The Sheela Paradox

Sannyas News feels this extract below – which is Osho’s answer to what happened in sannyas between 1979 and 85 during the Sheela regime – is illuminating. In particular it explains how Indian sannyasins were treated. However it also begs wider questions on which comment is welcome.

Question :

Beloved Master,
I’m amazed to see how much fear and how many wounds from my heart evaporated, listening to you talking about Sheela and her gang leaving the commune. Now nobody will throw me out, away from you.
Beloved master, I’m so happy that I’m laughing and crying together.
Please, just tell me one thing: why did this Sheela-Vidya gang hate your Indian sannyasins so much?

Osho:
I can see you all are immensely happy. I came to know just a little late, that you were dancing in the streets; otherwise, I would have joined you. I myself am feeling for the first time at home.

First the question, then a few more things.
I feel sad and sorry for Sheela and her gang. She has a certain hatred for Indians. The reason is she was raped when she was fifteen or sixteen years old by a man who was a friend of her father, and she had always thought of him as her uncle. Then she became pregnant.
And in India, in those days, pregnancy was a great problem. Abortion was not legal, so illegally, somehow, some physician managed the abortion.
That pain, that distrust, that ugly experience, and the trauma has remained as a wound in her. That is the root cause of her hatred for Indians.
Perhaps I am the only person from India whom she did not hate. The reason is clear, that I may have been born in India, but I am not an Indian.
I don’t belong to any tradition, any religion, any race, any color. The moment she saw me, heard me, she felt tremendous joy, that at least in the whole of India, of eight hundred million people, she can love one Indian.

The same phenomenon has caused in her mind a deep hatred for men too. Because of that old man (who raped her) she has been taking revenge on all men.
You may have observed that around her there were only homosexuals. Homosexuals are not men, homosexuals are not women. You cannot categorize them as men or women.

First I was thinking, why does she continue to be surrounded by homosexuals? Then I saw the point, that instead of men she would like homosexuals to be around her. They have dropped out of manhood. They are no longer polar opposites to the woman.
In India, she was consistently, for nine years, persuading me to come to America. I would have never come to America, but my physical health was bad. And her persuasion was right, that perhaps in the clean air, in a dry and cool place, my health will recover.
But in her own mind, the basic reason for me to leave India was the rape that had happened there. She hated the whole country. Her excuse to bring me out of India was perfectly right, but behind the excuse was her psychology. She did not want to live in India herself. She did not want me to live in India. She did not want my people to live in India.

She still carried the same antagonism, and she found excuses to throw away Indians. Many Indians had come to the commune, and had gone back to India with tears in their eyes.

India is a poor country. To make arrangements to come to America, and then to be refused by the commune, is simply inhuman. These people had come by selling their houses, their lands, all their belongings — and they were not accepted.
But because I was in silence, I never came to know what was going on. She had sent away many Indian sannyasins in a very ugly way.
Now everybody can come, because nobody has raped me, nor have I raped anybody. I don’t have any antagonism for anybody in the whole world. In fact, it was because of Sheela that Oregon became so hostile to the commune. I was silent. For five years I did not read any newspapers, did not listen to the radio, did not read any books.

It is all finished. I am keeping my eyes open only for you, just to see you and let you see in my eyes is enough. Whatever I had to achieve, I have achieved. I have loved enormously. I have been loved by millions of men and women. There is not any experience which was worth having that I have not passed through.

If death comes in this moment I will be going rejoicing, because it is not taking anything away from me. My life has been a complete contentment and fulfillment.

If I am still breathing, I am breathing for you, because before I leave I would like you to be in the same space in which I have lived.
So now nobody will be thrown out of the commune, and anybody who knocks on our doors has to be accepted.
Now there is no need for Oregonians to be hostile to us. Our hands will be always waiting for their hands, and our hearts will be always waiting for their hearts.

Sheela created this ugly situation because her life has been misery, anger, hatred. She created an unnecessary hostility.
But now I am speaking again. That hostility will disappear just like a dewdrop on a lotus leaf disappears in the early morning sun.
We are Oregonians. Now it is for Oregonians to become red! Why should those poor people choose to be dead rather than be red? We will change the whole situation. The whole world is ours — Oregon included. They are simple human beings reacting in simple human ways. There was no need to create what Sheela did.

It is past history and we have to erase it.
Just the other day I came to know that Sheela, and the whole gang that has escaped from here, were trying to kill three people who are very close to me: Devaraj, my physician; Devageet, who was my dentist in India; and Vivek, who has taken care of me for all these fifteen years as lovingly as no other woman is capable of. Twenty-four hours a day she has been just like a shadow to me, thinking of such small things — about my dress, about my bath, about my food.

You will not have seen any kitchen where a doctor is sitting and weighing calories of everything. They are very miserly; they don’t allow me more than three thousand calories per day. And I have to speak five hours, just on three thousand calories!
But they love me, and they don’t want me to leave my body before my people are ready.

I may have died without Vivek, Devaraj, Devageet, anytime. They have taken every care to keep me alive as long as possible.

Now Sheela is gone and the whole gang is gone. Things were repressed out of fear. People who knew could not say, because saying meant they would be thrown out of the commune, and they did not want to leave me. Just to be with me they had to carry wounds in their hearts.
One sannyasin came immensely happy and told Vivek that there was a meeting a few months before…. Vivek, Devaraj and Devageet — all three should be killed by slow poisoning. And she could not understand, so she left the meeting. So she does not know what decision they came to.

But they must have decided to, because Vivek got one dose of slow poison and her heartbeat went absolutely berserk. It took three hours for doctors, medicine, to bring her heartbeat back to normal.

This has never happened before. She had taken only one cup of tea at Jesus Grove, and immediately this happened.
In the meeting here, in the last ceremony, Devaraj was injected with poison. He is a doctor, has the highest qualifications from Britain. He immediately understood what had been done. He felt the prick. It happened when Shanti B. was by the side of him, telling him something, one hand on his shoulder, another hand near his body on the floor.
He immediately started saying that he had been poisoned, he had been injected. Nobody could believe it, but his situation was… he became pale as if he was dying. He had to be sent to Bend Hospital.
Hasya was there to take care of him. The doctors who were looking after him told Hasya that there seemed to be no reason for his sudden sickness, except that some poisoning had been done. They also said that the same case had happened with the attorney of Jefferson County last year, and they suspect it was exactly the same case of poisoning.
Now this gang was making it instead of a meditation camp, a concentration camp. And why did these three people have to be removed, to be killed? Just because they were close to me.
Sheela never wanted anybody to be close to me, for a simple reason: so I am never able to know what she is doing outside, what she is saying outside, in my name.

And you will be surprised and shocked, that even my room, my sitting room, my bedroom — they were all bugged.
On the surface they were all saying that they love me and they are ready to die for me. What could be the reason to bug my room? And Vivek suspected it, because her room was also bugged. Hasya’s house was bugged, and every telephone call was taped. Now, my people are not talking politics on telephones — perhaps with a friend, with a lover.

And when I suspected this, I asked her. She said, “No. We are simply tapping the phones of people whom we suspect are planted by the government.”
I said, “In four years, how much information have you got? You show me.”
They had not a single piece of information. So I said, “What is the point? For four years those thirty people were not phoning at all?”
And this is simply an excuse to listen to other people’s conversations. And it is ugly, inhuman, undemocratic. It is a crime. It is interference in people’s privacy.

I was not aware that they were even bugging my room. It will be difficult for you to believe — yesterday we discovered and disconnected a bugging device.
She was continuously insisting that my room should have a buzzer, an emergency buzzer, so that the guards know immediately if anything is wrong.
I said, “From inside what can be wrong? Guards are outside. If anything wrong is going to happen to me, it will come from outside. They should have a buzzer to inform me. I am living isolated.

Nobody can even see me from the outside, and I cannot see anybody outside. The buzzer is pointless.”
What she insisted was: in some emergency it may be needed. I said, “Okay, if you are so intent, it does me no harm.” But the point was — just yesterday we came to know — when the buzzer was removed, there was a microphone. It was a bugging device.
I was seeing a few people once in a while. She never wanted for me to see anybody. But I said, “This is not possible. I have a certain message for somebody, certain instruction for somebody. And I don’t think you are capable of doing it. So the person has to be called.”
So that was the reason for bugging my room — what am I saying to people whom I have called?
She had created almost a fascist state. It was ugly. It was criminal. And the whole bunch has escaped. Knowing that once Sheela and the main people are gone, the others will be in trouble because soon these things will be discovered….

But we are not going to leave these criminals in the world. They will destroy other communes, other people. I am going to inform the government; I am going to inform the international police force; I am going to inform all the communes; I am going to inform the press media. These people should be treated as criminals.

One of our old sannyasins, Shunyo, has donated three hundred thousand dollars, after an attack on my life was made, to purchase a bulletproof car.
Those three hundred thousand dollars were simply swallowed up by Sheela and her brother, Bipin. They went on saying, “The money will be returned, it will be returned within a month.” Now almost eight years have passed, and not a single dollar has been returned to the commune. And I heard yesterday that, although Sheela and her whole gang has left, Bipin is still in Jesus house.
Geeta has proved a jewel. She was the secretary of Sheela. Sheela wanted her also to go with them; Geeta refused. She has seen the working of Sheela closely, and she did not want to be part of that criminal gang. She informed me that this Bipin is in the house. I told her, “Tell him to leave immediately — he has nothing to do here — because he may do more mischief.”
These people could do all this harm, and much more about which we are not aware. But rumors are coming and soon people will start finding what else they have done.

It is just a rumor that they tried to poison the whole of The Dalles city by poisoning their water system. It is just a rumor right now. They did not succeed, but they made the attempt.

I am trying to make you absolutely apolitical, with no desire for power; and these people were using you and your strength for their own ambitions.
I have heard that some government office in The Dalles was burned, and it was the work of this group. These people could have done anything.
They could have killed me. Perhaps, after killing those three people who are taking care of my health, they would have started slowly poisoning me, so they become absolute dictators in the commune.

So it really feels fresh. The air seems to be totally different, and we are fortunate that they left by themselves. Perhaps they suspected that the time has come when they may be exposed.
Perhaps they have taken away money from the commune… because they have left the commune with a fifty-five-million-dollar debt. And strangely enough, three days before they left I asked Savita — because she was looking after the finances — “How much debt do you have?”
She said, “Nearabout two and a half million.”

Just three days before, two and a half million. They became experts in lying. The night she was leaving, I asked her, “You tell me exactly how much debt, because anybody who is going to run the commune will have to take care of the debt.”
She said, “It must be thirty to thirty-five million.”
I said, “Strange. Just within two days, from two and a half million, to thirty to thirty-five million? What happened in these two days?”
She said, “I was not aware of the whole thing. Because you asked me, I looked into it.”
I said, “But I have heard that you are leaving a fifty-five-million-dollar debt. And you are still saying thirty-five.
Be true!”

Hearing the figure fifty-five million dollars, she said, “Perhaps it is fifty-five million dollars.” Suddenly from thirty-five it becomes fifty-five — just there within two minutes. These people were lying to me. These people were lying to you.
Your letters were not reaching exactly — only those letters they wanted were coming. My answers were not reaching to you exactly as I had dictated them. They were edited. They managed the answers according to their ideas.

One thing has to be remembered, that such a thing should never happen again in this commune. For that reason, I am not going to be in silence again. Even if I die, just because of old habit I will go on speaking. Habits die hard; man dies very easily. But I am not going into silence. I have to keep completely acquainted with what is happening, so never again such a fascist thing happens to my people.
I love you so much. I could not conceive that anybody would do such criminal acts against you. And you have shown a great quality of trust, even in that group which was not trustworthy. I appreciate your trust. I condemn their acts, but I appreciate your trust.
But it is not going to happen again. And you all have to be aware that it should not happen again. And if you see anything like it happen — even the beginning of it — now I will be available to you directly.

From Osho’s book ‘From Bondage to Freedom”

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133 Responses to The Sheela Paradox

  1. groucho marx says:

    A priest is pulled over by a traffic cop for speeding.
    Smelling alcohol on the priests` breath and noticing an empty bottle of wine on the passenger seat,the cop asks him if he has been drinking.The priest replies `Only water`.
    Then,how is it i can smell wine?Asks the cop.
    The priest looks down at the bottle and exclaims: `Good Lord,He`s done it again`

  2. garimo says:

    More??

    Question : Beloved Master,
    For the first few days after Sheela and her gang escaped, everyone felt greatly relieved. Now, as the horror stories unfold, people are reacting by not coming to work/worship, or working without being there. There is suspicion, anger, resentment, and mistrust of those who were associated with Sheela and who have remained. Where do we go from here?

    OSHO: Nowhere! We are going to be here. It is a significant question. It represents many sannyasins’ minds.
    Basically, this is how mind functions. When you get rid of something which was binding you, enslaving you, which was a fascist thing, you feel relieved, ecstatic. The moment you heard that Sheela and her gang had left, you danced throughout the city’s streets.
    But I knew that the second part would be coming soon — because for three and a half years Sheela and her gang were taking every responsibility, were taking every care, and you were, in a way, unburdened.

    Now that you are free, a question of responsibility arises, and that shakes you. You have been dependent, and now you are independent. It will take a little time for you to change yourself from dependence to independence. You will have to pass through this trauma.
    This is simply a trauma.

    You are worried because many of the people who were part of Sheela’s group are still here.
    You should not be worried. They are here because they have revolted against Sheela and her group. They have done more than you have done. You should be respectful to them.
    Sheela had asked all of them to go with her. They refused. They wanted to be here with me and with you and the commune. They had not come here for Sheela; they had come here for me. One of the sannyasins, Ava, even went with Sheela, but came back — not even reaching the goal — the Black Forest in Germany, where they are hiding like criminals.

    They are no more wearing sannyasin dress, so they cannot be recognized. And they are hiding in a small village, afraid — because they are going to be caught. Whatever they have done, they have to be rewarded for it.
    Ava returned from the middle of the journey because, even being with them a few hours, she started feeling sick. The whole group was pathetic. She phoned here, and I told her it is her home, she can come back. These people were corrupted, led into things by Sheela, Puja, Shanti Bhadra, and they were as innocent as you are. They did whatever was told to them. Won’t you give them a chance to change? Don’t you have any love for your own people?

    Even if Sheela, Puja, Savita, Shanti Bhadra — who have all committed crimes of the first degree — if they ask to come back, I will welcome them, because their very asking to come back means they have understood, and they won’t be the same again.

    And whatever they did, good or bad, their intention was never bad. They were doing it for you. Their end was never bad, their means may have been.
    And a commune of loving people should be forgiving too. Love knows no resentment. Love only knows how to give opportunities for transformation.

    So please drop any ideas of the people who belonged to the group and have remained here. To be suspicious of them, or to keep away from them, is ugly on your part. They need more love to regain their dignity. They need more love to be transformed.

    And always remember one thing very fundamental to my way of life: anything a person does is just a mere act. It does not qualify and color his whole being. Being is vast.

    I will not punish even a murderer, because the murder happened in the past. Nobody has the right to destroy this man’s future, because in the future he may turn into a poet, a painter, a scientist, a musician, a dancer. One thing is certain: he has energy. He misused it. All that you have to do is treat him psychologically, to make it clear to him that something is wrong in his mind, to make him aware of how to drop it and how to change the direction of his energies. What is destructive can become creative.

    I am against all punishment, particularly the death sentence. It is inhuman, resentful, revengeful, and without any consideration of the person — in his situation even you would have done the same.
    And past is past. Why distort the future of a person? Any individual is worthy of respect. Your respect will help him to change. Your trust will help him to change.
    So the people who have remained here need more love, more respect, need to be more sheltered, protected, so they can drop their fear. And now we have a totally new regime. They will be working under it, and they can be of immense help, because they have worked for four years. We need a few experienced people. So anybody who is here, and anybody who wants to come back, is welcome.
    This is not an ordinary society. You have to prove that it is extraordinary, that you are capable of trusting even those people who deceived you. That will make them feel ashamed, and that is the only way for their transformation.
    And, whatever they did, once you accept them we will not need to find out and discover and investigate — they themselves will reveal all.

    Trust creates such a space, and love gives such courage.
    If a person can see, can say to the court, yes, he has murdered, and he is sorry for it, and he wants to be changed…. He does not know why he murdered. There must be something in his psychology which is wrong, which is destructive. But in the ordinary world outside he will be sentenced to death, or to remain in jail for his whole life, which is worse.
    Naturally, the murderer cannot be changed by your courts, by your laws.

    And for thousands of years your laws have gone on growing, your courts go on becoming bigger, and you have more judges. But do you know, your murders are not less. They are increasing far more rapidly than your judges. Strange — there is something basically wrong.
    Anything that is done should not be taken in the spirit of revenge, punishment; but the outside society lives only with greed and fear. Give respectability to a person who is obedient to the rotten society, and give punishment to anybody who does anything against the society. This society is not for transformation.

    But my people should behave differently. You are to prepare the ground for the new man and for a new human existence. And these are the chances, opportunities.
    Sheela has given you a great opportunity to learn the power of love and forgiveness, and to see that there is no alchemy which can transform a man other than love.
    So if these people come back — and also those who have remained here — they should be specially treated, with love and great joy and dance and rejoicing that they have come home. And I promise you, your love will change them. There is no other way to change a person.
    So don’t unnecessarily get worried, seeing the same people still holding power posts. I know about it, but I know that they have revolted in favor of you, against Sheela — and now you are misbehaving with them.
    They should be rewarded. And they are the people who will bring out everything that has been done; they are the authentic witnesses.
    But if you are behaving badly with them, you will not be able to win their hearts. And five thousand people, trusting, loving, cannot win the hearts of a dozen people? Then love is useless; trust is useless.

    You are just functioning with your old, conditioned mind that you have carried from the outside world.
    And you are feeling another thing which you have to be reminded of, because if you are not reminded, you will create another fascist regime.
    Freedom does not mean license.

    In Magdalena restaurant, people are not ready to prepare food. They are free. They want to meditate. Then what is going to happen to five thousand people?
    People are not working the way they were working under Sheela. That means you need Sheela. You should be working more — to prove that Sheela’s fascism was unnecessary. People are not coming to their work, and even if they come they don’t work. Do you see the implication of it?
    Five thousand people have to live self-sufficiently. You have to produce your food, your houses, your vegetables, your milk products — everything. And if you are not working, because you think that’s what freedom means, then you are behaving stupidly.

    You should do just the opposite.
    You should work more, not as a slave, but out of your freedom and love for the whole commune, and you will prove that Sheela was wrong. And that will be the guarantee that nobody ever again takes any fascist steps. But if you act this way, then perhaps another Sheela will be needed; otherwise you cannot survive. It is simple arithmetic.
    In Soviet Russia, when the country became independent from the czarist rule in 1917, in the Moscow main street a woman was found walking in the middle of the road. And when she was told by the policeman, “Walking in the middle of the road is not allowed”….

    There are two possibilities: if the country decides, then keep to the left or keep to the right. But no country in the whole world has the idea to keep in the middle. Traffic will become impossible. Accidents will increase a thousandfold. Just think, traffic in the middle! from both sides cars and buses and people walking! It will be a tragedy.
    But the woman said, “Then what is the meaning of freedom, if I still have to keep the old rule?”
    Don’t be so idiotic, like that woman. Nobody should impose any rule over you. If you are responsible, intelligent, you will create a life of discipline on your own.
    So remember, you can choose. If you want Sheela back, I can call her and her whole gang, and give the commune to her. If you don’t want anybody to be dictatorial to you, then take responsibility.
    Then work, and work more sincerely, honestly. The need simply disappears.
    And you are a group of very intelligent people, but this is the trouble with intelligent people. They always try to misuse freedom.

    I would like to remind you that Germany is one of the most intellectual countries in the world. It has given to the world people like Kant, Hegel, Feuerbach, Karl Marx, Sigmund Freud, Martin Heidegger — great philosophers, great psychologists. And still a third-class crackpot, Adolf Hitler, managed to get all the intelligentsia of the country to follow him.

    And I don’t think humanity has learned anything out of it. If you don’t learn, then history repeats. If you learn, then you can stop history repeating again.
    Martin Heidegger was perhaps one of the most significant philosophers of the century, and he was a contemporary of Adolf Hitler. He supported Adolf Hitler — inconceivable! The whole youth, which is the cream of the society, its intelligence, all the universities’ vice-chancellors, professors — they all supported Adolf Hitler, a man who was uneducated, a man who was refused from the school of art, who was refused from the school of architecture, because he had no intelligence.
    This man became the leader of the most intelligent country in the world, and he created the greatest fascist regime. He killed almost ten million people, and still people were supporting him.
    It has to be psychoanalyzed.

    What was the reason? The reason was, Germany was defeated in the first world war. And the intellectuals tend to fight among themselves. They argue, rationalize, philosophize; they are not physically active people. And they are egoists. They think they have found the secret of life, every one of them.

    After its defeat in the first world war, Germany was in a chaos. The chaos created Adolf Hitler, because he promised, and he fulfilled the promise, “I can make this country again united, again strong, so strong that it can rule over the whole world.”
    It was something that was immensely needed. People were not working, people were not being creative. Somebody was needed to make the country again creative, disciplined. And Adolf Hitler filled the gap. Within ten years Germany was again a world power.

    Strange — if you give people freedom, they become lazy, they don’t want to work. But if you give them a fascist order, they work to their very potential; they create, they are united, they become strong.
    Germany went on winning for five years. That proved that the people of Germany had chosen the right person — the whole world on one side, and he alone was enough.
    He gave the intelligentsia their ego as nobody had given them before. He said to them that the Nordic German race is the purest Aryan race, and it is its destiny to rule over the world, because all others are subhuman.
    It was tremendously gratifying. The intellectual ego was very much fulfilled, and even a man like Martin Heidegger fell into the trap.

    Only after Hitler was defeated and Germany was almost destroyed, then people started looking back at what they had done, what kind of man they were supporting: a monster, a murderer who has killed millions of people — perhaps the greatest murderer in the whole history.
    So remember one thing: freedom is not license. Freedom is responsibility. And if you cannot take your responsibility yourself, then somebody is going to take the responsibility on your behalf. And then you are enslaved.
    People have been asking me how it happened that five thousand people, almost all university graduates, having the best qualifications from the best universities of the world, could not see for four years.
    The reason is, Sheela was not only doing something ugly and fascist, she was also creating the commune. She was also making the desert into an oasis. She was making the commune comfortable in every way. Every coin has two sides.
    So you looked at the light side. And you were surrounded — which Sheela and her group created — with hostility in Oregon. That is a simple political strategy.
    Adolf Hitler, in his autobiography MY STRUGGLE, says that if you want a nation to be strong, create enemies all around it; otherwise, people relax.
    Keep them continuously in paranoia, fearing that there is danger all around.
    And Sheela created that. She created the hostility of the Oregon government. She created the hostility of Americans in general. That made you come close to each other, become strong: “Be ready so that nobody can harm you.”
    So if you don’t take the responsibility, something like that is bound to happen again. History certainly repeats, because man does not learn.

    Now I want no hostility with anybody. We have been here for four years. Others may have been for four generations — that makes no difference. If in four years you cannot be Americans, you cannot be Americans in four hundred years either. Years don’t count.
    We love this land, and we are pouring our perspiration into this desert to make it an oasis. We have fallen in love with this desert.

    And to me, America is perhaps the only hope for humanity, because the American Constitution is the only constitution which is authentically democratic. That is creating a trouble for American politicians, because those politicians are not democratic. So they go on continuously against their own Constitution.

    We will fight for the Constitution of America against those Americans who are prostituting it. But there is no question of hostility. We are part of this country, and we are going to be part of this country forever.
    And we are withdrawing everything that Sheela and her group created — fear, paranoia. I would like the City of Rajneesh to change its name back to Antelope. There was no need to change the name — Antelope is so beautiful a name — and why hurt people?
    And I would like that the people of Antelope who have sold their properties to us should take them back. We have improved on their properties, we have renovated their dilapidated houses, and anyway, prices in four years have gone high. But I don’t want — because it is not a question of profit…. I would give them back at the same price as we had purchased them. And if they can take all the properties back…. We have such a big land here, why should our people live anywhere else?
    We have three times more land than New York. We can create three New Yorks here. We have one hundred and twenty-six square miles. But we are not going to make those ugly structures, skyscrapers, against nature, against aesthetics. We will make small cottages which mix with nature, and we will make this place lush green. We need greenery, because the red becomes very great when there is greenery all around. Even trees understand it. Green trees and red flowers…. These are two basic colors.
    And we want the government of Oregon to understand that we are Oregonians.

    Governor Atiyeh has come from Lebanon. His father may have come, that does not matter. If he can be an Oregonian, why cannot you be an Oregonian? In fact, everybody in America is a foreigner except the Red Indians. Others have invaded the country. They have entered the country without any visa. They have exploited the poor people of the country. Their forefathers had no green cards.

    We have not invaded. We have given more money for this land than anybody else was ready to give. This land was for sale for fifty years, and nobody came to purchase it. The greatest offer was three and a half million. We have given six million dollars for the land.
    You should compare it. The forefathers of Americans who had come here purchased New York for thirty dollars. Just a little arithmetic: thirty dollars for the whole of New York? — then we should pay only ninety dollars for this whole land. Why six million dollars? But we want to be just and fair.
    These people who have come, without a visa, with no green card, no American passport, are asking us…. They should feel a little ashamed.

    We have come into the country legally, and I have chosen the place because I am in tremendous love with the American Constitution. It is far more holy than THE HOLY BIBLE, because it gives you all the democratic values of life: individuality, individual property, freedom of speech, freedom of information. It gives you everything that individual growth needs.
    We are for the Constitution, but the politicians are just corrupting it, in every way.

    You will be surprised to know that half of Oregon is owned by the federal government. This is not right; this is not according to the Constitution.
    Government should not nationalize anything. This is underground communism. The property should belong to individuals — what does the government have to do with it?
    And they had ideas to own the whole of Oregon. That’s why they are against us — because now they know they can never have the whole of Oregon. Rajneeshpuram is here and cannot be purchased. So they have been doing everything illegal, persecuting. But there is no fear. We have the Constitution in our favor, and we will win in every court, so there is no question of fear.
    And as far as the general masses of Oregon and America are concerned, we love them for one reason: that this is the only place which does not have a very loaded past.

    For example, India has at least ten thousand years of conditioning. To change the Indian mind is an Himalayan task. But to change the American mind, to transform the American is simple. America does not have any past — three hundred years only. Compared to countries like India or Europe, it has no past; it has only future. Its past is so small, it can be deprogrammed very easily.
    My whole religion consists in deprogramming.
    I don’t have any program to give to you; and I don’t want to give any program to you, because that is against humanity.
    I simply want to deprogram you — clean, fresh, unburdened, just a bird on the wing in the sky. And you have to find yourself out of your freedom.
    But freedom brings great responsibility. And I am trying to make you free, not only from fascist types of structures. I am trying to free you from Christianity, Hinduism, Buddhism, Mohammedanism, all religions. They are all fascist, because their basic idea is belief.
    They destroy your reason, they destroy your inquiry, they destroy your intelligence. They give you borrowed, centuries-old rubbish and call it knowledge. You call the BIBLE holy and every day you worship it, with great respect, without knowing that this is the most pornographic book in the whole world. If the Supreme Court of America is really fair, the BIBLE should be X-rated. But the same is the situation of other religious scriptures. All are pornography.
    I want you to be free from any ideology so that you can be yourself and you can search and you can go into the unknown. That inquiry into the unknown is such an ecstasy, such a great excitement — the only pilgrimage. There is no need to go to Israel, no need to go to the Kremlin, no need to go to Varanasi. These are not real pilgrimages.

    The only pilgrimage is the move from the known into the unknown, and from the unknown into the unknowable.
    I am not even giving you a God, because the whole idea of God is again fascist.
    God created you, so what are you? — just puppets. And he could not find anything better, he created you with mud. Humus means mud; that’s why you are called human beings — from the Big Muddy Ranch.
    And he was even more unfair to women, as if all the mud was exhausted in creating one Adam. But just to create inferiority — this God is a male chauvinist — he created the woman out of a rib of man.
    He was not a qualified surgeon, still he did surgery — a criminal act. And I have heard a story that because he created Eve from one of Adam’s ribs, each night when Adam goes to sleep, Eve will count his ribs. She has been counting since then.
    But to accept a God is to accept a bigger Adolf Hitler, supreme-most, omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent. He can do anything. You are just puppets in his hands. He created you; he can de-create you any moment.
    And the guy seems to be whimsical. According to Christianity he created you four thousand and four years before Jesus Christ, and I am always puzzled, what has he been doing for the whole eternity? Six thousand years old, and what was the fellow doing all along? He has a company: a holy ghost, a son. The company is gay — and AIDS is the result.
    At least one woman would not have been bad. There would have been a little excitement, a little gossiping, love affairs, fights — some story. But these three queens, what were they doing for the whole eternity? I have asked Christian theologians, “You have to answer me: What were they doing?”

    I have rejected this unholy trinity completely.
    Existence has always been here. Nobody has created it.
    And Friedrich Nietzsche is right at least on this point: that God is dead and man is free. Those two things together — God is dead and man is free — are very significant.
    If God is alive, man cannot be free. He is always there, and he is everywhere.
    I have heard about a nun who would not take her clothes off even while taking a bath in a closed bathroom. Other nuns said, “This seems to be a little crazy. Why don’t you take your clothes off?”
    She said, “How can I? God is everywhere. And he is all powerful and he can do anything, any stupid thing — he can send the Holy Ghost to rape a virgin girl, Mary.”
    No, with God, man’s freedom is not possible. God is a dictatorial idea. Communists may accept it…. Although they don’t accept it, it would fit perfectly with them, with their ideology. But any democratic mind cannot accept God.
    So my whole work here is to deprogram you — from God, from hell and heaven, from all religions, from all political ideologies, which are nothing but exploitations of you.
    Why has man been so much interested in heaven and hell? Poor man needs a promise; otherwise living will be impossible. Hope is his opium. He knows here there is nothing possible, only after death. That’s why all the religions go on giving hope to the poor — after death you will be rewarded.

    “Blessed are the poor for they shall inherit the kingdom of God.”
    I don’t see any point in poverty, any virtue in poverty — that they should inherit the kingdom of God. If being poor is virtue, then where is your pope, who is the richest man in the whole world, going to end up? All your popes will be found in hell. They are not poor people.
    But it is a consolation, and it is also preventive of any revolution against the rich. The BIBLE says that a camel can pass through the eye of a needle, but the rich man cannot enter into the gates of heaven. At least rich people should throw out this BIBLE; this is not for them. But they go on worshipping, they go on making more churches, more cathedrals.
    They go on donating, making trusts, because they know that this is simply a consolation for the poor. They are going to inherit the kingdom of God. They are already enjoying something of paradise — and experience counts. The poor man will not be able to enjoy paradise. He will be so unacquainted with any comfort, with any luxury. He is accustomed to poverty. Hell will suit him better.
    The rich man knows perfectly well that he is going to be in paradise. For the rich man the paradise is his greed: more and more and more. For the poor man it is a consolation: to live with less and less and less.

    I want you to be freed completely from heaven and hell.
    Hell is your fear projected.
    Heaven is your greed projected.
    And when we can create paradise here, why bother with something which nobody knows exists or not, because nobody has ever come after death to inform us.
    Strange — the story is that Lazarus died. He was a poor man, so he must have got into paradise. Jesus revived him, but in the BIBLE there is no reference at all — because he has been for four days in paradise — Lazarus does not give any information. The only man who has come back does not give any information about paradise.
    The reality is he was a friend of Jesus, and this whole thing was fake. Many people must have died in Jesus’ time. If the man was capable of reviving people then why only Lazarus? This seems unkind. Other people are dying. You can revive them just by touching them or by calling them, “Come back.” Such a small effort on your part and you give them life back. He never did that.
    My own understanding is that Lazarus played the part; it was a trick. He was not dead. He was placed in a cave, and his two sisters, who were also followers of Jesus, waited for him. Messengers were sent. He came and he simply called from outside the cave, “Lazarus, get up!” And he got up. He was not even asleep. And he says nothing about paradise, or anything about what happened in those four days.
    I want you to be freed from all this nonsense. Try to live here, now, as totally as possible.
    And the paradise is now here. If there is a paradise after death, certainly you will inherit it, because you will have already practiced for it.
    And don’t be worried even if you are thrown into hell — because you have been with me. I will be with you there, and we can create a great commune in hell.
    And in hell there are all the colorful people. In heaven there are only sad, long faces, saints, dry bones, no juice, nothing. In paradise there is not even a single newspaper, no movie, no film actors, no poets, no painters. All the geniuses are in hell. So if we end up in hell, we are going to have a great time.

    If we end up in paradise, we are still going to have a great time, teasing those idiotic saints, teaching them how to dance, how to sing…. Because for eternity, what are you going to do? Teach them how to make love, because all those monks must have been homosexuals.
    All the monasteries are full of homosexuals. All the nunneries are full of lesbians. That’s why I call AIDS a religious disease. It is the greatest contribution of all your religions to humanity.
    It is death and nothing else. It is not a disease, because it has no cure. There is only one thing that has no cure, and that is death.
    We are trying to live a different kind of life than in the outside world.

    So there are only two ways: either the way of Sheela or my way. I had chosen Sheela to be my secretary to give you a little taste of what fascism means. Now, live my way. Be responsible, so that there is no need for anybody to dictate to you.
    Every individual should contribute to the commune. It is not an ordinary society. There are no families, it is an organic whole. Contribute… because I have been hearing that since Sheela has left, many people are saying, “I don’t want to do this, I don’t want to do that,” and they were doing it for four years.
    You can change your job if you feel like changing, you can do something else. But just because nobody is going to force you, don’t let the commune become crippled. It has to become more healthy. It has to prove the truth of independence.
    ———————————————————————————-
    (Excerpts from Osho’s book ‘From Bondage to Freedom’)

  3. Neo Vivek says:

    So plant the thought and watch it grow
    Wind it up and let it go

  4. Neo Vivek says:

    Those are the last two lines form the lyrics of the song “Lies – Glen Hansard”
    Felt they fit into context, so posted.

  5. Heraclitus says:

    The appointment of Sheela was a mistake. Okay Sheela had her problems, but Osho (as she was family) knew all about them, and her history of being raped, etc. So why did he appoint her? That is the real question that is begged. In a way Osho rationalises his position, but actually he was responsible for her appointment and the replacement of Laxmi.
    In Pune one he claimed to know “everything” that was going on in the commune, including by the way the treatment of Indian sannyasins which he seemed to support. The treatment of Indian sannyaisns by the commune was actually poor even in Pune one.
    Why did he himself change his style of “management” in Oregon?
    Osho himself has some common sense questions to answer about the Sheela regime, and many feel he never did.

  6. Kranti says:

    Now we are re-opening Sheela facts.. Game/Debate for for big boys / Girls from Ranch.. may be Andreas will also jump in.. late joiners /pune 3 guys will step aside and watch the show..

  7. Alok john says:

    Heraclitus ….Sheela…

    Some say she pushed herself to the top and he could not get rid of her. That is my impression reading the history.

    Maybe he thought the movement needed to go through a period of fascism as a learning experience.

    Editors… great you put this up, especially for newcomers.

  8. shantam Prem says:

    Hindus celebrate a day in a year called Dashhera. Effigies of Ravna, the devil, the bad, the asshole are burnt and it is said, this festival is a victory of good over the evil, a victory of light over the darkness.

    As the resort has no more festival days, other than the new year eve; why not celebrate Sheela’s departure day as a festival day.
    This woman born on 19th March 1949 is a Judas, a Ravana of Osho movement. That day, people can atleast dedicate their Dynamic to her. Will someone pass this suggestion to Sadhana’s blog.

    Great , let us celebrate. New man, new vision has dawned in Osho’s world. Only the meritocracy rules amogst us. One asshole is enough for ever. Everybody else can be the heartbeat or the dimple on the cheeks!

    PS- Osho’s world is not “Osho World”

  9. groucho marx says:

    `God is a dictatorial idea`

    So is `Master`.

    End of.

  10. Harri says:

    Osho says that it will never happen again. I say that it has already happened. Do you think that I thought I wouldn’t be believed? I knew before I started writing that I would be assailed for even mentioning such a possibility. Anyhow, is it possible to consider that if it has happened again, or if it is happening again, what then is to be done about the situation? Osho says that he will not remain silent this time. Has anyone heard him whispering in your ear? What would he sound like? If it has happened (or is happening) again then I assume you missed the call? What then? Of course now I know you will automatically object and dismiss me. However before you do, I ask you to read the following.

    When I said my name was Harri, everyone replied to Hari. Do you think this was coincidental? Harri is not an Indian name, Hari is. Your mind knows “Hari”, but it does not know “Harri”. Hence you literally saw the word “Hari” on your computer screen, when actually the computer was displaying “Harri”. Yes what I am saying is that you were actually hallucinating. You I sure will disagree because to agree would mean you are stupid, and you are not stupid, I am.

    Unfortunately the story does not end their. If I did not explain very clearly that every time I wrote my name as Harry, the reply was always Hari, the situation would have continued this way. After a time, if I was to finally get tired of being called by my wrong name you would have called me a liar. You would have said that I was wrong, that I was a fool, and that my name was Hari not Harri. You would have said that I do not know what my own name is, even though as you continue to state you know nothing about who I am. At least you are right on that one.

    In the same way that you were hallucinating when I wrote Harri, you also cannot actually see what is written on this page as you now read it. You are looking into the minds image of the computer screen, and your mind is clouded by its misunderstandings.

    I may be wrong when I say that the Sheela fiasco has already happened again, and that it is still going in at the Pune resort and elsewhere. However you do not actually read what I write and hence have now chance of even understanding it, let alone disagreeing with it. Remember this, that with enough repetition of the term Hari, you would have told me that that was my name and that I was a liar and a fool.

    See if you can read this without being clouded by the emotions that turned into utterly ignorant and vulgar comments on the previous page. If you can’t read this with a fresh and quite mind, then come back to it later. That goes the same for any comments or questions you may have for me.

    Also, whatever call I am making it is not from Osho, it is from Harri (with two r’s).

    Maroon and Money and Marble

    If I have the opportunity, I will only vote for a people that allow me to wear whatever colors I feel reflect my current inner-beauty. Maroon happens not to be one of those colors. I like red, yellow, green, blue, and also white. Also, if I were a man I would like to wear a robe every second day and tight pants (to show of my bottom) on the other. However if I were a women, when I go to worship my beloved Master in the evening meditation, I would like to wear a dress that has lots of frilly flower patterns all over it

    I am absolutely sick of having to wear maroon. Even worse, I am sick of having to wear dark non-faded maroon, preferably made from a disgusting synthetic fabric that does not allow my body to breath (especially during active meditations). Don’t try and find any of those nasty crease forming natural cotton robes in the galleria.

    The restrictions on the type of robe are a metaphor for all that is happening at the resort and in the inner-circle. It does not matter if it is unpleasant or unhealthy or vulgar, so long as everything looks beautiful.

    Why is this so? You see there is a little mathematics involved. It is much much cheaper to make things look beautiful, than for them to be beautiful. What you then do is make sure that no-one from the outside can see behind the veil and find out that the truth is very very ugly. Then guess what happens? Lots of people are drawn to the beauty, especially because it is so cheap. This is where mathematics comes into it. The sale price is relatively high, but not to high. The cost is relatively low. Multiply the difference by the number of clients, and I have made heaps of money.

    The trouble with this logic is that you can only deceive people for so long. Stay for a while or come back a few times and you might start to wonder about the quality of your experience. Also, when you as a client engage with something that appears beautiful but is in fact ugly, you can have a nasty experience. Although this may hurt people physically, mentally, and emotionally, this is not of any significance at all. The key is that unfortunately it reduces the brand image.

    Brand images are rather important – it is also a form of hypnosis. If there is a beautiful ashram that has thrived by the efforts of its beloved disciples, then a strong positive brand image is built up. This gives me an idea. If I stop investing money into making the place actually functional and beautiful, and invest that money into making the place look artificially beautiful, then I can ride on the historically strong brand image, harm people and rip them off, and make heaps of money$$$. That seems like such a great idea I think I will do it.

    All I have to do is push the positive brand image that the place actually is beautiful, and people will be hypnotised into believing so. It will be easy to push a strong brand image, because when Osho left the body, his beloved sannyasins gave their heart and soul into making the place very functional and absolutely beautiful. Also, from my experience, if I can deceive the crowd sufficiently with my very strong advertising skills, I can keep then deceived even when I have hurt and deceived them deeply. Ah, the flock of sheep to my slaughter…such joy, and indeed such big bucket loads of money.

    There is an interesting twist to the metaphor of the plastic maroon robe. Following the argument it might seem that it does not matter that my body stinks from excessive sweating, so long as I don’t have any creases on my non-faded robe. However it does matter if I stink. People cannot see the ugly deception with their eyes, but they have other senses as well. They can get hurt by the dysfunctional and the ugly, and they can get put off by the stench.

    Perhaps my nose is a little too sensitive. I know, I will go to the Pune resort and breathe in the air from all the poorly cleaned air-conditioners. Then I will get a nice flu (hopefully the pig or bird variety). This will block my nose so then I no longer have to smell the stench.

    I just had another idea. I am going to vote for people that let me wear all kinds of colored clothing, and that also pledge to provide an efficiently functioning and good quality environment. I will also find out how I am going to be assured that this is actually happening, so that I don’t have to find out the truth once I have recovered from the flu.

    Of course meanwhile if I have completely trashed the place and its people, and the joke is starting to wear a little thin, what to do? The answer is simple and obvious. I simply sell for a song to an unsuspecting buyer.

    None of the above is particularly profound – just good business (sense if you have a criminal mind).

    Just good business that’s all.

    Of course in the last few years there was a lot of money invested in new infrastructure – a brand new meditation auditorium for example. This was an attempt to rebuild the cash cow that had been milked yet not fed. The smashing of Buddha Hall pagoda no doubt is connected with the building of the auditorium. It does provide an excuse to demolish it. This also provides many advantages. It removes meddling religious interference from worshipping Indians (and some devotional Westerners). It also makes the place easier to sell. However I do not think selling the place was in mind at the time. I think the aim was simple enough. The previous business model of ashram had been milked and the starving cow was almost dead on her feet. The idea was then to build a 5-star resort to attract wealthy clients. The brand new O-Hotel down the road fits nicely into the picture as well. Who would sell such a business? Also, resort management and the inner-circle become the elite in a powerful, religious organisation that has many wealthy adherents.

    However the place was so trashed that the efforts to create a new business model have left gaping holes in resort infrastructure. Also, the new investments are in a few short years not so new anymore: built on the cheap, improperly commissioned, treated with neglect, and poorly maintained. Any interference from well meaning working Osho sannyasins (who could possibly create trouble) was addressed by a well-dressed team of Sodexo workers. However Sodexo has been shown to be utterly and resolutely incompetent. Furthermore, like management is there to make money, Sodexo workers are there to do a job. This very quickly has put a further and significant drain on the energy field – the resorts greatest historical asset.

    So the old business model of ashram dried up, but thanks very much to all of Osho’s devoted sannyasins that in part gave years of the life to try and help recover from the guilt and injustice that arose out of the explosion of The Ranch experiment. The new business model is for the above mentioned reason’s not working. With the current state of archaic resort infrastructure, and the rapidly corroding new infrastructure, the new resort model is aging fast. With the number of people coming to the resort dwindling to a trickle in off-season, and rising to a hillock in the main season, and with additional expenses like an army of staff that actually has to be paid (all be it for doing an incompetent job), there is absolutely no way that the place can get a return on its investment.

    The only option left is to sell the place to the highest unsuspecting bidder. Of course this will create an uproar if the highest bidder has no connection with Osho and has no intention of keeping it as an Osho centre. The intractable part of this problem is that the Buddha Hall pagoda and the Samadhi are sacred to many Osho devotees. The pagoda is an easy one as the new auditorium provides the excuse to get rid of the old. Of course it would all have to be cloaked in spiritual terminology. You know how it goes, Osho wanted a 5-star resort and the Buddha Hall pagoda is the antithesis of Osho’s vision. I leave you my dream and all that nice mushy stuff. Ah yes it was his dream, and many tried to make it right this time, but others had there own ambitions and turned the dream into a nightmare.

    The Samadhi is a tough call. One idea is to change the name, change a few things here and there, and slowly slowly the Samadhi becomes sufficiently changed (not just in name but also in nature), that it can be argued that it is no longer a Samadhi, no matter what you might like to call it. This is the only approach available as the simple approach of demolition of the pagoda created such an uproar.

    You might argue that the demolishing of the pagoda was simply making way for the new auditorium, to enable a successful transition. However if the pagoda remained intact for any length of time after the opening of the auditorium, there was no way that the new auditorium could be used as an excuse. If the pagoda was left standing for several years, then that is how it would have to remain for a long time to come.

    The pagoda was very important to many people and was therefore a very emotive, but also a very powerful, object. It being there (with all the devotional people) could always pose a problem. Indian is famous for its great temple protests. So the pagoda was a counter-weight to the powers of the establishment. In general it could pose ongoing problems with devotees, and in the end could provide the ultimate problem if selling the place became the preferred option.

    A strategic thinker is always going to have a back up plan if things don’t go as planned. The new business model of resort was a big investment, targeting new and unknown markets. The risks and consequences of failure need always be considered. Hence it is straight-forward to conclude that if the business model fails the place may need to be sold up. It is also straight-forward to work out that there is absolutely no way you could sell a place that had a Buddha Hall, complete with podium and pagoda, and a Samadhi. Hence I would argue that it is entirely possible that strategic management was capable of reaching the same conclusions that I have here. It is not only entirely possible, it is, from a purely business standpoint, the smart decision to make.

    So ashram business was good until the starving cow refused to give any more milk. Resort business sounded great, but isn’t so good. The Buddha Hall religious icon is gone. The Samadhi has changed its name and we have some small changes. Let these changes settle for a while. Make a few more changes. Put the place up for sale. However don’t tell anyone that the ashram was so trashed that it was not possible to build a resort on top of these shaky foundations. Don’t tell anyone that the resort has started crumbling on the old foundations. At least, with the pagoda gone and the Samadhi less and less in the picture, we have a bargaining position. It is tough to sell to a non-Oshoite. However it is now possible. This gives a bargaining position to put pressure on any collective of Osho sannyasins to pay a high price. Indeed Pune real-estate has boomed and just look at the brand new resort. However the reality is that market value needs to take into account the fact that the resort, although looking beautiful, is actually not. The trouble is that Osho sannyasins have not been deceived by the image of a beautiful 5-star style resort (as have many visitors). Hence they will not pay the asking price needed for investors to recover from the failing investment. As time passes, the aging of the resort will become more and more evident. Hence time is of the essence. Osho sannyasins revolted against the destruction of the pagoda, and they didn’t much like the subtle changes to the Samadhi. This is putting a dampener on the exit strategy.

    I can not see an easy way out of this one. That is a terrible shame.

  11. Dilruba says:

    Sannyasnews …. this new thread you have chosen for yourself … l see this as an extention of your nationality .. what are you trying to convey .. if at all you are trying to convey something ?

    or is it that you personally want to undo what your forefathers did .. lam wondering

  12. shantam Prem says:

    When someone writes quite revolutionary and illuminating thoughts, my first reaction is to ask them about their identity. The face behind the thoughts.
    Facebook has made it quite easier.
    So groucho marx,
    without doubt your little Haikus are chili sharp. let us see the face of this Chili growing farmer.

    `God is a dictatorial idea`

    So is `Master`.

    End of.

    And than which movie will be played afer THE END.

  13. groucho marx says:

    After the end,You are absolutely free to find out which movie you are in.

    Maybe “Dictatorial Ideas 2″ –the sequel?

  14. shantam Prem says:

    first comes frist

    So groucho marx,
    without doubt your little Haikus are chili sharp. let us see the face of this Chili growing farmer at
    http://www.facebook.com

  15. Dilruba says:

    Parmartha {sannyasnews}…is it possible for you to come jus as a sanyassin … and participate … without being burdened by your post .. l would request this as we can have a true / open debate then … ?

  16. Kartar says:

    It was a difficult bridge to cross for many sannyasins when the ranch experiment failed.

    I remember when a lot of people felt they were betrayed by Sheela and Osho.

    Many close friends of mine were angry, hurt and bitter and dropped sannyas completely. Disappearing to who knows where.

    Nobody knew what was really going on when the dust hit the fan. Everyone was in shock.

    This is hard stuff sometimes….to defend another’s truth. Sheela made poor choices and suffered the consequences..Osho made informed choices and he suffered the consequences.. Anger or resentment will never bring healing.

    My love for Osho has stood the test of time.

    Nonetheless life is a series of lessons to be learned, not just about ourselves and people in general, but about individual people who we meet in our journey through life.

  17. Neo Vivek says:

    “Nonetheless life is a series of lessons to be learned, not just about ourselves and people in general, but about individual people who we meet in our journey through life.”

    Reminded me.. once at zorba, i did philosophize life .. and an experienced sannyasin sitting with me, gave a lion’s roar and said “Drop it, Now!” .. and than started laughing.

  18. Kranti says:

    ” Sheela made poor choices and suffered the consequences..Osho made informed choices and he suffered the consequences ”

    That why we can never judge anyone based on consequences..But only based on whether they are taking informed decisons or uninformed decisons..
    Consequences are within anyone’s control.

    ” Nonetheless life is a series of lessons to be learned,”

    To me the only lessson is ‘ Life has its own way.. there is notghing really there to learn except learning to be in flow of the unpredictableness of life ‘

    But sometimes i used to wonder the world outside us is not REAL because the it is an output of / byproduct of other people’s unconciouness .. You need to meet them where they are .. there is no point talking about we being very aware and concious..

  19. Kranti says:

    ” Consequences are NOT within anyone’s control “

  20. Neo Vivek says:

    Kranti
    ” Sheela made poor choices and suffered the consequences..Osho made informed choices and he suffered the consequences ”

    That why we can never judge anyone based on consequences..But only based on whether they are taking informed decisons or uninformed decisons..
    Consequences are NOT within anyone’s control.


    Something there i just cannot digest…. if someone is in isolation, they cant really make informed choices… i guess he wanted us to know he is as human as anybody else .. and there would be decisions which you will have to live with. Its amazing how osho managed the disaster. Sheela episode could have spelled the death of Osho movement. Although the Master turned around that loss into a win. That to me is the beauty of Osho.

  21. Kranti says:

    ” i guess he wanted us to know he is as human as anybody else .. ”

    Sure. Infact i really liked the way he answered that question when someone asked whether he knew his room was bugged.

    He said ” enilghtenment means I am aware of myself . It doesnt mean I am aware that my room is bugged ..”

    He always told us he as human..

    Yes . He turned around the situation… But i honestly dont know things when people talked about Osho being responsible for Sheela but he didnt take responsibility in the end.. I also felt how he can talk about Sheela so badly in the public.. First time i felt hurt with something Osho said.

    I am sorry for saying this.. But i thought i can get your view on this..

  22. groucho marx says:

    Sheela,Jesus,,Communists,Sannyasins,Homosexuals,The Pope,Mohamedans,Hindus,Hitler,Heidegger,God,The Mind,The Rotten Society…
    It was Them what done it!
    Me,I was just sitting in my room,minding me own business.

  23. Neo Vivek says:

    My View:
    If you believe in he being poisoned theory, he took responsibility with his life ( his actions ).
    Taking responsibility in words had legal consequences. It would have meant death of his vision of new man… we would never have got the amazing zen talks he conducted during his last days.

    Besides, i am sure all the crimes like attempt to kill Devaraj, Devageet, and vivek etc were in no way done with his permission.
    I would sum up with :

    When he was passive, he was passive in totality. That is all i can feel and think and believe and digest.

  24. Kranti says:

    ” When he was passive, he was passive in totality ”

    Absolutely.. thats what i have always said.. He couldnt have taken a position or other aggressively… To him everyone is equal.

    But His comments about Sheela is what made me feel hurt as it is discussing what she went through in life so publicly..I am not able to digest it.. He is gone.. We make out of what He said / didnt. Not sure whether this is needed for our growth ..but it does affect my openess towards Osho at this moment..I am trying to be honest to my feelings here.

    if someone can share on this further from a different perspective…. it will be good.

  25. Kranti says:

    May be the answer is somewhere in His words.. may be it is here..

    ” Sheela created this ugly situation because her life has been misery, anger, hatred. She created an unnecessary hostility. But now I am speaking again. That hostility will disappear just like a dewdrop on a lotus leaf disappears in the early morning sun. “

  26. Kranti says:

    “My answers were not reaching to you exactly as I had dictated them. They were edited ”

    Haha! Editing started then.. Not now..

  27. Kranti says:

    This is beautiful ofcourse..

    ” But I am not going into silence. I have to keep completely acquainted with what is happening, so never again such a fascist thing happens to my people.I love you so much. I could not conceive that anybody would do such criminal acts against you. And you have shown a great quality of trust, “

  28. shantam Prem says:

    “I am trying to make you absolutely apolitical, with no desire for power; and these people were using you and your strength for their own ambitions.”-Osho

    “One thing has to be remembered, that such a thing should never happen again in this commune. For that reason, I am not going to be in silence again.”-Osho

  29. shantam Prem says:

    If you look from the eyes of disciples, OSho is one of the most beautiful and intelligent master, just amazing.
    If you look from the eyes of a spectator, the world has never taken him seriously.
    Self appointed Bhagwan, sex guru; during these timings of 1984-85, one of the most circulated Hindi daily started publishing every week in series the book, ” God that failed”. and in many other languages too, this book had taken prominent space.

    I can imagine every sannyasin must have gone through the series of sarcastic questions in their surroundings. It was a time to stand for one’s convictions.

    These very people became the salt of 17, Koregaon Park, once Osho started His second innings there.

    Most of the videos we see in the Pyramid are of this time, sermons given in an ILLEAGL Tent.

    From an illgeal city to an illegal tent…..Others have only laughed at His sincerety, His very own have shown Him the earthly realites of intrigue, greed and lust for control, during and after the life time .

  30. shantam Prem says:

    In India and i am sure in many cultures, it is a common saying, ” Never marry a woman richer and powerful than you. As a man your pride will be always in soup.”
    May be one can say also, Never have the disciples, with more money and power than you.

    You will look like a master, they will be the master.

    In Mythology too, Laxmi is the boss of her scholarly husband Vishnu.
    The story says once they started discussing, who is more powerful. Husband’s wisdom or the wife’s money.
    Vishnu said to Laxmi, “Wisdom is so powerful and profound that people simply bow down before you.
    I can create an example. I go in the city like a wise teacher and you see what happens.”
    After few minutes of introduction, the owner of the best inn in the town, felt so humbled to have this wise man as a guest, he offered him the room free of cost.
    Few hours later, comes Laxmi with her pump and prestige. Inn owner was quite happy to show her the best room. Laxmi declined the room. Like Madonna, the girl Friend of tom boy “Jesus”, she said, when she rents she rents the whole hotel for her and her staff.
    No need to say, Vishnu has to spend the remaining night on the foot path.

  31. Kartar says:

    This is a story (about the Ranch) about four people named Everbody, Somebody, Anybody and Nobody. There was an important job to be done and Everybody was sure that Somebody would do it. Anybody could have done it, but Nobody did it. Somebody got angry about that, because it was Everybody’s job. Everybody thought Anybody could do it, but Nobody realized that Everybody wouldn’t do it. It ended up that Everbody blamed Somebody when Nobody did what Anybody could have done.

  32. Dilruba says:

    Shantam …. in Osho’s case … it was just the opposite … the rich disciples were working and in that sense no master has ever lived so luxuriously … in fact he opened the gates for all

  33. Dilruba says:

    Kartar well said Dear !

  34. Dhanyam says:

    Living at the Ranch to the end and seeing what was happening was an incredible experience. The mind can judge and the mind-fuck till the end of time. For me, my love and trust in Osho is absolute and I am with him forever, like so many others at that time who also ended up being banned by someone in the Resort.

  35. prem bubbie says:

    My take on the Ranch and Sheela is this: She was appointed to the top deliberately by Osho. The Ranch was a great experiment as Osho even states. Sheela and life on the Ranch was a lesson created by Osho to see how far we would tolerate stupidity, negativity, narcissism,condescension, arrogance and just plain selfishness. The Ranch was NOT a commune!!! At least by definition. A commune is just that, work, live, play and make DECISIONS TOGETHER!!! Osho even stated he didn’t know why we put up with Sheela. I pretty sure he knew. I think it was because we were selfish. For those of you who lived on the Ranch like myself, the most important thing was: To stay on the Ranch-permanently if possible. To be around Osho and in the Buddhafield. At almost any cost!! Beg, borrow, marry , kissing ass, and not making waves. If you questioned or challenged Sheela or her cronies- by-by, out you went. If you were fortunate enough to become lovers of a top or middle tier Ma or Swami or had money, or good connections, you had an excellent chance of staying and getting a brass bead. Let’s face it, the truth hurts, WE fucked it all up. All in our hands and we dropped it. It still amazes me, so many are still in denial. I recently read some of Sheela’s comments. Sheela, being a person of the upper caste from India, her comments did not surprise me. A Master works in many ways, including using life as a lesson. We’ve been shown by Osho that we have wings to fly, yet we continue to chase our tail.

  36. Neo Vivek says:

    Kranti,
    While reading the original article .. and Osho’s quote on facing your fear…. and than what you feel about Osho exposing Sheela’s deepest personal wounds in public…. i had a look at it from another angle.

    Osho must have thought, since every other thing failed in helping Sheela get over her deep personal wounds … the only way to make her accept it.. so that she stops being destructive is to make it so public that she is forced to face it, think about it. Since she entrusted Osho to help her get over the childhood wounds, Osho must have done this to her as a last resort.. the final attempt to help her move on from past.
    Acceptance is the first step to recovery.

    What do you think? is it reasonable to see it from this perspective.

  37. garimo says:

    …the more current story of another group of people; Woulda, Coulda, and Shoulda. They didn’t experience Ranch life and can only speculate how it would’a been, could’a been or should’a been.

    As for me… Nothing like it before and nothing like it since. No where else I have felt like my work is endlessly being interrupted by the dancing and hugging and snack times and the celebration… Such a fascist regime.

  38. shantam Prem says:

    As for me… Nothing like it before and nothing like it since. No where else I have felt like my work is endlessly being interrupted by the dancing and hugging and snack times and the celebration…

    The mistakes of ranch were not supposed to be made at Poona 2. The work experience was the same as Garimo has mentioned in the above paragraph. For sure the “system” was so new, one of its kind, that it was in the need of refinement, some leakages were supposed to be fixed, like the patches in the soft ware.

    Here and there, My ears are still listening Him saying something like, ” Power corrupts and absolute power corrupts absolutely, and He will take care that nobody stays for a longer time in the powerful position in His commune.

    Is 17, koregaon Park an address in Colonel Gaddafi’s Libya?

  39. groucho marx says:

    Dhyanam,
    God is a dictatorial idea
    Master is a dictatorial idea
    Banning people is a dictatorial Idea
    Perfect lineage.
    I dont see any confusion at all.

  40. Kranti says:

    ” What do you think? is it reasonable to see it from this perspective ”

    Yes … Neo Vivek.. Very much possible..thank you for giving me this perspective.. Let me abosrb this..

  41. Kranti says:

    groucho marx ..

    You are the perfect Neti Neti guy.. you reject everything..Sometimes i wonder what you are up to in sannyasnews..

  42. swami says:

    Loving Osho I came to love Sheela too.

  43. Dilruba says:

    l was not present then {ranch time} …. but even though … l have had a great time working in the Poona [ 2 ] Commune too … and for that matter all sanyassins / fellow travellers do get a taste of Zorba the Buddha in the commune … and l feel who ever explores this {commune life} …even today .. will always get this taste .. at least once in their lifetime … l guess in that sense all sannyassins / fellow travellers who enters this Gateless Gate to be available to this energy … will always get this taste of timelessness …

  44. shantam Prem says:

    Just yesterday i have met a German seeker,who has spend around three years in India and most of the time around Osho’s people from Goa till Dharamshala.
    When he came to Pune three years ago after many years, as he was living in a community of seekers around the south Indian guy, FIL( Friend in light), he rented the room in my flat, so the connection developed.

    In his opinion, Neelam’s place in Dharamshala and Oshodham in Delhi has a higher rating than Pune.
    Pricewise, service wise and the overall milieu of surroundins,groups and meditations.
    When i asked why?
    because Indians do this with more heart than that British doctor, what is his name?

    PS-Take the Osho’s radiation factor away from Pune, which for highly intellectual people is just a mind concept as there is no hard scientific proof about such bloody phenomenon. I can agree with this man.

  45. Chetna says:

    “Loving Osho I came to love Sheela too.”

    When Arun swami saw Sheela last year (she came to see him) his feeling was she still loves Osho….and I am sure Osho loves her.

    What to do! Shit happens ….But she has zero regrets

  46. Kranti says:

    What is the intention behind this thread as Dilruba asked?

  47. Kranti says:

    I am sorry . But i get a feeling we are moving to past and beating dead info rather than the present crisis at hand..although any discussion will help us to grow..

  48. Dilruba says:

    lam wondering why Anand Parmartha … is not replying … ? Kranti

  49. shantam Prem says:

    ….But she has zero regrets…
    All the great mother fuckers of history have zero regret, may be that is why they are historical figures.

    Why to look in the history, Bush or Osama, Blair, sheela or many other names; they all live in the zero regret zone.

  50. shantam Prem says:

    I am sorry . But i get a feeling we are moving to past and beating dead info rather than the present crisis at hand..although any discussion will help us to grow..

    Here, Parmartha must tell his psychological prospective of bringing the Sheela topic on the floor.
    To hide behind, Osho’s discourse is no good way.

  51. swami says:

    It is a little randon to say Sheela has no regrets, and I see no present crisis at hand? what about your regrets? what about your mother fucking?

  52. Kranti says:

    “what about your regrets? what about your mother fucking? ”

    Swami and his bad old posts are creeping in again here at sannyasnews forum..assuming it is the same swami..

    If you feel Sheela is alright and there is no present crisis then leave sannyasnews alone..why are you hanging around here and try to enlighten all the people who are sharing something out of their interest.. No one dragged you here and asked your opinion..

  53. Dilruba says:

    lam wondering if we can another thread / maybe Parmartha can jus show some courage ?

  54. Neo Vivek says:

    Though we are not discussing it, i think this explains
    ” In particular it explains how Indian sannyasins were treated. However it also begs wider questions on which comment is welcome.”

  55. shantam Prem says:

    Those who are interested to know more about Ms. Sheela, can visit the website of her old people’s home.

    Matrusaden & Bapusaden | Wohngmeinschaft fuer jung + alt – Home„Ich habe in meinem Leben durch meine Eltern soviel Liebe erfahren. Meine Arbeit ist mein Weg, um mich bei ihnen zu bedanken.” Sheela Birnstiel …
    http://www.matrusaden.ch/

    Sheela Birnstiel is her name after marriage.

  56. shantam Prem says:

    Chetna-
    …and I am sure Osho loves her…

    It was during few days before Osho left his body.
    Amrito has read His statement where Osho mentions his wish not to come to Buddha hall but meditate with us from His room and He feels immensely happy to feel the silence in our gathering which is so crystal clear that it can be touched. For this He was working His whole life.

    The reason not to come in the open gathering was that few people were using the black magic techniques to hurt Him immensely.This i have heard Rajneesh has also mentioned in his book as he was one of those who were taken away from the gathering, when the process was going on to find out the suspicious person/s.

    And the underline is, what Amrito read on His behalf, ” I can hurt them back but i won’t do. My trust in existence and reverence for life is absolute.”

    PS- The words in comas may not be the exact words. though i have listened Him saying so often in my brain during the last 19 years 6 months and 26 days.

  57. Anthony Thompson says:

    I would like to share some information I have got from interviewing people who were directly related to what happened at the ranch, and what i think about the whole story.
    Osho allowed sheela to take the position that she took at the end of pune 1. he did not choose her, he allowed her to take the position. She was way more efficient and effective than laxmi.
    Osho asked sheela to be obnoxious towards the press and Oregonians. “bad publicity is better than no publicity”.
    Sheela took the space that osho trusted her to get rid of people she did not like and to force people to do things she considered necessary for the survival of the commune.

    Osho was not informed about the details of the practical operations he just told her what to do… in many cases he did not know how and probably he did not care.

    She did whatever was necessary, weather it was legal or not to insure the survival of the ranch. After all, it was her fault to have bought a huge piece of land that had a zoning, a restricted use of land. which forced her to take over Antilope because they had no building permits for the ranch.

    what osho knew and did not know?, according to my research, he knew about the share a home program as a desperate measure to vote a sannyasin into the county. he did not know about the bugging of the ranch and his room. he did not know about the plot to kill the people in lao tzu house and the attorney general, he knew about the book of rajneeshism. he did not know about small center being closed and the details of who was banned from the ranch. he knew about her being antagonistic towards the neighbors. He supported the weapons at the ranch. he did not know about the dalles poisoning.
    this is the information that I have.
    anthony

  58. Anthony Thompson says:

    by the way. if anyone has a specific information or question to ask about that time… I can answer with pleasure. It is 23 years of research.

  59. shantam Prem says:

    The quotation below is from Sheela’s website-

    Commune-
    Commune life style is the best way to live – this is my experience. It allows one to fill each other’s deficit. It is a give and take. It avoids life of loneliness and depression. One does not feel isolated. Everyone feels needed and useful. This feeling brings stability and joy.

  60. Neo Vivek says:

    Shantam
    Thanks for the link to Sheela’s site:
    “”Love inspires. Inspiration motivates. Motivation creates.
    Creativity offers joy.
    Joy brings laughter. Laughter brings lightness.
    A light heart is healthy.”

  61. shantam Prem says:

    Even the words written in the above post are from a villain of Osho’s world, there is a taste and style of Him, even though Osho(Bhagwan) is not mentioned at all.

  62. johnny McDootz says:

    anthony thompson
    thank you for sharing the information that you have .
    while at the ranch I was involved in a project in the then city of rajneesh as Antelope was then called ; the project was to build houses and then invite people with Aids to come and live in them . I don’t remember exactly to what purpose .
    the project was stopped after sheela left .
    do you know if he knew about it ?
    was that his idea or hers ?

  63. Alok john says:

    Maneesha, Juliet Forman, wrote three large books on the history of the movement :

    Bhagwan: The Buddha for the Future
    Bhagwan: Twelve Days That Shook the World
    Bhagwan: One Man Against the Whole Ugly Past of Humanity

    Worth reading if you want to know.

    try bookfinder.com to find them

  64. Alok john says:

    Maneesha’s site here with discussion of the books
    http://www.maneeshajames.com/go/english/products.html

  65. Anand says:

    Sheela, Sheela, Sheela….when are you guys arriving in the ‘Now’ and stay here?
    All this dwelling in the past, just stops everyone from being in the present.

  66. Anand says:

    There are so many beautiful sannyas activities around the world happening every moment, everywhere. Why not bring out some positive news about these?
    That would be sannyas news. These discourses here at sannyas news go on since months about what should, what could…change the Inner Circle etc.
    Meanwhile the real sannyas news are being exchanged on facebook.
    This forum smells of rotten, old minds…sorry about my clear language, but that is how I feel. Love.

  67. shantam Prem says:

    Anand,
    About Sheela news please ask the editor. Many have already aske for this old mouse to be digged out.

    about Other garbage discussion, i take the equal responsibilty.
    And about facebook..is there not a single person on the earth who does not know about that.

    Meanwhile the real sannyas news are being exchanged on facebook.
    This forum smells of rotten, old minds…sorry about my clear language, but that is how I feel. Love

    Drink that what suits you, eat that what fits you, read what your sensibilites can digest.
    If in your tetra pack is not the apple juice but the cow urine with caradom taste, you can immediately discard that pack. So simple is this.

    This forum smells of rotten, old minds…
    it means you have a sweet young mind in your cabage. Make world rich with that before it spoils. Good bye and have a nice journey.

  68. garimo says:

    >>This forum smells of rotten, old minds…

    Anand,
    It’s not just this fourm where old news is being kicked around. Did you see the cover of this months Osho World magazine?

    http://oshoworld.com/newsletter/august09/index.asp

    From the cover one would think the queers is the only thing Osho has to talk about. Are the publishers perverted or just perverting Oshos message?

    -g

  69. Dilruba says:

    Truth is one … but it has many dimensions … and condemnation wont take us to the Truth anyway …. so lets … go ahead …

    For that matter condemning Sheela / anybody is not going to take us anywhere close to the Truth … nor is praising her going to {& this applies to all of us l guess} .. there is a thin line between criticism & condemnation … and sometimes we do tend to go overboard … but as long there is a forward movement one doesnt mind it … if one sees it is not taking us further … it means there is need for a change … somehow .. l feel this applies to all situations we face … l would like to withdraw from this thread

  70. garjuna says:

    “…rotten old minds…. so many beautiful sannyas activities the world… ” Well the world is both positive and negative. It’s fine by me to talk about the past and mistakes made, but many here want to bury their heads in the sand and only see “positive” things. That’s being foolish and being in denial. One can wonder if this is the biggest reason the ranch failed and all the bullshit that went on in pune and 2. How many here actually lived in pune 1 or the ranch? Not many I feel, I did at both places. How many actually dealt with Sheela and felt her wrath? I did, I think she was a complete bitch to say it gently, I really want to use a stronger word but there seems to be many overly sensitive people here. As far as Osho allowing her to be top banana and this and that, unless you actually heard it or saw it happening, maybe even saw a video of an occurrence , IT’S ALL SECOND OR THIRD HAND INFORMATION or gossip. As for sannyasins rejecting any negative stuff that occurred and only thinking that all was bliss at the ranch, please take your head out of your ass!!! I had a blissful time, mostly at both pune 1 and the ranch, but I also witnessed first hand some mean and nasty interpersonal exchanges. I was even told by a dept head when I was at the disco in the ranch not to talk about the negative things that went on. There were outside contractors there at the time. As for Sheela being “efficient”, that’s a laugh, most of the sannyasins living at the ranch had no professional skills at all, especially on the construction crews. I heard(directly) many complaints by the few professional sannysins(carpenters, architects,etc.) at the ranch about the poor quality and hap hazard work being done. The ranch didn’t fail because of the abundance of positive energy, it was because we were selfish, and looked away out of fear, fear of being asked to leave the ranch. Pune 2, I didn’t bother. I had enough, Osho’s my master but I’m not a sannyasin for other people’s sake. History repeats itself, mistakes and all and if you people had your eyes open you’d see why the mistakes continue.

  71. garjuna says:

    anthony thompson: your 23 years of research was done in a closet. As with Sheela, she flipped out back in pune 1 after her first lover died. After that she slowly descended into madness, this what I observed. Anthony, do better interviews and with people who matter. The truth hurts, time to face it.

  72. shantam Prem says:

    Me Too Dilruba, this is the last post for this thread.
    This thread was not needed and the person who started this thread is not coming out to explain the psychology behind.

    Healthy criticism for a country or organisataion or race, even persons is as important as the thunders and lightening for the fir trees, Devadar trees(English world i don’t know) in Kashmir.

    As one can see in all the Osho Times, there is always a sense of superiority complex because osho said so, Osho said so, and therefore we also say so.
    Small mouths are throwing the big sentences out, for sure few people have to take the broom to clean one’s own court yard too.

    May be this is their calling.

    Without this inner cleaning as individual sannyasin or group of people we will end up just any religion or the cult.

  73. Dhanyam says:

    Alok Johm,

    If people want Bhagwah: The Buddha for the Future and Bhagwan: One Man Against the Whole Ugly Past of Humanity, check out http://www.oshoviha.org.

    Anand,

    If people want the latest positive sannyas news, check out the Viha Connection magazine. I don’t see much interest from the Forum writers.

  74. garimo says:

    Dhanyam,
    Will bits of Viha Connection be online again oneday?
    I always liked and read when it was…

    -gairmo

  75. Neo Vivek says:

    “This forum smells of rotten, old minds…sorry about my clear language, but that is how I feel. Love.”

    This forum has the very quality of Osho in it. Posting and reading posts here has made me aware of so many deep rooted conditioning in me.

    So, here is a direct answer: Never judge a book by its cover and a forum by a single thread.

  76. Harri Om says:

    Dhanyam I can appreciate that the purity of your love and trust has allowed you to weather the storm of the ranch. Osho gave you a fire test and through it you have developed the eyes to see and the courage to stand by your own convictions. Indeed you are missing the harmful effects of participating in the implosion of Pune II. However the destructive pattern of The Ranch has repeated itself in Pune, and it stands to get worse. On the positive side this means that some of the trusting souls that are weathering the failing experiment in Pune will next time round be much wiser. However what it also means is that so many more people have had their lives deeply uprooted by the repeated pattern of the inability to understand Osho’s message. It also means that those who have darkness in their soul have had regular opportunity to indulge that darkness. Pune 1 was also not immune from this pattern. What if the whole world had decided to copy The Ranch experiment, not realizing what was really happening there?

    So what does the future hold? Will there by another botched Ranch or perhaps another urban tragedy? You profess to be faithful till the end of time. How far along will it be that a group of people of any significant size will have the capacity to understand Osho? What they are actually doing is making a mockery of him. It is not dissimilar to the conversations on these comments page. They write not from their own understanding nor from Osho’s. So who is it that they write for?

    Granted no-one can possibly bring it upon themselves to give a bit of a polish to Osho’s perfect diamond. However is there not a problem here? Osho’s words are not to authenticate any outward action. They are used to break down the blockages that stop us going in. It is this misunderstanding that creates the repeated cycle of destructive and dysfunctional social patterns. People listen to an Osho discourse or read an Osho book, and then go out and make a mockery of his teachings. What they also do is act in ways that are destructive and hurtful to other people. What this does is creates wounds in these people, and they are unable to pierce this darkness to understand their deeper roots. They then of course need Osho therapists to heal the wounds that errant Zorbas create.

    If there is any chance of applying Osho’s model to anything larger than a small family unit, then there needs to be an understanding that the social framework that the current ‘civilised’ world lives in also includes Osho sannyasins. It is fine to repeat a great Osho quote that defies the established order. (Of course it may well be fine to defy the established order, but the blind following of a quote is not sufficient reason for that). What is not fine however is to based on this delusion go out and reek havoc on fellow sannyasins and other fellow travellers. In this way any honest attempt to look at how Osho’s model of the universe can harmonious blend into a world that also contains laws and The Ten Commandments should not be condemned has heresy.

    I would also argue that Osho lacked the foresight to understand this. You might not like me to say this and no doubt will consider it an arrogant lie. However it is also the case that while Osho be a great master, there are other buddhas that know the same truth, yet not possess the intellectual genius to expound it. These buddhas are the ones sitting quietly by the corner, not being noticed, and being frowned upon by the ‘wise’ seekers eagerly listening to the masters great oratory. They may not give great speeches but their understanding of the truth is at one with a great master like Osho. They may just make a passing comment or offer a simple act of kindness, yet its reward to your soul shall be great – though it will probably go unnoticed.

    As it is that some people see not as far as Osho, is it possible that there are others that see further (if perhaps only by standing upon his shoulders). Osho has left the body and despite what he said, he is not literally coming back to ensure that The Ranch does not repeat itself. What he meant was that he had grown many of his beloved disciples into buddhas. They may not have been the giant of a being he was, and hence could not take his place as a successor, however they are many and varied and profound. These people are the ones whispering in your ear. They may be in the resort, around Koregaon Park, or in far flung places through the world. However they are why Osho says that he will not let it happen again – at least not without a good fight. Do you not see all the Osho disciples that have immeasurably qualities of beauty, yet they are banned. Sure who is to say who is a buddha and who is not. As you so beautifully expressed, finding and growing with your beloved master is not a trivial affair.

    You may ask (perhaps with sarcasm in tone) whether I consider myself to be in a category similar to Osho. The answer is no.

    You may ask (perhaps with sarcasm in tone) whether I am enlightened. The answer is no.

    And Mr Anthony Thompson, that is so nice that it would be your pleasure to share your wisdom. After 23 years of learning nothing about Osho perhaps you could spend a little of the next 23 years learning a little bit about how your own mind works. In this way you may have just a little bit of a clue about what Osho did and did not know, as at the moment you don’t. That is of course by the way.

  77. shantam Prem says:

    Cannot resist, this very positive energy!!!

    jut got this post from Ma Prem Jeevan.
    This senior sannyasin in mid 80′s send the best jokes, quotaions and humour. I have told her so many times,” Your mails have more Osho flavour and innocence, than all the combined Osho media.”
    Her mailing address is- jeevanosho@gmail.com

    A MASTER’S LAST WORDS

    -Beloved Osho

    What are going to be your last words to the world?

    It reminds me of a story George Gurdjieff used to tell to his closest disciples. The story is about a great past master, a buddha, who had a self-appointed right-hand man who was a faithful follower for year after year. And when the master was in his room on his deathbed, all of the followers silently waited by the door not knowing what to do and incapable of believing that their mystical master was really dying.

    Finally, through the sorrowful stillness, the master’s voice was faintly heard to call the name of the right-hand man, and all of the followers looked at him intently as he made his way to the master’s door. As he reached for the knob he glanced at the peering faces around him and imagined their envy and respect for him at being the only one to be called to the master’s side during his final moments. He already imagined how after the master’s death he would slowly emerge from the room as the new head of the system, a veritable Peter-of-the-Rock.

    Quietly he entered the darkened room and slowly he made his way and knelt by the bed. The old master nodded for him to come nearer, and he leaned over with his awaiting ear by the old man’s mouth, and the master whispered, “Fuck you.”

    The Dhammapada: The Way of the Buddha Vol. 2 [Which I am now audio checking!]

  78. Shahriar says:

    Harri Om, I do not think that Osho was against being civil in society. I understand that he said life is more than civility and society, but I do not think that he said that we should simply allow people to be violent or to rape or any such thing. Osho himself said that freedom comes with responsibility. As far as the ten commandments are concerned, not all of them are right. For instance, adultery is not something bad. If you want to love someone outside of marriage that is perfectly ok. Osho himself said that in a commune, there needs to be responsibility, cooperation and understanding, otherwise there would be no way for a commune to exist. In the outside society there is no responsibility, no cooperation or understanding. But in a commune there has to be these things, and if someone wants to abuse their position they should be thrown out, and no one is to be allowed to interfere in anyone elses freedom or way of life. So I think that when Osho was talking about a commune, he was also talking about these things too. Perhaps certain irresponsible individuals misuse his words but this does not mean that he was condoning their actions.

  79. Shahriar says:

    By the way, people who preach celibacy need to be jailed and sexual suppresion and anti-life teachings need to be destroyed.

  80. Shahriar says:

    Great joke shantam

    Lots of love,

    Shahriar

  81. Shahriar says:

    Read as “lots of love to you all”

  82. shantam prem says:

    Shahriar,
    It was not a joke but excerpts from His discourse.
    and yes, i wanted to know from you, if you are not vegetarian, is it Ok for you to eat Non Muslim meat style and the animals. The meat sold all over the super markets.
    love

  83. Shahriar says:

    I look like a muslim but appearances can be deceiving. I am neither muslim, christian, hindu, buddhist etc. etc. etc. No labels attached. Just a human being. As far meat is concerned, I do not eat pork because it disgusts me, and not because of any religious idea, and I am not vegetarian, mainly because it requires too much effort. I am only 18 and my mother still cooks for me, so I do not want to be too fussy.

    And I do not want to unnecessarily pretend that yes sensitivity is good and I should be a vegetarian, etc. As far as I remember adolf hitler was a vegetarian. So I think that sensitivity should come first, then vegetarianism, not visa versa. I know that this paragraph has nothing to do with your post but I wanted to put it in there.

  84. Kartar says:

    Life is not all dewdrops and lollipops. You take the good with the bad. (Kartar.)

  85. shantam prem says:

    Shahriar, the question for you, was a universal question connected with our religious or social conditioning. There role playing is quite dominant.

    Coimng from a Sikh family, i was supposed not to cut the hair or smoke. When my friends in Pune challanged me in the game of droping the conditioning, my blood pressure went low with the first cut.

    On the other side, there was a senior sannyasin from a muslim background, very sharp and intelligent. It was not about pork, i just mentioned him to have a chicken in a restaurant where meat is not Halal, he could not do it.

    There are many vegetarians, i know personally, who suck the human blood in their business of money lending. Who are so non violent that they will hire police to beat their opponents.

    on the other side there is a story of Jaina Sannyasin, who left his high profile judiciary job to be at ranch and he was given work in the Poultary firm. Naturally, he was eating eggs too, first one in their family history.

    Last time, when i met this sannyasin in Pune, he mentioned buildings have become beautiful, laughter and music wise, these people have created the energy of Autumn.

  86. deva Ashik says:

    This is a road we are on….. but we seem to be travelling not straight but meandering and circling around.
    how far do we need to go to learn the lessons of the past?
    Is it good to divert to dissemble about criminals and morality?
    Where does this get us?
    Beloved friends
    three people i know became ill( er) this week
    one with endomitrial cancer ( well she found out about it)
    Aneurysm
    and and a twisted gut bowel, involving two major ops in three days.
    These will persist or die but their conduct and care fir others including me makes me think there is more teaching in this than acres of angst on Sheela now.
    I want to jump into new- ness …..

  87. Dhanyam says:

    Garimo,

    I will take that up with the editor in charge, but we need to find the right person to arrange the Viha Connection as an online publication. We are not tech-savvy people here.

  88. Dhanyam says:

    Hari Om,

    I am not sure of the message of your posting.

    I have no connection with the Resort. I am banned. My connection is with Osho, and I do all my work at the Osho Viha Center. I guess you have never seen our Viha Connection magazine?

    You keep linking me to the Resort, but there is no link between us.

  89. shantam prem says:

    Deva Ashik,

    Thanks a lot for your comment and it is so truthfully touching that i am tempted to tell my friend in Poona to deposit 40 Rupees at German Bakery for two cups of chai, when some named Deva Ashik comes!

  90. sannyasnews says:

    There have been some posts in this string which imply that as one of the Editors of Sannyasnews I (Parmartha) am Indian. This is not true. I am English, and come from a similar English educational background to Amrito who partly runs OFI and therefore could be said to have a good insight into his psychology of assumed leadership.
    There are other posts which seem to indicate that they think that I have no experience of the history of sannyas or of commune life. Actually I have been a sannyasin since 1975 and was a commune member in Medina, Hamburg and the Ranch.
    The intention of the Editors in posting this material was a result of requests that this period be rediscussed, and in a sense rediscovered.
    It is actually a wonderful zen story, and whether intended or not meant that almost all sannyasins at that time (1985) were given a sound thrashing of the ego in keeping with a good zen tradition, and those who continued to be disiciples after that date were much the better for it!

  91. prem bubbie says:

    Hey Johnny McDootz- I was at City of Rajneesh too! From September 1984 until February 1985. I was there from the beginning, there were only 8 of us there, then it slowly got bigger and bigger. Do you recall Swami Satbuddha(S.B.)? and Ma Deva Doris? They were the coordinators there. I remember a few others. Were you there when we had the unpleasant encounter with the Guardian Angels? I had a blast!!! So much fun even in the mud and rain and snowy conditions. When were you there? Believe it or not, I’m in Oregon again!! Got some stories to tell. Caio

  92. Harri Om says:

    Shahriar understanding is immeasurably important. Communication can help clear up any misunderstanding. Responsibility arises out of this.

  93. Shahriar says:

    “Shahriar understanding is immeasurably important. Communication can help clear up any misunderstanding. Responsibility arises out of this.”

    Harri Om,

    I see what you are saying but I am unsure about whether you are responding to a particular post or whether you are trying to start a new conversation.

    Communication can certainly help clear up any misunderstanding. It seems to me that there are people in this world who do not know how to communicate. The muslims and the jews are one such group. I do not think that people anywhere in this world have a particular desire to die or to lose their families but because of a lack of understanding people can do so many wrong things to each other, so it certainly is imporant to be able to communicate and understand the other. (as opposed to communicating and misunderstanding the other.) The problem as far as I see arises because people do not know how to communicate and understand because communication is not just being able to talk and ask someone the time. It is also about putting aside prejudice and establishing empathy with the other person. And we are currently lacking in the ability to put aside our prejudices and establish empathy and understanding. Because communication which does not lead to understanding cannot be called communication. I am not sure about whether responsibility arises out of this or not. Responsibility will certainly arise when people understand that they need to cooperate and work together, so if you are saying that coomunication will lead to understanding and when people understand that they need to cooperate, then they will take responsibility for themselves, then certainly.

    Human beings as far as I can see need to be able to feel each others suffering and joy, so that they will be sensitive to one another and not indifferent. When we are indifferent to one another, suddenly we are cut off, and one of the consequences of this is that any dictator can kill and be violent and no one will care as long as it is not happening to them, when people become indifferent to each other, insensetive, they lose that feeling of common humanity and suddenly the world is not based on love anymore but on ambition and competion, cruelty and ruthlessness.

    What is love? Love is, but what is it? It is so tangible for me, and yet for those poor, unfortunate persons who have never known love, and who all their life wander without feeling, without sensing, without being aware of…the immaterial, which is so present to those who are aware, to those who can feel, to those who can sense, perhaps some way could be found to help them come to the experience of love, perhaps someway could be found to help them feel and awaken their heart, so that they can also partake of this joy, this treasure.

  94. I feel that arguing about what is right and what is wrong and discussing about the being of Osho is waste of time…..

    Clock is ticking…. what are we going to do….. just forget about the people who commercialize spirituality which is the essence of humane being….

    I know there were 5000 people who lived with Osho in Oregon, USA…. My question is why even 1 of them were not able to continue the work of Osho which is nothing but pouring ice cold water on a person who is deep asleep…. He obviously didn’t do it to change the entire world. But it is useful for the 1% of the human race who are awakened and are tortured by the majority and the other 1% who were in the middle of the 98% asleep and 1% awake…. The 1%, we could say that they are half asleep and any moment they will be absolutely awake if we join together and do something sensible… I am ready to take on this endeavor and I don’t care about the consequences….. I have found out that this is my life’s purpose….

    Check out my channel on YouTube and contact me and lets get into action my fellow humane beings….

    Thanks for your time….

    Love Happiness Peace is always with U….

    Cheers ~arun

  95. shantam prem says:

    “Human beings as far as I can see need to be able to feel each others suffering and joy, so that they will be sensitive to one another and not indifferent. When we are indifferent to one another, suddenly we are cut off, and one of the consequences of this is that any dictator can kill and be violent and no one will care as long as it is not happening to them, when people become indifferent to each other, insensetive, they lose that feeling of common humanity and suddenly the world is not based on love anymore but on ambition and competion, cruelty and ruthlessness.”

    Shahriar, The idea of commune was born out of feelings expressed above.
    If not the whole world atleast as a pilot project, commune was suppose to create this enviorment.
    Commune was a living extension of Osho vision. Our work was suppose to go on making it more refined more in terms with the changing flowing times.
    Alas… Lest we forget….

  96. garimo says:

    Harri Om wrote:
    >“Shahriar understanding is immeasurably important. Communication can help clear up any misunderstanding. Responsibility arises out of this.”

    And as Shahriar & Harri Om, are discussing communication and understandings in another thread, I’d just like to add my take on what is possibly being called a “misunderstanding”.

    Seems to me, misunderstandings are just two or more understandings that are not shared. You may have your observations of what the universe has presented to you, and I may have my observations of what the universe has presented to me and with our minds we create our understandings.

    It’s the finding a way with communication to see when understandings can merge into one, and it’s the sharing and willingly allowing unshared understandings and ideas that can bring about minds opening and being receptive to each other, and it’s perhaps with the opening that then silence can …be remembered.

    I’m thinking the intention of connecting through communication could be the mutually respectful and responsible act that comes before… not after.

    and there I go again with the thinkin’…
    -g

  97. garimo says:

    >>> in another thread,
    Oops… It was I who was going to post this in another thread, but didn’t.

  98. johnny McDootz says:

    prem bubbie
    my job on that project was to supply the plumbing crew with whatever they needed , so I did most of it from the plumbing shop in sariputa ; I only occasionly went to the site so I wasn’t there for the Hell’s angels .
    I do remember the mud though .
    sounds like you had a great time there .
    I had my ups and down but overall I had a good time as well .
    I was working with Shunyo the head of the plumbing crew , and I don’t remember many other names from that time , certainly not the ones you have mentionned , sorry …….
    I lived in Eugene Or .for a while back in the late seventies , I still have friends there .
    Anyway , thanx for sharing .
    love

  99. prem bubbie says:

    Hi Johnny, I knew a plumber by the name of Deva Michael who worked as a plumber at the ranch, he was living in Seattle, WA about 10 years ago, now who knows? Did you know him? Talking about Eugene Oregon, I’ve been living there and in the area for about 16 years now. I met 2 sannyasins in all that time and am aware or many dozens who are “underground”. The locals are still sore about the ranch, even up in Portland, after all this time these yocals can’t move on!! If you have any contacts around here please let me know.. the moderators have my email address. Are you still in the states? Hope your life’s trip has been a balanced one.

  100. I do not think that we should blame Ma Sheela for what ever happened in the ranch.

    Even if she had done some thing wrong then she is already been hit much by the negative vibes and curses of the sannyasins. Let her live now and allow her to grow in meditation.

    I feel, if she was such a bad person as portrayed in the articles about her, then Bhagwan could have easily seen that in her eyes.

    Ma Sheela could have hided the facts but she can not hide her eyes, her vibes and her mind from Bhagwan.

    She was meeting Bhagwan continuously and I have no doubt that Bhagwan can not know whats going on in her mind.

    I would like to request all of you to see ma Sheela videos again. If she is as bad as been portrayed by the Sannyasins then her eyes and action will show it.

    I do not know the inside detail of what happened and why Bhagwan allowed all this. But I feel its WRONG to hit Ma Sheela for everything. She is not the only culprit.

    Every sannyasin who was part of that time and era is responsible and biggest responsibility goes to Bhagwan himself. Bhagwan was the only conscious person present there. Or Swami Anand maitreya had a samadhi experience. I do know whether he was present in the ranch or not. I think he was there.

    We have accused Ma Sheela enough and now its time to look at oneself. Are we been sincere in our search till now Or we have wasted time in just quoting bhagwan and dancing once in a month.

    We have already hit Ma Sheela for what ever little wrong she must have done. May be much much more than what she actually deserve.

    My personal understanding on this matter is that she should be thanked by every sannyasin for saving the name of movement. she is the one who has taken maximum burnt of negativity.

    I think its futile to write more because Osho sannyasins have stopped thinking. By Quoting Osho, one does not become intelligent but one has to develop his discrimnation by doubting and meditating.

    My personal experience is that meditation is not part of most of Osho sannyasins any more. Its another matter that they know every thing about meditation except practicing it in daily living.

    Some one who is really interested to know what has happened, please start contemplating on the issue once again with out bringing what others or Osho has to say on this thing.

    Best Regards
    Swami Amitabh

  101. johnny McDootz says:

    prem bubbie
    yes I used to know deva michael and I last saw him in seattle after he’d left the ranch .
    after the ranch i lived on maui (hawai )until osho settled back in poona and went to stay there for a while ,on and off ,until he left his body .; then I settled in europe .
    yes life is good for me these days ;hope it’s as good or even better for you .
    I can’t believe those guys are still hung up about the ranch ………..my god ……..!
    Take care.
    bye

  102. Kranti says:

    Nostalgia for Prem Bubbie and johnny McDootz ..

    Sorry guys for intefering.. I get a high when i see some old timers taking about old Osho days.. I really enjoy it as it compensates for my not being there when Osho was in body..

    May i take the liberty to ask you how the big the difference is the experiences for people who lived in Pune 1 or Ranch compared to people who were physically close to him..say some one like Amrito… Was it looked at , as a disadvantage or everyone wanted to get closer to Osho?

  103. prem bubbie says:

    Greetings Kranti, Yes I am an old timer- feel it my bones!!! Regarding the difference in experience, I look at as those who went to the ranch or pune 1 went for their own reason(s) whether or not they were close to Osho or not. Your own personal “trip”, whether to get laid a lot, or a power trip, as with Sheela’s cronies; to mediate, do groups, catharsis through the intense physical work( at the ranch), whatever you focused your energy on, you generally got, as I see it. I did waste a little time on dreaming what it would be like to be, let’s say Osho’s cook or a rich sannyasin having a personal darshan with Osho. A rich sannysin that I was familiar with did have a personal darshan with Osho at the ranch. Most of my energy was focused on channeling my negativity through work, into the earth, and then letting go through play and dance, I spent a lot of time at the disco(s) after work. So much cleansing, lightness and a deep connection with Osho. I was fine where I was. For those who shared their inner feelings with me, those who stayed at the ranch, I feel they too, were fine where they were, and also felt close to Osho. The ranch was a genuinely selfish trip, I think we were naive somewhat as well. I would not trade that time of my life for anything in world. With some intelligence and common sense on our part, maybe we can do better next time.

  104. prem bubbie says:

    Amitabh, I kind of agree with you and please read my comments above, if you haven’t already. It’s not blame but responsibility. We were all responsible and Sheela was responsible for her own actions and as I see it she had some serious mental issues before she even got to the ranch. Instructing people to go as far as committing violent actions to make one’s fantasy real, shows some serious mental illness. All of us allowed her to continue on her manic ways. Who knows, but we might even still be living on the ranch today if we took responsibility back then. Only conjecture of course. Sheela still does not accept responsibility for her actions, THAT’S what is troubling to me. One can not grow without doing so. After all that time with Osho nothing rubbed off on her!!!! Caio

  105. prem bubbie says:

    Hey John and others, If you’re interested in the energy in Oregon check out this article… google– williamette week/urban pulse 2/02/2000. It’s interesting Bubbs

  106. Kranti says:

    Thank you prem bubbie .. I am greatful for what you share.. It is really beautiful.

  107. Kranti says:

    Prem bubbie ..can you please give exact url.. I couldnt get the article

  108. prem bubbie says:

    Hi Kranti! Here’s the url: http://wweek.com/html/urbanpulse020200.html cheers b

  109. Kranti says:

    Thanks prem bubbie ..It was good reading..

    Just wondering how things are there as another ten years had gone by..

    The way they say how Osho insights helped them is heartening..

    There may also be a hint there..somehow Osho had sown the seeds of a path which is all about individuals taking responsibility for themselves..not looking up into the sky for god to bring joy..

  110. Kranti says:

    Prem bubbie.. I wanted to ask this but missed..

    You said ‘ A rich sannysin that I was familiar with did have a personal darshan with Osho at the ranch ‘

    Was it real that richness has got anything to do with people being able to ge closer to Osho..Was that tag ‘ rich man’s guru ‘ real at that time?

  111. prem bubbie says:

    Yes, Kranti, in my opinion. I could fill this thread and then some with what I know as FACT regarding your question. To keep it brief, as I see it, humans’ existence at this time and when Osho was around is in such a precarious and desperate state that Osho needed to do what was necessary to wake us up, as many as possible. He, I felt needed to use every available resource and the western culture being capitalistic, needed money and wealth to do so. AIN”T NO FREE LUNCH as they say here in the states. The net had to be made as big as possible, and the bait to catch the “fish”, abundant and tasty. I trust you are intelligent enough to figure the rest out. I would like to share with you , what I consider, the three most important books ever published, regarding EXISTENCE and the “game” that exists. 1) Only One Sky, by Osho or back then Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh 1973 2) Psychology of The Esoteric also by Bhagwan 3) Fundamentals of the Esoteric Philosophy by G. de Purucker (under Theosophy category). For us western neurotic minds, the last two books are difficult to absorb, I had to take about a year to grasp somewhat the G. de Purucker book!!! I would like to share my story or “trip” with you. I won’t share with all but on an individual basis, that’s just me, and if you are interested of course. The how to is the question. I also would like to hear about your trip to Osho. Enjoy Bubbie

  112. Kranti says:

    Prem Bubbie.. I feel greatful with the way you replied..I will be immensely happy to share.. I came to Osho after he left body and have not been part of any great experiences so to say…Still i will share my love for Osho.. Let me know your mail id.. i will write to you.. My Id is venkatease@gmail.com.. I have facebook account also …Looking forward to sharing insights with you..

  113. Dilruba says:

    l came across this video of Sheela ‘s latest interview .. l want to share with you all

    ttp://www.hyoutube.com/watch?v=B39aER85PSg

  114. Dilruba says:

    http://www.hyoutube.com/watch?v=B39aER85g .PS. missed the h in my previous post

  115. Dilruba says:

    the previous links are faulty..

    this is the one :

  116. Dilruba says:

    “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  117. Dilruba says:

    Try : “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  118. Dilruba says:

    previous ones dont work either ..
    :”http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  119. Dilruba says:

    l keep on trying till it works
    “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  120. Dilruba says:

    again :
    “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  121. Dilruba says:

    “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”

  122. Dilruba says:

    “http://www.youtube.com/v/nwp-lUOUZig&hl=en&fs=1&”
    http://www.youtube.com

  123. Kranti says:

    Your messages look like a gramaphone disc went wrong Dilruba ( Just a joke ..take it easy )

  124. Dilruba says:

    anyways there is one more on you tube

    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  125. shantam prem says:

    Hi Dilruba,
    Just saw your posts above and got the opportunity to see History from Sheela’s eyes.

    It seems every history has many corners many versions and poor truth has many Uncles and Aunts but no Mama and Papa.
    May be that is why in every spiritual teachings, Truth is being lived by God/Parmatma/existance.

    Those who have no one is being loved by God.
    remeber the song in Hindi, ” Jiska koi nahi uska to khuda hain yaro, main nahi kehta kitabon main likha hain yaron.”

  126. Dilruba says:

    Shantam .. truth is interdependant on trust .. and in a way they are both one .. guess l / We all have to know that for ourselves …
    Chareveti … Chareveti …..

  127. Angela says:

    Thanks for posting everyone. I enjoyed it very much.

    In some posters said that on Facebook there were positive news about sannyas, anyone can tell me how to connect to them?

    Thank you very much,

  128. Veet Manu says:

    Angela:
    http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=42891949173

    Search Facebook with search term “Osho” to find the half-dozen or more other Osho sites.

    –Manu

  129. Be still!
    Sheela was sick by the same unconscious tha we the male has done over the female in order to contoll them(femenine!)we have created sickness ,and it be better if we coulod accept that ours have unconscious and make space for a better futre with ken that have come to help Us from the pot hole!
    Please be forgiving to our selves as male and accept that qwe´ve done to ourselves and to the femanin and that has been part of our male psychi!
    We are unconscious and the outcome of our actions are just what they´re and then we go on blaming!Osho only did the blame of Sheila as a provocation but He knew otherwise!
    Amen!
    Love all femenin as mother daughter,lover friend and teacher,
    Amrit*

  130. Arun says:

    Very interesting forum … thanks for Osho’s words regarding the Sheela affair …

    My impersonal take on the reasoning why Osho chose Sheela was that he wanted to see what would happen as an experiment. i’m sure many of his “followers” were always sleeping always waiting for him to make a move. he wanted to see what they could create.

    in actuality, sheela had a lot of initiative and took control, but everyone else took a passive, unaware role. of course, unfortunately, i don’t think osho realized the extent to which sheela could abuse herself and others. however, the episode, however extreme, provided an excellent opportunity to bring awareness and possibly awaken a whole lot of people from their dependence on Osho and on belief systems in general. unfortunately, as with any genuine effort, much thought is wasted in essentially gossip-type information gathering instead of understanding the essence. However, I do not believe osho was trying to spin the situation into a “positive” one.

    just my 2 cents … please disregard if it’s not meaningful …

  131. Vedamo says:

    I was at the ranch… worked in the tire bay with Shreyas, RBG, Pipe crew.
    That was a long time ago. I was young… 19 when I got there, 21 when I left.
    the whole experience was beautiful, if not sometimes dificult. Being young, I had a lot to learn about life in general… what a beautiful place to do it. So many beautiful people to help, and the buddha field. Before Oso, I was very troubled.
    the people, the Sangha most likely saved me…. it certainly taught me how to
    live, thrive, overcome adversity, how do they say it today ” maximize my potential”. I used to speak to Sheela, an vidya… Su.. Mukta….. I was young
    and had questions… and was very open…. never did I ask a true question without getting a righteous response…. maybe it was just me…. maybe it was just the moment. I never blamed sheela or anybody, for anything. just understood it as it was. Always understanding that OSHO was not stupid
    and that the whole game was just there to be played. I could write a book
    on the experience but it would hardly scratch the surface even if it were
    1000 pages. The energy is not gone…. never will be. We make a choice.
    you are open… then it is there. simple. I have had very little conact with sannyas since those days…. the boat carried me across the river…
    Much love to all, Much love to those who made the commune, I am forever gratefull that our paths crossed .