Parmartha Reflects:
I have always been amazed at the number of fellow travellers who find doubt in Osho’s clear statement that being enlightened simply means he knew himself – not that he could or should know that his Secretary had put a bug in his room. Such confounding of an obvious truth has always seemed to me to come from those who do not live in the portals of common sense.
The relationship between Osho and Sheela his second secretary between 1981 and 1985 was not that of Sheela being a Chief Executive to Osho’s Chairmanship of the board – an analogy sometimes made. For his whole time in Rajneeshpuram Osho emphasised he was a guest of the commune, not someone intent on somehow heading up an alternative city.
I remember Sheela’s number two, Savita, who I knew personally a little, saying that when she said goodbye to Osho she could not understand why he said his enlightenment was infinitely more crucial than any creation of an alternative city. I knew immediately what he meant, but Savita nursed it as a wound, so somehow these guys were very attached to somehow making a mark “in the world”, with all the obvious accompanying melody of ambition, which always leads to a sort of mental instability.
Hence just as in the world of business (for example the Murdoch empire) when the role of Chairman and Chief Executive is conflated, much trouble follows as there are no checks and balances of power.
Of course it has been argued that Osho should have made a point of being aware of this, and setting up the foundations of the commune such that it did have such checks and balances. But was it “his” commune, well strictly speaking no, it was a place where he simply wanted to be a guest.
The other popular argument was that Sheela was a fall guy, and that Osho “knew” most of what was going on. But clearly he did not. As he succintly countered this argument on Australian TV at the time – I would have known about the bugs had that been the case.
There have been quite recent revelations about Sheela’s clear descent into a nervous breakdown whilst holding on to the trappings of power from 1982.
Madhuri who was a middle management sort of person on the Ranch records a “weird” afternoon she spent with two phone company executives and Sheela and entourage when she was a liasion person. This is a much shortened account below
“Sheela was giving a luncheon party for two representatives of the telephone company; a number of Ranchites were invited as well. I, as liaison, had to be there… ….
The poor duo from Outside were outnumbered, flanked, bitten – and they tried so hard to be cheerful and friendly! The whole weird afternoon… ….
Lunch was announced and we all went into the dining room. There must have been twenty of us. Sheela had gone back into her room for a bit and she now appeared at her door wearing a long white lace wedding dress. The middle finger of her right hand was elaborately bandaged in white as well; and, of course, it stuck straight up whenever she raised the hand. Which she did immediately, to show everyone and explain: “I was cleaning out a cupboard,” she said, “and a spider bit me. My finger got so big –.“ Her huge round eyes blinked – the heavy flat voice seeming to come from a glossy, cynical brown toad. “So it had to be bandaged.” She sat down at the long table, we all sat, and soup was placed before each diner. Sheela went on, “I’m wearing this dress because Jayananda and I are going to get married again. Last time we got married it was on an airplane. So we wanted to get married on the ground, too.” Jayananda, as ever giving nothing away, sat near her; he neither spoke nor nodded nor shook his head. His eyes held…what? Not nothing. But what sort of something was it? I could not fathom him at all.
You know that Filipina nurse Sheela kept near her? The one who dispensed pills from a sort of plastic lunchbox she always carried? Round face, pocked skin, always beaming? Disappeared without a trace when it was all over? Well, whatever pills she had given her patient to cope with the pain caused by the mighty spider’s mandibles, their effect was accelerating as we watched. Sheela went on discoursing, blinking those san-paku orbs, her small mouth in her broad face slackening, her fuck-you finger on the table, pointing at whoever. She was, quite frankly, maundering, with sentimental slurrings coming in amongst the matter-of-fact words. Then she toppled forward into her soup.
The table held its breath and scraped its chairs back. The phone company guys, I saw with a quick glance, were in shock, and still trying to put a brave face on it. Someone helped Sheela sit upright and mopped her off. As I remember it, another pill was administered – presumably to wake her up. It worked; some dreadful eternity later we were all gathered in her bedroom, phone guys included, and many more Moms arrived to crowd in and watch the ceremony. Sheela and Jay stood near their bed while someone – I don’t remember who – married them again. The bandage really did look fetching with the dress, in lieu of a posy. Many gifts were given and unwrapped – they all seemed to be large enameled or pottery plates – and then the bride subsided again.
At last the afternoon was over and it was time to get ready for the evening; the Oregonians were allowed to escape, and they drove off in their jeep. I do not know what tales they told their wives that night. Whatever it was, I had no part in it, despite my title – in my coral PR suit, there was nothing I knew to say to them of business, nothing I could say to explain to them what had happened to them; no way to comfort them, or myself.”
Clearly Sheela had descended into a Lear like insanity. Okay it was difficult for communards who knew this. But all the same they really needed to have taken responsibility and somehow address the issue. Fear somehow destroyed their need to become mature, and risk “having to leave the commune”. But it was an option…..
Have often pondered on the effect Osho had on us with what he did not say, all that he allowed, all that he encouraged, that we had learned to not do for fear of punishment, disapproval; when growing up.
The first generation of sannyassins came from broadly authoritarian back grounds, where everything was frowned upon.
He never disapproved essentially of anything. He actively encouraged us to behave in ways that we had been taught were morally wrong.
He must have had some broad understanding of what he was unleashing, and I am convinced expected to and did, and does, as it were; respond to those events in the moment, as unfolding happened, and then those responses, verbal, events, became part of the treasury of devices, and koans which are still at work, and will go on working on future generations.
He knew what we were capable of, as devils as it were; and evolvednesses.
He was, is entirely consistent. He encouraged us to go into everything we had bottled up. All the things a Christian culture condemns. (Everything. ) Liberal lefty culture disapproved of. What else was going to happen? How else were we going to grow up?
I don’t mean this as a definitive statement. A few words only. Some notions.
If man or woman cannot ever contradict, challenge, condemn, mock , sabotage or insult their own ‘guru’, either face to face when alive or especially twenty years after the event, then enlightenment whenever it comes to their own good self will be as nice and reverential and homely and as utterly beneficial as all the wonderful poetic legacies of ascended masters have been to humanity in preventing or redeeming suffering through reverence of their plentifully humourless contribution….ie not a lot …
(ok, luckily Osh was pretty good in that last category which makes him really stand out from the crowd )
however …(you knew it was coming eh ?)
if we crave the memory of osho and all the benefit of the meditations and insights and ability to be oneself allied to everything we hold spiritually dear…then living life to the full and burning the gods as we go, to the sound of a roaring crackling fire and a roaring crackling laugh will quite possibly not be very useful to us as an approach or metaphor….perhaps it would create too much insecurity
Can we delight in the pointlessness of it all… what i suffered for no good reason . WHAT WHHHAAAAT ???
…..all the history of the world proves how we’d like things to last forever, family, friends,religious truths, words, notions of the absolute…. thing is they don’t.. and neither do we…..
if you can’t guarantee to take it with you when you go….then its definitely gonna go…hanging on to the serious absolutism of O and any formulaic guarantee of his well intentioned ‘teaching’ is understandable but only as a clutching replacement for the insecurity that the bigger life is deservedly famous for creating….
in conclusion, i don’t need to absolve O of having cocked it up by saying he showed me a lesson by inversion….
but he as a mortal bloke was as capable of cocking it up as you or me do…and he did…no probs there ….but facts are facts.
I never liked his ways of imposing so called ‘change’, never liked Pune et al if the truth be known and even less on historical reflection…thoug as I’ve said before institutional sannyas was better than the conforming betrayal of society’s social democratic pragmatism, but not a lot…
one’s own Life does all that inverted ‘told you so but you wouldn’t listen’ lesson learning stuff anyway… really the cock ups are utterly unavoidable.. in fact our unique take on them shows us just what matters to us whether its naivety, justice, freedom from morbid emotions etc etc .. we are all marked by degrees of these termites, through experience….and a Guru relationship is another one of those lessons some of us were helpless to avoid…..in a nice way too..
and..was the good stuff worth it ? I’ll leave everyone to be the judge of that for themselves….but unlike therapeutically hierarchical guru driven linguistic minefields of meaning driven commues i won’t shove it down anyone’s throat to redeem them of unawareness…in preparation for the effulgent light….
and if anyone is in any doubt of the model of confused sincere meaning driven communes for improving one’s self esteem just give Veeresh and the Leela centre or Arun in The Himalayas a call , or the Afroz Goat eating therapy Centre in Greece or the Miasto family of glitterati or the Vancouver Millionaires Osho jacuzzi bath liberationists….Ask them do they do inverted teaching lessons based on ‘if we fuck it up, its your fault, type trainings?’
The line might go dead, but ring back.. its always good to talk…
Sannyas, us, enlightenment driven communes, expensive liberation trainings and Osho and his memory are and will remain forever different things..its good to know what each is capable of rendering without being …(how can i say this without causing mischief…) an iconoclastic robe wearing b***shi*ter, who should better instead watch their back and practise getting out of tricky situations pronto whilst carrying their copy of ‘Teach yourself Getting through life easily whilst healing quickly from your parental genetic inheritance accident , without mentioning growthful awareness of the knowing seeing being, too often ‘
the rest is icing on the cake, if it happens at all…I for one am glad I tried….it was all of my adult relationship life and gave me a few excellent intimacies and the capacity and language for that…. but, and i don’t know if this is generically true of sannyas.. my interest thinned over the years as with my hair..and like my hair it wasn’t obviously replaced by anything as epic…. and thats just fine….in fact i’m expecting that like a good Whine , I get better with age…..
Your a perfectionist mate.
You are never going to be fulfilled.
Father Murphy is explaining the meaning of faith to his congregation.
“In the front row,” he says, “we have Paddy and Maureen and their five children. Maureen knows they
are her children — that is knowledge. Paddy believes they are his children — that is faith.”
One defence I have heard argued for Sheela’s “behaviour” was that Osho was working on her, but that when you get that close to a Master, and are not ready, you get burned…. you go mad….
I also heard quite a few sannyasins say or argue when the (fairly closed) communes were formed around 1981 that that was the only place to be. In the heart of the fire, being actually in Osho’s Buddhafield one would expect that the ego would be burnt out of you….
Like you Arpana, just observations, nothing definitive… but worth putting in the mix.
He once said those who were in the front row couldn’t swim, and those in the back row could.
BELOVED OSHO,
WHY AM I NOT IN THE FRONT ROW?
Anand Anado, before I answer your question, there is another question also which will make your
question complete.
BELOVED OSHO,
WHY AM I IN THE FRONT ROW?
Mukesh Bharti…
A Lufthansa airliner had to make an emergency landing at sea. The captain assured the passengers that they
would be picked up shortly and that the plane would remain afloat for at least thirty minutes. After twenty
minutes had passed no rescue boats had arrived, and the captain announced, “Everybody who can swim, get
on the left wing. And everybody who can’t swim get on the right wing. Now for the people on the left wing
– when the water gets to your knees, start swimming. And for the people on the right wing — thank you for
flying Lufthansa.”
Anado and Mukesh Bharti, those who are in the front row are the people who cannot swim, and those
who are not in the front row are the people who can swim. Okay?
Osho
Satyam Shivam Sundram
Chapter #20
Chapter title: The radiation of enlightenment
An interesting piece from Parmartha. However, I find the idea that Osho was merely a ‘guest’ at the commune to be too facile. He was everyone’s guru, master, and ‘supernatural aid’, to use Joe Campbell’s term. He was no incidental guest. He was the reason for being of the commune.
As for Sheela’s ‘nervous breakdown’, I think that’s a given. Clearly she went mad. The madness was barely detected, however, because the prevailing mindset of the commune was that authority was not to be questioned. That was, of course, a sad irony in the face of Osho’s own fiercely rebellious character.
Thanks Teertha. I understand your point.
However Osho himself certainly behaved like a refined guest. He never visited any of the commune depts, and would have not known the tool shop where I worked, from any other dept. He never visited the truck farm or the lakes, or enjoyed the Ranch in the way that many of us did. He never came to the restaurant or had a look at our accommodations, etc.
Once in 1985, I think maybe after Sheela left, he came to the disco to dance, but for 10 minutes, and later said he hated it cos there was so much smoke….
So he certainly was not “interested” in the way that word is usually used in “his” commune. I have always thought this was because he himself never thought of it as “his” commune.
Agreed Parmartha, Osho never came by to check out my dish-washing in the cantene either.
His visits were usually limited to this:
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BTW, stumbled upon this very short clip of Osho speaking in 1973, Bombay. Fascinating:
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And I found this three-stage video
Stage one :
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The master plays chess
Stage Two: the master goes boating on the lake with some friends
Stage Three: master dresses up like arab
‘that authority was not to be questioned. ‘
That was in place for most of us before we took sannyas surely; and had to be raised to the surface and transcended, which happened for a fair number of Osho’s people. Events at the ranch more than played a part in that, or that time did.
Parmartha by the looks of it . . it seems secretaries have been indigenous to his work & his people too in some way
The SN moderators have allowed your post but it is not at all clear what you mean.
I thought that Laxmi (1971 to 80) was a very good CE/Secretary. She hardly had a personal life and gave everything as far as I can see to serve Osho and his work. One mystery worth exploring is how Sheela replaced her….
I simply feel . . all secretaries of his caravan from Kranti , Yoga Chinmaya , Laxmi , Sheela , Neelam to Anando & his sanyasins , family , lovers . . he knew all along what he was into
I have met many sannyassins and they always share about their experience with his Laxmi as the best secretary . . ( I cant speak much as I was not around ) . . I came during Neelam’s reign as she was the secretary for Indians when I came to Poona but for me it was always really strange that in Osho’s Ashram there existed Indian & Rest of the world (mainly western ) groups as I never came here to be part of any group
There is this series of videos which is shared by Rajeev last night on facebook :
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this seems to be an old recording . . maybe some of you would like to watch it
The people who wave to passing by kings and queens, crown princes and their wives will never ever come to know, what it means Palace Politics….
Do disciples of any guru can ever imagine that people around him also produce pee and shit..this is another fact, only once in a while, they forget to flush!
A sort of poetic ring to your post Shantam…. being closely involved with a Master, as some of these guys were, … I figure you have to be ready in some way which may not be obvious. A good question is what of the judgement of these “Masters’? Should they be more careful in those they allow to be around them, or trust that existence washes up those who are indeed ready?
Most Sufi orders are pretty careful about admission to their orders, but who knows, maybe they bar the real rebel, or he who listens to the beat of his own drummer?
With Sheela I always felt this was some kind of family appointment, her father was related to Osho and a close friend…. I saw her father a few times in Oregon, but he looked so lost…. clearly Sheela herself was not ready for the fire though she was very ambitious to be in it.
Nothing definitive here, just as Arpana might say, musings.
Parmartha,
Interesting point about Sheela’s father. Did he go back to India? Did he remain a sannyasin? Does anyone know?
No Roman, dont know much. I know he went back to India. If he is still alive he would now be quite old. I dont think he had anything to do with Osho after 1985.
I also would be interested.
Roman
Overnight I have been reminded of the so-called Session 29 of the first addition of Glimpses of a Golden Childhood.(1984). This session was expunged in later editions. Devageet says it was added by Sheela, and with the implication it was ghosted. Who is to say? I have written about it elsewhere on sannyasnews some time ago.
In that session of which I kept a copy there is full mention of someone called Ambalal Patel, who was a friend of Osho’s father. Osho called him Babuji, as he is supposed to have become Osho’s godfather, and looked after him for 3 years before he was seven in a beautiful house near Juhu Beach in Bombay. At the time he was unmarried. According to Session 29 (first edition) after Osho began to live with him he took a wife.
He had four daughters, the youngest was … Ma Anand Sheela…
Babuji’s sannyas name was Swami Swarupananda Bharti.
All the above may be fictional, Devageet seems to imply this. Some Indian sannyains may know the truth and maybe Kavita or Shantam could ask around within the Indian sannyas community.
I do have a distant memory that Sheela’s father was called Babuji on the Ranch. As I say the few times I saw him he looked really quite lost.
As for what happened to him, and what happened to him after the Ranch Shantam or Kavita might also be our best leads.
Frankly Parmartha Iam not interested in Sheela’s father’s whereabouts . . . so count me out for any leads
Kavita, thanks for the recordings. We weren’t told why Osho’s room was bugged. Did he ask her to do it? Well one would be cracking up if one wasn’t up cracking ( not taking it all too literally and maintaining some humour ).
roman . . for me Sheela episode is a love story that turned out to be a horror movie . . . I guess the end was quite inevitable in one way or the other
my all time favourite is Colleen McCullough’s ‘ Thorn birds ‘ its exposed the reality of christianity / it could be any instuitionalized religion
Parmartha, you’ve reminded me of a lot here.
I had a first edition. Interesting that Devageet implies it was fictional yet the truth can be stranger than fiction. Another case for Sherlock.
Parmartha, It seems you have an unending fascination with Sheela, and it is not difficult to understand. As it seems, you were young, almost early thirties during that Osho phase of 1984-85.
The end of Rajneeshpuram must have left you heart broken and also a big hole in your financial position, so much so, that you could not make to Pune 2, the final and refined phase of Osho’s work.
Why don’t you write some musings about your Pre and post Puram phase. For example, how it was feeling to be back in the ambitious and “non Meditative” world, to go through the job search etc. or using some family inheritance to stand on your own feet. After all it is the Family who comes to the rescue,when one is on the verge of down and out and not some commune, The Sangha of New age spiritualists!
You remind me of a guy I knew in the UK. He could have taken sannyas at the same time as Parmartha, but didn’t have the courage. He could have taken sannyas when I did, but didn’t have the courage. He could have taken sannyas during the ranch time, but didn’t have the courage. He is as critical of older sannyassins and Amrito etc. as you are.
However he did finally find the guts to take sannyas, after we stopped wearing the mala and red clothes, and his pomposity, self importance, knowingness and intolerance of those who had put themselves on the line so visibly before he finally found some pluck, became even more egregious.
Sorry to disappoint Shantam. No my great, great and maybe great grandfather was quite a famous English Victorian detective, hence it’s in my bones to be one.
I have never felt the period from 1980 to 1985 has been absolutely fully explained, so it’s a kind of hobby with me !
the butler did it…..
now can we purleeesse move on…otherwise lets rename sannyasnews The Tardis….. but only travelling backwards through time….cue theme music….
‘I say its Doctor Whom-artha….where are we Doctor?’
”We are in 1985 .. we will always be in 1985..its called letting go with The Master”
‘Ah yes of course Doctor ,…letting go by… standing still how sublimely paradoxical..I should have realised how good of you to correct me….and excuse me .. what IS that thing , Doctor Whom-artha ?
”That, my time travelling friend is an English Cricket bat..it helps to wack googlies over the stump ”
…..’I wish I’d never asked’
Parmartha,
Thanks for introducing this thoughtful thread. The psychiatrist James Gordon ( author of ‘The Golden Guru’ ) interviewed Osho for The New Yorker after Sheela and her group left the ranch. Here is an extract from that interview taken from ‘Osho-Autobiography of a Spiritually Incorrect Mystic’ edited by Sarito Carol Nieman. Interestingly the publisher is St.Martin’s Press, who now publish Osho books, but originally published Milne’s ‘The God that Failed’, which is now out of print. Gordon is obviously asking the questions and Osho is providing the answers.
Q: In my meeting Sheela, certainly one could see her intelligence at
least in very practical matters, in her cleverness about things, but
you could also see the very oppressive side, the very mean-spirited
side as well.You must have seen that being contact with her every day?
A: I know! But it was needed for all those mean politicians all around.
I could not put the commune in the hands of some innocent people – the
politicians would have destroyed it.
Q: But you didn’t see what she was doing on the ranch itself?
A: No, because I was never coming out and never meeting anybody…
Q: But if you’re creating such a big experiment (as the commune in Oregon),
don’t you think it would have been helpful to have had at least one other
person coming to talk to you?
A: No. The experiment means nothing compared to my silence. I am
teaching everybody to be an individual and depend on his own insight.
And if he feels that he is being forced to do something that he does not
want to do, he is perfectly capable of revolting against it. There is no
need to submit – and many people left.
Now there will be a totally different atmosphere – but looking at the
world, whatever happened, although it was not good, only bad people
could have managed it. Good people could not.
Q: Over the last year I thought to myself, When is he either going to get rid
of Sheela or turn things around? And I felt like maybe you were just
letting her go and do things.
A: I will do something only when I feel it is time. When I saw the point
had come to do something I did it.
Q: How did you know the point had come to do something?
A: When her group poisoned my physician. That was the point when I
started asking my physician and caretaker about things, and I declared
that I was going to speak and meet with people. The information started
coming by and by, and I started exposing Sheela and her group. Then I
informed the government, the police, The FBI – they are all here, but they
are doing almost nothing. We have given them every proof – and they go
on saying, ‘We don’t have any solid proof.’ I don’t understand what
solid proof they want – do they want the person, caught red-handed?
Q: Why did you wait nine months or so?
A: It was needed, because she was fighting so many legal cases – I did not
want to disturb things in the middle. I wanted things to come to a
conclusion from where a new group could start. And this was the time,
when many cases are finished and the new cases will start almost eight
months later, so those new people within eight months will be perfectly
prepared to take over. And they will be able to fight – there is no
problem.
Q: You play a very risky game.
A: Certainly! I am a risky person. And it is a game – I know the right timings.
I am just a referee, nothing more.
That was the point I was trying to make, probably badly.
That seems entirely reasonable.
I wait for the right time to act, when difficulties occur in life.
Happens by itself. Begin to get a feeling of something not right, watch, wait. Yes. Wait. Action happens. Hell breaks loose. Hang on in their. Difficulty begins to resolve.
Strategy. Act to soon. Make things worse. Wait to long. Slide downhill.
Thanks for that, Roman. I dont actually think that much of Osho’s answers here.
Sheela “left the commune”, as was the perogative of any commune member, she was never dismissed by Osho or anyone else.
Also Sheela made a real mess of dealing with the politicians of the local communities, and in the end committed crimes against them. Mean spirited or not, the best person to deal with a politician is a politician – not a maniacal housewife shouting at them. Her behaviour actually sealed the fate of the commune. Handled in a different way it might well have survived, but guess that just wasn’t existence’s wish.
Parmartha Swam.
Do we not tend to read his words, at times, regularly, (Note I say we, not you) as if he used them the way we do, in a way that’s to do with ego us. Nothing he says is about him, its always about the other. Most of what we say is about us, not about the other.
(To whom it may concern.
You know who you are.
This is merely my viewpoint, a viewpoint that I would not have come to if I had not meditated and been exposed to Osho and so much of what he has to say.
No research has been done and it is not possible to say it is a proven fact. )
Arpana,
Thanks for these insightful remarks. We have all quibbled about comments Osho has made at some time. I posted the interview because I also had mixed feelings about Osho’s replies. Still, Osho must have impressed James Gordon, because James turned up again in Poona 2 and found himself dancing in the ashram. And yes, James did go on to work for Bill Clinton.
Yes perhaps I should have said Arpana that “on the face of it” Osho’s answers did not impress me on this occasion, though they did on countless other occasions! Guess it is partly about who he is talking to at the time.
I think that James Gordon’s questions themselves were quite good. In particular why Osho, or in fact no-one else failed to act when it became clear 8 months before Sheela left, that one of Sheela’s hencwomen had made a serious attempt to murder Devaraj. (Amrito), Osho’s personal physician.
I have always been surprised that Amrito himself never wrote about this, or this period in his life, which, whatever else one thinks, must have been really difficult for him in every respect.
I have always held back about difficulties I’ve been through over the years, because rightly or wrongly I revere Osho, and no amount of abuse or sneering from other people seems to rock that. (I’m fucking filling up. ) Wet as it may sound I don’t want to do, or say anything to cast even the tiniest shadow on him, on his efforts on our behalf. (Have loosened up about what constitutes shadow. )
Nobody has ever occupied such a role in my life. He doesn’t go away and I’ve grown n up a bit and feel him closer to friend than parent figure. He adopts us and re-parents us.
I trust his intentions absolutely, even if what is going on is hard to handle. ( Plants need good and bad weather to grow. )
I wasnt correcting you. Just chucking a viewpoint into the bubbling wash tub that is Sannyas News.
I on the other hand,( which i always keep free in case of a need for a-musing light relief), swing both ways with my sentiments on Osho, and it matters not in the slightest which hand I choose.. I still get pleasure from my thoughts, about him…
arpana .. as long as you don’t need my support for your version of unflinching oshoified reality (yours), I wont ask you for yours in mine….(mine)
(mine : which is actually fluid and bears little resemblance to your own ,or others’ in the same vein, stated approach )
and I never have asked that if you notice my posts to anyone… though I do go on about how others wanted me to maintain theirs in every possible way.. hence organised religion on the back of liberation…
Okdokey ? or do you need a precis and more validation ?
You are turning into a parody of yourself.
Martyn.
From all that you’ve said here, you were a doormat when you were involved with the sannyas world.
I gave as good as I got doing groups, and was never a bully, and when I started working at the ashram, after a brief spell of acting surrendered, an obnoxious Ma gobbed of at me once to often, and I said to myself, ‘fuck this, I’m not putting up with this’, and I never have since.
I give as good as I get eventually, and try to avoid crossing the line into being a bully, (A line you, having been a doormat, cross regularly) so although I’ve had my disappointments and hard times, I am not nursing a grievance in the way you are.
My other difficulty with you is that you are not the first person I have ever met who has an absolute embargo on the truth, and I do admit I may be wrong, but unfortunately, I’ve never worked out a way to tell which of all you people who have the absolute truth, and none of you agree with each other, I should follow.
I recall once in the early eighties being called a disgusting pagan by a Christian. A religious scumbag bag by a lefty. A fascist by a lefty . A lefty by a Tory.
Parmartha,
I do love Sherlock Holmes and I thought the same thing about the eight months.
In the second chapter of WHAT MATTERS MOST: LIVING A MORE CONSIDERED LIFE, and in his lectures related to this book, author and Jungian analyst James Hollis addresses the difficulties of living with ambiguity and suggests that one of the marks of a mature person is the ability to tolerate ambiguity. The demand for certainty is the ego’s demand, and Jim calls the ego a “Nervous Nellie” that insists that life square up with its ideas and be predictable, safe and familiar. The ego’s need is for the status quo to stay stable, a need that can keep a person in constant anxiety simply because so much of life is uncertain and unpredictable.
Arpana,
Thanks again.
Betwixt and Between. Wonderful word Liminality.
‘Midway this way of life we’re bound upon,
I woke to find myself in a dark wood,
Where the right road was wholly lost and gone.
Dante
Doesn’t anyone get the point yet that if sabotage by sheela was possible, then the version of sanctimonious guru worship is going to rip your balls off without it being anything about living love well.
If it can fuck up so craply , right under Osho’s nose…then he won’t give a toss..but you just might..and that dear friends is what will f##k yoou over in all of your presumptions about fellow sannyasins…lathering about letting go won’t get you anywhere…closer to osh or able to build a commune of dependable accountable trustable fellows…bloody fantasists who disrespect their own right to be human first…
People, myself included, post here, whose values, at the bare minimum, are, at the least as valid as yours.
Arpana….
and ….. i’m not trying to conduct yours or anyone else’s religion through acquiescence or salvationist rhetoric either,(like corporal communesque bludgeoning techniques, borrowed from UK boys public schools except there’s no detention just collective disapproval)…how about you ? are you at the very least collusive in being incapable of saying Boo to a Ghost ? (you know those things you think you see but aren’t really there after you look with a torch or a shining light after 20 years ?)
the litmus test of transparency being sincere, well aimed, refined ,astute, spiritual …..satire ….. (it’s in the Blue Peter book of handy things to do with an empty corn flakes packet and some glue…Page 241 of their Bumper Fun Annual)
as always I found that is something religionists, therapists , centre leaders,so called -lovers, proto disciples, couldn’t bear was taking the piss in a crisis.(I learnt well from my master) and the British Army in the trenches (‘Hello Fritz’ , chortle)….and its a good litmus test of both ways transparency, but you have to be good at it or it doesn’t work…(takes a lifetime of serious study)…. no never got an approval rating for that until.. … towards the end of my corporate sanfascism tenure when I let rip….
gosh guess what ….my old and new friends approved .. especialoly the ones who had seen manipulative ambitious mindf**ers get away with shite for years , whilst using others to sponsor their huge corporate, bloated , effete unaddressaballs personalities….all borrowed with strap on wings by mouthing OH SHOWWWW…..
and now for this weeks Countdown conundrum*
TRUSTMEIMASANNYASIN
(Tick tock tick tock..
dadadad dadadadada buoummm.)
..*this last joke was sponsored by UK television and refuses to translate into any other language even with Google translate)
Precis this and I’ll try and answer.
Cant make head or tail etc.
This is an automated message from my virtual secretary.
‘PM is out of the office right now and even if he could make a precis , he would have to be in the mood, which he isn’t.
Thank you for writing in and we hope it doesn’t cause you any sleeplessness.If you would like to be removed from the list of people who have trouble understanding his posts please do not reply to this email.Just click on the link and make yourself a nice re-assuring drink .
alcumsoutinthewash@lovemelovemyguru.com
Arpana…I’m just ‘happy’ you now can act in accordance with the red line …..and whatever you surmise of another by their evidence and your conclusion….i’m glad to be of service in the name of all things Osho…
bless
Now if you were discussing something other than your self interest i might give a shilling for your thoughts… but it isn’t … and i don’t…
Translate into English please.
?, thanks.
the trouble is in vision building otherwise known as politics….and not giving a toss about the consequences (to you or others)… either in your personal life ..ie Love and relationship.. or in gurudom…aka: Love of the abstract through perception….
the moment we as mortals give a toss, we are in the reality
the moment a guru wants to build a vision, he doesn’t give a toss and is not in the game….
we however still have ourselves, our consciences, our lives (and others’) to live with
whereas the guru has been shown the door
we care about the score most of the time
he never did (well not from the age of 13 and 100 ft bridge jumping into rivers then via age 21 enlightenment)
He’s an example.. just plot your own graph though and don’t offer strict advice based on his or your own life (mine too)…and if you do use a get out clause like ‘its just a game…’ (snigger)
(ps you all know James Gordon was in Clintons Cabinet as under-health secretary as i remember )
osho was a human being first and a guru.. second… let that penetrate as deeply as possible….so that you become fully accountably limitedly human first
if you want to venerate tactics,(yours or a guru’s) then try motives and agenda and investment transparency….
it’s where a lot of shit hits fans…
I wonder why none of the old timers ever think that in between all enlightend Master and ambitious Sheela, there were dozens of equally powerful players, who were trying their best to please the Sugar daddy by sabotaging the others in the lane..
Just imagine their are no feeding bottels and yet human mothers give birth to as many children as pig mothers. Surely their will be a civil war among the kids for the territorial rights around only those two breasts.
Almost similar situation happens around the Spiritual master, when disciples get this notion to be closer to Him is to be closer to the divine..
Power and the survival will remain dominant factors, and there is harm about it. Wonder is to see those indulging in the Ego survival tactics, who are on the voyage to be free from the ego..
Falling in love with enemy is also a human trait.
So when , and by who, was the research carried out that supports this proven fact.
Beloved Parmartha,
LOVE.
I have a video/DVD titled “The Man Who Came to Visit” about Osho’s visit to RBG and Pythoagoras, for your information.
Also, in KP’s book, “Osho, India and Me,” he details how Sheela manipulated department heads to support her to become Osho’s secretary and replace Laxmi.
Love,
Dhanyam
Thanks Dhanyam for the information. Yes I also saw a short video once of Osho visiting Antelope, with Sheela as I remember.
My main point was, and still is that Osho saw his sojourn on the Ranch as a “guest”. He said so many times, and it appeared to me that he was disinterested in the wider commune, though I freely admit he did visit a few places around and about once or twice, but never the Truck Farm and Magdalana, which were crucial for commune life.
Yes I had read about Sheela’s manipulations in her reach for power from KP’s book. But not sure why Osho would have “appointed” her, except that he may have thought that if we were going to America we would need someone who had lived there previously, as Sheela had done.
I found it amusing that the recent movie from Sheela was partnered with Shiva (Hugh Milne). She gave him such a hard time as soon as they transferred to the States in 1981, that he certainly left the commune in my view because of the way she treated him…. I see that was not explored in the movie!
Rajneeshpuram is that past which is dead and buried for ever and wonder is most of the articles on this site are dedicated to that phase. Surely sannyasins can feel the joy of martyrdom, as the final bullet was fired by the hostile enemy.
I wonder why my esteemed colleagues on this site and somewhere else don’t write analytical articles about the slow bleeding death of Osho’s vision in Pune and all around the world. Just because bleeding is caused by the friendly firing does not mean one should ignore the present reality.
I wish to write an epilogue for Rajneeshpuram; who knows its end was a divine prudence, after all Osho was going to leave the body sooner or later. Think about the power struggle in a territory thousands of times bigger than Osho, Pune. Emotional and financial investment also thousands of times and add the presence of light weapons too.
I have not added those sexual harrasment cases(False and real) against Swamis before American jury, which were sooner or later bound to pop up!
ahemm ….because Osho once said (yes its a realtime quote folks !) that ‘he couldn’t care less what happened after his death…because if any of it was worth it , then his fellow travellers would take care of it/him/ the awareness/the rebellion/love /and the rest /implicitly, ( because it’s not a thing, its just you..so as you can’t stop or start YOU then just carry on as usual…and he ,Osho, trusts life….cheerio and thanks for the ride)…
and if you look at what we are saying about Rpuram it’s about the models of human corporate behaviour and their origins, it’s not about the past as an event but as an example of what your brave mind is capable of..or should i say , and you’ll like this one, me old sea-sikh-Shanty , those self justifying porky pies (london cockney rhyming slang for …lies) that cause indigestion even in the search for truth.
Such a tragedy. If only you’d been there. Everything would have been as perfect as it will be when you oust, I mean fulfil your ambitions, spiritual of course, for Osho’s work and take over from Amrito.
shantam
if it’s of any use for you to know..(stop there.. here’s a clue : it isn’t ! ) I much more support Amrito (gulp i think i’ve just blasphemed) than anything you’ve ever said or thought… and if ever there was a risk of anything you said on Pune becoming remotely likely then i would hope that whatever you wish for would be refused by the genie of the lamp , as he could only make wishes come true and yours hadn’t even practised credibility, let alone been exposed to anything remotely like truth since you started blogging, so he was going back into the bottle until you actually strung some legally credible rationality together to reveal convincing evidence about yourself for him to believe…..
the idea that you here on SN has consensus over anything you call osho is as removed from my radar as your ability to stop being an unimaginative verbal drone..
but hey now lokesh frank oshobob and pennie won’t post anymore… at least you’re good target practice…..
From a discussion board I use.
Re: The Unconscious/layers of mind or consciousness
Which brings to mind something regarding the subconscious or personal
unconscious. There is something referred to as the “critical factor”. Although
the subconscious can easily be programmed to believe almost anything, the
subconscious will reject it if it does not correlate to previous information
taken in. In other words ..even if I used hypnosis, I could not convince anyone
here that we now know that 2 plus 2 equals six. No one would ever believe this.
Few if any would even be willing to contemplate it. We might trick a susceptible
subconscious to accept this for perhaps up to three days, but the critical
factor would come forward and reject it.
In turn, anyone who firmly has their mind made up around anything they think is
true will often find a way to reject anything that doesn’t mesh with what they
think they know to be true. A person with a strong “critical factor” will
immediately react to new information. It takes a very open mind or a blast of
lightning to get through this “critical factor”. This is one reason why people
age. They live with endless assumptions and false beliefs. When you stop taking
in new material, that’s when things start to harden…;O)
It would be hard for any of us to spend much time contemplating the new formula
for 2 plus 2, but math is a perfect science..not much else..nothing else is..so
everything is still only theory and assumption even if it’s based on physical
studies. This topic is wide open for discussion if people are open to in and
interested. It’s irrelevant to claim this or that is false. Maybe if someone
says false or wrong the reply should be “prove it”.
Rima
This year the EurovOshon Song contest will be featuring songs that we hold dear in our religious memory.
Last Years winners the Azebaijani Baku Osho Complimentary Health and Oil Refinery Centre singers will be singing that charming tear jerker
There’s no h’Armenia saying you don’t exist..
From Germany we have the side splitting comedy fun songsters
Nink and Poop..
Singing their laugh-a-minute medley of famous Beer Kellar Osho oompah favourites…
including their chart busting
Osho-Poomp Osho-Pah ,
Osho Poomp und Pah, … Ja…, hooray.!
From France the latest entry has suffered recent unexpected back room arguments over the idea , the meaning, the song title, who will sing it , for how long, in what dress , and who said so.
The Song has a provisional title of
If you think Osho is more important than me , You’d better do your sums again, amour.
From Ireland we have the Skibereen Dunworkin Osho Unemployed Mortgage arrears Claimants Collective singing and river dancing their way into mass hysterical celebration ..
The tune they will perform is called
Sweet Holy Osho , Mother of Our Lord…
From Israel we have the Ineffectual Osho Meditators for Palestinian Liberation..
They will be singing their family favourite tune of solidarity and land occupation called
Osho fished men like Jesus , so why not try to net in a yahoo…..
“Hay Swami, Look around that idiot Banana seller before the German Bakery crossing is also here in the heaven. I wonder what kind of people are admitted in heaven. I don’t think he has ever done any meditation, what to say about intense groups and silent retreats.”
Swami looks around and utters, ” I must speak with the trustees of heaven. if such kind of people are also admitted, soon it will look like UK. How come this man is here, he does not even know how to register himself at facebook”.
Good Idea Swami, my support you have. These UK guys are realy hard stuff. Not that the Swami soon pays 20 £ entry fee, 10 £ for the “Sente Bale Trust” of Harry, “argh”.
Intermission time – consider this a cartoon between features when you stretch your legs and visit the bathroom or the snack bar. There is a Facebook page called ‘No-Facebook’ – a clever name for a discussion group dedicated to ‘having no head’ – after the book by Douglas Harding, ‘On Having No Head’. I joined some time ago ( for research purposes… ) but am just lurking. Tried to cut and paste some comments here but no luck – and possibly illegal. It started when a member innocently posted an Osho quote and then all hell broke loose. Ninety posts followed in quick succession. Some called him Asso. Others found this very amusing and said it was an apt name. A couple admitted to being ex-sannyasins. What they said was interesting. Being at the ranch. Learning ‘never to give their power away again’. One post stated adamantly that ‘Asso’ stole all his ideas from Krishnamurti… and was fond of Goebbels. Some discussion on Osho’s discourse on Nisagardatta and how he ‘got it wrong’. Another was aghast at his ’13′ rolls royces, only to be corrected by an ex, who explained that, actually, there was meant to be 365. Words like ‘Fake’, ‘Imposter’, etc etc. One of the final posts simply said ‘Asso!’ I almost posted but thought it best to remain silent. Just wanted to share this – as they say on FB ; )
Rajni,
That’s a lot of posts in quick succession and a lot of vitriol being expressed. The poor dears!
I think it was a sannyasin who got me unto Harding years ago.
Rajni,
Unto, into, onto! What the heck!
‘Fake, imposter’. Talk about chocolate laxettes and decaffeinated coffee. Seekers wanting the ‘real thing’ and being swindled.
Perhaps it isn’t a choice of the blue or red pill? We need a third pill.
Trust in Osho; but don’t bitch about
him when your car gets stolen because
you forgot to to lock the damn door.
Arpana – your words or something similar were the ones I was going to post on that No Facebook page. I meant no offence by ‘sharing’ its latest postings. I merely thought sannyasnews posters may find it of interest. That a bunch of people ‘without heads’ are talking so much and getting so wound up at the mere mention of Osho. Apologies if people have misread my intent. Best for me to remain silent
Just to be clear here – and then I’ll be silent – the words that started those rabid postings on that No- Head site were these:
“I am not interested in communicating something to you,
I am interested in communion.
Communication means my mind talking to your mind.
Communion means I am not a mind,
you are not a mind –
… just your heart melting into my heart,
no words.”
Rajni,
The unfathonable abyss of silence. Nice when it happens. Must thank Osho for that one.
I’m not sure why your apologising Rajni.
Your post are always interesting.
(^o^)y
I have always been amazed at the number of fellow travellers who find doubt in Osho’s clear statement that being enlightened simply means he knew himself – not that he could or should know that his Secretary had put a bug in his room. Such confounding of an obvious truth has always seemed to me to come from those who do not live in the portals of common sense.
These opening sentences of Parmartha are as relevant today as they were during the times of Rajneeshpuram.
There are still few people who try to defend the regime in Pune by saying, ” How come Jayesh be wrong.Was he not chosen by Osho himself?
Being the participant of Rajneeshpuram era, I would like to request Parmartha to use his investigative skills and tell us a bit,” How come Jayesh simply got this much prominance in few days time to get the opportunity to be hand cuffed with Osho and his personal physician?
Really life around Osho was not a Bible reading class but watching and living a Thriller!
It is a clear statement. Osho made many statements. That does not qualify them as being true or limited to being a permanent yardstick as to what is real. Have you considered simply dropping reading Osho’s words and pursueing a more rewarding pastime…like gardening? It is spring and the grass seems to be growing by itself, but it wouldn’t if there was no rain. You’ll learn more from observing nature than you will from reading a mountain of Osho books. First there is a mountain, then there is no mountain, then there is.
Osho made many statements. But not many that can be empirically verified! This one was, by the FBI.
I am not tied up in Osho’s words and the truth of them, and earlier in this string you will see I found his answers in James S. Gordon’s interview about the Ranch pretty unsatisfactory.
I work in horticulture, so it is likely that I am as wedded to nature and the soil as anyone else posting here!
By the way there is a drought here in the UK with hose pipe bans imminent, so the grass is not growing by itself!
Parmartha – I read about the UK drought in the Guardian recently. I cannot picture the green UK of Arthurian legend drying up. Here in Oz we are always in drought somewhere. And you are right. In non-zen blunt reality, the grass does not grow by itself…
Is it pure coincidence that the words ‘boo-hoo’ and ‘guru’ rhyme, or is it the case that this is very significant?
Thanks Lokesh,
Nice reminder!
We ‘give birth astride of a grave, the light gleams an instant, then its night once more’.
Boo-hoo, Boo-hoo. Godot, my Guru.
Nothing is funnier than my unhappiness. Thanks Pozzo? Bozzo? Probably Osho.
Lokesh,
A maniac drive to remain happy. All puppets in this circus whinge.
Cheers
For the romantic English entry we have :
The Osho Semi Detached Suburban Seekers Highly Strung Brass Band and Palm Court Orchestra
Singing their affectionate intimate dotty ditty:
‘ To have my mother show physical bonding to me, I had to use Araldite Glue.
For the International non-denominational entry, We have the Osho Black Robe High Maintenace Therapeutic Ensemble,
Singing their 60 ‘s hit from the naked musical Oshospell SuperStar
‘Harmony and Understanding… this is the Dawning of the Age of Insaniyas..Insaniyasssss…
I am looking forward the response to my above post, let us see who dares to take the psychoanalysis from Sheela to Jayesh, The man who is holding the numero uno position from the time John Major was the PM in UK or was it Mrs. Margaret Thatcher. Amazing thing is hardly any sannyasin utters any word about him publicly. Such a taboo, such a fear, such a reverence. IS sannyas not a path to explore the taboo, jump over the fear and come out from the shadows of reverend father!
Whoops!!!
Nobody else has your grasp of proven facts Shantam,
so we can’t assess these matters the way you can.
Beauty lies in the eyes of the beholder…is ugliness lies somewhere else?
It must be also in the eyes of the beholder.
It is may be the matter of perception…make the rhyme Guru with Boo-hoo or Guru is YAHOO!
Nobody else has your grasp of proven facts Lokesh,
so we can’t assess these matters the way you can.
I am not quite sure why, Arpana, but your comment made my face end into a grin.
That is BEND.
are parking wardens members of a spiritual sect..? they are seekers, always on the look out.. they don’t mind their own business, although utterly self absorbed, cause trouble in the name of a higher authority and collective benefit , are ultimately unaccountable, wear funny ill shaped clothing, look to the heavens when you challenge their views, stick to the rules like sanctimony, take inordinate pleasure in what they do, and disappear with your money ?
should I join?
Well, you could at least get a ticket for being still on the same spot for a long time.
is it some sort of jigsaw . . . none of us have been here / there from day one of the caravan / whatever one needs to call it or is there a possibility all of us have always been in some form or the other ?
I need my cuppa now !
Parmartha,
I loved your musings about ‘most Sufi orders are pretty careful about admission to their orders but who knows, maybe they bar the real rebel ………’
I once met a woman whose husband overdosed and died in Goa. She was also in a bad way. She went to every ashram and guru in India but was rejected by them all. In Goa she heard about a ‘Black Magician’ in Poona (her words). She became a sannyasin and did kick her habit. I think this was something unique about Osho and the different souls he accepted. I met sannyasins who were banned from the ashram but still swore by him. One of the most moving experiences in my life was the day after Osho left this planet and I saw disciples who came from everywhere and anywhere. They reminded me of characters Meher Baba used to go out to bless. They were ‘mad’, the masts, who had left the bullshit behind but hadn’t crossed to the other shore. With Osho one felt loved to the core of one’s being – and I’m not the bhakti type.
In one of the Sheela video clips that Kavita sent earlier, Sheela states, ‘I’m the last Rajneeshee’. I don’t think so …
I wonder what she meant by that comment? I also found it interesting how she went from using Bhagwan to Osho, a couple of times, when speaking about him. She did once say he would always be Bhagwan for her. Any thoughts? Speaking about secretaries, I once asked Anando about the past, and she said, or words to the effect, ” What happened in Rajneeshpuram could not happen again.”
A friend of mine to this day refers, caustically always, to Sannyasins and Rajneeshees.
We discussed this on an occasion and decided people will come to Osho on into the future, who, if they had to wear a mala and red would still take sannyas, and those who get involved, who, if they had to wear a mala and red, would not take sannyas; but prior to that a rajneeshee was a follower of other sannyassins who followed other sannyassins, and a sannyasin was a follower of Osho.
Arpana,
In January of 1983 I was heading to the Shakespeare Bookshop in Paris when I was approached by a woman who thought I was a disciple of Karl Marx. She obviously thought my mala was a photo of Karl and I was invited to a meeting of radical lefties.
Which of course you attended.
(o_O)
You’ve reminded me of how torn I felt for years after I took sannyas, between left wing me, and sannyas me; and more to the point, as a perceived problem that stopped years ago, and I didn’t notice the going.
Arpana,
I like your take. Interesting that people on Wall Street read Marx these days. I’ve always dissociated Lenin and Trotsky from Stalin and I’m not being romantic here. They were ruthless but these were ruthless times. World War 1 and civil war promoted by capitalists.
Chris Read a fine English historian writes well on Lenin, a trusted biography. He didn’t work for a Ronald Reagan or Thatcher like some. And I loved Thompson’s history of the English working class. What to say about poets like Blake?
A fine tradition the English working class. Have friends from the socialist left, decent caring people. I didn’t go to the meeting in Paris that night because I lost the address. Reminds me of Catch 22. I certainly didn’t walk around the corner and tear it up.
I’m not the bhakti type. Perhaps the romantic type. Osho was a great screen for projecting anything on to, from utterly negative to the ridiculously positive. If we grow in the right direction we begin to question who it is that is doing the projecting…some eventually find out.
Meher Baba, as I understand it, was not exactly blessing masts but rather taking care of their bodies and trying to make their so-caled devine intoxication more wholesome. What exactly do you mean by ‘the other shore?’ Who or what is it that you imagine is doing the crossing? I suspect this is another romantic notion.
Lokesh,
Appreciate your response, one throws a nickel and there is a ripple. I do love the romantics.You are right of course about projections. I don’t know who
‘eventually find out’. Always seen myself as a bit of a noodle, a simpleton but it has been great fun. A rosy crucifixion as Miller would say. Not easy to become a Great Fool. Trees stop growing. Tell that to the new age movement. Love dropping willows. The spirit rises but the soul moves one down to the world of Keats and Shelley. Anyway I like sad places and sad songs. Always loved the old Otis Redding song. You’d know it well. Dropping willows and those sad hanging vines, I guess that is romanticism.Then again narcissism is an ugly fault and a boring fault.
Talking about the romantics what about Leopold Bloom. I’m obviously referring to Joyce’s Ulysses. Leopold a great soul. The wondering Irish Jew, lower than low but so warm and decent. His talisman a small potato in his pocket. And that potato worked beautifully for him. No external crucifix around his neck. Bloom of course wondered the streets of Dublin. An inner journey to Ithica. Do you like Van Morrison? What an album ‘Astral Weeks’. Van, the little working class boy, looking in amazement at Cypress Avenue. Do you know one can do Van tours these days? A bit like Bloom’s day.
Where to go with Meher? There is a contributer on this website who could say more. You are right about the masts. Baba disciples I knew felt the masts where in a half-way house. Who knows? That was many years ago in another time and another place.
I guess these ramblings are a failure. One failure on top of another. What would Papa Freud say? Still I’m trying to fail better, these self-monitorings create problems where there are non. Still there is a long history of misery in this would. Latest Laurie Anderson album is beautiful. Loved the song about one white whale, did cry. Soon they’ll be gone and the ocean is red. Amazing how she and Lou Reed have worked it out over all these years. I guess she hit him with her flower.
You know we are in trouble when someone says Moby Dick is just a book about whales. Will spend the day hearing the rain on the roof and listening to the birds. Magpies are amazing. What intelligence! Thanks again
Lokesh,
I obviously meant ‘drooping willows’. Back to Baba. He just came to mind because on that day in Poona I saw these misfit, bedraggled sannyasins who weren’t into new age spiritual growth. They seemed to come out of trees. An embarrassment to any self-respecting organization. One of these misfits, I was told by a psychiatrist, was enlightened. I guess shrinks know. Socrates knew he knew nothing. He could neither read or write. He could walk, talk and drink hemlock.
As an aside Baba was against eating meat because the animals contaminated you and prevented your spiritual development. I guess the Avatar had some problems with purity. I prefer Shaw’s ‘Be kind to animals. Don’t eat them’.
I also don’t know who is crossing. I do love the old woman down the road, in her red uniform, who guides the school children. Reminds me of the ferryman.
Amazing how these myths stick in one’s head. Poor Icarus. He flew to high, grew too quickly and plunged into the sea to his death. They say the ploughman may have heard the splash. The dog apparently scratched its behind.
As for suspecting, I’ve always suspected that Elvis was blonde and he dyed his hair. He copied Roy Orbison. I also suspect that Elvis was related to Byron. Look at a photo of Elvis and a painting of Byron. They both died prematurely and autopsies showed degenerated livers. Both were incredibly charismatic, bloated and into costumes. There’s a lot more. I suspect I could be right but I’m no sleuth. We need Marlowe or Parmartha’s Victorian connection. Love Jim Thompson. ‘The Killer Inside Me’ and ‘The Grifters’ comes to mind. Now here is someone who could write about suspicion and suspecting motives. What about Phillip K. Dick!
I must admit you’ve got me with the other shore. ‘The way through the world IS more difficult to find than the way beyond it’. Wallace Stevens.
Now what about these secretaries? Did you ever suspect anything? Did you like any? I found Anando charming. I didn’t suspect. Nice to throw the ball around.
There was a high school on the hill tops. Its success rate became the world news. No school has produced so many scholars, scientists and other professionals than this school.
Educationists around the world started coming to see this model. What they found was beyond their imagination. School has a principal, peon, canteen in charge but no teachers.Yes, no teachers!
“Who teaches these students, who maintain the discipline?”, was the question.
Instead of answering, principal will take them to the classroom, to have the first -hand experience.
Every classroom has a photo of the founder of the school and a PowerPoint presentation.
Educationists will even get more confused. Principal always enjoyed such moments and delivered his final statement: ” We have taken the lead from the religions and spiritual institutes. If they can deliver higher education just through the photo or some symbol of their founding father, why can´t we? If you can feel the presence of your religious master after his death and get the wisdom, what is the problem with simple education?”
Each individual, as well as a commune which contradicts the ruling hermetic system is being exploited. For this purpose, mystification is the perfect tool. Never ever it will be allowed, that a living being what is not deployed by them, will be accepted as wise or authority of truth. He will be ruined and later mystified for common use.
Shantam you put forward the question, ‘If you can feel the presence of your religious master after his death and get the wisdom, what is the problem with simple education?”’
If there exists a problem it might be grounded n your emotive imaginings about feeling presences.Just because you are feeling something does not make it real. Such things have their foundations in religious programmes. It all sounds very spiritual, but in the long run does it do you any real good? Personally, I find it more helpful to feel my own presence and have done away with the notion that I need something external to myself on that level. Please bear in mind that it is only due in part to Osho that I have come to such a point. Learn what you can and move on is what I am saying.
Lokesh,
Poem titled ‘Play’ by Archie Ammons came to mind. You may like it or trash it. Meant it as a gift. I can’t write like Archie.
Play
Nothing’s going to become of anyone
except death:
therefore: its okay
to year
too high:
the grave accommodates
swell rambunctiousness &
ruin’s not
compromised by magnificence:
that cut-off point
liberates us to the
common disaster: so
pick a perch-
apple branch for example in bloom-
tune up
and
drill imagination right through necessity:
it’s all right:
it’s been taken care of:
is allowed, considering
Lokesh,
It is obviously ‘to yearn too high’.
Maybe one can make something with ‘year’.
Don’t you have to laugh. There’s always a stitch missing, an achilles heel. Blah blah blah
ps, by anyone’s definition i still regard myself a happy go lucky experiential net creditor of Oshoness.. I just do it (a bit different) from the crowd… and still have a great time amongst those in the know….
and i offer individual sessions online here for mirthful sedition….if you want to book just ask the editors for my unpublished collection of posts….
don’t all rush at once….
Religious programming!
Lokesh; Raman Maharishi to Punja ji Maharaj; were they not colored by their hindu belief system and doctrine?
And Osho?
After reading your above post, i remembered those nuns in the hospital chappel, last year i was admitted into. To see them serving with grace, to see few older ones before Maria´s statue with devotion and prayer were touching moments during that stay. Such human beings are every where in every country..
Does some guard will stop their entry into the elite club of some so called Nirvanaists, just because they don´t fullfill the membership criteria proposed by neo Spiritualists.
Is it like that old version, woman can be enligtend too, but in the next life when she is born as man?
and we close with Today’s thought for the day from the series: Freedom from Worry…..
If you must worry then always choose someone else’s problems…… they’ll thank you for it, whilst you can take the day off whistling tunes.
the full series is available from:
Hesse Darmstadt fellowship of Hanoverian Claimants to the throne of the House of Windsor.
Virgin Islands Banking and Tax Advice Citizens advice Bureau
Jamaica?
….No she went of her own accord.
(if this gets printed i’m a chinaman…)
gleetings from
Hu flung Dung
Well, I’d no idea Shantam had a thing about nuns…perhaps an old habit. One thing’s for sure, Shantam still has that resort super glue on his boot heels.
. . there is nevertheless a certain respect, a general duty to humanity, not only to beasts that have life and sense, but even to trees and plants. We owe justice to men, and graciousness and benignity to other creatures . . . there is a certain commerce and mutual obligation betwixt them and us.
Michel Montaigne (1533 – 1592)
Arpana,
Much appreciated. A gentle soul without prejudice. I’ve only dipped.
if wearing a habit is a habit ?
I need to re-sort
To what I wonder. As long as it is not harping on about the resort. Talk about flogging a dead gee-gee. Giddy up!
didnt harp at all . . . maybe hum sometimes . . . I didnt like flogging anything dead or alive . . . caress maybe . . . ne !
Wasn’t sure where to put this.
Parmartha, for the record, your article “Osho in the Dental Chair” has been falsely attributed to Christopher Calder by Timothy Conway, in his “The Enigmatic ‘Bhagwan’, Osho Rajneesh”.
Scroll about 80% down the page:
http://www.enlightened-spirituality.org/rajneesh.html
["...People clearly saw the nitrous oxide spigots installed by his bedside. When you get to the point that you have nitrous oxide spigots custom installed by your bed, you are a very serious nitrous oxide addict, not just a casual user." And see Calder's article “Osho in the Dental Chair” at: sannyasnews.com/Articles/OshoDentalChair.html"]
(I’ve always assumed that that piece, “Osho in the Dental Chair”, was written by you, not Calder. At least I hope so, as I credited you in my own book.)
Out of curiosity, how much of a hand did you have in Paritosh (Sam’s) “Life of Osho”? I ask because your writing and thought processes often remind me very much of Paritosh’s. This was very true in the “Dental Chair” piece, which was why I’m sure it was written by you and not Calder.
Teertha,
It surely does fit in with secretaries?
‘Suspicion torments my mind’.
Is the new Crowley biography any good?
I think you mean Churton’s work, Roman. It’s quite good, though definitely the work of an apologist. I’m contemplating doing a full-blown bio of Osho myself, building on the material from ‘Magi’, sometime in the next few years once I finish my next two writing projects. In my opinion there is still no Osho biography around that is both comprehensive and good (as in balanced between critical and sympathetic). Paritosh’s work was my favorite, but probably too short to be called comprehensive. Vasant Joshi’s work is decent but sanitized. The older works from the early ’90s and ’80s are mostly forgettable or lacking objectivity.
Teertha,
I did mean Churton. I recently heard him speak on Utube. He lectures at the University of Exeter.
The key concepts book on Gurdjieff which you recommended is useful. Your own book has saved people a lot of homework. I find it fascinating that Israel Regardie loved Osho.
I agree with your comments about an Osho biography and I did like Paritosh’s work because it is well written and looks at things slantwise. Parts moved me very much. No-one has done anything like ‘The Harmonious Circle’ by Webb which (as you know) covers the Gurdjieff movement. I think it needs to be done and whoever has a go at it needs all the help and resources they can get. Only a fopdoodle would think you’d do it for money or celebrity. Heard Joshi interviewed on the radio in the States some months back. I agree with the sanitation but no doubting his sincerity. I became a friend of someone who went to University with Osho. Osho pointed out that it was inevitable that thousands would come to him back then. The university lectures were always packed. Hope you have a go at it. Happy to help out if I can. There is much a few of us could share here.
Roman, Regardie may have loved Osho, but alas, apparently the feeling was not mutual:
http://www.livingworkshop.net/regardi.html
(Couldn’t recall if it was you who sent me that link several months ago).
Re the bio-project, appreciate your offer of help. I’m thinking that several here could be of help were I to tackle this project (which at present I’m leaning toward doing, and my current publisher is interested). I think a figure like Osho can only be assessed and evaluated with at least two decades of post-mortem water under the bridge. What is needed is assessment from sannyasins who were not too close, but not too far, and I think I fit that general zone, as well as being a fiend for research.
And whilst I’m at it, if I may shamelessly sneak in mention of my next forthcoming book, due out in May:
http://www.amazon.com/Rude-Awakening-Perils-Pitfalls-Spiritual/dp/1846946093/ref=sr_1_2?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1331942303&sr=1-2
Teertha.
I transcribed these interviews from the Darshan Diaries. Is only about a third of them. Might be useful to you.
http://www.wikifortio.com/778265/Darshan Diary Interviews(3).PDF
Arpana,
You surely have a book in you with your research skills.
Thanks Roman.
I’m a bit of a nerd is all. Albeit getting on a bit.
I’ve kept a journal for twenty five years. Every day. Written two novels, neither of which are good enough to publish, which took me eleven years to write; and recently spent three years writing an autobiography, which includes about 400 pages on my time at the ashram. The autobography is connected to Tarot cards and this.
http://intensivejournal.org/index.php
I’ve also been a painter since 1985.
All because of me, Osho and Meditation.
Osho we love you.
Fuck all the know all bastards who try to tear you and us down.
You rock Osho.
Love your inconstancies.
Love that you can’t be nailed in a rational objective way by ego maniacs,
and inconsistencies.
Arpana,
Parmatha is right about the Maneesha interviews and I would not doubt her integrity. Appreciate the reminder.
I think her current project is important and worth supporting.
Thank you Arpana. This will go under the section The Book of Arpana and Related Acts, in the forthcoming Holy Rolls Scriptures.
Teertha,
Your new book looks interesting. I didn’t send the link. I imagine there will be a lot more written on Osho in the coming years. One is reminded of all the Gurdjieff material. I did enjoy Peters, Bennett and co. Some of these books being written years after Gurdjieff’s death. You did point out in ‘Magi’ the importance of Maneesha’s books and I did like Amrito’s which I thought was well written. I’m surprised he hasn’t written more. However, the two decades comment makes sense.
The best Gurdjieff biogs appeared roughly between 30-50 years after his passing (Bennett’s “Making a New World”, and Moore’s “Gurdjieff: Anatomy of a Myth”, and Patterson’s works). It takes around that amount of time to properly evaluated a master of that scope. In that sense, no surprise about the lack of comprehensive Osho biogs up to now. A generation or two seems needed to gain sufficient perspective. Too close prevents clarity as much as being too far away, and that seems to apply to time as well.
I’ve never understood this fascination for Crowley.
I mean, did he really have anything to offer suffering humanity? Or was he simply stuck in the dark psychic cul-de-sac of so-called ‘black magic’?
Crowley was an interesting man, a good writer and a courageous mountaineer. Osho never had anything much good to say about him. If I recall rightly he said Crowley was misguided.
My favorite Crowley book is ‘Diary of a Drug Fiend’.
“Interesting”, perhaps, but surely not someone to revere as a significant spiritual teacher?
Lokesh,
I haven’t read his short stories but apparently they are brilliant? They have just been republished in a cheap but excellent edition.
Crowley was a powerful figure for me during the late sixties in that he was a ‘head’ of his time. Since then I have found what I believe are a lot better men and women to look to as some kind of guiding light if I find myself needing one.
Last week my girlfriend and I attended a Gnostic Mass, Crowley’s version the Catholic Mass. Far from being some sort of devil-worshipping affair, it is a lovely, poetic ceremony that involves a mystical validation of the divine feminine and divine masculine. Osho’s work was ultimately about an attempt to exalt what is best in both men and women, get us beyond our neurotic, self-absorbed needs in relationship, and aspire to something higher that is beyond all the nonsense. It was not much different from the alchemy (inner marriage) and tantra as taught in the western esoteric traditions. The Pune resort is the Church, the meditations (Dynamic, Kundalini, etc.) are the “Masses”, the therapists are the priesthood, the seekers in maroon robes are the congregation. Crowley’s people took Latin names, we took Sanskrit names.
Gurdjieff also gave names, incidentally, only they were less flattering — he called his students by the names of animals. One of his women students he called a boa-constrictor, another a crocodile. Ouspensky he called “Mr. Wraps-Up-The-Thought”, a comment on his need to resolve thing intellectually as quickly as possible. The Sacred Dances were their version of a Mass, etc.
Alister Crowley a 33° Grand Inspector General of Scottish Rite Freemasonry.
The article “Osho and the Dental Chair” is mine. I dont know who else has used it, or falsely claimed it. I’ll check.
I was a good friend of Sam, Prem Paritosh. He said I was the “Godfather” of his “Life of Osho”. Whatever that means!
I am very sorry he passed on, we still miss him.
Lokesh, i am “stuck” with Osho´s place because i care for something which has the potential to blow the collective mind away. I hold few braanches of the tree, which is getting chopped so that new owners can put few flower pots there.
Whether holding the branches will make me enlightend or not, is not my concern. I don´t want to live and die with the guilt, i did nothing to stop an unconstitutional blunder!
Shantam,
Form a Constitutional Assembly. We are all CITIZENS of the RESORT.
Shantam, I have a new title for your forthcoming autobiography. ‘SHANTAM IN BLUNDERLAND’.
Human mind is aksing about the God and who is controlling the universe. Without some intelligent hand, system can collapse..
I really don´t know about the universe. But for EARTH i have a theory.
God put the seeds of green earth and then He withdrew himself from the day to day activites regarding the Earth. It is still being taken care of, by Management Team..The members of that team are called Angels…Devtas..and one can see their signature everywhere, As it is above so is the below..
Famous jealousy, greed and lust of few angels is here, same is the bravery, caring and compassion…
The system is similar like Osho followed. Only great thing about God´s iner circle is; it did not get broken. Management team members try their best to dominate the others, but are not allowed to knock out the opponents out.
After all…allmighty God is Allah..is Parmatma Also…Waheguru!
As the Earth is ripped from our hands by chaos, violence and confusion in order to lower motives keeping the power interests. Maybe the Ashram is torn from our hands for normal use of same interest. Now we can play Don Quijote, I spread my wings and fly even higher
But a material Place (without money interest) to share with all the other wing spreader would be nice 
Shantam,
You are The Incorruptible.
Roman.
Not sure I can say this right, but I mean this well.
Buckets of respect.
Shantam gets a bit of stick here, but you ain’t gonna’
run with the crowd.
Far fuckin’ out.
(^o^)y
When life as a sannyasin was so full of laughs, of all sorts , why so little drolery in all the books, the magazines,the therapy, the meaning, the organisations , the selling of their trainings , even the music…. ……if the ‘purpose’ was to lighten up, to give the hellenic gods back their laughter… how come so little balance in all the written, organised , hectares of future projections and nostalgia…..why laughter sublimated to absurd paragons of sincerity when most everything else wasn’t.. including ambition ..of course under the name of anything you please….
my best moments with Osh and my/his mates and matesses will always be best remembered that way…. that’s why so much is forgiveable without even trying…
a nutter……don’t forget that part… the wholly professional ….nutter
This from the guy who defines serious.
Holy Moly.
Overheard at a recent conflab (meeting) of NGO’s on all things Osho coordinated by the Well Heeled initiators of a new Millenium, in the face of War and abysmal Global Warming (or the acronymous WHIMFWAGW…)
SCENE :two supping cocktail drinkers ( male )
a)Ah Yes, my public school was a pretty rum job, all male teachers and lots of balls……..ahhh ermmm you know…. rugby , cricket, footers that sort of thing….
How about you Swami Farquharson ?
b) Well I’m just so happy we have the WHIMFWAGW to….
a) …Sorry to interrupt but look out ..by jove,.. i don’t believe it… look.. there’s the Truth….
b) Why, Swami Twice Nightly.. you’re right.. quick man…. lets organize it…
May be it can bring little solace to Sannyas heart to see the below link, it is not just our master, who was handcuffed by American Police.
I think one should give the benefit of doubt to Osho-Bhagwan of that time, the man from an Indian province, who had all the good intentions and ambition to be a new Spiritual celebrity in the league of Buddha and Jesus. The blame lies mostly on those Lunar sannyasins from the west, who misjudged the power and fairness of their own legal system and the pride in their collective religious heritage in Christian values.
It is also possible, most of the western sannyasins may be the old souls from India, who had still this idea,” With the power of money, one can manage all kind of legal hurdles or everybody has a price”. Maybe they were also thinking, there are no handcuffs which can tie an enlightened one..when His presence can melt the hearts, what to say about the metal!
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2115961/George-Clooney-arrested-Sudan-protest.html
This Metal… I call it Ignorance. It does not bind the enlightend, but the understanding of the Metal.
A story says, there was a mystic, who touched a tree and within days it started blossoming. This news spread like wildfire in the nearby villages. People started coming to have the Darshan of this mystical man. Few even gave the newspaper ad. of the tree, how it was and what it has become.
Seeing it in the newspapaers, city dwellers also were seen making journey to his village..
This is a story, when the fame comes to someone it comes through the right doors and on the right moments.
I will bet, if this mystic will touch the same tree in few months, leaves will start falling, branches will become bare and empty within days..
When the time is of Spring, even the dog pissing under the tree will make it blossem with uncountable leaves….
Oh Time, you changing time..you move with such an unbiased way…
Are you Enlightened!!
Was it Crowley or Nostradamous, who predicted in their trance readings, ” Soon their will be an apple from the factories of China, whose market share will be many times more than all the apple fields in the world!
And it is happening!
One of them had also predicted, the new land of dreams and hopes will have a President who will look like a bit of pastday slaves. He will usher the humanity in an era of less wars and more recession!
And it is happening!
Either of Crowly or Nostradamous also predicted, ” When people will love without any distinction of gender bias and anytime any where in any way, two third of humanity will be wiped out! Osho highlighted this by saying nightmarish ninties will make it happen (unless people start doing meditation!!)
This did not happen.
(thanks to meditative lovemaking and use of rubbers)
but yes…two third of disicples are out of the fold!
Who says..Crowley have not added some value to the human race!
But was it “his” commune, well strictly speaking no, it was a place where he simply wanted to be a guest.
Parmartha, this kind of talk could be categorized as sannyas ‘doublespeak’ and is typical of some of the cosmic hokum that Osho was capable of producing and the party faithful blindly parroting. Ultimately we are all guests on this planet, or rather visitors, but after Osho left the scene it did not take long for it to collapse completely, signifying that he was in fact the foundation that the castle made of sand was built upon, which is a lot more than being a guest. I suggest looking the word ‘guest’ up in a good dictionary. None of the definitions fit Osho’s role on the ranch.
Like you, Lokesh, I like to be provocative.
I lived for a while on the Ranch, and dont think you did?
I personally always found it a bit weird that Osho lived in this isolated compound. He did come out, many but not all days, for drive by.
But most of the time he was isolated and with his household people only. I am sure he did not know the Ranch in the way for example some ordinary communards such as myself did. I was living there. In some ways I dont think Osho was. I dont think he showed any real interest in his surroundings at that time.
I also dont think it is sannyas double de gook to simply relate how I experienced it. I was an old head, even then, and cant easily be duped.
I never visited the ranch. I was undergoing a rude awakening from the sannyas dream. It was a dificult time but in retrospect I am glad that I woke up to certain aspects of the sannyas way that were stunting my growth.
he came out everyday except for one day while i lived there(over one year), that was due to the immigration chief visiting the town mall. but sheela’s people went around saying that he was ill.. We just laughed when one ma told us that.
Not to re-flog an old horse, but in point of fact Osho did have a few positive things to say about Crowley. Scroll to page 122 of the following darshan diary:
http://www.livingworkshop.net/PDF-files/dd-The_Buddha_Disease.pdf
I found these comments of Osho’s touching, actually, because as much as anything they reveal the scope of his mind, and his penchant for flushing out obscure mystics and shining a light on their redeeming qualities. (Look what he did with all those obscure Chinese Zen mystics during those incessant Zen lectures of 1988-89). As for Crowley, he was in my opinion a sort of English Edwardian-era precursor of Osho (his whole teaching was ultimately about rescuing the sanctity of the individual from 2,000 years of self-sacrificing Judeo-Christian programming, a sort of blend of Nietzsche and esoteric practices). Imagine Osho trying to teach about sex as a means of conscious liberation (as Crowley did) in a repressive pre-1940s British India, and imagine him not being maligned (far worse than he was in the late 1960s) or strung up on a tree. Social context amounts to quite a bit, and accordingly colors future reputation. The Bible paints Simon Magus as bad not because he practiced magic, but because, essentially, he wasn’t Jesus — but what he was doing was uncomfortably close to what Jesus was supposedly doing (walking on water, raising the dead, etc. — i.e., magic).
Teertha,
The comments are touching and thanks for the comments about the obscure mystics. Maneesha points out how she went through his library to find these guys. A very close friend of mine, Satish, who was a very good poet and died in Poona in 1992 had a wonderful library of these obscure zen poets which he left my partner and I.
She also ran an esoteric bookshop back in those days and she would order every one of those characters. Those discourses in 1988/9 were pretty amazing. I’d been into Gary Snyder and others centuries ago but Osho bought me back to them and ones I hadn’t heard of. The early publications of Hackett, Stryk and Anne Walderman ( Director of Poetics at Naropa Instute) are wonderful to have on the shelves. I’ve got an old tape of Anne Walderman chanting ‘Fast Speakin Woman’ which I love. And what to say about Tuttle Press?
Douglas Stewart, a well known Australian poet, spent many years living in Kyoto where he eventually died. His doors were always open. His Net of Fireflies by Tuttle is beautifully designed and full of wisdom. Thomas Merton also jumps to mind.
Teertha,
Wordsworth Press have brought out the complete collection of Crowley’s Short Stories which they say are apparently long overdue. Wordsworth speaks for itself. So no doubt the guy could write. I haven’t read any.