Towards the end of December, 1989, in Pune Two, Osho choose to mention at the commencement of one of the evening meetings in Buddha Hall, that he was being attacked by inaudible sound waves, sound waves beyond the normal range of human hearing, which were aiming to damage him.
The effect on the sangha was one of stunned astonishment. At that time the habit was for much dancing and celebration preparing the sangha for Osho’s entry. But this was a real shock when he spoke such things. His face, seemed very strict, and he cast his eyes towards the right side of the sangha where hundreds of people were gathered.
He stated to the white robed gathering that there was a very small group of people, probably three, who were using sound to harm him. Some thought this whole business a device, others, the majority, were not so sure.
On the following evening Osho asked those on the right side of Buddha Hall to swap places with those on the left.
He declared that his esoteric power was equal to the sound waves and he could reflect it back on the persons concerned, but he would not do so as his principles of non violence were unmoveable – even if it meant his own bodily death.
Over the next days much paranoia invaded the sangha, and many searches were made to try and find the source materials of such attacks without success.
According to Shunyo his then caretaker the attacks continued for many days, but Osho choose not to mention them again as it was giving such bewilderment and sadness to his sannyasins.
Osho left his body on January 19th less than a month later.
We never knew what to make of these events at SannyasNews. What do our readers say? If anyone was actually there at that time it would be especially good to hear from them.
‘Losing’ and ‘plot’ come to mind.
Some were confused, others puzzled, even more, bewildered.
Surely Obi-Wan could have reflected back the sound waves, ‘setting the phasers to stun.”
~ Ewell Nevenow
swami rajneesh was there – here is part of his account of the time from his book “tears of the mystic rose” page 204 onward
“black magic announcements appear in the buddhafield
a mantra is in the air
lookout and go deep inside
hear and search the sound of the mantra
it will kill bhagwan
children run around looking for the treasure that was never buried
the treasure hunt…the search begins
the device in play
this is serious must find the mantra man
no it is not a mantra man
it is a group of people who are targeting the sound to his hara
the news is alarming
scents are thrown into the wind
some lead north…some lead south
some now east…some now west
northwest southeast northeast southwest
each day a new direction a new turn a new twist
the plot thickens and the device is real
the entire buddhafield is switched from right to left
no signs of the black magic mantra
ok…try from left to right
no signs of the black magic mantra
vital vertical conditions and spaces need to be prepared
the secret balance in the transmission
left to right or right to left
left to right
left turn
the spirals match
perfect”
Yes, 88/89 was a strange winter season. Osho once did not wear his wristwatch, clear something drastic will happen. When Osho himself was speaking about the “black magic” attack, it was to me as if he asks for help; my doubt about the commune was complete. Before Osho, the dead of Nirvano, strange… all had a curtain smell, it felt helpless something not nice was working. Maybe our beliefs about enlightenment made us unable seeing what is going on, perhaps. The energy was different as the previous years, perhaps more alert or was it an arranged Drama. Honestly, I do not trust my perception according that winter.
As dominic said “Ewell Nevenow”.
Oh, of course 89/90.
Preetam says:
>> The energy was different as the previous years, perhaps more alert or was it an arranged Drama. Honestly, I do not trust my perception according that winter.
In those 9 months leading to his leaving his body, some (sannyasins) were conscious, some were unconscious, and some were probably superconscious. No matter how the bird finally left, just the anticipation of its leaving would had created all sorts of (psychic) epiphenomena.
Like Dharmen I can not remember a lot. One memory came up yesterday. A Gossip around bugging of the Telephone calls from Shriman Hotel. Many Sannyas made their western calls from there, me too.
Buddha hall was intense for the Brain system, can not say anymore how I felt, anxious because of Osho’s health. Over the day, as far I remember normal work and Meditation process.
Mantra Man! Sounds like something out of DC comics.
I can recall hearing stories about the sound attack at the time and thought as I think now, what a load of nonsense.
Osho’s principles of non violence were unmoveable – even if it meant his own bodily death. Quite a change of tune from when the sannyas army was getting tooled up with sub-machine guns in Rajneeshpuram. Sub-machineguns? How do those instruments of death and destruction tie in with principles of non violence?
Once in a while Osho would come up with some mumbo jumbo about one thing or another. For all we know he might have been influenced by Star Trek vids in regards sonic attacks. Afterall, Klingons were always a part of ashram life. The same goes with Osho’s fascination with Patton and hence he became a general rallying the troops for a last stand at Wounded Ranch.
There was much to be learned from Osho. In this case I’d say thinking for oneself and questioning all authority might be the reason for Osho creating such a device, because if you don’t question such nonsense it is a good indicator that you are stupid.
As for Swami Rajneesh’s take on things…well, obviously the words of someone working with a damaged helmet.
Your BS detector has been checked and seems to be in good working order, mcswamiji.
Aye, lad, it looks like the photon condenser tubes are doing just fine.
Agreed. Maybe he was sick of people thinking he was so on top of things all the time. Think of it – he told people not to follow anyone, yet was surrounded by followers. I would have messed with those peoples’ minds too.
One of his devices to get rid of the hangers on, the also rans.
The only device needing attention was the loose indian wiring in the guru’s motherboard. Sounds like a cry for help (yet another).
A true believer’s thinking process. “If it walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, smells like a duck …. it’s definitely not a duck.”
It’s a device and we have reasons… stupidity checkups, kling-on elimination, … More please, leaving no chakra unturned.
All embracing slogan:”Hey it’s a mystery school deal with it!”
God that’s deep!!!
God: “that’s deep”.
Thanks God.
~ Phil O. Soffical
Is there any science behind all this? Maybe someone knows?
I know that I had many recent hospital scans, etc and the Doctor doing the ultrasound scan told me it was the least invasive of any of western medical procedures. Personally I am not so sure.
is there any science behind it?
well you can check the side effects of long term use of benzodiazepines(valium etc) and nitrous oxide.
devagit admits that osho decided his own treatment in the dental chair.
must have been the same with the doctor and his meds too.
re. vivek ODs.
many of the “device” merchants say osho is not affected by his longterm partner and closest all those years` suicide (or).. because he is so enlightened?
heres a message for the girls out there…
if you meet a guy who believes that,dont offer to move in and cook his dinners !!!
luckily most of those guys are too fucked up and toxic to get a girlfriend in the first place and have to get their kicks in fantasy psychic realms and akashik zones and other astral areas reserved forpseudo-spiritual retards who cant relate evenly to the opposite sex…..
Parmartha,please read this:
http://www.bibliotecapleyades.net/scalar_tech/esp_scalartech04.htm
there is some science behind all this.
I think these rather strange happenings need to be put in the wider context of the last months of Osho’s life. A few months before, for whatever reason he demanded that good teeth be extracted, nine in all according to Devageet, his personal dentist, for no clear reason.
Then there was the untoward death of Vivek the previous month – what on earth was she doing overdosing in a Bombay hotel? Accident or design, or a bit of both, clearly no amount of continuous contact with Osho had gifted her “detachment” from the affairs of the heart. Devageet mentions this in his recent book, and even says that Osho seemed affected by this.
Osho’s body did seem to be disintegrating for some months, and he complained of being sometimes in great pain from various parts of his body. There would seem to be a variety of explanations for that, but for whatever reason, clearly the body that had inhabited Osho was in disarray.
One thing that is not mentioned much is what I remember Osho saying much earlier in his life which was that the link between his body and whatever he had become, was tenuous since enlightenment. It sort of “hovered around” ready to leave at any time, but his love for his disciples, and their love for him held the swaying bridge that crossed that precipice together.
I think you’re right to contextualise it …having 9 good teeth removed… Vivek’s death/suicide etc. Seems kind of sad overall.
Removing 9 good teeth seems unethical, to put it mildly, and should be a red flag.
It seems there was no-one to say ‘no’ to osho, give boundaries or give feedback when he needed it, only grovelling, though he was probably not open for it either. Generic problem with despotic leadership ‘do not disturb’ sign, becoming a victim of your own ‘infallibility’ and hubristic isolation.
Come off it,Dominic.
Of course it was a device to he eliminate the unconscious also-rans ,hangers on and time wasters.
Just look who is left.
Swami Rajneesh,Dhyanraj,Devagit and Arpana.
Its easy to see how enlightened these guys are from their brilliant writing.
Isnt that proof enough?
Your sounding a tad defensive.
You’re sounding right on the rupees, Yogi. To believe that Osho’s delusions were a device for one’s awakening is em…er…delusional. Osho was drawing close to death when the events described occured and in my books Osho handled the pre-death phase like a spiritual hero. Give the old man a break…he did a great job of being Osho up until the end. Who gives a shit if he lost the plot a wee bit towards the final countdown? Let’s see how well we handle it when our time comes.
“Osho handled the pre-death phase like a spiritual hero. Give the old man a break…he did a great job of being Osho up until the end. Who gives a shit if he lost the plot a wee bit towards the final countdown? Let’s see how well we handle it when our time comes.”
Please captain not in front of the klingons. Hang on, park the mothership, there may be a leak in the photon tubes and it’s all getting a bit soft and fuzzy.
If you’re heroes are dope fiends…then yes. If being Osho was a performance…the Osho Show, then bravo, nice idealized self. Still works for some. If a wee bit runs into the last 20 odd years or so then agreed it’s not even an angel’s fart.
Funny these mixed feelings to the old megalorascal. One minute I loves you pops, the next…you dirty rotten scoundrel.
Have to put your last thought on hold, but given the prevalence of social media, could be the next big thing!
I plan to shit myself and call out for prostitutes when my times comes. Of course, I’ll probably just shit myself and forget about the prostitutes. Oh, well.
The work consists of two things:
I have to help people to become sannyasins – seeing their possibilities, potentialities, hoping for them; but when I see that a person is impossible, that the more I give to him the less he receives, the more I give to him the more closed he becomes – as if he is obliging me… When this feeling becomes settled – and it is not that I take a hasty decision about it, I give all the opportunities and occasions for the person; but if it is impossible, then it is impossible – then I withdraw myself from his being. Once I have withdrawn, sooner or later he will have to drop sannyas.
Chillies Red
It functions both ways. The moment you take sannyas, you think YOU are taking sannyas. In the majority of cases I have chosen you – that’s why you take sannyas. Otherwise you would not have been able to take such a risk. And it also works the second way: when you drop sannyas, I have chosen you and I help you to drop it, because left to yourself you may go on postponing for your whole life. When you take sannyas, then you postpone for a long, long time. When you want to drop it, then too you postpone for a long, long time. You cannot do anything immediately. You cannot live the moment in its totality.
And this too I have felt: once you have left sannyas there is a possibility you may come back – because then you will miss me, and then you will understand what was being showered on you. Then you will miss the nourishment, then you will miss the contact. When you are getting it you start taking it for granted. Sometimes it is good to take it away so real thirst and an appetite arises in you and you start seeing.
But next time, when you come for sannyas, it is not going to be that easy. I will not initiate you so easily. Then you will have to earn it. Once you drop sannyas, coming back is going to be difficult. I will create all kinds of barriers. Unless you transcend those barriers you will not be accepted again.
That too is to help you, because there are people who can enjoy things only if they are difficult. If things are very simple and easy they cannot enjoy them. They need long, hard, arduous ways.
Sannyas is a simple phenomenon because the whole foundation of it is to relax and live in Tao, relax and let God take care of you. It has to be very simple; it is simple, but your mind understands difficult things more easily. If you have barriers to cross you become challenged. When Hillary reached the Everest peak, do you know what he said? He was asked, “Why? Why did you take such a risk? – because there is nothing. You went there and you came back; there is nothing to get! Why did you take such a risk? And many people have died before: for almost seventy years people have been trying to reach Everest.”
And do you know what Hillary said? He said, “It was such a challenge! Just the presence of Everest, unconquered, was a great challenge. It had to be conquered! There is nothing, I know, but that is not the point. Unconquered, and Everest is standing there, proud? Man has to conquer it!”
This is how man’s mind functions.
So next time when a person comes back – and many want to come back – then it is going to be difficult. Then I am going to create all kinds of difficulties for you, for your sake. That too is a help for you.
Osho, The Secret of Secrets. Vol 2, Ch 12, Q 4 (excerpt)
Maybe it was a device AND he was totally losing his mind. Maybe he thought it was real but it was actually a device implanted in him by Penn Gillette time-travelling from the future. Maybe he was just old and his brain was falling apart from stress and drug abuse and stress. Maybe it was real Klingons. It’s fun to think about silly things.
Just opened sannyasnews in Kopenhagen at host´s apple and surprised to see an article about the theme, management wants to bury for ever just like Osho´s chair and the Buddha hall, where unique history was being created.
What Buddha was doing in his last days or Jesus or Mahavira; thanks heavens i have no desire to know or read because one like them was writing a new saga in our time.
My eyes could witness this one in centuries happening, gives a feeling of immense contentment. Rest of many things one can do in another life, for example earning money. The distance between me and my richest relatives and friends is not much, just around 4-7 Millions euros worth!
When the article is here about those last days of Osho´s life, i hope i will also write my version, like all my posts(Haha) it should be closest to authentic events as i have no personal interest to make my own constituency out of Master´s ashes and His vision.
Beloved Arpana.
As a self-proclaimed non-also ran and non-hanger-on,you should, like the great Mystic Rose Swami Rajneesh,be loud and proud about your successful discipleship and higher state of consciousness.
Well past ‘a tad’ defensive now.
Maybe he’s just messing with you.
Stranger than strange
http://www.n0by.de/2/a2z/Deeraj.htm
BV.
that’s our old friend ramarshi the constellation therapist who was on sn a while back pushing his theory that amritos grandfather was jack the ripper(solved at last!) and how,according to ramarshi that explained a lot….
I like what they write in a kind of lobsang rampa meets rambo
(lobsang rambo?) kind of way..its imaginative and entertaining.
good spi-fi.
they take it seriously.
Interestink bv. My flabber is gasted.
German Saten, who was at Medina for a time, (Feel like I’m remembering a dream. ), and who had cancer, got caught up with him. The guy was going to cure him, but when he failed said it was because Saten had come to him to late and his Karma was to heavy.
swami rajneesh continues his recollection of the “death mantra” time :
“what i reveal is just the very tip of the whole truth
what i can reveal or wish to reveal or express to the world
i am aware of the multidimensional layers of questions
that will manifest from my revelations
the new mysteries these will now create the hundreds of questions these will raise…into more and more questions
i reveal only that which i feel i owe to my fellow travellers
to lovers of bhagwan and to this humanity
to the future seekers of truth
and to all living buddhas above who watch silently from the beyond
bhagwan has his own choosing…his total freedom of choice
his vision and wisdom far ahead of our times
his complete awakened awareness
mysterious announcements are made every day
they need to discover who is the black magician
perhaps an american cia agent with some special humming device
or a group of people chanting a special mantra to destroy bhagwan
or a certain person…perhaps an indian with the mantra
for the very first time in the entire life of bhagwans countless appearances buddha hall is divided at 45 degrees with a tape on the floor
all indians are to be seated to the left of buddha hall
and all foreigners on the right side
the message is bhagwan will in his flight of deep meditation
hands moving higher and higher
point out to some indian person or persons
who will be very gently tapped on the shoulder and not touched again
but gently asked to move and go towards bhagwan
and leave the hall by the steps next to his podium
bhagwan arrives on the podium with his mysterious device ready
the music follows his each hand movement
he opens his eye…points to one indian
gently brought toward him and walks out by the stairs next to him
the music continues…faster…another pointed out
the music continues his hands higher…another pointed out
the music faster his hands high in the sky…another pointed out
the music moves faster his hands higher…another pointed out
a highly peaked buddhafield
holding the golden strings rooted down down down
the wings of the phoenix must be held down in gravity
the vast leap between an unfathomable ravine and chasms of infinity
how will the master thief steal the biggest diamond the kohinoor
in broad daylight and in open view
the decoys have worked…bhagwans target still sitting
the music raises tempo into crescendo…his hands flying
bhagwan looks at me like an eagle from the sky…deeply penetrating
i knew my time has come
i am pointed to
i freeze
i stand slowly…unmoving…very slowly take a step forward
i am frozen and cannot take even a single step
each step is heavy like lead…each step slow and timeless
he looks at me
eyes open focused and ferocious like bodhidharma
the whole sky is descending and the earth is heavy with a forceful grip
i walk slowly towards him…just 3 metres…the gap is close
time has completely frozen into slow motion
everything buzzing into a deep stillness
i disappear
the sky pours heavily upon me
the diamond rushing heavily downwards into my crown
in the dark undetected…yet in the open broad daylight
an unravelled paradox to be forgotten
the greatest secret kept alive
the secret transmission of the sacred lamp”
swami satyam dhyanraj says:
>> “what i reveal is just the very tip of the whole truth
You know nothing! Prove me wrong.
If he knew nothing that would be cool, but the poor guy thinks he knows something important…file in under lost souls.
The secret transmission of the sacred lamp…ho-hum, such terribly old hat…a throwback to Lobsang Twofang’s secret transmission of the silent fart, circa 1969, even back then it smelled stale. That people still get off on trading in such tired cliches is hardly surprising in a world full of programmed robotos. I’m spiritual…lets talk mumbo jumbo……charlie chakras…thousand pettaled daffodils…..entititlement to enlightenment…I have a deep connection with Osho— he comes to me in my dreams but still hasn’t delvered on his promise to supply next weeks winning Euromillions numbers, so I too can enjoy the pleasure of driving a Rolls Royce on my own private ranch….its all a device.
Negative waves does exist.Don’t be so stupid and ignorant like frank and lokesh like to think.And about the story of absolute non violence,i also don’t believe
Yeah, like I can dig it YS…negative waves man…like atlantic rollers that roll in instead of out…like wow. Belief and doubt…two sides of the same pancake. YS do you like maple syrup?…being lost in space…like does the word astronaught ring an alarm bell in your helmet?
Lokesh, this sounds a bit like the reason for ignorance of an convenient Karma believers are Pancakes.
As a recent follower of Lord Nuddha and the right to bare arms, you seem well acquainted with his knoble beratefold path. Including right satire, right sarcasm, right ridicule, right laugh, righ twit, right bloody-mindedness, right slagging off, and right in the goo***s.
It’s a lao-tse job but someone’s gotta do it.
You have been promoted to Bloodysattva in the Mahahahahahayana lineage.
His blessings with maypole syrup.
Only frank and lokesh? Some of us are feeling a little unacknowledged.
Negative waves i can handle but poor syntax and grammar, i will not up with that put.
I don’t care so much….my grammar and syntax are poor,since is not my mother tongue,but people like you who try to copy the style of lokesh are much more ridicoulos for me….
YS, if you don’t know the language too well then you’ll inevitably miss a lot of the humour in the Swami Dominic’s posts.
I assure you that he and Lokesh each have a recognisably individual style.
(Cash, if possible, please, Dominic. Usual place, ok?).
Where once was a Baniyan tree, one sees series of flower pots lying.
There are still few branches and leaves of that tree scattered around, few want to plant those branches again, few think why not plant the leaves!
1. Do we have some exact dates of these events?
2. Any (online) videos to look at?
Do we have some exact dates of these events? Ehm…yesterday?
Any (online) videos to look at? Well, I’ve always found this one to be quite sensational. I mean how did he pull this one off?
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
Or this, god in disguise…
http://youtu.be/3WyoenjZAZw
Thatz an auld wan.
Auld wan syne then.Yours (split personality) is perfectly sick and look forward to showing it to frail elderly people, for their snufftori.
His very rude nude blessings. _^_
My Nudalini is rising and the thousand petalled thistle has opened. It’s a prickly experience.
1. Do we have some exact dates of these events?
2. Any (online) videos to look at?
These are innocent questions from Bodhi Vartan.
I am sure he is not asking for some clue about some lost Polish family during world war 2.
When the cult heads simply erase the facts of the happenings just 23 years ago, at least to me it simply shows priestly cunningness at work.
rajneesh´s interpretation is another extreme of Indian priestly mind.
Fact is Osho has not transmitted any sickness or lamp to anybody. He was provoking intelligence, was trying to create science of spirituality.
According to Osho World he complained about the black magic on the 16 Jan 1990.
http://www.oshoworld.com/biography/innercontent.asp?FileName=biography10/10-68-notes.txt
Is there any video of that day?
Shantypants…the voice of reason? Gimme a break.
shantam prem says:
>> Osho ……. was trying to create science of spirituality.
Spirituality is not a terminus, it is a search. How do you create a science out of a search? Are you sure you got that bit right?
I was present when Swami Rajneesh was narrating Tears of the Mystic Rose.
He had hidden many stories, in front of me as he said it would upset many sannyasins, and the right time will come for this to be opened.
We also know that Osho pointed to him as the last 6 person in the Buddha Hall event of the Mantra man and black magic story.
I know that he can easily open this story but is waiting for right situation when people will understand and able to absorb this sad event as he says.
As he says many times to us, there will be a great shock.
Maybe he was the Mantra Man ?? But what is the real reason ?? What was this Osho devise ? Why ?? There are many questions, and i have heard Swami Rajneesh explain secretly to me and few very close friends these sad reasons for Osho leaving his body. And i know what he explained is dangerous to many people including Swami Rajneesh.
He was told about this new article, and said the time is not right, it is too dangerous for his life to speak now. Looks like some people will not understand, and will make a big fire. It will make may people cry and understand why Swami Rajneesh has not opened out of deep sadness and pain.
In view of what’s been said here before, some time ago, it’s not too hard to read between the lines of your story, mini kang.
And well you know it.
mini kang says:
>> i have heard Swami Rajneesh explain secretly to me and few very close friends these sad reasons for Osho leaving his body.
What must be pissing you guys off is that everything worth knowing about Osho and his work is already in the public domain and you have to invent little secrets in order to feel a little special.
Mini Klang’s comment is a classic. She should be awarded the Golden Dummy award. What a load of contrived bullshit….must have a strong constitution to swallow it but obviously not yet digested. Wake up babe, you’re having the wool pulled over your third eye…big time!
Osho was fond of saying there is only one real secret and that is that there is no secret.
Lokesh finally again, giving me the Golden Dummy award.
We all thought and it was decided, that this Dummy Award award belonged to you. Need more coconuts ??
The time is coming, when everyone will know who is the real dummy and where the bullshit is coming from.
What Osho was fond of saying is not your statement, please do not quote him to measure yourself.
Mini, relax, there really are no secrets. People like to create secrets to make themselves more interesting. Osho had no need for such a subterfuge. He was already interesting enough and he delivered all the good old secrets in a series of books for everyone to share. Decades after his death people are still trawling through his ashes in search of what exactly? Secrets. Forget it.
My sediments entirely, Lokesh.
Pass the bottle, please!
Cheers!
If Lokesh is the real dummy, then I’ll listen to him. People who are smart all the time are awful bores.
Duh!
when at buddha hall white robe on the night of osho having announced about the death mantra being used on him – it completely freaked me out
i was absent from buddha hall on the subsequent nights of demarcations of buddha hall and putting sannyasins into different groups – i just couldnt bear it the whole thing that osho was being killed
i remained in koregaon park in my little magic stones shop surrounded by crystals in those days – a womb of stones
one evening a sannyasin in white robe stopped his rickshaw outside my shop
osho is dead get in and come to buddhahall now
in white robe i go to buddha hall
osho’s dead body is brought – a doll looks like – so small and frail
i dance as i have never danced in my life flying around buddha hall
the slow journey down the road to the burning ghats
the space filled with sannyasins in white robes mostly
osho is burning and so am i
Bodhi Vartan >>> What must be pissing you guys off is that everything worth knowing about Osho and his work is already in the public domain and you have to invent little secrets in order to feel a little special.>>>
If everything about Osho is already in the public domain, then why this question about Black magic and the Mantra man still not answered ??
You know everything about Osho ??
What a tease from the (agatha) christie Mystery school. Obviously the butler did it or…? What a cliffhanger, I can’t bear the suspense… I shall burst.
It’s elementary my dear kang, Mantrap man is the mirror image of Valium man but if you have some csi evidence, lay it out.
Spot on, dominic. I’m voting for the, er, ‘butler’ as well.
In fact, I’ve just called Lads-broke and placed my biggest bet of the year on that very outcome.
Banker bet of the last 23-plus years (inside info from Swami R, so it must be true).
PS: Only joking.
I knew you were taking the PS.
Because you’re thinking about it. Stop thinking about it, and the questions will vanish. Unless you’re some sort of Spiritual Sherlock, then you better get busy because Heaven’s Scotland Yard is waiting impatiently for some results.
Mini Klang enquires,’why this question about Black magic and the Mantra man still not answered ??’
Mini, in my not so humble opinion it can only be answered in light of the fact that this all happened towards the end of Osho’s extraordinary life. Osho occasionally went on strange trips and declared all manner of unsubstantiated stories to be fact, when they were in fact just his very own warp factor 9 mind trips. Ask your pal, Rajneesh, to tell you about Osho’s prophecies of doom period…Mount Fuji blows its top, California sinks into da Specific, apparently delivered due to a PR experts advice…Doom and gloom is a plus in terms of attracting stupido seekers(sad but true)…Or how about two thirds of the world population getting wiped out by AIDS?…mass steralizations in the ashram…ehm so sannyasins could devote more time on their spiritual growth…whatever they imgined that to be at the time…nothing to do with growing up. So, after a few years of tranqz and laughing gas is it so surprising that Osho dreamt up a death mantra delivering assassin in the sangha?
Of course a schemeing bunny like Rajneesh knows all the answers to the enigma but won’t deliver it out of compassion. Sweet! The poor guy def needs to throw a blanket of mystery around himself to cover up his ham acting in the ill-suited role of Osho successor. Osho had a hard job playing the role of Osho from time to time(the pressure must have been a million atmospheres)….Phew, I need a break from this guru shit. Listen kids, I’m going into a silent period of my work/watching too much telly and ordering too many rollers for da budget. Do you really think Osho needs a successor?…he pretty much demolished the concept of the holy enlightened one. Still, new seekers are born every minute, suckers too it would seem.
Mantra Man…ehm er…isn’t that kid’s stuff? I suppose it is, so no surprise that a kid like Mini is ever so serious about why this question about Black magic and the Mantra man still not answered ?? Note the double ??, this is no joke! Poor Mini. What an awful lot she has to learn about the game of slippery snakes and Jacob’s ladders. Still, if you want a meaning for life learning is a pretty good one. Now, pass me that bottle and I’ll sing you all a real song.
wow lokesh – such hatred for osho – an ex sannyasin since 32 years and still obsessed with bhagwan
One man’s “hatred” is simply another’s ‘realism’, DR.
Unfortunately, your ‘love’ appears to want to only acknowledge a ‘perfection’ that is purely your own creation, a fiction.
And this in turn leads you to a false conception of those whom you imagine ‘hate’ the one you ‘love’.
The pitfalls of being a ‘devotee’, in a nutshell.
Thanks for demonstrating these so well.
poor guys – “realists” who cannot forget bhagwan or forgive him – found a living master and were blessed – and have to spend the rest of their lives trying to pull him to pieces to save their foolish little minds and egos from the threat he is to them.
Well, put it this way, DR:
That’s what you, as a sort of ‘fundamentalist devotee’, choose to believe.
But, like most such notions, although it suits your particular mentality down to the ground, it doesn’t necessarily fit the facts.
Still, as the old saying goes, ‘Priests will be priests!’
Aah sweet dhyanraj, aka Propaganda man. Must have been a huge shock when you found out about Santa man. Wait..you still believe!
So retro living in a black and white world.
Must ease the burden of thinking for yourself with K9 psychology.
Sooner or later it’ll come crashing down. Till then…Onward christian soldiers…
I don’t knock it,dom…
I believe in a bit of laissez faire…
live and let live,i say …
after all,having your lips superglued to brians butthole is no laughing matter….
except possibly for brian.
frank says:
>> after all,having your lips superglued to brians butthole is no laughing matter….
You have the beginnings of a spiritual version of The Human Centipede (2009)
You can be a living master too. Osho told you that over and over again. Once you get the message, hang up the phone. Unless you’re deaf, then by all means marry the phone and tape it to your face and get in fights with people who tell you that you have a phone taped to your face.
I think that it is good to share our personal experiences of what happened around these remarkable events….
it was a cool winters day in January 1990…
i was taking a stroll around koregaon park.
I stopped into the public toilets at the burning ghats humming johnny cash`s `ring of fire.`
as I shuffled my way across the stained and muddy floor,i heard the creaking of a door…
holding my breath,i peered through the darkness visible …
to my amazement…
it was MantraMan….
he was in a cubicle, changing out of his disguise and back into lunghi.
I recognised him immediately….
One distinguishing feature that only I can recognise…
he looks at me like an eagle.
I know my time has come.
I freeze.
i try to take a single step,but the plot thickens beneath my feet.
he whips out his device from under his robe
it is a black magic crystal wand..
he points it at me.
I only have one chance.
I rush for the door.
as he tries to blast me with his black magic wand..
but he slips on a massive slimy turd that is lying in the floor and there is an unhealthy sounding splash….
now I knew the secret and identity of MantraMan.
but he knew where I lived.
I had to get out of town.
if I ever tell anyone who he is,my multidimensional and hugely significant and important revelations that only I am capable of revealing will cause too many questions and much sadness amongst true seekers,people will suffer ,many will die,bad things will happen, it will be very sad,my compassion stops me ……
I know too much..
and many will demand…
who is MantraMan and what did he have under his lunghi?
what were the strange vibrations that I heard ?
but my infinite compassion does not permit me to say…
so with great sadness I keep MantraMans identity to myself
until the moment comes for the transmission of the lunghi……..
I feel privileged to have read such a searingly honest, yet heart-wrenching account, frank.
It is hard for you, I realise, but the burden you carry from that ‘private encounter’ (the term ‘cottaging’ almost came to mind, but I quickly repressed the thought, of course) must, to a large extent, be ‘en-lightened’ by the inner certainty that you have been ‘chosen’. Surely?
Thank you, Chosen One.
Aah you can’t fool a fooler frank..
“the public toilets at the burning ghats”…
There are only ahem…outside toilets there, which would make you an ass-ended master. And “Ring of fire”, that’s code for a curry-in-a-hurry bum.
But thx for clearing the rest up. I knew it had to be a “device ” of some kind.
Good laugh, Frank. I was right there with you. It’s all so terribly exciting!
Just imagine,
for a moment,
that there were no hypothetical situations….
A hypothesis is only necessary when the thesis is f*cked up (so to speak).
In most cases you should follow the money. In this case follow the power and no hypothesis will be needed.
Lmao frank.
“until the moment comes for the transmission of the lunghi”
But now you’re rubbing salt in the wound. Remember two sarongs don’t make a rite (even black magic ones).
~ Hugh Dunnit
P.S. Is it true what they say about black magic wands?
Revealed: the truth about black magic..
http://youtu.be/YZOe6xFlR5M
This is exactly the reason Swami Rajneesh has hidden the facts. Whenever he decides to speak about it in public openly, remember what you all have stated here. It will be a shock to you all. That is all i can say as Rajneesh has asked me not to put any more details or discuss this matter here. Just wait for that day.
No, mini kang, I think you underestimate the punters on here..
We already know who done it, thanks very much.
As I said, I’ve already placed my bet -
Should ‘make a killing’ on that one….
Remember, Osho pointed to Swami Rajneesh in middle of the meditation in the Mantra Black Magic event, and was asked to go towards Osho podium. All lies again ??
Were you there, mini k?
Doubtful, as you’re not that old, are you? (How old are you anyway?).
How do you know this story is true?
And if it is, what’s the point of it?
What has a fact of what happened got anything to do with my age ??
There are videos of this event and every sannyasin knows of this day when Osho pointed out 6 people. It was setup in this manner that Amrito, Devageet and few others would walk silently and when Osho would point to the person, was then asked to gently be brought to Osho podium. If Osho was looking for the Mantra person would he ask them to come close to the podium ?? Point or no point you decide for yourself, or read Tears of the Mystic Rose more carefully.
But this is not your experience, mini k, you weren’t there and you never even knew Osho when he was alive, in fact you were hardly born, I suspect.
Anyway, I haven’t the slightest idea what all this mumbo jumbo means as no one has explained it in plain English.
mini kang says:
>> There are videos of this event and every sannyasin knows of this day when Osho pointed out 6 people.
If I was Swami Rajneesh I would have the video of that event posted on SN.
MK, put out or shut up.
My feeling is that Osho was fishing and he decided that SR wasn’t the fish he was looking for.
“Just wait for that day”.
We have formed a wait watchers group in anticipation.
Will he come soon with his big reveal, quickened by the Master baiting? (We’re all getting on a bit you know!)
Or are you devo-teesing us in the standard missionary position?
In any case does seem to get the creative (bitter lemon) juices flowing nicely.
Btw what is a mini Kang and how does that compare in size to a midi or maxi kang?
Are we talking star trek, marvel comics, simpsons?
Mantra man and mini Kang sounds like a good combo. Voodoo you think they are?
~ super-maxi dom (aka Tantra Man)
mini kang says:
>> Rajneesh has asked me not to put any more details or discuss this matter here.
Why are you taking about it?
Mini Klang declares, ‘ It will be a shock to you all.’
I can already feel a tingle in my sporran.
Dharm Jyoti a close associate of Osho from prior to Poona 1 days , mentioned an incident in her book. She once became interested in black magic and started to read a book. She mentions about this to Osho and he seems to have recommended her to stop reading that book. She also mentioned about how mysteriously that book used to fell down from the reading desk. She of course discontinued reading it.
Osho also mentions ( forgot where) about some incidents, where he was able to heal few friends. But he did it with a condition that they don’t spread the word to others. Also there was a mention of Sai Baba how he got obsessed with miracles that happened only at a certain time of his life. To maintain the image he learned cheap techniques of magician.
We also heard of St. Francis body remaining intact even after few hundred years in a Cathedral in Goa. According to Osho, he learned a technique from Tibetan masters that involve some kind of Hypnotherapy at the time of death.
In my child hood there was a man in my Village, who was able to cure victims of king cobra bite with a mantra. There are still people like that in South India, who can cure the patients over the phone.
Also in India, there is an architectural science called Vaastu which is widely used in Construction. No one builds in a plot which is in a T junction and right opposite to the road that makes T. Only temples are allowed to build in such a site. Vaastu is a widely accepted practice in India and it has lot of science and logic behind it.
So there could be things that are possible which are beyond our comprehension. Some are possible to explain logically with modern science and some are not.
When it comes to spiritual journey, as far as I am concerned, I don’t give a damn and move on.
Black Magic has its cunning significance, for keeping masses away of them selves but instead forcing those sacrificing Authorities at the peripheries. To achieve these goals, all means are justified as well killing the Master.
To me it seems, even Buddhism is involved. Buddhism’s insult unto Truth is, it shifted “Kama Rupa” into what people understand by Karma today.
Our world is driven by people like Albert Pike hiding “truth” for lower reasons and thinks the reasons are virtue. He is baiting for all against all, our world proves it.
It seems no Albert Pike’s are necessary, you confuse with each other so beautifully, great.
In 1871 Pike wrote a letter to Giuseppe Mazzini, where he described the need for 3 world wars, and how they should be caused. Is that Black Magic, too?
Beloved Exsitance,
If you give me the role of a spiritual master, please give me this much sense, not to allow western male disciples too close.
I think this is one of the main step future Indian masters have to learn from the history!
And also please reduce this Indian quality in big proportion where mountains are created out of moles. Mind or no mind, Chappati eater Indian just cannot stop going over board, when audience is gathered.
Yes and India could learn, not being obedient to western Authorities and Money.
shantam prem says:
>> Beloved Exsitance,
If you give me the role of a spiritual master,
You will be given nothing. If there is any to be had, you will have to take it.
>> please give me this much sense, not to allow western male disciples too close.
Racist and sexist at the same time? Don’t worry tho Shanti, when the time comes, we will corrupt you. (Like the last time, oops.) The day India starts making the best cars in the world, I’ll start worrying.
“please give me this much sense, not to allow western male disciples too close.”
…except to empty pockets and provide hook-ups with lovely western female disciples for Shantiespanties.
Or
“My Belaughed Experience… Please give me some sense!”
Black magic can be the same when some one talks shit behind your back. If prayer and for example your friend’s love give good vibes, if you create a lot of enemies, they create bad vibes. I would first say no, then not put more energy to it, but simply step back and find positive people. However, if I give a simple reason for Osho’s behaviour with the mantraman, perhaps many of his closest people knew he was leaving the body and were already fighting about what would happen afterwards.. That’s simply bad vibes..
Cathartic methods are kind way of recycling bad vibes..?
Perhaps Osho wanted to recycly the spiritual vibe (all kind of vibes) of the commune to be ready for his death..shifting people around and around..actually practical..
I have been thinking about recycling lately a lot; it seems to be the only hope for this earth., that is drowning in the shit and garbage. It’s also like from mud to the lotus flower, literately from shit/death into the born of new life. In shit/mud there is all phosphor and nitrogen needed for new birth and growth. It’s quite a metaphor that plants and our food then only need light for growth to happen. It’s quite a wonder that lotus flower comes from the bottom of the water, how on earth can that happen? And that is only in the physical world. And light is there all the time, only earth moves around and round like a wheel.
What happens to the emotional body/world with recycling? The whole spectrum of emotions; anger. Sorrow, joy, bliss etc..Can it be recycled? Somebody here wrote when you dye, all your love dissolves to people you have loved.. I did like it, kind of same way like osho dissolved into his people…consciousness stays..
So, for today’s situation, I wonder, can something new be born out this shit energy level with sanyas..are we in deep shit and just about the come out of the water or what?
So, too much fertilizing or dumping of the animal’s and our own human shit on the fields and water contaminates the water. That is for fact next biggest environmental issue after global warming…so
Too much talking shit contaminates the emotions..
If love is food for the soul.. then…?
Too much (?)..Contaminates the soul..
And then consciousness…?
Sorry Fresch, for my ears a much too naive view that way it will not work. If a person knows perhaps History and is using his knowledge for bewilderment and Power over others it’s negative. If it becomes organized by structure and Order its Black Magic. This world is provided Fascist, since more than 3000 years. Still the same Babylonian fascist Order what keeps Humanity within his claw. Those people are really intelligent, cunning and sick. They won’t go for any your therapeutic goals, only those people whom anyway cheated and betrayed. So it wills the same Story moving on and on, very tricky.
it seems that vaastu building techniques were used in the construction of the public toilets down at the burning ghats.they are on a T junction,too, which would explain the earth shattering and world-changing events that have taken place there….
not only the extraordinary story of mantraman and the transmission of the lunghi …
but I have witnessed many outrageous scenes there….
yet I am bound under oath and under pain of death,or worse,to the black-magic tantric agoris, hardcore hindu cruisers and various other adherents of the “left-hand path”, not to reveal.
to say that theres some pretty heavy shit going down in there would be an understatement,but out of compassion lets just leave it at that.
the fact that transmissions of the highest wisdom are taking place in public toilets has great import for india in the 21st century.
most neo-vaastu-ists that I have spoken with agree that if they can stop building temples and build public toilets instead,life in india will improve immeasurably.
I suggest putting little shrines to all the various gods in the cubicles so that the faithful can pray and do their ablutions simultaneously.
win/win surely?
You dreamer frank. You optimystic.
You can lead a vaastu to-vast smelly holes, but you can’t make him drink…(pardon the mixed metaphor.)
When I was in Auroville, the westerners built lovely clean toilets for the locals on the beach. Did they use them? Course not. Things stayed as turdy as ever.
It’s an uphill struggle against thousands of years of Insanitary Man and the path of lefthanded brown tantra. But I feel your lunghi-ing…
~ Cacaji
However, to be able to produce food, earth needs shit ( contains phosphor and nitrogen) – but moderately and not thrown to the water..and then light..
So, Frank your story is so true..
Black magic is throwing shit to the water..
Vartan you draw attention to the time line placed at Oshoworld for the events before Osho’s death, etc.
This is not the same as the time line that is described in Devageet’s last book.
“The first Buddha in the Dental Chair”. His description is more dramatic, and describes Osho confronting the sangha towards the end of December with the death ray stuff, and very unexpectedly, as he had not actually spoken publicly for some time.
The best is if someone who was there, like Dharmen, comes forward and tells us his recollection of this time line.
I was by chance , talking to a friend last evening about the the days prior to 19th January 1990 , that person ( poona -1 indian sanyasin ) was assigned as one of the gaurds in buddha hall at that time and said that there was a humming sound which was coming from the empty area of the visitor section in buddha hall & not from any person , the whole group of gaurds( poona -1 indian sanyasin ) confirmed this who were present there .
” The best is if someone who was there, like Dharmen, comes forward and tells us his recollection of this time line. ” , This statement says a lot , could be any / all of the below
a)Dharmen is the one who wrote this article .
b)Dharmen is inclined towards yellow journalism .
c)Dharmen is not sure of himself & needs to clear his doubts .
d)Dharmen is the Jayesh / Amrito of sn .
e)Dharmen is / has the last word on sn .
f)Dharmen is not his full sanyas name !( the secret is in the other half) .
the whole group of gaurds( poona -1 indian sanyasin ) who were present there , confirmed this .
Gosh! Kavita this is terrifying news. Any tips on how to protect oneself from a close encounter with Mantra Man? Earplugs? Bullet proof vest? Anti-mantra? Auntie Mantra…eureka!…that’s the culpirt. Kavita, in all due sincerity, are you Auntie Mantra?
no Grandpapaji , Iam not any kind of Auntie , wondering why would you need any tips ?
I was just checking in the akashik records and my copy of “black magic for dummies”…..
it says there that one of the most potent,if not the most black magic mantras is:
hahahahahahaha
apparently,its use can turn a fairly normal bloke from somewhere up north into a zombie wearing nothing but a tea towel round his bollocks and repeating gibberish that he has heard from another brian-damaged guy for eternity……
scary!
listening to all this gibberish is making me kinda dizzy , I need my cuppa now , my boyfriend is off on a mountain retreat , so shall have to make it myself !
hahahahahahaha….e gads…you mean…I don’t believe it……swam satyam dhyanraj is Mantra Man….I knew it! But hold on..lets take a few notes….the finger points to Swami Rajneesh as being the Anti-….I can’t bring myself to say it…I’m going to take an asprin and lay down….this is all getting a little out of hand…and here’s me led to believing Kavita was Auntie Mantra, while all the while she was just an innocent lady sipping tea.
holy lunghis,mantraman,i shoulda put on my deathray-proof chuddies this morning…
whats that sound..?
theres a humming coming out of my computer..
rrrrr..oh no!
its…its….its can`t be
it is…
hahahahahaha…
aaaargh…..
another mantra that is drivin` `em loco down in Acapulco…
I wanna be like you
I wanna talk like you
walk like you
a monkey like me
can be enlightened like you-hoo
Or..
If I Only Had A Brain
I could wile away the hours
Enjoying all my powers
Consultin’ with the sane
And my head I’d be scratchin’
While my thoughts were busy hatchin’
If I only had a brain
I’d unravel any riddle
I wouldn’t have to fiddle
In trouble or in pain
(Dorothy)
With the thoughts you’d be thinkin’
You wouldn’t be out pimpin’
If you only had a brain
(Scarecrow)
Oh, I would tell you why
I wouldn’t have to bore
I could think of things I never thunk before
And then I’d sit and think some more
I would not be just a nuffin’
My head all full of stuffin’
My heart all full of pain
I would dance and be merry
Not so angry and contrary
If I only had a brain
if only you had a brian?
get your lunghi on, and get down to Acapulco …..
hahahahahaha
Who is Brian?
Is he a practitioner of the left-hand path?
Is he blessed with a black magic wand?
Acapulco… a sunny place for shady people.
I must go, but first does my bum look big in this lunghi?
Looking forward to more extracts from “Indian toilets I have loved” or was it “Carry on up the kahzi: A Ghori Story”?
It’s so….hahahahahahahaha
Actually mantraman has been seen recently in Goa, where he was reported to have been killing goats, and tourists with his mantra’s.
I have some special amulets, which I am selling,for a good price, for tourists to protect themselves from mantraman.
dharmen did not write the article
dharmen detests yellow journalism even though he does not really know what the term means
dharmen is not sure of anything
dharmen – last word – these days I can’t be bothered, id rather have the last laugh
the other half is not much of a secret
keshavadeva is a better one.
so option f) is more like it for dharmen !
& The Chief Investigator is Parmartha obviously
‘ there was a humming sound ‘
Echoes from a Nadabrahma session perhaps? A generator?
Mantra man…aieeeeeeeeeee!
I was there at that time, I found the whole death ray malarkey as bewildering as anybody. As for time lines, I can only relate the white robe brotherhood event(s), the other stuff I have no knowledge of: It was a normal white robe brotherhood except half the mystery school and other bods where wandering around Buddha hall trying to track down the source of the humming but it didn’t look to me like they were having much luck.
Of course there was lots of gossip afterwards as to what was going on and the official story took a bit of swallowing for some.
As far as I know, nothing has ever been concluded about this stuff, there is a lot of speculation, but no facts. From all the speculation it probably comes down to three things:
Auditory hallucinations and the like
The vibes were real
Osho was up to somthing
Guess its time to fill in the missing gaps
Anybody?
I was there too, but I can’t remember much, except all these people in white sheets, some paranoia and hey ho, another day in the Asylumfield.
Falling for all this yellow journalism means urine trouble.
Mwahaha Mwahaha….omg it’s gone viral and mutating!
Throwing shit is black magic..life is simple.. No need for paranoya
On the esoteric and Osho: Here is the dilemma for the mind:
“Everything that is valuable is esoteric”. (Osho, in his book, “Beyond Psychology”)
“Esoteric means Bullshit.” in Osho’s book “From Bondage to Freedom”.
Simple dialectics I would have thought.
A=B, B=C thus A=C or bullshit is valuable as most rural indians will tell you.
Aah but you mean there goes the old fella talking out of both sides of his mouth again. Be a surprise if he wasn’t. It’s de-vice of de Osho.
in the context of black magic, osho also talked about uri geller and the power of thought (maybe someone has the link)
in this talk he expounded on how gellers experiments proved the physical power of thought ,bending spoons,watches etc.
nowadays,the goof is out,and we know that a whole host of magicians can/have always been able to do this stuff,but gellers unique angle was to call it thought waves rather than just trickery.
so osho believed in this discredited crap.
(ok maybe he didn’t care,just wanted to make a point etc)
in any case,he spoke as if it was scientifically established fact.
back in the day,i was friends with a pro magician called magical mystical michael.
he spent quite a bit of time travelling in india living from doing his close-up magic tricks to anyone who would watch.(its not too hard to get a crowd in india)
i learnt a few simple card numbers with a trick deck from him…
as a misdirectional patter,i rabbited on about psychic powers and getting in touch with energies etc.it was a good line because when I fluffed the trick, I could say the energy wasn’t very strong and I would have to take some deep breaths etc and try again,or even blame the audience for their negativity(which is one that geller used,in fact)…
now,when I did these tricks on westerners,they were amused by the patter but generally wondered how is the trick done.
indian people,however,tended to believe that real magic/psychic powers were involved.(this was just basic `pick a card any card type stuff`)
this included sannyasins who had meditated for a long time and ones who had western/modern type jobs ,eg a doctor…
michael was taken to be a holy man many times,feted with garlands,people touching his feet and carried through the village etc.etc.
luckily he was more interested in the travel,free food, lodging and smoke.
he could easily have donned the lunghi and declared himself the head of a lineage or whatever……
Do you know the story by H.C Andersen: The Emperor’s New Clothes? it’s a short tale about two weavers who promise an Emperor a new suit of clothes that is invisible to those unfit for their positions, stupid, or incompetent. When the Emperor parades before his subjects in his new clothes, a child cries out, “But he isn’t wearing anything at all!”
Perhaps enlightenment for Indians is all that poetry and described bollywood language, even osho also says just the “ordinary silence anybody experiences, is Buddha nature..”Where as we western people do not get it that silence is the same you have just by sitting by by the lake..Perhaps all this fuss is just matter of perspective. Cultural perspective. We could just simply relax..
Fresch:
Perhaps all this fuss is just matter of perspective. Cultural perspective. We could just simply relax..
SD:
Perhaps so…
But that would go against all our cultural conditioning, our whole ‘western mind’, so it’s not so simple in practice.
That’s how unnatural we’ve become – I mean, as a culture, not of course anyone reading or contributing to this blog….
with globalisation easterners can become brainwashed and conditioned by western crap
and westerners can become brainwashed and conditioned by eastern crap.
whacked out westerners in lunghis and white robes….
rational easterners in three piece suits and white lab coats….
I`m not complaining…
we`re all just humanimals at one big fancy-dress party…
pass the bubbly (or chai)….
Reckon it goes rather deeper than that though, as you don’t just lose thousands of years of socio-cultural conditioning ‘just like that’ (to coin a phrase).
Can’t make up my mind which is the more ludicrous:
Westerners trying to be eastern, or easterners trying to ‘go west’…
Then I recall Mr DR and all becomes clear….
I reckon the easterners have it. They’re hungry for the western material lifestyle, more than we are for their brands of spirituality. When I look around I’m an endangered isolated species, outgunned and outnumbered. In 50 years europe will be Eurabia/Eurasia etc. High immigrant birthrate, low indigenous one.
The 1% look after their own and don’t care.
Am i on the right forum?
ludicrous is anti osho guys calling themselves sannyasins -
he lived his life according to himself, not according to the prejudices of others
- and fools like to try and big themselves up by putting our master down
As I said yesterday, that’s just your biased, skewed interpretation, DR, born out of fundamentalist-type ‘zeal’.
But your second line (above) is rather nicely appropriate for those whom you yourself like to “put down” – “the prejudices” in this case being all yours.
Give me ‘sinners’ like the punters on here, every time, rather than a goody-goody would-be ‘saint’ of a priest like you, any time.
ha ha ha ha ha ha ha
you are welcome to have your “punters” – ignorant tossers all
i know ! – you could talk about toilets and shit together for years on end and be happy forever – particularly if you can link shit, toilets and arseholes together with osho and his disciples in the same sentence even greater joy will be yours ! – happy happy “punters”
Why then even bother coming here, Mr Indignant Priest, when the congregation either laughs at or ignores you?
No ‘converts’ here, everyone’s well on their way to Hell!
So are you, of course, but you don’t know that yet….
satyadeva says:
>> Give me ‘sinners’ like the punters on here, every time, rather than a goody-goody would-be ‘saint’ of a priest like you, any time.
As Osho said: It is easier for a zorba to become a buddha, than for a buddha to become a zorba.
Dhyanrage, just add nauseam.
Seriously though that’s a pretty big blind spot you’ve got there.
Trying hard to lay a guilt trip on others and maintain your illusions, when there’s so much compelling evidence for any reasonable person to think otherwise.
Enslavement and dependency on an outside authority is a childish dream as is the ideal of a perfect master.
Wake up and smell the incense!
why do you imagine a master should be perfect or that a lover of the master should be enslaved and dependant ?
the childish dream is yours – fear expressed and called reason
the master is an opportunity for sannyasins – and falling in love with a living master as osho – here is spinned as zealous fundamentalism and illusion
you are obviously not a sannyasin are you martyn? or dominic ?
Dhyan Raj:
the master is an opportunity for sannyasins – and falling in love with a living master as osho – here is spinned as zealous fundamentalism and illusion
SD:
No, DR, it’s what YOU have made of it all, how YOU come across.
Why such a need to condemn others? To tell others what to think and how to behave?
As if only you and your (largely young, inexperienced) allies are the ‘true disciples’.
As if you yourself ‘know’ anything.
A well-meaning, sincere fool, very likely at least as ignorant as those you condemn, spouting overflowing love, yet full of overwhelming, humourless self-importance.
In short, an almost archetypal fundamentalist missionary-priest.
One might well ask, Who do you think you are?!
But I wouldn’t necessarily trust your answer.
SS Dhyanrage
Whatever floats your boat
and your bible studies.
I say peace on it.
satyadeva -
Why such a need to condemn others? To tell others what to think and how to behave?
As if only you and your (largely old and knowledgeable) allies are the ‘true disciples’.
As if you yourself ‘know’ anything.
A well-meaning, sincere fool, very likely ignorant rather than those you condemn, spouting overflowing cynicism, yet full of overwhelming, humourless self-importance.
In short, an almost archetypal fundamentalist missionary-priest.
is this you satyadeva ?
Er, actually, no, Mr Outraged.
In denial again, I see…
And as unoriginal as your ‘guru’.
Oh well, predictable and par for the course.
Dhyanrage…I like that. It’s more witty than shit for brains.
frank says:
>> with globalisation easterners can become brainwashed and conditioned by western crap
and westerners can become brainwashed and conditioned by eastern crap. …..
Yes and no.
Today it is generally the easterners who are looking to the west, than westerners looking to the east.
What I see around me in the west are some eastern devotional practices with the devotional elements taken out and used as secular exercises (MacYoga, MacMeditation, etc). I can foresee us exporting these new westernised versions of the eastern practices back to their countries of origin (isn’t that what happened to zen and Japan?).
Osho Sannyas is actually a perfect example. The eastern Osho is not the same as the western Osho … which Osho will prevail, how, and why?
We could just simply relax.. Yes its true, Togetherness, intelligence and movement aren’t they our social roots till Stone Age; we relax if the needs are satisfied.
Indeed in this present world it seems good if people can not fulfill their needs so that they can not relax and go easy for War and rise the Dow Jones up. It is something like a fake global warming.
I recently was told about this by a supporter of this organization.
http://www.proswastika.org/videos
Next weekend they are celebrating it all over the world. Check it out.
http://www.proswastika.org/swastika-day
Playing with the swastika symbol is about as stupid as anyone can get, given the history of the 20th century. If you are going to play with stupid symbols you might as well pick up the cross…
What I mean with “invisible” clothes, that we sanyasins put so much fuss around the silence, calling it enlightement – the secret story again, even all people are experiencing silence in many ways (?). It’s as if our silence is more special than other people’s silence. And then some of us have, of course, more of that special silence you cannot get from anywhere else, secret skill, level A,B,C to your death…for sale. But nobody has really (!) experienced the same silence as osho, ofcourse.
“invisible” clothes? Doesn’t that kind of comment belong in that naff thread Shantypants wrote about Germany’s FKK strand and the effect it has had in raising his….ehm…consciousness?
Have you observed what have happened to all new movements like communists, woman or environment movements? Even the business people say about new business ideas the same; “first people get slaughtered, latter people launching the same idea cash it, then come copy cats and it spreads mainstream”. So, meditation is spreading many ways, not just Osho way, all over in the world. I am a bit tired with fundamentalist attitude of this is the only right(!) way, better than any other way, the only right kind of silence. Silence is silence is silence, not a property somebody owns. And it’s a bit cult stuff that I would feel not very comfortable saying this in osho places. Like if you practise osho kind of silence, practising other kind of silence would be wrong. However if somebody new or not sanyasin does it, it’s ok of course, “he has not got it yet”. The right kind of invisible secret silence. And I have heard osho say: “There is NO middle man”.
Fresch, there are two kinds of silence. There is ‘nothing’ and there is ‘an absence of something’. Don’t get caught up with the clothes. Transparency might look good on paper but life is more wondrous and magical with a few mysteries thrown in.
PS Osho was far from transparent …
PPS When you think about it ‘white people’ are actually transparent …
I was watching Sir David Attenborough doing Galapagos 3D and he was talking about a new species of (pink) iguana which was recently discovered … well it’s not pink, it’s translucent
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
And transparency would diffuse any secrets and black magic. I know they say osho wanted even practical things to be organized secretively. But are they going to practise exactly that for next two thousand years? What was this talk about using your own sense or keep things moving. For me secretive, authorities style is soooo old fashion, outdated way. In modern world you cannot even run a company, especially were there work creative people, in that way any more. But that is in free world and more evolved society (not Saudi Arabia). And I do not want wear, even an invisible burkha.
And I mean all sanyas activity (not just one place in one Indian city). They all could just be transparent about everything.
The Beauty or Perversion of the western mind lies in the fact, even the places of pilgrimage it has brought into the catagory of tourism.
Through Osho´s laborious ways, handful of People here have tasted the forgotten language, before this taste could spread further, arche type west again popped in.
Body vartan, what is the need for mysteries with practical things? Like giving out numbers of osho books sold, income and costs of activities, names of the people responsible etc..( in all sanyas activities, not just in one indian city)
Shantam, i assume you must be one of the few who have tasted…
That is what i mean is such garbage to be recycled
One reason, why all these pseudo sanyas trainings are not approved from governments (so that participants would get officially proved diplomas) is really not at all because of the content of the programmes (similar contents by other organizers are proved already), but because of practical (!) reasons. To get approval they should open their accounts and budgets. They do not do it because that’s the way for organizer to make money, not pay taxes…they do not care that nobody qualifies for nothing with these so called trainings..
And why are they not opening the figures with publishing sales? Why are different sanyas groups fighting about publishing? Because of the money. If you start looking at any issue, the ground rule is always, look who benefits financially. I hope you have seen the great document about the Rain man. And publishing is going down as we know, but customers are coming from the happenings (even for normal publishing houses, singers etc)..When money comes, power comes; sex comes, love from stupid new comers come, so forth. And rajnees (?) is just doing the same, “giving it for free”..but then asking the money any way, which is even more cunning
Cannot see this Fresch. Most “businesses” that I know avoid tax like the plague and are full of deceit, it doesn’t matter if they are sannyas or not.
Tax avoidance has been a way of life since Judas, though he was pretty good at finding it out and therefore very unpopular!
You are a great genius if you can find a way of stopping this. I even met a businessman in a Hospital A and E once who said thank God for those who have to pay their taxes through their jobs, cos none of us businessmen do! Of course he was getting free life saving treatment under the English NHS… !
Good and bad, well if those descriptions of human beings really exist, there are a lot of small “bad” men!
And I am heard it so many times that “nobody is making money ..plalaplaa” For me it’s ok, if people are making money like in any other jobs or companies (my normal friends are definetely making so much more money with their companies or jobs), just be transparent about it.. then it’s clear
I estimate the correct number of active sanyasins is about 2000 in the whole world, at least less than 5000 ( that sounds too many for me actually)
mind you,most of them hate osho
and are not fit to wear the lunghi.
Hate Osho…I seem to have heard that before. Then again, love and hate are two aspects of the same rupee. It’s like…wow…energy!
Personally I prefer a good bottle of Baron De L. Makes me feel like everyone’s enlightened. Well, apart from Dhyanrage and Swami Rajneesh. You’d really have to be real deal enlightened to see those nutters’ potential for Nuddhahood.
Surely they have all fooly realized Nutterhood?
frank there can be reason for it. If your children have been sexually abused in sanyas communities, you have been sterilized, you have lost all your money and possession, you have lost your family and outside friends, you have been lied for years…so forth. And it’s your own karma and you are actually responsible for all that. So, there just might be reason for some mixed emotions. Perhaps from your past life. so, stay positive..
Perhaps from your past life. so, stay positive..
SD:
What the hell does this mean?
Please clarify.
and it’s true i seem to be a bit pissed off with the cult stuff, because I am considering what move to make and it seems I am in the down sift with this one..so my own fault, my own karma
Thank you frank, i really am acting out as osho hating ex sanyasin. More dynamic:) and i will loose some weight (and hate, and fate) to fit the lunghi..what colour is it?
Bodhi vartan says
“Playing with the swastika symbol is about as stupid as anyone can get, given the history of the 20th century. If you are going to play with stupid symbols you might as well pick up the cross…”
Totally agree. The so called new-age folks are into any thing that makes them feel special. Only positive note I saw in this is that they found some thing common across all religions and beliefs. Especially the major ones. I at the least morally support things that tries to melt the barriers between the religions..I dream for that day when these quarrelling folks agree on basic things like “oneness” ( Godlyness is one).
shantam prem says:
“The Beauty or Perversion of the western mind lies in the fact, even the places of pilgrimage it has brought into the catagory of tourism.
Through Osho´s laborious ways, handful of People here have tasted the forgotten language, before this taste could spread further, arche type west again popped in”.
We heard many times that Sex is the first rung of the ladder and Samadhi is the last and beyond. In other words can we say, when the dick gets erected we are on the first rung and when the eyes gets rolled up focusing towards sahasrar we are in Samadhi ?. It has no west or east dear.
But yeah, it takes some time for both the folks from west and east before they clean their &$I# and meet in the middle.
dominic says
“Simple dialectics I would have thought. A=B, B=C thus A=C or bullshit is valuable as most rural indians will tell you. Aah but you mean there goes the old fella talking out of both sides of his mouth again. Be a surprise if he wasn’t. It’s de-vice of de Osho.”
Once in a while for a change I ( I am sure you too) have been to other maestroes who supposedly talk only from one side of the mouth ! Aren’t they good?. yeah, but they play the goody goody game, ain’t it? Bad boys find it suffocating to be with em. Here is a song for you from the bad boy..
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/michaeljackson/bad.html
http://www.jango.com/music/Michael+Jackson?l=0
Michael Jackson a “bad boy”?
You’re joking, surely?!
Erm yes..perhaps thy kundalini is overheating from thy moonwalk (it’s lunarcy!)
“Your Butt Is Mine
Gonna Take You Right..”
(That’s already a confession!)
Chorus (sing along)
Woo! Woo! Woo!
(And The Whole World Has
To Answer Right Now
Just To Tell You Once
Again . . .)
You Know I’m MAD, I’m Mad
Come On
(Mad Mad-Really, Really Mad)
You Know I’m Mad, I’m Mad-
You Know It-You Know It
(Sad Sad-Really, Really Sad)
You Know, You Know, You
Know, Come On
(Sad Sad-Really, Really Sad)
And The Whole World Has To
Answer Right Now
(And The Whole World Has To
Answer Right Now)
Just To Tell You
(Just To Tell You Once Again)
Who’s SAD
satyadeva says:
>> Michael Jackson a “bad boy”?
You’re joking, surely?!
While nobody took the situation seriously MJ was really really really bad …
Fresch says
“I estimate the correct number of active sanyasins is about 2000 in the whole world, at least less than 5000 ( that sounds too many for me actually)”.
That’s quite an encouraging figure. You don’t need too many flowers to spread the fragrance. Whether it is few flower or 100s of flowers, the whole garden will be filled with their magic. I am sure the fragrance is spreading across the world. Today is not what it was yesterday. Be positive.
How do you define an ‘active’ sannyasin? I’ve no idea what that means.
Batteries included?
I thought it was all about non-doing.
I would imagine that an ‘active’ sannyasin generally means someone who shouts and swears for at leastt ten minutes a day, followed by jumpig up and down for 10 minutes, and shoutng ‘hoo! ohoo!
hoo! and waiting for ‘estop!’
An active sannyasin will often use phrases like ‘far out’ and have a few photos of a bald-headed man with a beard in their home. Active sannyasins will often listen to tapes of music recorded many moons ago with songs such as ‘hes the the sun,hes the moon’, and mray like to wear orange clothes.
Some sanyasins may stop the ‘hooo! hoo!hoo! esrtop! phase, and may even reach the ‘satsang’ phase, but mayrr suffer from delusions of grandeur, where they feel very important and perhaps very ‘ mature’ however, they will still worship the bald head mat where they feel ve
Swami SS, thank you for the crystal clear definition of active sannyasin. Guess I’m not on most counts, except perhaps for having a photo of bald-headed wallah wearing a straw hat and sipping on a cup of tea in my kitchen along with a few other of my fave holy babas, Ramana, Poonjaji, Beedie Wallah etc.. I do listen to a lot of funk and house music, being an active DJ and all that, so I guess I must be a ‘radioactive’ ex-sannyasin of thirty-two years. Phew! What a relief.
Careful Lokesh, SS has ways to make you active whether you want it or not.
Parmartha, Tax planning is as ok as making money..As long as you are not putting innocent people to pay for it, so that you actually deliver the best you can for worth of money people are paying in exchange. So they do not have to feel betrayed, like many actually now do. And many, including my self do not want to be involved in that. Of course you can always say that people make that decision them selves. Like in stocks, you bay something and take the risk, perhaps it goes up or down.. But now I am talking more for small investors.. well, of course the karma of small investors is always to loose it…or you can go on and on..
I hate bureaucrats, bureaucracy and I am paying too much taxes. I have all these conflicts with authorities, like getting parking fines twice a month, perhaps for 2000, – a year, which is crazy, since I was really trying to be careful with parking my car. Also, I had to threaten my government partner’s (in my work) with the layer, because they were putting impossible rules on me. And a lot of more minor issues … until I really decide to get into their, brocades, heads, what is happening there. So, instead of trying to understand my self I really put lot energy to understand them, to become them.
So, after – or ongoing – all my antiauthority- and antibureaucracy trips for some reason they have started to co-operate with me. I will not go into details, but now I get suggestions from different byrocrates how things would work better for me. It’s amazing. And I am for the first time in my life getting something in return for taxes.
Many sanyasins try to avoid it or fight against it, like I was trying for decades, ending up in real mess. So, now I try to see if I play by the book and not despise these people and system, can I get more out of it. but not on some body’s else expense.
However there is a saying in my language – fucker of comma – and I do not want to become one. Also I do not like places where everything is by the book and every step is stalked by some overly eager pleaser army member.
Kavita, your post is really interesting and I would very much like to hear more about your experience..or even intepritations. I was in Poona too, when osho left and I heard all these stories..i was too young and spaced out to understand anything about it; paranoia was big and still I was just starting my journey. Only thing comes to my mind is echo as a solution for that humming. But I still think the whole episode was to clear the vibes for osho to leave. People were in shock and there for silent..
Lokesh, you know what I mean with numbers of; anybody involved. That number is incredible small.
Fresch I think most people ‘ are ‘ in shock & confused and therefore silent , maybe now existentially few are ready at least to talk about it , in hushed tones through / on this medium .
btw Fresch , is that your real name ?
Anand Newman!
Is this another creation of frank?
Is the sannyasnews, sex stories site, where it is accepted and expected that writers will chose some funny name?
Well an anagram for anand newman is…wanna man end.
Pretty big clue I’d say shants.
~ Ben Dover
Alfred E. Newman (of MAD fame)?
Kavita, i do not want to write with my name so that i will not start controlling.. Ask your friends to tell what happened, it will clear the air.
Fresch , my friend / friends are not internet savvy , to each their own , just like you don’t want to reveal your name , guess each one is a master piece !
Kavita, ask them to tell the happenings for you and then you can tel us:) names are not needed.
Fresch , are suggesting I change my name on SN or perhaps unconsciously want me to quit ?
Anyway let me tell you existentially I have a small nose , so in case in future one needs to pay tax for breathing according to size of the nose , I shall be paying the least !
Kavita, change your name for that story..i would love to hear all stories
Taxes are not popular, but not being part of society or against it is kind of teenage stuff.. Middleway..
Fresch , you sound like a toddler ! whichever way .
Kavita, dynamic helps you to find your inner toddler, too.. Or inner grandfather..
Fresch my dynamic days are over , Iam into simple & natural breathing these days !