhi in Pune, which is revered by his faithful.

    After reading the wiki on Kushinagar, I am wondering why it was abandoned in the first place & why the faithful could not preserve it – or better still, who are the real faithful?

  2. shantam prem says:

    When disciples’ mind becomes over activated…the idiot priests will give all kind of logic to implant their versions, their theory, their bloody shit.

    Even the writer of this piece is such a smug, has he ever used what Osho Was heard saying many times, “Never speak about master’s vision in absolute terms. It is wise to say, I have heard master saying”?

    Sannyas is not a movement. It was.
    All because of frozen mind unable to produce and recreate.

  3. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    Friends,
    the here printed thread text issue is breathing the Master inside-outside essentially and at its best.

    His ´promise for Liberation has not been a promise, but a statement that ´the goose is out´ already.

    Yet we love to meet temporarily in places, spaces, for encouraging that reminder, don´t we?
    (And it is very good to keep up a well-equipped , easy-to-reach cleaning supply cupboard and also know how to use the cleaning supply, wherever).

    As long as we are in the body, gratefulness and the joy to share, needs an address in a way. That´s why I write.

    Sometimes I feel that writing into a huge virtual brain-assembly of a big brain of algorythms (anonymities) comes close to a trust to Existence, where the total lack of control can be experienced in a contemporary way.

    The thread text of today brings into awareness that this Master really loved us.And I am grateful, having been loved that way, as it is so rare as diamonds to be loved without possessiveness (what Simond reminded us on recently).

    Yet, He loved to be loved too, didn’t He?

    Me, I feel very interdependent on a climate which makes such exchange possible in a human way.

    What about you, Friends? Do you feel self-sufficient ? Total independence?

    Madhu

  4. Parmartha says:

    I felt, Madhu, a spirit of interdependent love with many, after Veeresh’s passing, it seemed to be in the airways. I still feel it ten days later. On the string, even if this was not obviously Osho’s own view, it would be mine.

    I am of course aware that some Osho sannyasins on the sub-continent seem to need these childish things. But as they say when one becomes a man or woman, isn’t it time to throw away childish things?

    I accept, Kavita, that the disciples of Buddha wanted to resurrect him with statues. I find it ironic that Judaism and Islam both hate “graven images” – and also often seem to hate each other (though Arabs and Jews are apparently part of the same genetic branch of humanity).

    If I was a mediator between them I would start there, they seem to have at least that dislike of idolatry in common!

    • prem martyn says:

      Parmartha, as an ex-humanoisitist it is not with regret that I say Leela or the Humaniversity would be the last place on Earth I would go to to remember Veeresh and his work…too close to Harlem or da Bronx for my liking…or Romford. Though I consider trails of what he played with to be genuine.

      The emphasis is on play. I don’t think for a moment he was ‘playful’ or what he created to be anywhere near a lightness of friendly being. Solid or whatever, full of what Osho called relevant, discipley or whatever, but like Teertha or Devagit or others I wouldn’t personally, with all my defects, recommend or touch with a bargepole. A touch on the side of gross and unwieldy. I don’t even like Devagit’s or Teertha’s or Arun’s faces. Simples.

      • Parmartha says:

        One hopes there is no Samadhi for Veeresh being built at the Humaniversity – but one can never tell!

        Frankly, Prem Martyn, I never knew the guy. When I say that, well, I met him twice personally through friends, and both times I took him at a personal level to be quite a vulnerable soul, and on one occasion to be depressed. I wasn’t sure for those coming from a background of addiction they could have good results.

        I do, however, know people who lived in humaniversity-type little communes, etc., and must say on the whole they seem very heartfelt people and don’t like bullshit. Those two characteristics do not make a ‘whole’ man or woman, sadly, but again sadly, they sometimes seem to think they do.

        I have been moved in the last ten days by the album ‘Sammasati’ sung by Veeresh. I imagine he knew he was dying when he sang them, and it has a certain magic and transcendence.

        Veeresh was like many who somehow make a contribution in life; they are more mixed than ordinary mortals.

        I have always felt that, as we are into literary things at the moment, about a character like Heathcliffe – the capacity for good and bad, exisitng together, makes such characters so much more interesting than the mediocrities which most of us are!

        Once when you were younger you lived in a Veeresh-style commune? So at one time you must have felt attracted. Maybe that is a starting point for you for a deeper reflection.

        • prem martyn says:

          PM, re the past…
          I wanted to cover all the parts of myself that Osho had laid out as being necessary to do. I got to Pune too late for the just-ending late seventies basha-thons that were always eulogised, so I went for what I could get my hands on domestically in London. The house woman leader there was a natural psychotic, as you remember, but in those days, despite the advertising, the net effect of having been chosen by Osho to choose others to do his work meant that when you confronted said chief disciplers you ended up being threatened, and had your bollocks stuffed back in your throat. Not growthful or Osho. Sorry, just not.

          Because it was deference time – that’s something that we now in retrospect declaim and decry here on SN as much as moderately allowed by your august organ, and still inexistent as a body of work because it cannot be institutionalised or at least not easily..although Ko Hsuan was brilliant for my version of Sod-em and Gommorrah or Bollox and Bejeesus. But deference was nevertheless part and parcel of the cult that you also paid for.

          Not bothered, just making sure the rose-coloured glasses are off, even at funerals.

          By the way, I heard just a few weeks back that Kamala died of cancer, not alcohol.

          I’m glad that my dilemmas don’t reach neurological proportions causing desperate adherence to extremely weird situations or questing. But my casualness may not be enough to get people out of bed to do Die-manic like you have done en masse. Can’t be arsed. Different strokes, different folks.

          No need for precise renditions of self-justifying searching unless one aims to build a fellowship peer group for seeking. I don’t. And I’m not welcome with those who do.

          I got my fun doing Commedia dell Arte in Italy. Extremely humane and creative insights, hilarious, life-long wisdom into the human condition. Not a red robe to be seen. But no beloved Osho joyous hilarious shaktipat either.

          I don’t have address books filled from either engagements.

          Life is strange, no sermons necessary.

          • Parmartha says:

            My only thought is you CHOSE to live in Misfit City, London, as I remember.

            Many, even at that time, including myself, to use your phrase, would not have touched it with a bargepole. So the inner question for you is really, what was the attraction?

            • prem martyn says:

              PM:
              It’s not relevant in semantic terms to even attempt to discuss in retrospect, here, the full stories of that time, as that revision occurs only with relevance when attending to today. Today I ‘avoid’ (take the mickey out of) like the plague that relevance…hooray, it’s a choice now, not from ze freudian past but to the NLP future, ya ? Same knee-jerk response to the Lowen surname or Shyam Singha…bollox, ha bloody ha.

              Nor would it be significant elsewhere to fully revisit that choice, unless the demolition of the past was to build something new or continue something – maybe, maybe not. My closest have had these discussions endless times. You don’t think you’re raising a surprise question there? Why did I choose? Cos I was a desperate, needy cunt? Or in need of some. Will that do?

              I’ve given a version of events, but it would be churlish to attempt to cover the whole context, as surely as asking “why, then?” now is.

              You choose to define this blogging as doing Osho’s work by definition (see last post eulogies). It’s an identified, self-defined attachment that comes with all forms of associative endeavours in that name.

              I don’t like to do that. The merit or not lies solely in the values sponsored and expounded upon. Could be Godzilla’s work, for all I care.

              It’s people in a peer group doing their thing, as far as it concerns anyone, online. Neither creditable nor discreditable.

              Why does your policy of magazineship attempt some form of added value when much of it is tendentious and Jerry Springer-like? Because you choose to do this and I choose to comment. That’s it.

              I’m not there,then, in 1986 now, out of considered and venerable reflection. But meet me for something more enjoyable than an explanation and I’ll tell ya, ‘by the way’, as with anyone here…

              Why seemingly load explanatory Osho stuff with that extra leader-serviced ‘sharing’ mendacity camouflaged as sponsoring others, a la Veeresh or anyone else from the hat, when it was and should be described as Totnesian psychosis (I’m not going into THAT one ever…think toilet cleaner. :) ). And on reflection,because I thought being told stuff in the 80s was good for me/you by the Bronxman’s acolytes and was doing Osho’s vision. Good script, eh?Growthful. Bless.

              I repeat, it was part of Osho’s common parlance that the growth had to happen from the libido up, en masse. Cue Veeresh in Europe.

              If you, PM, did that in ’76-79 and had had enough by then, then you had chosen already and been there, done that. I don’t need to know if you did or didn’t, or your choices then, nor ask you to look within and type your answer, now.

              I’m glad you have space for Veeresh. I’m not mean or stupid enough to decry his output, but that corruption of willingness should be much more friendly and with fewer shotguns from complete strangers who care not a jot about you or your life, the language used or the proseltysing involved wearing a ding dong round their throats (or not) and nodding. Yes, the man was kindly, I have no need to consider his output as meritable or definitive of love between lovers. My call. I choose.

  5. Lokesh says:

    Good article. Short and sweet, and no doubt sour to the traditionalists.

    I have visited the Temple of The Tooth in Kandy on several occasions, for lack of anything better to do in a not particularly inspiring town. As for the tooth relic – pure nonsense, as is making a holy of holies out of Osho’s ashes…just the sort of bullshit he was dead against. Osho is in part to blame for letting the kids worship him so much when he was around and it was forseeable that the Indians would make a thing out of it.

    Yeah, I am aware that the Samadhi has a special vibe and all that jive but if the place was bulldozed tomorrow I would not give a shit. Might save a lot of trouble further down the line. Whatever happened to the way of the white cloud? For me, Osho was a man who taught reverence for that which is alive, not worshipping dead fucking ashes, even if they are his.

    Reminds me of the Zen monk who was cold and burnt the wooden buddha statue to keep warm one night, while crashing out in the local temple. Osho loved stories like that and so do I. Anyone remember the three monks laughing about who was going to die first? One of them does and the other two load his clothes with fireworks so he goes out with a bang on the funeral pyre. That is the spirit.

    As Osho has put it, “It does not matter where awareness happens, what matters is that it happens. If it happens in a casino, then the casino has become a temple, a sacred place.”

    Now that is something I can relate to on an existential level, being a bit of a gambler myself. I have visited casinos from Macau to Vegas. Casinos for me are temples of Babylon, mon. They represent the rotten hub of the wheel of materialism and I enjoy to sit right down in the middle of them and check it out. That is why we are here, is it not? To live life in its myriad forms, experience separation, enjoy the movie in the puff of smoke cinema.

    Sitting in on a game of poker with a bunch of cunning strangers, whose only interest in you is how much money they can win off you, certainly puts you on the hot seat. Great stuff, and no better place to become aware of your breathing…definitely gives an edge. Lady Luck can be a fickle bitch, but hey, no surprises there.

    “Sannyas is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.”

    Can’t disagree with that. Here’s to the spotless spot. I went ‘all in’ decades ago. So far, so good.

  6. shantam prem says:

    After reading the western males I just pray to God, “Never ever make them again my fellow-travellers.”

    The women from the West are sweet like the nuns.
    Men on the spiritual path, those who fart from the mind and call it heart!

  7. Kavita says:

    “I accept, Kavita, that the disciples of Buddha wanted to resurrect him with statues. I find it ironic that Judaism and Islam both hate “graven images” – and also often seem to hate each other (though Arabs and Jews are apparently part of the same genetic branch of humanity).

    If I was a mediator between them I would start there, they seem to have at least that dislike of idolatry in common!”

    Parmartha, I am sure that there have been intelligent meditators who may have tried to resolve these issues like yourself , the seeds of hatefulness are so superfluous to us , perhaps even Mohammed couldn’t foresee this.

    It is an amazing site to see so many worshippers, either probably these hatefuls should be given a free ( only if they can’t afford ) & compulsory tickets to the Kaaba : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jM81wroj_MQ

  8. Kavita says:

    Shantam, to me, these western males you mention don’t sound heartless, it’s only they see something probably we can’t see, these guys have been in the valuable presence of the Master, it definitely won’t go wasted.

    • shantam prem says:

      Kavita, when I say “these western males” it is not three or four here at SannyasNews, but in the very epicentre of Osho Movement.

      In the valuable presence of master thousands were sitting, including many of our wonderful friends.

      Maybe you have heard too through facebook that Greek Mukta is asking for charity in her begging bowl at the ripe old age of 85. She is the one who bought LaoTzu House!

      If this is what an organisation does to its foundation and still talk about LOVE and punches on other religions and their icons, who knows. God turned into Existence has different kind of parameters?

      Simple fact is alpha male ego of Osho Sannyas movement in the process of trying to be distinctive is restoring to rimming, one must do something unique never done before.

      • Kavita says:

        Shantam, it’s sad to hear about Mukta. I am not on facebook any more, it’s been quite some time now, I thought she had enough money to live; looks like something fishy is going on somewhere. Anyway, Antaro will take care of her, for sure.

        “Kavita, when I say these western males it is not three or four here at SannyasNews, but in the very epic centre of Osho Movement.

        In the valuable presence of master thousands were sitting, including many of our wonderful friends.”

        Yes, dear, I include all of them, including you.

      • Parmartha says:

        Re Greek Mukta:
        Shantam, please cut and paste in this string.
        Not everyone is on facebook, and very wise they are, and even though I am, I am not a facebook friend of Mukta as I never knew her.

        But she was a person of great service to Osho, and if she has some trouble everyone should be informed. She must be very elderly now.

      • Kavita says:

        Wondering if the state of Greek economy has affected her?

  9. samarpan says:

    “Sannyas is not a movement. It was.”

    Shantam, how do you understand sannyas? My understanding is that sannyas both pre-dates and post-dates Osho. We were fortunate to be able to commune with a Master who initiated us into neo-sannyas… a delicious, fun, non-dualistic neo-sannyas.

    “But be fully alert that your robes are not your sannyas, your mala is not your sannyas, your new name is not your sannyas. Sannyas will be there when there is no name, when you become nameless. Then there will be no rules. Then you will be so ordinary, you will not be recognized. Only then…

    But don’t think that now it is okay, so no need to take sannyas and no need to take an orange robe. That is again a trick. You have to pass through this, you have to go through this. You cannot bypass it – and if you try to bypass you will never reach to the other shore.

    Rules of the world, then rules of Sannyas, and then comes a no-rule state; no commandments are needed. Don’t change the old commandments – they are okay as they are. You be, simply be, and follow and flow into the being.”

    –Osho, ‘A Bird on the Wing’, Chapter #9, ‘Save the Cat’

    • shantam prem says:

      Samarpan: “My understanding is that sannyas both pre-dates and post-dates Osho.”

      Shantam: “My understanding is that Apple both pre-dates and post-dates Steve Jobs.

      “We were fortunate to be able to commune with a Master who initiated us into Neo-Sannyas…a delicious, fun, non-dualistic Neo-Sannyas.”

      Was Osho under some kind of karmic debts to provide condoms in his ashram´s kiosk for the spoiled fellow-companions of past life?

      Has Osho spoken for the whole world, but created his commune only for the chosen Few?

      My concern is simple, CEO of Osho Foundation should be prosecuted for his blunders the way a CEO of an insuurance or retail company feels the heat in case consumer confidence falls.

      In my heart, Osho`s work is a part of service sector industry. All the religions, cults, sects, groups, therapies are part of service sector.
      They must not have any immunity, neither here nor in the other world.

      In a way, if master or prophet still exists after the death he must feel the heat because of the shit created by the followers. Same nature, same rule, same system for everybody!

      I don´t think God or Existence is a supreme leader of North Korea kind of regime.

  10. shantam prem says:

    “Sannyas is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.”

    Looks quite cute, but quite cheap, as one pound pearls necklace in a corner shop.
    It also shows staggering vanity and narcissism bestowed upon the once alive movement called Sannyas.

    And most probably, writer has not realised this particular sentence is used millions of times by millions of scholars like him.

    Has he never read:
    “HINDUISM is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.” ?
    “ISLAM is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.” ?
    “The word SIKH simply means the disciple, therefore Sikhism is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.” ?

    And penny-wise, pound-foolish writer is right:
    “Sannyas is a movement that is not dependent on any place or time, in fact to try and tie it down to a single spot simply serves to defile it.”

    Sannyas is part of Indian way of life thousands of years before Rajneesh Chandra Mohan found it in a junkyard and polished it accordingly.

    Sannyas was an accidental export to the West, and without after-sale service, withered away. Last few junkies are left….

  11. shantam prem says:

    “I have spent seven intense years in India, slept with dozens of women, met my life partner, did some kind of meditations in the company of other people, and then it dawned on me: ‘Mister, spirituality is not confined to any place.’ And now it is my life’s vision to inspire people to meditate anywhere. Spirituality is everywhere, Samadhi is everywhere!”

    Sir, what is Samadhi?

    “Well it is a ritual in some Banana republic to preserve the ashes. After certain time, they consolidate into diamonds!”

  12. simond says:

    My feeling is that Osho was a product of India, and the Indian mindset, even though he reached across to the western mind as well.

    Remember, all the images of him, pictures galore in every home and in every centre, and the castings of his feet, and framed autographs? And ideas of buddhafields and malas, and wearing red, and then white.

    We all fell for it, (we were young and naive) and he loved it. He loved the praise and the attention and the worship. He loved the notion of us all surrendering to the Master.

    And yet he also tried to debunk it all, by showing us that the teaching was fundamentally for the individual, and to remind us that he was just an ordinary man, not special, just someone who showed us the way.

    He was a product of his time, a product of his culture and we can all, surely recognise that our cultural and social conditioning never fully disappears. He was no exception.

    The “faithful”, as Kavita observes, may choose to preserve and to fix his legacy in buildings, places and in time; or remain faithful to the essence of his actual teaching. In the West we tend to be far more irreligious than in the East. We’ve had enough of religion, thanks very much!

    • Arpana says:

      “My feeling is that Osho was a product of India, and the Indian mindset”

      How could he be anything else?

      We are all products of where we come from.
      We can’t change that.
      We can only get past the delusion that we are special because of what happened to us, get past identification with what stays with us in ego memory.

      .

  13. karima says:

    Martyn, I often wondered myself why at the time I let myself be seduced by the Humaniversity-style approach. Looking back now at the time I see I was very hard on myself, thus consequently I chose mirrors who were also hard on me too, thus allowing me to express all the rage against so-called authority.

    So far, so good, but what I always missed (and this was my experience) was being vulnerable, indeed I was mostly on the defence for the next attack! But again, this was only a mirror of what was in me already. But the defence wasn’t broken through that approach, I only got more terrified, but that was shouted over by anger. So the bottom line, which was fear, was never touched and transformed. It took a much, much softer approach (inner child and voice dialogue) to heal those parts.

    And now the emphasis is not so much on expressing emotions, feelings, but feeling them through, and there is nobody to blame.

    • prem martyn says:

      Very clearly put, Karima. Some of us moved on quickly and weren’t actually in it. I avoided house meetings by staying out late until I found a place to move to.

      Leela Centre never did or Veeresh’s output, by the sound of it. Can’t stand the Humaniversity sound music, it sends shivers down me from parts of society I wouldn’t associate with, or them with me, club house ambient disco thump thump bollocks. Sex it up? Maybe. With that god-awful voice- over. Otherwise empty and heavy.

      One euology talked of Veeresh being caught having a bacon buttie in the Blue Diamond, and said his rebellion is an inspiration. Who to…waiters? Gordon Ramsay. more like. And Frank (Gary Glitter) Natale, Veeresh’s mate – what an inspiration, a 50 year-old making out with a teenager…because he got his Results Course sorted out. Do what they legally want is fine, it’s the smarminess that’s not credible.

      Complete lack of irony in the building or with Captain V, just like with O, because it was deemed insincere and mindy. My foot.

    • Arpana says:

      Karima,
      Dynamic: A gift to the puritan mindset that says if it’s not making you miserable it’s a waste of time.

  14. Kavita says:

    “My feeling is that Osho was a product of India, and the Indian mindset, even though he reached across to the western mind as well.”

    Samarpan, what you say is totally true; that’s the reason maybe he was for mixing cultures.

  15. Neerav says:

    A samadhi is a samadhi is a samadhi!
    (A picture of sannyasins meditating at Osho’s Samadhi at Osho Tapoban in Nepal).

    • prem martyn says:

      “Communal picnic dining table idea goes back to the drawing board as diners awake to find moat six feet wide separates table from seating area.”

      Table design by Resort Pools and Limited Space for Relaxation areas, Pune Pvt.

      When asked to comment by Reuters news service, the international media received this fax:

      http://cs622325.vk.me/v622325540/e0c7/dcLy3hNf-vw.jpg

      Together with a detailed plan for a memorial statue to Veeresh’s contribution to world hugs and sharing:

      http://www.tantra-essence.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/khajuraho.jpg

      • prem martyn says:

        Who will they get to make productions like this again ?
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j3jIJakLhrc

        Wrong context, wrong formula , wrong advice, wrong injunction, wrong expectation , wrong definition, wrong strategy, wrong seating arrangements, wrong room full of nodders, wrong no challenge, wrong intervention, wrong intention, wrong association, wrong use of a superlative, wrong identification of what things are supposed to look like, wrong use of chaotic provocation, wrong suggestion, wrong dichotomy,wrong extrinsic advice as intrinsic, wrong associative implication, wrong validation, wrong use of imperative, wrong use of microphone, wrong implicatory reference to pre-determined higher values as espoused by guru of guru , wrong chain of events wrong charm, wrong ideational use and use of language, wrong deference, wrong legacy.

        But the place has been going years… so it must be doing something right ?
        (Guess the answer )

        Stll they’ve got the videos to sit around and watch for years. That should help them get it ……. ( fill in missing word )

        Ps If you work it out for yourself you’ll get it right, but not because I or any one else says so.. cos that would then be….. (fill in the missing word )

        And what that says about me… well it would be wrong of me to … no I couldn’t possibly…that I….

        To put it it in the words of a guru .. what that says about me is ‘I’m sussed and I have no need of your version of reality to validate me, pass me the microphone.’

  16. Neerav says:

    Here is this month’s video of what has expanded from Osho’s Samadhi in Nepal.
    Osho Sandesh XX : Life is just a play!
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dt0pNHuTQU8

  17. shantam prem says:

    Oh my God, Osho Samadhi in Nepal.

    Looks like Bank of Samadhi Pvt. Ltd.
    If this is the way, I am not a depositor, I am not a shareholder.

  18. samarpan says:

    Shantam: “My understanding is that Apple both pre-dates and post-dates Steve Jobs.”

    Shantam, here is what I said of Neo-Sannyas, translated to computers: “My understanding is that computers both pre-date and post-date Steve Jobs.”

    Sannyas pre-dates Osho. Neo-Sannyas was Osho’s contribution.
    The computer pre-dates Steve Jobs. Apple computer was Steve Job’s contribution.
    http://www.computerhistory.org/timeline/

    Both Sannyas and Neo-Sannyas co-exist. Both Apple and HP co-exist. No monopoly can exist.

    Osho Samadhi is everywhere now. As Osho said, he is dissolved into white clouds, into Existence. Access to Osho is easier now than ever. No monopoly can exist. In my opinion, it is what it is…and all is well.

  19. shantam prem says:

    “Osho Samadhi is everywhere now. As Osho said, he is dissolved into white clouds, into Existence. Access to Osho is easier now than ever. No monopoly can exist. In my opinion, it is what it is…and all is well.”

    Samarpan, Swami ji,
    You have written so profoundly deep. Can the readers have the darshan of your face? Please.
    Are you on facebook?
    I don´t send friends requests any more. Just curious to see your face.
    In the ancient texts it is mentioned, by having darshans of guru´s devotees, one feels the presence of Him.

  20. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    That´s what I found in the dictionary, Satyadeva, when I wanted to find out what you meant by “codwallop”.

    Dictionary
    ´codswallop´

    codswallop
    noun cods·wal·lop \ˈkȯdz-ˌwä-ləp, ˈkädz-\

    Definition of CODSWALLOP:

    British:
    nonsense
    See codswallop defined for English-language learners
    Is it “healthy” or “healthful”?
    Watch and find out!

    Examples of CODSWALLOP:

    That is a load of codswallop.

    Origin of CODSWALLOP:

    Origin unknown
    First Known Use: 1963
    Related to CODSWALLOP:
    Synonyms:
    applesauce [slang], balderdash, baloney (also boloney), beans, bilge, blah (also blah-blah), blarney, blather, blatherskite, blither, bosh, bull [slang], bunk, bunkum (or buncombe), claptrap, nonsense [British], crapola [slang], crock, drivel, drool, fiddle, fiddle-faddle, fiddlesticks, flannel [British], flapdoodle, folderol (also falderal), folly, foolishness, fudge, garbage, guff, hogwash, hokeypokey, hokum, hoodoo, hooey, horsefeathers [slang], humbug, humbuggery, jazz, malarkey (also malarky), moonshine, muck, nerts [slang], nuts, piffle, poppycock, punk, rot, rubbish, senselessness, silliness, slush, stupidity, taradiddle (or tarradiddle), tommyrot, tosh, trash, trumpery, twaddle

    Related Words:
    absurdity, asininity, fatuity, foolery, idiocy, imbecility, inaneness, inanity, insanity, kookiness, lunacy; absurdness, craziness, madness, senselessness, witlessness; hoity-toity, monkey business, monkeyshine(s), shenanigan(s), tomfoolery; gas, hot air, rigmarole (also rigamarole); double-talk, greek, hocus-pocus

    Near Antonyms:
    levelheadedness, rationality, reasonability, reasonableness, sensibleness; common sense, horse sense, sense; discernment, judgment (or judgement), wisdom….

    Thanks for the English variety and the look into some of the cellar rooms (of yours).

    Madhu

  21. Kavita says:

    Seems Swami Arun wants funds for his next foreign trip. I heard he is holding camps & fleecing not only innocent as well as corrupted sannyasins abroad. Anyway, I don’t drink from such kind of cup of teas, thank God I have never seen him in person, his camp photos were repulsive.

    So agree with Marty & Shantam.

    Lokesh, only hope Swami Neerav dosen’t take your comment seriously.

  22. shantam prem says:

    Osho Said,
    Osho Says,
    I have heard Osho saying…

    I wonder whether there are no more living disciples who have seen What Osho did, What we have seen Osho was doing, What Osho does…

    Talking is more important, or the actions?

  23. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    What else could it be, Friends, our verbal sharings re the issue ‘Towards a Real Samadhi’ as entering the waves and samsaric wheels of the Living?

    All contribution deeply touched my heart, and I have been especially long occupied by your contributions, Prem Martyn, and their changing moves, coming in contact with other turbulent waters .

    Long time also busy, Satydeva, with your remark about “codswallop”, and that enormous range I found therefore in the English Merriam-Webster Dictionary, but also experiencing your part of contributing as another way to turn and to be in the turning of a wheel in turbulent waters (took me some time to find my ´yes´ to this too, Satyadeva).

    Or reading your response, Parmartha, re Greek Mukta, and knowing what happened with that beautiful woman, just one example of innumerable ´files’ of our karmic caravan, and it has pretty much always been that way, and not only the very last decades, if you have a deeper look.

    So much has been contributed, and so deeply honest too.

    The river, this morning, or better said, even at the very time of sharing(s), its waters long, long gone towards an unknown and unknowable Sea.

    And even if it is utterly futile to stop the wheel of the river going, what to say; I want to leave you a message, that I loved to get a glimpse of your faces and to feel so many echoes in my heart, while sitting here, or having been sitting here,
    looking at the River.

    Madhu

    • shantam prem says:

      Madhu, are you married to some king or prince?
      Maybe in the past life as many of the women who once travelled to India believed.

      Your patronising style, applauding the labourers for writing short stories during lunch break!

      • Arpana says:

        Shantam, are you married to some king or prince?
        Maybe in the past life as many of the women who once travelled to India believed.

        Your patronising style, applauding yourself for writing drivel during lunch-break!

  24. shantam prem says:

    If someone cannot provoke or inspire through the words, better not to write.

    Electric wires where one can hang the clothes for drying demonstrate a simple fact, ‘Current can be anywhere, but not here.’

    If Osho is born again, many wise disciples can give him private tuition: “Mr. Jain, now I will tell you the difference between real Samadhi and the artificial one.”

  25. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    No, Shantam Prem, neither I take my lunch-breaks the way you imagine it, nor am I obsessed by a kind of ‘princess’ role, in any culture or historical time whatsoever.

    I simply live alone. Being alone.
    If you can allow a fresh breeze to your fantasies, I would very much appreciate that.

    Madhu

    • shantam prem says:

      Thanks..
      Now we have some humane communication.
      Seems like you are living alone for a long time.
      As I have observed, majority of O disciples utilised their quota of partnerships before the age of retirement.
      His gamblers played with what world saves for the rainy days.

  26. bodhi heeren says:

    At least one thing Arun and SN-pundits have in common. They know what is right, what Osho would have wanted, and more important: that theirs and only theirs way is the Right way.

    Osho was a man of many colours and why is it so impossible to accept that there are different approaches and that, for example, some have more need of bhakti than others?

    Some like to go to the Samadhi, some don’t. Some like to wear their mala and others have thrown it in the dustbin to show their independence. So many roads, so many roads…

    But what I don’t like is the ethnocentrism in many posts about Arun. And I honestly think, especially the British should be a little cautious about letting those feelings take too much hold (so as not to be accused of an old-fashioned, imperialistic way of thinking)!

    • Parmartha says:

      Heeren,
      As far as I can see, SN pundits are not of one voice about Arun.
      Also, one of the main critics of Arun on SN is Kavita, who is Indian and lives in Mumbai, as far as I am aware.

      In the past, the SN collective has published articles by Arun, and even at his request put into decent English a few of his memoirs.

      I myself only have a judgement about the recent politicising around and with Modi, who is clearly a Hindu nationalist without any idea of what contribution Osho made to spirituality. Given most streetwise sannyasins who know the sub-continent take this to be self-evident, one wonders as to the motivation of why Arun is networking in this way.

    • swami anand anubodh says:

      Bodhi H,

      In my experience, Osho was not here to fulfil people’s needs.

  27. Kavita says:

    Bodhi Heeren, your first para is totally a generalised statement, what you say about Arun & SN pundits. I beg to differ on this as, except for Shantam, no one is persistent for any kind of open sentimentality. I don’t know where you saw any commonality between any of the SN pundits & Sw.Arun?

  28. swami anand anubodh says:

    For all:

    A little thought experiment…

    Would you really go to Osho and say: “Bhagwan, when you are dead I am going to worship that chair you are sitting in”?

  29. Kavita says:

    Parmartha, you are aware 100%, but I live in Pune, I was born & brought up in Bombay (1967-1992), but surely these days it feels my heart is there, as these days one of my dear friends, Chris, is in Mumbai right now.

  30. Tan says:

    Frank, my dear, not me, not at all. I would be laughing and just holding a gun, totally naked, if I may say so. Anyway, thanks for the guess! XXX

    • frank says:

      Tania,
      Sorry, a case of mistaken identity then…

      It was just that an image formed in my mind from somewhere of an innocent young woman who got drawn into the bizarre world of an obscure, wacko, self-styled radical 70s criminal cult with pretensions of changing the world through amoral means!!!

      Dunno where that came from!

      • Arpana says:

        Serious question, Frank.
        Do you see yourself as amoral, or highly moral?

        (I would imagine your pretty principled actually, in your ongoing direct dealings with people, despite your belief that it’s OK to take the piss out of anything or anybody that moves, if you can get away with it. Lol).

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