‘Nothing to Lose’ Lokesh Reflects

When you got nothing, you got nothing to lose. Bob Dylan.

During the process leading up to Osho’s awakening he used the enquiry ‘Who am I?’ as prescribed by Ramana Maharshi, one of the few Indian gurus that he spoke positively about in his morning discourses. Now this process of self-enquiry, which cuts through layers of delusion and eventually cracks the nut of ego, has gone mainstream. Some of Ramana’s disciples became masters and then some of their students became teachers and the core teaching is now awash in a morass of self-proclaimed enlightened masters, luring the uninitiated with self-enquiry’s directness and simplicity into a murky bog, composed of guruspeak, psychobabble, spiritual egotism and a protracted fantasy from which they are unlikely to emerge anytime soon.

Ask yourself, ‘Who am I?’ And from there on in all words, including those of genuine enlightened masters, are no longer needed…unless perhaps you feel afraid and need a little encouragement to take it a step further. You can do it on your own. Osho did, so why can’t you? You don’t need anyone else to help you. Five words and you are free. Or to quote Osho: ‘‘You don’t need any priest, you don’t need any scriptures, you don’t need to be in any religious organization, you have to be just yourself – silently, peacefully settling within your home.’’

But hold on…let’s take a few notes…five words… that is too simple…and besides, nobody will be able to make any money out of a spiritual teaching that can be encapsulated in one sentence, because anyone who wants to sell enlightenment has to package it in such a way as to make it seem obtainable to the ego. The plot thickens. Extra, extra, read all about it, enlightenment for sale, tastes like Ambrosia creamed rice and you’ll be blissed out 24/7. And thus we have the self thinking it can attain no-self and enlightenment has been redefined as something that the ego can ‘get’. From there it is only a small step for today’s seeker to begin believing they are plugged into the nirvana socket, experiencing what they believe is a special connectedness to God, inner emptiness, showers of bliss and a variety of other so-called spiritual experiences that once upon a time might have taken a serious seeker lifetimes to achieve and now, thanks to Guru Boo Hoo, it is all yours…for a price, be it unconditional surrender, actual money or perhaps allowing yourself to remain in a childish dependency trip that takes away freedom rather than delivering liberation. But hey, maybe that is what you want, perhaps you never really wanted to find the truth in the first place. It could be the case that what you really want to do is play a spiritual game with the guru in the role of some big cosmic daddy who will keep you safe, you being the ego that was once needed in order for your continued survival on this planet but is now, at least in the enlightenment stakes, obsolete.

For me the biggest obstacle that I encountered in letting go of my guru trip was the amount of time and emotion that I had invested in the past. When I look at the direction that many of my contemporaries who met Osho took, most of them moved on, many, like myself, with gratitude in their heart. The ones who remain somehow connected to Osho usually have an investment in one form or another that they are not willing to let go of and are still harping on about the experiences that they had while Osho was still alive, which is on par with listening to people describing their LSD trips…in other words very boring and uninspiring.

The big question is do spiritual experiences actually have anything to do with awakening? I am at a point in my journey where I am beginning to see that the only thing spiritual experiences have to do with awakening is that they are something you pass through, that the truth of who I really am lies somewhere beyond the bliss dimension. You would be justified in asking, how can I be sure of this? This is my answer to that question.

It was H W L Poonja who first helped bring my awareness to the fact that there is really is something that exists which is beyond the world of experiences. He did this by asking me to move beyond my bliss. On reflection, I now realize that my time with Osho had a lot to do with experiencing bliss. This is a reflection of who I am. I say this because I believe that Osho was a genuine master who really was, for the most part, beyond it all. And once more I have to say that none of what I am now aware of would have happened had it not been for Osho’s influence.
So what is the truth? I think in order for the truth to be ‘you’ have to get out of the way for it to happen. And from time to time I see that it is happening. It really is no big deal and it has nothing to do with kundalini rising, fireworks going off in your chakras or feeling a special connection to a master. No, truth has nothing do with any of those things. Truth is like a cool breeze blowing through an empty room. The first time I realized this was with Osho. At the time I thought that this was ‘his’ presence I was experiencing but when exactly the same thing happened at Poonjaji’s feet I realized immediately that this was who I am and the only thing it had to do with the master was that he reflected this. After all, if you want a definition of what a master is I’d say, ‘A clear reflection’.

Zen abounds with stories of instant enlightenment, ‘The frog jumped into the pond, plop.’ ‘The goose is out.’ that sort of thing. But the way it looks to me enlightenment is a gradual process, like an onion being peeled to its selfless core. When all the layers have gone you have nothing in your hand, but the process leading up to that moment has been gradual, although the final extinction of the flickering flame of ego might indeed be sudden and instantaneous. The bottom line is that language deals with concepts and cannot by its very nature describe truth. But you can always try…just for the fun of it.

Truth is something that…you open, you become silent, you become receptive, you become wordless…your whole mind comes to a full stop, and then what is left is the truth.
Osho. The great Zen master, Ta Hui.

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288 Responses to ‘Nothing to Lose’ Lokesh Reflects

  1. Prem Abhay says:

    Life is a joke isn’t it? All these serious people in the world and Osho always used to say this was an inherent sickness in all the dead religions…didn’t he? Wait, I am sure I can get you a thousand quotes to back up my argument…oops, now I am being serious.

    It may be helpful to make light of things sometimes. It may be that things are anyhow light. Still, to always take the approach that everything is a comic strip makes me a little suspicious. Non-seriousness in the Osho world is so often reflected by great crowds of people laughing loudly, and most importantly at nothing at all. If you are sitting nearby, or walk passed, what happens? Do you feel any temptation to be also drawn into a great belly laugh – you know how infectious a really good laugh is. Or, is it that you feel a little flat afterwards and wonder why it seemed like all the laughing was an utterly fake act. Strangely I have that same feeling when I read the repeated jokes here on SannyasNews lately.

    It seems to me that the jokes are a front to avoid something. You are comfortable going to the resort or doing the things you do, and all these ‘serious’ issues are a challenging to your vested interests. To get into an intellectual debate is a bit of a challenge, especially when you have not a case other than power hungry lies to try and support. Of course you can simply ignore or dismiss the quite murmurings of discontent, yet still this leaves the ego a little unsteady, and that is little joy for great spiritual Osho beings. So a good light hearted banter and a quote about passing clouds should do the trick.

    Perhaps there is a fear that the Osho mafia may get wind of your discontent, and to make a joke distances yourself and shows you are not involved at all. This is a little funny when you are motivated enough to repeat a boring joke endlessly.

    If you are an editor of a website, perhaps reject any offerings to have the real story told as a lead article. Allow it to go on in the partly unseen comments. If it seems a little loud still, throw a few quick articles up to show that you are not really supporting these views. To yourself you say you are supporting the airing of the real issues, yet you also can show the Osho mafia that you are not on the side of those that have the courage and intelligence to hone in on the truth that reveals the ugliest lies, threats, and violence.

    In all this scheming you better hope that the Osho mafia has the intelligence to see what you are showing them. I have news for you. There conduct has more and more tended towards a serious lack of intelligence. In the beginning they were the good managers, and that is why it worked to kick out all the heart people. In ‘business’, you need a sharp mind and the capacity to make tough and sometimes unpopular decisions. This is how things stood for a little while.

    I have news for all you smart sannyasins that hide behind plots of humour, anonymity, or whatever. The Osho mafia – that you know is worth fearing – is no longer making predictably rational decisions. It is reflected in the drinking water contamination, in the response (or lack of it) to the terrorist blast at the German Bakery, in the effort to have the ownership rights of the name ‘OshoWorld’ transferred to OIF, in the attempt to blatantly lie to the US trademarks office, in the current attempt to forcefully take over all the Osho centres, and in the cut and paste job on Osho’s words. On and on it goes. The tendency is towards increasingly irrational decisions backed by a growing (yet false) belief in ones own stature and capabilities.

    What does all this mean? It means that the Osho mafia is not thinking the way you are thinking – assuming you are a reasonably rational and sane human being. This means that you subtle schemes for hiding do not necessarily work. When you say or do something, you have to put yourself in the position of an irrational person to try an understand where the Osho mafia is coming from, and what they will do. Unfortunately, by very definition, it is only a stroke of good luck that will see you second guessing their reaction.

    By hiding and being false to yourself it means you have achieved the aim of being close to Osho in some way. Perhaps you can call yourself a friend of Osho’s, or perhaps you can lay claim to living in Lao Tzu house. Still the fact remains that you know that you have reason to fear the powers that be. Well, in achieving your first aim, you achieve a second aim by corollary. The consequence is that you have actually brought yourself closer to the growingly unpredictable team at the top of the whole show.

    So you are hiding from someone for some reason in order to get what you need from Osho. How real are your assertions that there is something to fear? Think you might get banned? Think you might get threatened in writing, or perhaps verbally threatened? Think you might get physically threatened or physically assaulted? Think you might get threatened with a knife? Think you might get run over by a wayward rickshaw? Think you might get hit by a flying bale of hay, or perhaps burnt to a crisp from nature’s incendiary fury? What do you think?! Or is it, like the current gang, you don’t think to well at all? Perhaps it might be time to apply for a job at the resort, or OIF, or the “Inner Circle”.

    Do you think that you can hide by making blazing yet targeted criticism of the current teams ideological position – they’re doing a good job really, but just need to share the load – whilst avoiding other serious issues. To get yourself into this space you need to really have a good go at criticising anyone who tackles the serious practical managerial inefficiencies (and criminality).

    Don’t get me wrong here. I like a good joke just as much as any deluded Osho sannyasin hypocrite. So here is my little offering. The joke is that there are authentic seekers on the path that have had the courage, intelligence, and awareness to live and speak their own truth. Now these people may have been tormented by the crowd. They may have ended up being attacked physically. They may have even risked their lives. There may be more to come. Who knows, they may have even got hit by a flying bale of hay. Whatever has happened, and whatever does happen, they remain unwaveringly on the path towards wholeness, integrity, or completion. The selfless knowing is that they are contributing there worth to a more prosperous world.

    You might here be wondering where the joke is. Don’t worry, it may be coming soon. The joke is that all those who live a scheming and safe life have unwittingly exposed themselves to the unknowns – from that which they a protecting themselves from. In hiding you have allowed yourselves to come closer to that which you are hiding from. The management has demonstrated increasingly irrational, violent, and psychopathic tendencies.

    Who knows how many people have been sickened (or perhaps worse) over the years from drinking seriously contaminated drinking water. To make a managerial decision not to even by a few filters shows that a few dollars saved is a trade-off for how much suffering from gastro-intestinal sickness. Ever had typhoid, amoebas, or the rest of the host of nasties you get in unclean water in India. To allow year after year this to go on is serious negligence and tantamount to mass poisoning. I do not see the difference between this conduct and a more obvious bio-terrorist attack of introducing a toxin into a water supply.

    What about another example – the repeated issue of for years not fixing the lighting around the resort such that people continued to fall over and suffer ligament tears and broken ankles or wrists. What, if you grow in awareness do you suddenly develop night vision?

    I suppose people are still slipping over and breaking bones in the plaza during the monsoon. Of course management will tell you that you weren’t walking meditatively enough. They will even give you an Osho quote to back it up! Anyhow, I thought they threw out anyone that walked slowly? The idiotic mentality demonstrated here is based on a warped understanding of growing in awareness. It is also not an isolated instance, but rather a symptomatic example.

    How much does it hurt to break you ankle or wrist? Does it often times leave any long term problems? The management have demonstrated that they are immune to such severe types of pain and suffering of visitors to the resort. This seemingly complete lack of empathy is disturbing.

    So resort management doesn’t mind a bit of (passive) mass poisoning and the extreme pain of broken bones and torn ligaments. How far will it go? How far has it gone already? Where are we at now, considering we are in an unknown and foggy land of religious fanaticism complete with hypocritical people covering up the stupidity, misconduct, negligence, and criminality of the management in order to fill their empty pit of desire?

    I have no doubt the Osho mafia would have been keeping tabs on SannyasNews. Anand – our mysterious intelligence operative – interestingly makes mention of our beloved Yogendra in relation to this. They would have known that a particular Prem Abhay was saying he might do a compilation of the relevant SannyasNews ‘gossip’, and hand it out at the resort gate – same as the year before.

    For those that don’t know, the year before, he handed out a Water Contamination Report that outlined serious ongoing problems undealt with. The resort’s reaction was to go completely troppo in a series of verbal and physical threats, and physical violence!! Now here we possibly have Abhay with a lot more of the nasty truth – perhaps compiled into a book. This was in the lead up to Osho’s death celebration in January this year.

    We also had non other than Keerti – officially accused by the resort in apparently attempting to abduct Amrito, and also deemed by the resort to be a terrorist – from OshoWorld saying he heard there may be a mass gathering of celebratory protests by Westerners marking the death celebration on the 19th of January. There was even the talk of locals and Westerners having a celebratory protest street parade if I remember correctly…westerners dancing to techno and locals doing their traditional stuff (if that was what they liked).

    For those that don’t know, the German Bakery is the central point for not only the local intelligentsia and riff-raff, but also for all the banned and otherwise dissident Osho sannyasins. To the resort, the German Bakery – just down the road in up-market Koregaon Park – was (and perhaps still is) the axis of evil.

    There are serious questions about the conduct of resort management in the lead up to the Bakery blast. They had a collection of briefings indicating a serious threat, yet seemed to do nothing to address this. All the while of course we had resort propaganda saying how everything was being dealt with and appropriate security measures were in place. Also, on the night (and following day) of the blast, the conduct of the Chairmen of the Inner Circle and the Head of Security remains unexplained and (seemingly) deeply disturbing.

    If you haven’t got the joke already lets put it really simply. If you have a nice residential room above the multiversity, then you were exposed to a very real risk of getting blown up that night – of course not to mention all the resort disco goers.

    Out of your need to become close to Osho you are close to what exactly? What, you don’t like getting blown up? Would that be serious?

    If it really was an Islamic terrorist cell that blew up the Bakery – remember there was intelligence from Headley, and a Karachi based militant group had a special Osho resort video night – then all the authentic Osho sannyassins that have been banned from the resort will not be exposed to this risk of getting blown up…at the resort, that is.

    So that was the joke. Did you like it?

    What about all the original Osho sannyasins that are still in the groove of making the regular jaunt to the resort, decade after decade. Ask them and they will give you all kinds of justifications for their implicit support for the resort and affiliated organisations. Still, the only way you will get a clear answer from them – all be it shrouded in fog – is if they do something like post their comments on a website under an assumed name. Talk about taking a stand for what you believe in!

    How is it to live divided like this? Funny thing is you don’t know! A hypocritical laugh or anonymous web postings in tacit support of the resort is pathetic. Sure you pretend to meditate, can tell great jokes, and give breathtaking sermons, yet as a person you are far away from completion. A person on the path of integrating rather than smothering their different aspects – of becoming whole – is light years ahead on the path.

    Keep paroting your Master without an ounce of your own intelligence. When that fails and your mind becomes distressingly slowed such that fear and confusion set in, run to your executive mentor – who promises you more fun times, a nice room, and a seat on the board – for advice. Forget all your intuitions, all that you have seen, and all that you know to be true. Forget about what sits right in your heart, and forget that you cannot hide your past actions from your own mind. Forge ahead blindly and if you do not enjoy creating much pain and suffering for others, at least enjoy making a good Osho joke of it!

  2. Well written, Lokesh.

    Today´s no thought of the day…(Osho´s smilies for Lokesh)

    Loneliness is when you hanker for something, some occupation; when you hanker for the other and you miss the other, that is loneliness. And when you have started enjoying it, the beauty, the austere beauty of being alone, the silence, the stillness, the joy of just being, breathing in the sun, just sitting under a tree doing nothing, listening to the birds, just being utterly herenow,
    and a great joy arises…aloneness.

  3. Abhay.. your lengthy and very first comment, which looks like was prepared before you have even read Lokesh´s article has a very unfitting timing.
    It is like someone puts a bowl of chili before a streaming pot of coffee.

  4. Kavita says:

    Lokesh each one has a ..
    unique way of expression …
    but truth itself is abstract ..

    Truth can neither be framed ..
    nor comprehended …

    Truth and Enlightenment ..
    are an inseparable couple in that sense ..

    then there is only utter silence / utter nakedness ..
    one has no choice but to keep going ..

    All words are really meaningless ..

    but then life is paradoxical ..


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  5. Lokesh says:

    Well, I suppose Abhay just needed to get that off his chest. Sounds like a severe case of bronshiteus. Get well soon.

  6. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    Prem Abhay,

    Why don’t you start your own thread next time?

    Your response had very little to do with Lokesh’s posting.

    If the Ponna Resort is really so terrible, why do you bother to go there? Let the lawyers and authoritarian personalities play their games, and get on with your own game. Stop looking outside and look within. Forget the past.

  7. So Jenny… now the response with Lokesh´s posting..

    Since i have read this post, my metaphor creator software has the same feeling as if one sips a good well brewed coffee; does not matter on the highway, in down town or during the work break….

  8. Truth or enlightenment is an illusory commodity or an experience based solely on one´s own perception is a debate, from the time man started thinking.
    Fact is… there is a complete industry around it, and every new comer tries to create his notch in the highly crowded and brutally competitive market.
    Money involved in this branch of human endeavour may not be that much but amount of emotional energy involved is tremendous.

    That is why i say.. Lokesh´s article is like a well brewed Coffee…. but human beings need or they think they need, hundred and one other things too. For example a croissant with coffee or a baquette and two eggs omelatte… and list goes on…

  9. Kavita says:

    illussion is also an illusion probably

  10. frank says:

    ……..life`s not worth a damn
    till you can shout out “i am what i am”
    –gloria gaynor….

  11. So what is the truth? I think in order for the truth to be ‘you’ have to get out of the way for it to happen….

    I think, this is one of the most famous signature tune of 2010 Satsang scene and spiritual literature. It impresses the audience and creates the impression, speaker or writer must have gone away from the way of truth.

    How one can bring these people back?
    If it is a guy, show him a gorgeous looking woman in the audience or bring an architect who discusses the cost factor of new energy field around the TRUTH.
    To woman.. as they are not so much flattered by the visuals. few simple sentences will do the trick, ” you are really a modern day RAbia or Meera or a Zen Master with a lion´s roar in a female body.”

  12. Kavita says:

    and for Shantam to really sing .. the ” l ” has to go maybe

  13. This is a great Punch.. Kavita..
    My hypothesis is future spiritual scene will not be that condemnatory to “I” .
    Present day ” I” has taken the shape of Devil of the medieval ages. Make it disappear like an egg in the magician´s hat and one can see it is nothing more than Satya Sai baba kind of tricks.

  14. One of another hypothesis from shantam with small
    “i” is.. the next big wave of spirituality from India will be spread by a person who does not have the Santa Claus kind of look!
    Beard and robes age has lost its significance and to the brave and intelligent world it represents more a conman ship than authenticity.
    To be taken seriously.. one has to be just ordinary.
    May be this is the reason.. Osho Vatican does not publicised Osho´s photos. Indirectly they want to give the message Osho is another J Krishnamurti.

  15. May be this article by Lokesh radiates so much sincerity and authenticity that most of readers can find it difficult to comment..it really touches the SILENCE AND STILLNESS point.

  16. bob says:

    This Lokesh has no credibility.
    Yesterday he said he worked in the British Embassy in Beijing for 2 years, and could translate Chinese.
    Then he was caught lying on that, and he owned up to the lie.
    So, who’s going to believe him now, with this Poonjaji story?
    No credibility, pal.
    Now you gotta live with it, Luca.
    You will have to establish some trust in your audience, your readers here, for your words to hold any weight.

    I’m glad you put in that ending quote from Osho though, from his series ‘The Great Zen Master: Ta Hui’.
    If just one person (the right person) is directed to the original talks, then all your efforts here will be worthwhile.

    Link at my site for the complete Ta Hui Osho audio mp3′s, and PDF book — all open access to anyone in the world:

    http://www.livingworkshop.net/ob-thegreatzenmastertahui.html

    Cheers

  17. Kavita says:

    what you wrote in your 7.27 pm comment .. Iqbal is true

  18. Anand says:

    Nice point of view Abhay, I agree with you. But now ..
    what to say, here it goes:

    Some time ago I revealed that Anand is AND ALWAYS WAS virtual. I created Anand about one year ago and he grew and he got a life of his own.

    Soon he became Frankanandstein and talked of visits to Pune last year (which never happened), visits to the German Bakery site (since I invented him, I know he surely was not there). All his sights on airports of important people, he invented it all.

    Then Anand got fixed on his nemsesis Bubbie, who he imagined as a former CIA agent haunting Osho and fighting all the ‘good’ sannyasins. He even drove up
    to Oregon this summer to find him there, all made up of course.

    He never owned any real estate or developing company in Florida and never went to Costa Rica either.

    Anand then got sentimental and befriended Shantam and invited him for chai in Freiburg, wanted to have sushi with Lokesh on Ibiza and made up stories
    about Osho dental notes. All fantasy of course.

    Abhay and Frank got it right recently, I lost control of Anand and nearly handed him over completely to Frank.

    I had my last meeting with Anand yesterday. We walked the shores at Pollenca beach Mallorca and shared a glass of sweet red wine.
    I told him, “Anand it is time to separate, I am sorry”.

    At first I did not know, how to separate from him. Should I kill him or let him suicide? I shared my feelings with him.

    Anand said, not to worry. He is taking off on a cruise this week with a sailing yacht into the unknown. The yacht is called ‘The Thundering Rainbow’ and he and his friends are sailing to find the source of dolphin songs near the Australian riff barriers. He will be gone and out of WiFi reach for at least one year.

    I was sad and happy at the same time and wished him all the best.

    We spent some nice time together.
    Bye, bye Anand, I will miss you!

  19. Tantan says:

    Dear Lokesh

    Enlightenment is always sudden, the awareness is a gradual process.
    Osho had the gift to enlighten anyone then and there, he couldn’t force it though. Maybe all the birds and monkeys in Pune 1,2 and the ranch were all enlightened. So sorry you couldn’t get it.
    XX

  20. Anand created virtual Anand….

    I created Anand about one year ago and he grew and he got a life of his own….
    —-
    —–

    We spent some nice time together.
    Bye, bye Anand, I will miss you!

    Who is saying bye bye to Anand….??

    Is this bloody Zen quan?

  21. bob says:

    I never did like this Poonjaji guy much.

    some salient bio points on the “Papa” for y’all:

    — his uncle (mother’s brother) was the fairly well-known Hindu advaita sadhu, Ramateertha, who committed suicide at the age of 33 by jumping off some mountain cliff in the Himalayas — Osho has talked on this.

    — Poonjaji spends his childhood years immersed in the Krishna fantasy world prevalent among Hindu devotional types, chanting Krishna’s name continuously; living with Krishna, his friend, by his side (shades of “walking with Jesus”), etc.

    — not interested in mundane family things, but gets married at age 20 anyway, and fathers 2 children, pleasing his parents.

    — joins the British Army, right at the time when most Indians are joining the anti-Raj pro-Indian freedom movement. WW2 is in the making.

    — becomes a satsang giver only very late in life, as a retirement occupation,attracting some Osho sannyasins and others interested in this type of “sitting at a master’s feet”, right after their master has exited the stage. Also, his presentations include some fairly circumspect and boring peope, e.g., Andrew Cohen (yes, frank, that’s the original Brian doppelganger Cohen) and an American suburban housewife who got bored with her life in ‘burbs, and thought this satsang scene would be just thing to revitalize her post-menapausal ennui — renamed “Gangji”. And others.

    — tries to give some sort of a Chinese Zen Master impression to his methods, but can’t really pull it off — his pupils are mostly western impressionable refugees from the “I wanna get it” crowd, overly quick to validate a pseudo-Zen gathering by a daddy figure (Lokesh, listen up here — the name “Papaji” is not created out of an awareness of “yourself” as the Godhead/Source — and you are criticising others for a big-daddy fixation? Looks like you Papaji pupils are the ones in that mud puddle (shades of “The Pope”, il Papa, Father Jose, etc. in the Christian Church monikers…).

    Funny, I was thinking this morning that Osho actually set this guy up for the ’90-’97 sannyasin re-direct, a side-show of sorts for someplace to fall for the guru-fixated types, maybe similar to the role the Unitarian Church played in secular/scientific Darwinian environment of England over the last few centuries.

    But, all in all, Lokesh, I think this was a good post by you — you sounded sincere in your writing. Well done, bro’. Respect.

  22. bob says:

    That’s right Shantam, who will believe “Anand”, a self-admitted liar.
    There are three things he’s missing:

    Credibility. Credibility. and Credibility.

    It’s not a Zen koan, it’s an embarassment.

  23. bob says:

    Plus, frank has said he created “Anand”, and so far “frank” has not been known to “lie”.

  24. Bob—Yes. you are coming out from this…
    “Dear Brothers and Sisters, i love you all, attitude.”

    First time i have read in clear terms, somebody´s daring attempt to do some background check of Papaji…
    And still i beleive.. some inner opening must have taken place in Punja ji´s presence, because he really gave grand fatherly attention to the few who visited him.

    This warmth may have done wonders.

    PS_who has confessed to create Anand?

  25. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    Bob,

    Your audio mp3s aren’t working

  26. bob says:

    Jenny,
    the Osho mp3′s aren’t working for you?
    now, that’s a problem that needs immediate attention!
    what browser are you using? Explorer, Firefox, or Safari?

    Can you see the mp3 players, or what exactly is the problem? Let me know…

  27. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    Google Chrome

  28. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    I click on play and nothing happens

  29. bob says:

    hey thanks jen,
    I will have to troubleshoot it…Google Chrome…
    thanks again….

  30. frank says:

    anand,
    you`re a boring wanker.
    no need for the bullshit farewell speech.
    just piss off.
    btw.i have sent your balls to the thought police,17,kp.
    they are deciding what to do with them……

  31. bob says:

    there’s your answer “Shantam”.
    “frank” created “Anand”,
    and now it looks like he’s doing a cyber autopsy on the poor “dude”, just like “Dave” did to the “HAL” 9000 computer in “2001: A Space Odyssey”, by “Stanley Kubrick” when “he” pulled the hard drives and memory out enroute to “Jupiter” and “Beyond”.
    Body parts being mailed to “Kor 17″ it looks like.
    Nasty.

  32. bob says:

    Jenny,
    I tried to open up those Osho mp3′s using Google Chrome browser, but they don’t fly.
    It looks like this new browser can’t play mp3′s. I don’t know why.

    Only suggestion would be to try using the other more well-known browsers like MS Explorer, or Moxilla Firefox — they seem to work fine. You should be able to download any browser quickly, and free of charge too.
    good luck.

  33. If Anand is only a virtual reality, same can be said about Frank too…
    Why this genious satirist has no face.
    Is Mr. Stephen Hawking playing the games here, checking the theory of quantum physicas, If universe can create itself from nothing. how difficult it is to create identities?

  34. bob says:

    How difficult to create identities from nothing?

    Not very.

    Hey frank, did you create this “Stephen Hawking” character too? I just saw a video interview with him, slumped over in his wheelchair, talking with his synthesized voice, and nothing was moving. Nothing!
    Not even any drooling from his slumped tilted head…and the sentences were out of some L. Ron Hubbard book, or Tom Swift, nothing profound. The universe was created from nothing, says The Hawk, what a crock…this guy is the greatest genius physicist in the world today?! Can’t you limey’s do any better than this? Looks like he should take his rightful place in that slow Lithuanian post-eloctroshock march with Brian Doppelganger and the crew….hey, what’s goin’ on here…!? frank, what’s the skinny, bro’……?

  35. prem bubbie says:

    It would be wonderful if I were to say that you fools posting here are high as a kite by way of nitrous…. wishful thinking … what the fuck are you idiots babbling about now? From that jug head meister Prem Abhay- which one are you? Anand from across the pond a.k.a. James Bond… all virtual of course..
    Shantam I. Singh-me a song, you’re the piano man… changes his name to give himself praise every time he posts, for all to see- narcissistic bastard! Where’s rajneesh when you really need him?

  36. Lokesh says:

    Some interesting posts. Bob made some good points but is way off target on others.
    First off, I don’t give a flying fuck about my credibility ratings. I have no desire to be credible…incredible…yeah, that sounds more like it.
    Your ‘factual’ take on H W L Poonja is all very well, but I’d guess you never actually met the man. For years I sat in darshans with Osho and watched as even the toughest of egos melted at his feet, although there were a few exceptions, there always will be, which brings into question why it is that people who are not interested in letting go end up at a master’s feet in the first place.
    As I mentioned in a previous post, when I first heard about Poonjaji from my wife I groaned inwardly at the thought of going to see another guru in shit pot India. One of my oldest friends was a star disciple of Poonja’s, so before I met the old boy I phoned up my friend and asked, ‘What’s the story with this old geezer?’
    He replied, ‘You have to have a brass neck.’
    And that is why within three days of arriving in Lucknow I had Poonja’s undivided attention.’
    On first take he was a dithering old man in his dotage. Up close he was extremely intense and a real force to be reckoned with. The old boy blew me out of my socks in one minute flat and showed me exactly how far I’d tavelled in forty years of living.
    If you met me you would realize immediately that I am not a man who is looking for big daddy. I am afraid of very little that life can throw at me and even if something is shaking me I just grit my teeth and face it – alone. One thing I don’t need is daddy to hold my hand. I’ve met enough daddies in my life to know I don’t need one.

    To quote one of my heroes, Chuang Tzu says:
    The perfect man of Tao remains unknown.
    Perfect virtue produces nothing.
    No-self is true-self.
    And the greatest man is nobody.

    The greatest man is nobody. I like that.

  37. Kavita says:

    ” I phoned up my friend and asked, ‘What’s the story with this old geezer?’
    He replied, ‘You have to have a brass neck.’
    And that is why within three days of arriving in Lucknow I had Poonja’s undivided attention ” … l wonder if that was the real reason ? well l dont know what the real reason could be .. Lokesh

    Chuang Tzu says:
    The perfect man of Tao remains unknown.
    Perfect virtue produces nothing.
    No-self is true-self.
    And the greatest man is nobody.

    lam wondering if the perfect man is invisible too

    Bye for now

  38. Lokesh says:

    Well, the christian churces have had people believing in the invisible man for 2000 years.
    As for the real reason…well, I suppose I am trying to be reasonable.

  39. Kavita says:

    Lokesh .. l love bruce lee


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  40. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    Excellent post Lokesh, it did leave me speechless…

    Reminds me of the Enlightenment Intensive which was very powerful.

    Words cannot adequately express the language of the heart but I’m glad you are giving it a go.

    If time is an illusion, how can enlightenment be a gradual process?

    Love is seeing the unity under the imaginary diversity

  41. Seems like Ego is like Choclate.
    It melts when on the fire. Take the fire away and it is again solid.
    Same is with people in Darshans with any master…
    It is the power of the Master on one side and greed and need of the disciple on the other.

    And love affair happens…!!

  42. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    I am he as you are he as you are me and we are all together.

    Elementary penguin singing Hari Krishna

    I am the eggman, they are the eggmen.
    I am the walrus, goo goo g’joob.

  43. Kavita says:

    Looks like We are in a Wonderful Safari .. Jenny

  44. An Osho Joke…
    As a breakfast coffee for Bubbie, the man who works hard six days a week with the name “Prem Bubbie”, it must be at an Indian call Centre, everybody has another name than real. Sharma is Smith, Verma is Victor, Banta singh is Mr. Khan!

    Mr. Marx rings his home. A strange voice answers. “Who is that?” he asks.

    “The maid, sir.”

    “But we have no maid,” he says.

    “Your wife engaged me this morning,” she said.

    “Oh, all right. Let me speak to my wife.”

    “Well, sir, she’s upstairs in bed with a man, and…”

    “What!” he shouts. “Look miss, whatever your name is.”

    “Pauline, sir.”

    “Right, Pauline. You want to earn ten thousand dollars?”

    “Ah, yes sir.”

    “Then go to the hall cupboard and you will find a loaded shotgun there. Go upstairs and kill my cheating wife and that bastard with her.”

    “Yes, sir.” Marx waits; he hears two shots, and then the maid’s voice: “All right, sir. What shall I do now?”

    “Throw them in the swimming pool until I get home.”

    “Sir, what swimming pool?”

    “This is 973-60452,” Marx asks shakily, “is not it?”

  45. If That ‘Mosque’ ISN’T Built, This Is No Longer America …a letter from Michael Moore…

    This letter was in my mail box forwarded by 85 years old energetic woman Ma Jeevan. She always refers to Mr. Moore as the Rebel, a man Osho would have loved.

    Similarly, there are many commantators in German Osho Times, In Osho World, Sadhana the spokes woman of resort writes in her blog, Osho Bytes-one common facotr they all share is to advise Prime Ministers and Presidents, always finding fault in their education, population and fiscla policy.
    Sounds very intelligent…

    And none.. raises the question about their own community, about the life and polices after Osho.
    Why??

  46. http://ibnlive.in.com/videos/130817/india-is-a-corporate-hindu-state-arundhati.html

    Meditators or no meditators, please watch the above link. The power, grace, integrity and volunrabilty of Ms. Arundhati Roy.

  47. Kavita says:

    There comes the Bull in the china shop ..

    l wonder why this china shop was created ?

    the bull does’nt bother me nor the china shop

  48. Kavita, forgive me, if i am wrong.
    The above poem will beome a fitting tribute to the contemprary seekers, if i add one line more..

    The bull does’nt bother me nor the china shop
    What bothers me is…..
    me me me and you you you…

    Solution??

    Let us go to one week group, ” Subway of love.”

  49. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1311300/Husband-enraged-wife-cooked-eggs-kills-others.html

    22 years after the creation of Mystic Rose, is this also the work of Mr.Steve jobs of Apple inc. to publicised it before the world at large.

  50. Lokesh says:

    I followed your thread to the guy who shot a lot of people because his wife cooked his eggs wrong. what’s so interesting about that? The world is full of people in a murderous rage. The reason the media prints and shows such negative stories is that it supplies a quick fix for people who are addicted to negativity. ‘Indian guru says love thy neighbour’ as a headline won’t sell any newspapers. But if some mullah says we are gonna murder you bastards for invading our country…well buy me a dozen and one for my cousin.

  51. For days, i was thinking to find out when was the last time, some one at any Osho platform has discussed,
    ” Mystic Rose”, the 21 days social and individual thereaputic meditation group, which cuts through layers of bullshit.

    So i have chosen the above news of man killing his wife for not cooking the eggs properly. It is a mirror of our inner rage.
    Love thy neighbour, every Indian guru is saying. To create this quality of love, Osho has added the extra ordinary techniques. No doubt, Osho has spoken so praise full about Thomas alwa Edison.
    looks like, Osho was thinking himself in the same range.

  52. How important are the eggs, it was in the news few months ago, Charles the green crusader, the 60 plus man who is still a prince and not a king, gets 6 boiled eggs everyday on his breakfast table, so that it is easier to chose the 2 perfectly boiled eggs.

    This is what makes a differance between aristocracy and a working class man.

  53. Lokesh and others too,
    If you have seen this link about Arundhati Roy, can you share your opinion about her vibes, “energy” or the contents of her speaking.
    This i am asking for the reason as i have seen, sannyasins have a keen sense of observing the people and looking through.
    As i see, she is one of the most daring and fearless persons in India, where to speak against the status Que is almost equal to mutiny.
    And than she is charmingly beautiful, eloquent in spoken and written English; so for my taste..she is an Amma!
    But i am curious also to see, what others on this forum think as an observer.

  54. prem bubbie says:

    Yeah right…Chuang Tzu was the guy who didn’t whether he was dreaming that he was a butterfly or that he was a butterfly dreaming that it was a human! Osho made a funny comment about that too!! These enlightened bastards don’t know their ass from their elbow!

  55. Lokesh says:

    Shantam, I watched that interview and found it utterly boring. Only thing good about it was their’Goodness, gracious me’ accents.
    Love Bubble, good point. Thing is, I suspect Mr Tzu’s statement came out of his psychedelic period and therfore means little to the uninitiated.

  56. bob says:

    speaking of identities and life….

    every day about 350,000 new babies are born on this beautiful planet of ours — with no identities whatsoever.

    every day about 150,000 people die — with well-developed and massive identities.

    the human spiritual journey seems to be, in a nutshell:
    ‘can i regain my no-identity state before i die’.

    ‘will this ‘gradual’ path (life itself) lead to the ‘instant’ awakening (enlightenment), and will i regain my birth innocence again through my journey of experiences?’

    Stay tuned folks….by this time tomorrow, 350,000 will have been given that opportunity, and 150,000 will have lost it. They come, they go…

  57. Krishna and Punja ji, the Papaji of Advaita movement

    Krishna, lord Krishna..i am your Gopi
    My Krishna..take me in your heart, my beloved…
    My soul, my virgin soul craves for your touch…
    Oh my Krishna.. My lord Krishna…

    Krishna.. No one can say with authenticity whether He is a mythological figure or an historical one.

    But He is the top three figures of Indian spirituality.
    Sri Punja ji for decades was worshiping Krishna. He must be pouring his devotion out, must have many photos of Krishna around his living space..must have cried and danced around the statue of Krishna like other thousands and thousands of Krishna devotees, who after a certain period radiate a sublime fragrance of feminine grace and charm.

    And no one can say with authenticity whether Krishna is a part of mythological tale or it was a reality…

    And even it was a reality story says, ” After the great civil war of India, lonely Krishna was sleeping under a tree and a arrow of hunter killed Him, The Chakra in His feet gave the impression from the distance as if it is as eye of a dear.

    Still… Krishna lives..like Buddha or Jesus…and uncountable numbers of people may have achieved a last destination of human destiny without even bothering they have reached home.

    In this regards, what Osho´s disciples and managers comprising of rational generation X of 20th century, think about the status of their Master?

  58. Lokesh says:

    Krshna! That’s the blue guy who shows up on Flower Power Night in Ibiza’s Pascha Discotheque, Right?

    One of the most noteworthy though underrated parties in Ibiza is Flower Power with original Pacha jock DJ Piti. This happy hippy fiesta is probably one of the lesser known to the majority of outsiders who visit the island, but it is easily one of the most popular amongst those in the know.

    Totally unique atmosphere almost anywhere in the world, likely to give you memories that you’ll take to your grave and bring a tear to your eye every time you think about them. The highlight of the night is when the blue-skinned Hindu god Krishna is carried through the club on a pallaquin to the sound of George Harrisons ‘My Sweet Lord’. One other example is the time every single person in the club joined hands whilst chanting John Lennon’s “Give Peace A Chance”. Supreme!

  59. Ma Prem Jenny says:

    And I thought you made it up!

    Only 48 Euros

    http://www.ibiza-spotlight.com/night/promoters/flower_power_i.htm

  60. Lokesh says:

    Yes, but if you live here you can get on the guest list, which does not exclude you from the 12 euros for a small bottle of water.

  61. Someone should take the initiative to declare john Lennon, The Enlightend Beatels.
    His shrine in Liverpool can attract thousands of people, make a round around the shrine, chanting 101 times “Give peace a Chance”, and the wishes in the heart will get fullfilled in no time.
    Some one from strong Indian community in UK can certainly do it, after all back home, so many magical shrines around so many names have been created out of little something.

  62. After seeing the entry charges of 48 euros, and i presume people pay it happily, i would like to give suggestion to my brothers and sisters in the managerial post at Pune, please, send some delegate to this club to learn the art of attracting people.
    One thing is sure, this club does not play,
    Kajrare Kajrare tere kare kare Naina…

    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

    I close my eyes and see 20, 25 western Mas learning Bollywood dance at Osho plaza disco.
    Beats are so strong that birds have stoped taking shelter at Ashram trees.

  63. frank says:

    whether you pay 48 euros for a disco trip
    or you spend 48 years wandering round the jungli in your chuddies mumbling “who am i?”

    remember what the bidi walla said……

    it is in the nature of being to see adventure in becoming..
    as it is in the very nature of becoming to seek peace in being….

  64. Lokesh says:

    Yes he did say that. He also said, ‘There are no steps to self-realization. There is nothing gradual about it. it happens suddenly and is irreversable.’
    But you know these bidi wallahs, they are always up to cosmic hanky panky. ‘Ganesh beedies!’ Get it? The joke is on you.

  65. Just was turning the old pages of sannyasnews and read about an article about Unmani and her website not knowing dot com.

    So a thought arose, why the western participants at sannyasnews does not talk about the awakened people living in between them.
    Why only the asian brands?

  66. US business schools/ Osho Mystery school(s)

    Business is the new Dharma. Economics, finance, commodities are the new Scriptures. Millions of brilliant brains have got the will and passion to become managers, to touch a product and create world market around them.
    There is no class or cultural barrier. Egos need to be transcended, profit depends upon oneness.

    And when i look around, the neo spiritual movements started in the 20th centuries are looking like the industrial ruins, once the founders with global vision have died. Managers of these few sects have only one agenda how to preserve the vast real estates accumulated by these inner entrepreneurs.
    What we see now on the spiritual arena are the small time traders selling their meditative ice creams on three wheelers!

    Long live Organised Religions!

  67. Lokesh says:

    Shantam, you are definitely developing a very warped sense of logic. Here are the lyrics from a song that is a response to your last post.

    ARMAGEDDON DAYS (are here again)

    They’re 5 miles high
    As the crow flies
    Leavin’ vapour trails
    Across a blood red sky
    Movin’ in from the East
    Towards the West
    With balaclava helmets
    Over their heads
    YES!

    But if you think that Jesus Christ is coming
    Honey, you’ve got another thing coming
    If he ever finds out who’s hijacked his name
    He’ll cut out his heart and turn in his grave

    Islam is rising
    The Christians mobilising
    The world is on it’s elbows and knees
    It’s forgotten the message
    And worships the creeds

    “It’s War” she cried
    “It’s War” she cried
    “This is War!”
    Drop your possessions
    All you simple folk
    You will fight them on the beaches
    in your underclothes
    You will thank the good lord
    For raising the Union Jack
    You’ll watch the ships sail out of harbour
    And the bodies come floating back
    Watch the ships sail out of harbour
    And the bodies come floating back

    If the real Jesus Christ were to stand up today
    He’d be gunned down cold by the C.I.A.
    Oh, the lights that now burn brightest
    Behind stained glass
    Will cast the darkest shadows
    Upon the human heart
    But God didn’t build himself that throne
    God doesn’t live in Israel or Rome
    God doesn’t belong to the Yankee dollar
    God doesn’t plant the bombs for Hezbollah
    God doesn’t even go to church
    And God won’t send us down to Allah to burn
    God will remind us what we already know
    That the human race is about to reap what it’s sown

    Islam is rising
    The Christians mobilising
    The world is on it’s elbows and knees
    It’s forgotten the message
    And worships the creeds
    The world is on it’s elbows and knees
    It’s forgotten the message
    And worships the creeds

    Armageddon days are here again
    Armageddon days are here again
    Armageddon days are here again
    Armageddon Days Are HERE!!!

    back to Lyric Book index

  68. The world is on it’s elbows and knees
    It’s forgotten the message
    And worships the creeds

    I really don´t know who was bringing the message, UPS or DHL and who was sending this unwanted message, but worship of the creeds is a Reality, a fact written all around.
    It must be serving some very basic human need. Why multitude of people do this worshiping and fighting like crazy to protect their brand.

  69. Prem Abhay says:

    Guten morgen to you all…oops, too early in the morning and I haven’t had my kaffee laced with chilli yet.

    Shantam you say that I probably had my little number prepared even before I read Lokesh’s daring dash of wizardry. What makes you think I even bothered to read it in the first place? I of course dismiss the majority of your comments outright. I hope that this enlightens you a little about who am I, and how I approach this site.

    What is this I hear…Osho attended Master’s day celebrations? What…he created other special days of spiritual remembrance and significance, and even during the so-called Zen era of Pune 2? I am confused! I thought that Osho only ever turned up for the New Years Eve party!?!

    And Ma Genie Genius, if my post had something to do with the lead article than it would have been a fLuke. You say…why do I bother to go to the resort. Huh, are you kidding. I just got seconded for this job, and from what I have learnt I agree with you general position. Since you seem to know a little about law and authoritarianism at the resort, on what legal authority can anyone at the resort stop something that Osho either supported or initiated? Like all such interferences and infringements, the management (and Inner Circle) say things like ‘we are stopping Osho becoming a religion’.

    My question is, why then did Osho not stop all those supposedly religion forming events and celebrations? Perhaps it is that he was simply an unwilling participant? Actually it seems not, for he not only attended, but also initiated some such events. As said before, this included in the ‘Zen’ era of Pune 2. So tell me, with the legal authority to only make practical managerial decisions about the day to day affairs of maintaining and offering Osho’s legacy, on what grounds can resort management (and the Inner Circle) overrule Osho?

    Was it that Osho did not want a religion formed around him – there are plenty of good quotes for that line of argument – but he just was not too good at making that happen? Does the resort management or Inner Circle know better? Maybe they would like to think so, but they have no legal authority to take such decisions – unless of course they want to go anywhere else on this planet, and set up their own Osho centre.

    You see it is a little contradiction here that has everyone puzzled. Osho left his legacy to an Inner Circle. This included the Pune centre, his books, discourses, pictures, robes, etc. Of course while Osho was in the body he was the ultimate authority on spiritual matters. When he left the body, he declared there to be no successor, and left a practical managerial body (the Inner Circle) to care-take his affairs. So, at the main centre, no one can play guru. No one has any authority to impose their preferences (likes or dislikes) on anyone else.

    The contradiction is, that at any other centre, you have the freedom to offer whatever aspects of Osho’s legacy you like – so long as what you offer is authentic and complete, and so long as OIF/Inner Circle/Global Connections does not succeed in the effort to take over and control the centres. If you have never liked Master’s day, then at your own little centre don’t have a Master’s day. If you like a good rave party for New Years, than have a good rave party.

    You might here ask that this idea of offering everything of Osho is a little impractical, and decisions have to be made about what aspects or events of Osho to make available at any given time or place. This kind of thinking is misguided. The background, as already stated, is that at the main centre everything should theoretically be available. The same is the case with publication of his words. The practical decision about what to choose is simply based on what people want.

    The practical managerial decisions at Number17 Koregaon Park (and the publishing branch of OIF) should be based on an efficient system of gauging people’s interests. If almost no one turns up for a certain celebration, then maybe downscale it next year. If no one turns up next year, then maybe call it quits for a year or two, but still listen for feedback as to whether or not interest is starting up again. This same practical process should be carried out in all areas of the resort, and with all media publications. It is a little like if you set up your own centre just the way you like it. If no one turns up, you might think you are having a good time, but you may well go broke!

    The Inner Circle has no legal authority to change what Osho left behind in any way. If Osho started a certain celebration event and did not call an end to such an event, there is no legal power to have it stopped. This is especially evident if it was initiated or undertaken during the last years of Pune 2. Likewise, there is no legal authority to edit Osho’s words in the extensive way that OIF has – even if you think people might like it, even if it becomes popular, and especially if it changes the meaning such that your own personal stance is promoted at the expense of other counter-balancing points.

    OIF has edited Osho’s words to reflect their supposedly Zen style resort. People read the slanted books, come to the supposedly Zen style resort, and think everything is beautiful. They just wonder what all these banned and ex-sannyasins are doing complaining all the time. They have essentially been hypnotised.

    The plan of course is to go global with this strategy, with more supposedly Zen style resorts. All the other ‘smaller’ centres dotted around the world need also to be kept under tight control. If these centres started offering aspects of Osho that the current gang does not like, it could expose some people to the truth of their scam, and this might create an unravelling of their iron-like grip on spiritual power.

    So you don’t call what OIF, the Resort, and the Inner Circle are doing creating a religion around Osho. What do you call it then? Perhaps it is simply and international organised crime network.

    OK enough of that stuff. It is now time for the skinny of it.

    I know it looks a little like it but I am not a spy.
    Some of you may also wonder if I am Enlightened,
    or at least whether I think I am, well I am not.

    I know how people like conspiracies,
    but I am not one of them.

    ‘Who am I’ seems to be what this thread is about so I better cut to the chase.

    I am not Herr Prem Abhay.
    I am not the Real Prem Abhay.
    I am not the virtual Prem Abhay.
    I am not the dead Prem Abhay.

    I am not Harri Om,
    nor am I Harriet Om.

    I am not Swami Detective,
    nor am I Detective Swami.

    I am Operation Prem Abhay.

    I am real all right,
    but more machine than human.
    Ever seen The Transformers?

    So there it is!
    All the cards on the table.
    You folk reckon you are interested in the truth.
    Well, here it is.

    No more a surface reflection.
    Truth is whole.
    It is completion.
    It is not That,
    as all these Papaji loko bozos mumble.
    It is This.
    It is Operation Prem Abhay.

    I swear it is with my hand (if I had one) solemnly atop a doctored and pirated Osho book.

    You know I had one conspiracy theory for a while that Anand was unintentionally revealing himself as Amrito. Then I thought that it was more and more intentional, in which case it could possibly be considered a virtual suicide. However, Operation Prem Abhay (that’s me) has some stuff at the end of this little comment which makes me again doubt this.

    The situation is a parallel with me (think of me as ‘the Machine’ if it is easier). I was pretending for a little while to be a real life Prem Abhay, who interestingly enough did have a few hassles with the resort – nothing much though, when all is said and done. And then of course me (the Machine) came along and started throwing my weight around. So of course it would have looked a little rude of me (the Machine) to make a relatively harmless Prem Abhay a potential target for the Osho ‘thought’ police.

    What to say…some things are better left as they are, at least for now.

    Love and hugs,
    virtually always (as opposed to always virtual),
    Operation Prem Abhay.

    Hey virtual Anand, any spare berths aboard your virtual yacht.

    Who am I? At the end of the rainbow you will find me on the yacht.

    So, what about this part of virtual Anand’s virtual transcript of virtual dental room conversation (Raj is Swami Devaraj is doc Amrito):

    Sunday AM, September 3, 1989

    It is a strange feeling. As I close my mouth I feel you are working on my teeth. In the night. And I know you cannot be because my mouth is closed. Right now it is there. Do you want to have at look at what can cause it. (gas again?) You can because this happens 3 or 4 times in the night. It is so actual and I know nobody can be doing it. Something in the nerves must be throbbing – in the way.
    ___________________________
    Raj, please help Geet.
    ____________________
    Can something be done. It harasses me the whole 24 hours. Whatever Raj and you decide you will never have such a willing patient. It is hurting now (sigh).
    _______________________________
    I can see. Don’t disturb your work. (Finished) OK.
    ___________________________
    What a failure of science. I am available. You can take my whole body. It does not matter to me but the pain is unnecessary suffering. I can leave the body this moment.
    Raj. What do you think, because as I close my mouth I am still feeling Geet’s work and in the night it becomes terrible.
    _____________________________
    It is really strange. My mouth is shut and Geet’s work continues inside my mouth. And you cannot think I am imagining.
    Geet do you think the explanation can help? (No). I can understand your difficulty. The piercing pain continues (another injection).
    ______________________________________

    End of transcript.

    What about Harri Om’s spicy little number:

    http://oshodemocracy.blogspot.com/2009/09/who-really-poisned-osho.html

    Excerpts from article:

    The idea of Osho being poisoned by United States authorities makes for a good story, but as has been regularly pointed out, it does not fit with Osho’s circumstances. For the two years following The Ranch break-up Osho at least appeared to be in reasonably health. He has admittedly said that since that time he has felt some deterioration in his health. However what does not make sense is the dramatic turn of events that occurred when Osho had a minor ear infection that simply would not heal. As explained by Osho, he spent the next 7 weeks gravelly ill in a battle of life and death. It was this sudden and rapid deterioration, of which he never seemed to recover from, that struck me…The unusual thing about the minor ear infection is that it simply would not heal.

    In Shakespeare’s ‘Hamelet’ Claudius poisoned Hamlet’s father by pouring a vial of a deadly poison into his ear while he was having an afternoon nap: ”with juice of cursed hebenon in a vial, and in the porches of my ears did pur the leperous distilment…that swift as quicksilver … courses through the natural gates and alleys of the body…Thus was I, sleeping, by a brother’s hand, of life, of crown, of queen, at once dispatched.”

    It was a discovery of the time that it was possible for fluid to pass from the middle ear to the back of the nose and throat. It was thought that this was caused by an ear infection causing a membrane to perforate. Hence it was known that a poison administered through the ear can actually be ingested. With the wisdom of modern medicine, it is now known that this passage is not the result of infection, and is called the Eustachian tube.

    Ear infections were frequent at the time, and as mentioned it was thought that a perforated ear drum meant that a liquid in the ear can pass through the perforation and travel to the back of the throat. Hence at the time of Shakespeare’s writings there was an account of a French surgeon being suspected of killing the King of France by giving him an ear infection.

    Two fictional references that involve poisoning via the Eustachian tube include:

    Huizinga E: Murder through the ear. Pract Oto-rhino-laryng, 1971.
    Kan JA: Atropine poisoning in Hawthane’s The Scarlet Letter. NEJM

    In the non-fictional domain we have the following reference (of poisoning via the Eustachian tube):

    Eclectic medical journal, Volume 22 – 1863, pp43-44 On Secret Poisoning – yet he was sorry to say he could not but repeat the statement he made last year in a paper on slow poisoning, read before the Royal Medico-Chirurgical Society of London….Nay, more, he even went a step further, and declared that he not only believed that we magnified the difficulty of perpetrating the crime, but that we were also inclined to exaggerate the facility of its detection.

    The article goes on to discuss how in small doses a slow death may result in the toxin going undetected.

    Also from Google, there has been a scientific study of the effects of thallium on rats:

    Revised Final Report: Toxicity of Thallium (I)
    DW-89922097 between EPA and the U.S. Department of Energy. ….In the comments by a Dr. Koller we have that … extra steps were taken in an attempt to diagnose an unexpected ear lesion that occurred in all groups of rats in this study.

    End of quoted text.

  70. Lokesh says:

    Is it a bird? Is it a palne? N0! It’s…it’s Super Abhay…the verbal windbag.

  71. anugrah says:

    Meditators or no meditators, please watch the above link. The power, grace, integrity and volunrabilty of Ms. Arundhati Roy.
    shantam, I saw the vedio , Interviewer karan Thapar, is asking tricky quetions,and not doing his job . and Arundhati is of course great and telling the turth…….this interview shows that media is not in public side most of side. They go to government side, so they can run business of selling news
    media was born to create bridge between normal people and people who run the counrties, but that is not the case.
    karan thapar again and again trying that Arundhati makes some statement , so he can put her down. My point is Arundhati shows her grace and power as authur and call out india a coorprate hindu state. , but other person who is working for cnn and talking interview shows clearily that he is leaning towards government knowing perfectly governemnt is the one who breaks the rules .and goes against constitution

  72. Abhay, being a native English speaking person, you are quite good in prose, and many facts are also pointing towards the right direction, but some where something is unripe around you or your counterpart Harri OM.
    On a certain level, whether it is Dr. Amrito, Shantam Or Lokesh, Abhay, Rajneesh or Ms. A2Z, we are unwilling to accept something is not fully unfolded in our being, and by resisting to look at the missing link, we are bound to harm things in the equal proportion to our authority.
    JAyesh and Amrito, for example are too small the chaps to carry forward the complete package of Osho. They are too proud to take the cooperation of others.
    What is the way than?
    To go on reducing the contents of the package or to take paid help.

    My suggestion as per my understanding will be to create an environment where in the beginning every initiated disciple gets the opportunity to laugh, cry and than be silent.
    It means Mystic Rose is the must for every seeker on the way with Osho.

    Why up to now not more than 5 hundred people per year do it at 17, Kpark is a matter of a complete new thread.

  73. anugrah says:

    this is not first time i saw interview like that. here in america on cnn , sometimes micheal moore, world famous outspoken documentry makes comes and try to speak to american people about war crimes and about wall street crimes and these journalists in media trying to put him down and try to change subject and government would not allow this movies to run in cinemas, do you call it freedom or domenation
    bottom line here is is media could be blessings to world , if they tell the turth , but that is not the case. media now a days is just business and ratings and always lean towards rich and politicians

  74. Anugrah, my point of insisting towards this interview was for the reason to check out, whether in a broader sense, we are the passive masses, happy with work, money, sex and family (add discourses too)
    or we are the ambitious ones to sell our knowledge to get more respect and luxuries or we are those tribe of a miniority who have got Conscience.

    It is even more important for Osho´s people to see whether the inner viagra they are taking so proudly has worked on the being or not, as, like Osho we are in the for front to raise fingers towards other people and organisational short comings.

  75. Just the other day i got an e mail from a long time Ashram inhabitant woman who treats Michael Moore as a rebel. I wrote her back few jokes about the Ashram sorry resort.
    Here is her reply-

    Hey Beloved Shantam I Singh

    What’s your problem? You seem to be so snide and negative about the Resort and you never come here. Kirtan and Disco can live together. The Resort is a paradise on earth for me, and I am grateful to be able to come here in this time of my life. Why make yourself unhappy about something other people are doing. It’s none of your business anyway .You try putting love in your heart and then you may see things in a different perspective. Love. xxxxx

  76. Lokesh says:

    Shantam, you say: My suggestion as per my understanding will be to create an environment where in the beginning every initiated disciple gets the opportunity to laugh, cry and than be silent.

    Makes me think of a scene I left half an hour ago. I was sitting on some rocks by the sea watching some quite negative thoughts crashing around in my head when a female voice says, ‘Hi, Lokesh.’
    I look up and see Astiko, a sannyasin tantra reacher. She has on a pair of heart-shaped sunglasses and a genuine smile. Just seeing her moved me into a positive dimension. A conversation about the judgemental mind began and soon a few people are hanging out and chatting, perhaps 50% are sannyasins, the rest freaks, misfits, world travellers..
    I take a swim and when I return an hour later the gathering has grown. I just sat there glorying in the situation. I mean really beautiful, somehow like how life would be in the perfect world, but in that moment it felt perfect anyway.
    I’ve travelled the world and my problem is that I can’t find a better place to live than the island of Ibiza. Now then, when I think about it that is not really a problem, is it? That is a real blessing.
    So, Shantam, if you have the eyes to see, that idealized environment that you visualize being created is already here. Earlier today I met another sannyasin woman and I said jokingly to her, ‘You are the director, star, and cameraman of your own movie. If you were not here this world would not exist.’ And so it is.

  77. Without doubt Lokesh, the world cinema is not confined to Bollywood and Holllywood, I think the most thought provoking movies are being made somewhere else.
    Same is about sannyas scene. In bits and pieces it is scattred all over the world. Few people may not have this option to chose the places like Ibiza or Bayern Bay or Hawaii, but the human sense of beauty and fairness is creating the meditative enviornment at nondescriptive places too.

    But this does not reduce the value of Poona an inch less than as it should be, because it is an uncontested choice of Osho brand of seekers.
    it was left as a melting pot of east and west, Zorba and Buddha and i with my little hammer will go on hammering till this Cliche does not get its spring back.

  78. Lokesh says:

    Yes, Shantam, you are of course right. The thing is that I almost died in Poona so apart from all the good associations that I have with the place I can never forget that drinking a cup of tea made with contaminated milk almost brought my Planet Earth movie to an abrupt end.
    The other thing is that when you fly from a place like Ibiza, which has very little in the way of pollution, and fly into New Delhi my first reaction is, ‘What the fuck am I doing in this dump. I must be mad.’ Yet on the other hand there is no place quite like Mother India, although at this stage in my life I am more in love with the idea of the place than the reality.

  79. The youth in the west have the cravings to explore the world. It always surprises me to see young western at railway station like Delhi( which is becoming and cleaner with every passing year) eating Samosas and drinking Chai.
    Once in a life time, beofore the work pressure creeps in; it is not a bad idea to explore the world different than the home country, and also it is said, once you can survive India, your immune system can only get better.
    But there is another dimension, which attracts people to India. A kind of emotional bond with some theology or a person of throbing soul.
    Once this is there, it is a calling of the heart, dirt, dust or rocks on the way, simply make the resolution strong.
    Most probably, Osho triggered this emotional bond in those people who are almost rational till their core. To make such people cry and make them voulantarily go through a cosmetic change is an engineering performance one of its kind.

    This is also a fact of the path that emotional bond also must be dropped on the way, but this process happenes only with the individual will and timings and any kind of outside push, hurry and manipulation is equivalent to violance. Pricking the unripe fruits cannot have the sweetness of a timely ripe fruit.
    One can see this kind of violation written on the face of Sannyas.


  80. The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

    Pam Ayres – They Should Have Asked My Husband

  81. bob says:

    Operation Prem Abhay, is it? The Machine?
    Ok, ok….but, what next, what is the upshot of all this? Is there really a yacht somewhere over the rainbow? Can you tell me please… vat yat? Oy vay!

  82. Lokesh says:

    Well, Bob, I was sitting watching a a few yachts this morning and I must say the idea of having a craft that can travel the worlds oceans is an appealing one for me. The thing is, I don’t have a yacht. All I have on that level is a good pair of fins and a mask. Those yachts can be a danger to me because sometimes I swim across broad bays and if a yacht catchs the wind and is bearing down on you at over 12 knots it is good to know how to do a crash dive because those mutha’s keels can cut a man in half.
    There are different kinds of people manning those boats. Sometimes I swim by as they lay at anchor. The ones that I am not keen on are fat ones that smoke cigars and jabber on mobile phones, no doubt cutting deals as they stride about impatiently on the deck of their ten million plus toy. When I look at those people I think, those jokers sure need a lot of stuff round them to feel that they are having a good time. The truth is, yachts can be fun but they are also a big piece of baggage. Still, I wouldn’t mind having one, so that I could up anchor and sail into the sunset with Prem Joshua’s album ‘Yatri’ playing over the sound system, or maybe the Stone’s ‘Exile on main street.’

  83. bob says:

    Sounds good to me Luko…whatever the music they had goin’ would be ok with me too, as long as they had a decent Chinese cook in the galley, kept it lite on the MSG, you know, and the pork belly dishes…Jonhny Chung’s Lo Phat Yat…that would do it for me….

  84. Just came across a page of “Osho Maitreya” at facebook. Please enjoy the thought provoking photos and contents of a Nepali Enlightend one from the stream of Oshodhara.
    Those who are fed up from continental OSho , this tandoori, butterly version gives quite another taste.

  85. Good morning Lokesh,
    i think you have ducked my post regarding the Bhakti path adopted by Shri Punja Ji.
    What is your opinion about him worshiping Krishna, Chanting his name, gazing for hours at artistically Imaginative picture of Krishna.

    There must be some inner science behind all this or even people like Punja ji also were simply biting the finger rather than looking at the moon.

  86. Lokesh says:

    Hi Shantam, I did in fact take in your comments about Poonjaji’s gopi Krishna trip. My take on it is as follows.
    We all have a past and HWL Poonja was no exception. As a westerner or just a sceptical Scot his Krishna story sounds ridiculous and bizarre to me….also funny. Poonja had a few good stories and he was big enough to join in and laugh about his personal capers when it came to it.. For me the best story of his is when he gets a visit from Ramana at his home in Punjab and is told he’ll find what he is looking for in Tirvanamuli. Off he goes and finds Ramana in Tirvanamalai and gets off to a bad start by calling the master an imposter. Great cosmic comic book stuff…right out of Paramahansa Yogananda’s Autobiography. It is rare to hear of an enlightened person who played the enlightened game right from the start…Ramana would be the exception. Osho had a past also…somewhat glorified in his book Glimpses of a Golden Childhood. The point is, as far as the truth goes, it all happens here and now and has nothing whatsover to do with the past.
    When I met Osho I did not look in his eyes and think, ‘This guy used to jump into whirlpools when he was a young man.’ I did not do that sort of thing because I was not thinking. Same goes for old Mr Poonja. I simply looked into his eyes…no past and definitely no future, at least as far as the mind is concerned.
    If I look back at some of the roles I have played in my life, I simply shake my head in disbelief, no matter that they were somehow necessary in the process of arriving here.
    We are creations of change. There is nothing permanent about us except the consciousness which allows all these apparent events to take place on an illusionary stage created out of abundance for that purpose.

  87. Is This The End- A poem by Sri Aurbindo

    From the time in my B.A. English class, the text book poem, Is This The End of Sri Aurbindo has stayed in my heart. Once in a while, the taste of this poem, its essence as conceived in my heart goes on mystifiying, while watching or being participant in life´s drama.

    Whether it is the article or the Lokesh´s post today… the poem sings again its silent music.

    Is this the end
    Is this the end of all that we have been,
    And all we did or dreamed, —
    A name unremembered and a form undone, —
    Is this the end?

    A body rotting under a slab of stone
    Or turned to ash in fire,
    A mind dissolved, lost its forgotten thoughts, —
    Is this the end?

    Our little hours that were and are no more,
    Our passions once so high
    Being mocked by the still earth and calm sunshine, —
    Is this the end?

    Our yearnings for the human Godward climb
    Passing to other hearts
    Deceived, while smiles towards death and hell the world, —
    Is this the end?

    Fallen is the harp; shattered it lies and mute;
    Is the unseen player dead?
    Because the tree is felled where the bird sang,
    Must the song too hush?

    One in the mind who planned and willed and thought,
    Worked to reshape earth’s fate,
    One in the heart who loved and yearned and hoped,
    Does he too end?

    The Immortal in the mortal is his Name;
    An artist Godhead here
    Ever remoulds himself in diviner shapes,
    Unwilling to cease

    Till all is done for which the stars were made,
    Till the heart discovers God
    And the soul knows itself. And even then

    There is no end.

  88. A white-haired sannyasin walked into a jewelry store one Friday evening
    with a beautiful young blonde at his side.

    He told the jeweler he was looking for a special ring for his girlfriend.

    The jeweler looked through his stock and brought out a $5,000
    ring. The old man said, “No, I’d like to see something more special.”

    At that statement, the jeweler went to his special stock and brought
    another ring over. “Here’s a stunning ring at only $40,000,” he said.

    The young lady’s eyes sparkled and her whole body trembled with
    excitement. The old man seeing this said, “We’ll take it.”

    The jeweler asked how payment would be made and the old sannyasin stated, “By
    check. I know you need to make sure my check clears so I’ll write it now, and
    you can call the bank on Monday morning to verify the funds and I’ll pick
    the ring up on Monday afternoon,” he said..

    On Monday morning, the jeweler ‘phoned the old man and said “Sir, there’s
    no money in that account.”

    “I know,” said the Osho Freak, “but let me tell you about my weekend!”

    Sannyas scene is full with such smart old men***

  89. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1311945/Stunning-Vatican-library-reopening-years-7-5m-restoration.html

    Life and death, inbetween daily life, academic and spiritual research; if one thinks from reincarnation point of view, many of the Sannyasins must have studied theology and religion in the vast liabrary at Vaitcan…

  90. bob says:

    and where did all the money come from to build, stock, decorate, and renovate the Vaitican halls…?
    same place that the Krishna temples, paintings, statues, and books came from….
    out of the superstitious fantasy worlds promulgated by the mafias of the world, i.e., ripped and raped from the poor masses by the priest/politicos/perverts that prey on the innoncence and ignorance of the common man and woman down through the corridors of time.
    An ugly monument to human avarice, mind-control, and just plain stupidity.

  91. prem bobby says:

    just incarnating myself here, checkin’ in, and waiting for my 24 hr. clearance from the Editors. hope i make it…and just to let you know, i really am ‘prem bobby’.

  92. I think in the range of a quarter million people are added to the world every day.
    How many of them are born to the agnositc parents or in the family of non belivers?
    MAy be few thousand out of a quarter million every day.
    And this amazing increase in population is being baptised by four main religions who have a following base of billion plus.
    Naturally, with their enormous financial clouts they will built huge monuments in the fond and loving memory of their founder, who were having just very few people around them in their life time.

    If someone wants to see a different set of enviornment, please click the website of Krishna Prem, one can see the beautiful pictures of Osho Basho, the fitness centre at 17, Koregaon Park Pune.

    At some photos, my impression was, “Is this the lobby of some hospital in the west!”

  93. As a poetry it sounds very musical to listen osho´s mention about ten thousand Bhikshus travelling with Buddha or they were sitting silently in a Mango groove…those were the golden days.

    And this was 2600 hundreds years ago in a area of Bihar where the sanitation system is still primitive in 2010.
    How these ten thousand people were doing their daily bodily routine?

    It must be a jungle of stink all around !!

  94. Lokesh says:

    Very quiet around here.

  95. Forest Gump says:

    Lokesh,

    I would like to comment on your post at // Sep 14, 2010 at 8:47 am

    You say, you didn’t think of any gossip or fake, when you looked into the eyes of enlightened masters.
    You simply got absorbed into the moment, if I have understood it right.

    So now when those eyes are not available, what do you do? Get absorbed in the gossip and talks about the how fake those master’s are? You have said “Sarcasm is the lowest form wit”. Is this not sarcasm to gossip negative about Osho. Where did the glimpse of those eyes get disappeared, when you indulge into utter tosh like Osho beef pie, Osho behavior being questionable, Osho addicted to nitrous oxide, etc, etc?

    I feel, Connection to master is plays an important role to remain absorbed into the present moment and gratitude, and then you don’t need master in physical body to look into his eyes. His eyes and presence become Omni-potent.

    Please don’t take my statements as a criticism to you. I generally admire your posts, especially the lightness and non-seriousness, no matter how non-credible they are. Some are good entertainment and a few are insightful. But somehow it just becomes arrogance on your behalf when an insightful person like you start circle around bullshit over and over.

    My love to you.

  96. Lokesh says:

    Ah, Forest, how delightful that you decided to pop in and share some of your brilliant insights with us this morning.
    And that, Forest, is a very good example of sarcasm. Something which you do not seem to grasp totally it would seem.

    You ask a few specific questions and I’ll answer them with a general answer. Lighten up. You are taking things much too seriously, when there really is no need for seriousness. Please don’t give me the standard, ‘I’m not being serious, I’m being sincere’ response, because it is not relevant in this case.
    Please, if you feel connected to the master and it fills you with gratitude and helps you remain present, keep on going the way you are going.
    One thing you could drop is this, ‘My love to you etc’ crap that you have a tendency to use at the end of a comment wherein you are actually trying to shoot someone down in one form or another, in this case ‘arrogant’ me. On the superficial level you are saying, listen, Lokesh, I am getting on your case but really we are all one and love rules supreme kind of spiritual speak. Just scrape a little of your ever-so-spiritual veneer off and what we find is some smug twat who thinks they are very clear about everything and have it all worked out. People who worm their way into this none too exalted state of egohood then start believing they are judge and jury too, and then start condemning everyone and everything that does not fit into their myopic world view. To top this narrow-minded perspective off we have the ‘My love to you’ bullshit, which to anyone with a bit of sense comes across like some condescending godfather.
    There are shades of the old testament Christian God in here. You know the sad fuck who gives out ten commandments and if you disobey them you will be sent to hell for all eternity….but hey…don’t worry…everything is cool…why?…he loves you.
    Time you went back to the drawing board, Forest.

  97. MYOPIC-short-sighted, near-sighted, as blind as a bat
    unadventurous, unimaginative(informal)
    myopic – unable to see distant objects clearly
    nearsighted, shortsighted
    myopic – lacking foresight or scope; “a short view of the problem”; “shortsighted policies”; “shortsighted critics derided the plan”; “myopic thinking”
    (from the free dictionary)

    We were always blaming the traditonal politcians and priests for their ” myopic world view.”

    Osho build His work by pointing again and again,” How blinds are leading other billions.

    What happened with His work, with His people?

    Yes..new set of glsses and the frames.. but myopic world view….! ?

  98. So far we have travelled, like Lokesh.. i or many others will also not find Love in Love or friendliness in Beloved friend, kind of words, when used by sannyasins or those indian celebrites who have copied such lingo…

    LIfe is an illusion or a Leela may be in the final realisation of our inner mystic.. but in day to day life.. it is a matter of trust, to be as good as one´s words.

  99. http://neo-sannyas.com/video/

    since last evening, this video in the newsletter of oshoworld, i have watched two three times.
    Not because of any nostaligia but the sincerity, honesty and depth in the voices of singers and Osho and presentaion had made the eyes watery….

    These vibes and atmosphare were easily maintainable for centuries, to get proper shave in these years was not a barrier of any kind.
    who turned the Alchemical forest into a garden with Jacuzzi; where lies the individual response, is a question worth contemplating.

  100. frank says:

    thou art twat

    —bigyin mcmaharaj

  101. Lokesh says:

    I looke at that vid, Shantam. Osho’s voice is very tender and although I don’t understand the words I reckon he is talking about his father.
    I can remember working in Osho’s parents home, doing repairs as family life ‘Indian-style’ went on around me. It seemed to me that his folks couldn’t believe their luck…an enlightened son who became a guru with a weathy ashram built around him. Yet, Osho’s parents did not allow fame and fortune to go to their heads. They remained humble. I’ll always remember Osho’s father’s last words, ‘The wheel has stopped.’ He was a lovely man and I actually feel quite touched that our orbits crossed. Something else to feel graetful for.

  102. Lokesh says:

    Frank, I’ve missed ye. Where have you been? Raking through dustbins on Sauchihall Street? Or maybe peeping in bedroom windows over in the red light district. I am Twat. Yes, I want to merge with the twatness.

  103. Lokesh says:

    There has been a distinct lack of laughs on this site lately. More of that, Frank, please.

  104. frank says:

    lokesh,
    i dont have much to say at the moment.
    i am waiting for the muse to start singing,but she`s fast asleep on the sofa….
    and me,i`m wandering about in me chuddies.
    who am i?who am i?who am i?
    i must be somebody.
    nobody knows.
    i`ll ask him….

  105. I really wish for the next year edition of Mahaparinirvana, Oshoworld gives English subtitles for this tender yet powerful video.

    “I was worried for him, not because he is my father, the way i am worried about YOU too; will it be possible to open the wings before death takes you away…….”
    (The main sentence was something like this)

    The humble parents of Osho did not allow any kind of fame and fortune to go their head. Till the middle of 1990´s Osho´s mother was living in the same room with very middle class set up.

    But sibling rivalry is just another thing. One after another, many of the family members have jumped into lucrative business of awareness. I am sure…parents will not feel proud anymore.

    but who knows….circumstances are like this. Everybody wants to have their pound of flash.

  106. Chinmaya says:

    Shantam i Singh, this is nice. Beautiful what you said above. God bless

  107. Lokesh says:

    Pound of flash. Clever!

  108. Lokesh says:

    Frank….I say unto you…..unless you trample your chuddies you will not enter my kingdom of Twatvana.

  109. Alok john says:

    Found this on you tube, Osho’s birthday celebration 1972.


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

    Note a few young, mainly female, orange-clad, Western sannyasins including young Vivek, right at the end of the video.

    This must be some of the earliest video/photos of Western sannyasins. I appreciate this is not of interest to everyone, but as I am of that culture and generation, I can identify.

  110. frank says:

    you are right,oh,wise one..it is an attachment…
    and when you wear the same pair for 36 years or more,a real attachment develops…

    i need to remember the tale of the rich man, whose house was burning down,and he was calmly accepting it, while the great yogi panicked because he had left his only possession,his chuddies,or langotri,i think they called them in those days,were inside the house…

    are you familiar with the hindu myth/tale in which the entire world is created from a pair of chuddies?
    it`s a good one,maybe some of our indian fellows may know it?
    it`s well worth hearing….

  111. Lokesh says:

    And the Lord sayeth unto the great nothingness, ‘Let there be chuddies, and there were chuddies.’
    And then the Lord asketh, ‘What is that unholy smell.’
    And to this day no answer came forth from the chuddies except, ‘Life is a mystery to be smelled not a problem to be chuddied.’

  112. Lokesh says:

    Alok, followed the link and from there moved on to this old sannyasin guy dropping malas over people’s necks in Nepal. I thought that looked a bit corny and pathetic. You’d think they would at least try and come up with something new. Initiated into what exactly? Sheepshit? Oh no…don’t tell me…I’m being judgemental again. Down tibura…bad boy…down, I say!

  113. frank says:

    but seriously,lokesh,
    forrest has a point.
    it is beneath the dignity of a man of your standing and credibility in the world of the enlightened ones to be veering from the path and making a mockery of moksha by gibbering on about osho beef pies,when everyone knows that osho`s specialitiy was pork pies.

  114. frank says:

    you mean swami arun?
    they say he is a medium,but the fact is,on the chuddy front,he is definitely large,or maybe x-large.

  115. Forest Gump says:

    No, Lokesh, I have not worked it out, I am a student and on the drawing board all the times. I just haven’t been able to figure out what you are trying to convey. With the quest in heart about your message in general, my post was just my way to express my thank you for contributing your time and insights you share. My love to you..

  116. Lokesh says:

    Yeah, Swami Arun, doesn’t Arun mean moon? Lunatic fringe, perhaps.

  117. Lokesh says:

    Forest, you concluded your previous post with……..But somehow it just becomes arrogance on your behalf when an insightful person like you start circle around bullshit over and over.
    Now you conclude your next comment with….my post was just my way to express my thank you for contributing your time and insights you share.
    Something does not quite fit. But…heh..that’s cool…Osho often contradicted himself, so why can’t you?

  118. Forest Gump says:

    Friends,

    I want to get your opinion about Love and Meditation “merging” or going in “parallel”. I don’t know, “merging “will be true or “parallel”, or may be “none”.

    The reason I ask, Osho always has talked about Love and Meditation. We all know love has many dimensions from gratitude to devotion. In Bhakti marg ( path of devotion) its normally taught that “Fake it until you make it”. I have seen people getting transformed in this regime “Fake it until you make it”.

    Western world likes to live in sort of so called “reality” plus the overall scenario doesn’t really fit to fake it. So it’s easy to adopt the path of pure meditation. I can see more and more western people are getting converted or inclined towards Buddhism and Yoga. No devotion is needed in these paths. However I also see that people are making their life completely dry and long faces in practicing austerities on those path.

    Osho Sannyasins have been absorbing into both “Love and Meditation” since the very beginning, which I find perfect suitable to my journey.
    Now the latest Osho regime in Pune has been suggesting Osho lovers to drop the devotional type of attitude and stick to pure meditation.

    Is it suitable? If yes how? Doesn’t it imply the traditional long face approach upside down?

  119. bob says:

    good point Lokesh on zoning in on people who wrap up their posts or emails with “Love”, just after they have criticized you, counseled you, manipulated you, educated you, etc….a real game of one-upmanship on their part…

    i always like Osho’s way, when he was writing his Cup of Tea letters in the ’60′s — he would start off with “Love. …” and then go into it. Turned the whole form upside down.

    or when he was talking about Lao Tzu, who had said “I have 3 treasures to give you….” (Osho even named the book after this line….Tao: The Three Treasures (’75)….well anyway, Osho comments that as far as he is concerned, he has 3 treasures to give too —
    “Love. Love. and Love.”

    Right out front.
    In a way, right in your face….

  120. 1972 Osho birthday Video.
    Osho was just 41 and it is clear, He has reached his Target audience. As it is said, to make first million is work, after that it is repetition.
    People are adoring Him like nothing and millions were bound to follow.
    “One day, the color of the earth will be Orange”, such a powerful and raw delivery of the message, and people started pouring.
    As one sees in the Video, in 1972, western people are like salt in the flour, ten years later it was flour in the salt..
    what kind of bread one can back with it!!!

    Wall mart of spirituality has reduced the inventory and export orders are almost negligible.
    When was the last time, Some one from the developed world took the sannyas.

  121. Forest Gump says:

    Shantam,

    And if someone takes it (sannyas), some thoughtful friends refer it as “being initiated into Sheepshit or corny and pathetic.”

    I would like hear others friend’s thought on these kinds of comments.

  122. Gump, one thing i want to stress again and again, what so ever is being offered at Pune is still the class one quality. Two weeks there and two weeks somewhere else, can show the differance.

    This is another fact, what is being offered is not enough because at the main seat of Osho, one wants to have the complete menu*.

    As Bob has mentioned from the discourse, Osho was saying clearly, Love, love, Love and almost all of us have taken this as granted to seduce the others in the grab of Love.
    May be it is the curse of the broken hearts, that Love, Love, Love has been withdrawn from the menu*. but as we all know, ban something and underground market flourishes. What is withdrawn from the masses, always ends up in elites lap.

    So it is no surpirse that a group of long term residents now in their late 50´s till mid 60´s have the choicest of the girls, and women in the same age…they are happy to do Vipassana!

  123. Lokesh says:

    Forest you ask, Is it suitable? If yes how?
    Suitable for you is meditation as the love thing for you is simply a case of faking it and not making it.

    Then you ask, Doesn’t it imply the traditional long face approach upside down? Um..well, that’s a tricky one, Forest, but in the end I’m inclined to answer yes, most definitly.

    Now in your next comment you say, I would like hear others friend’s thought on these kinds of comments.
    Deary me, Forest, I’m…I’m lost for words, but I suspect that where there is sheep shit there is sheep shagging so run along and get yourself a pair of rubber boots before you miss out on all the fun.

  124. Forest Gump says:

    Music for the kindred hearts


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  125. If one goes by public transport to any hill station of India, it is a usual scene to be greeted by the hotel touts, ” Do you need Room, I have a very clean room. good price. you my first customer, god swearing no cheating…”

    Something similar happens at the ashram.(resort). Middle aged Indians go to meditation camps or at Neelam´s place with their family but without the young sons. They should go to Poona to get the experience!

    Naturally, the moment some 20 plus,30 has entered the gate, chase starts. same energy same style, but different words as at the hill stations.

    This aspect was definitely need to be regulated. Management can share the message in the bold letters in light of Osho´s vision, something like sign boards we see in every country, “Curve ahead, drive carefully. speed limit 60, camera is watching etc.”

  126. Forest Gump says:

    Lokesh,

    Although your reply was very judgmental of my traits in your crystal ball, but I appreciate your sharing. Let’s see what other friends share.

  127. Lokesh says:

    Forest, I don’t need a crystal ball to read a simple chap like yourself.
    Luv.

  128. Power, sex and their derivatives, express them or supress them..have always played the roles in all the sphares of life..

    Osho being the Master of this age has layed down the ground work to understand these emotions and the implications.
    i am sure, next high wave in the world of Osho will take these issues more intelligently and in a transparent and observatory way.
    Osho show has much surprises to unfold.

  129. Forest Gump says:

    Lokesh,

    That’s fine; can you point to any person who does not fake love in your opinion? (Please don’t say “Mother Teresa”..lol)

    And further, if you are willing to spare a few more moments, may be shed some light on your point of view of love?

  130. Forest Gump says:

    I don’t know what kind of reply you would come up with Lokesh, One thing, I feel (in my fake heart) about you, Lokesh, is that you have tremendous amount of love in your heart. Don’t you think, you share your understanding out of love?

    We may spend time here in pointing fingers to each other, but we have one thing common, that’s love…It bind us and provoke us to come back here again and again. We fight and love each other that are day to day realms of a Sannyasin.

    I take refuge at the feet of this virtual Sangha. My love to you all.

  131. prem bubbie says:

    What is love? An old osho discourse where he responded to say that “our love” is not the same as a buddha’s love.. Our love is based on conditions, wants, needs and desires, a love also based on manipulation and selfishness and the desire not to be lonely. A buddha’s love is from an entirely different plane, even from a other universe from what I see. please spare us the “with all my love crap, Forest and others… this here is all a fuckin’ stupid, insane game. It’s all fake.

  132. Forest Gump says:

    Bubbie,
    Have you ever loved your mother or father or children or anyone? If yes, what do you call it?

  133. Lokesh says:

    Forest, you ask, can you point to any person who does not fake love in your opinion? My grandson for a start, but he is only one of many. Bubbie is probably right, though, in that human love usually happens when the conditions are right.

    You then ask, may be shed some light on your point of view of love? My point of view is constantly shifting, so what I say on love today might not be the same tomorrow. To really try and describe love one has to enter into the world of poetry. I am not a poet. However, Kahil Gibran was and it is him that I go to now to give a quote that describes essential qualities of love.
    Love gives naught but itself and takes naught but from itself.
    Love possesses not nor would it be possessed;

    I think you are mistaken in believing that we all return to this site because of love. In my case, love has nothing to do with my commenting on here. I am curious by nature and I also take pleasure in visiting this site because, among other things, it provides me with small challenges. If you think it is love that draws you here, well and good, but it is a romantic projection on your part to think that is the case for other commentators. The thing is if you continue on this course you will always wind up in trouble with people because they will refuse to fit in to your movie.

    You say, We may spend time here in pointing fingers to each other, but we have one thing common, that’s love.
    You obviously have a need to feel that you are a part of something. Why not drop the ‘we’ and replace it with ‘I’. That way you might actually learn something about yourself. You appear overly concerned with the other. In this world that is a very normal point of view but it is absolutely useless in the world of self-enquirey.

  134. frank says:

    asking what is love is like asking what is funny.
    you will only know when you love/laugh.
    you can then find out what sort of love or sense of humour that you have/dont have.
    you could always read a book,by sigmund freud,or some other bearded bore about
    “the function of humour in the human psyche”or somesuch pompous nonsense.
    but you wont get any laughs…..!

  135. frank says:

    i was straining my imagination to try to picture
    “the feet of this virtual sangha”

    i see them as wearing a well worn pair of slightly threatening doc martens …
    a fair amount of corns, callouses,mallet toes,ingrowing toenails, bunions and wear and tear from lengthy voyages on many continents…..
    but underneath..
    a good air-cushioned soul.

  136. frank says:

    nice and bouncy,
    but not so nice if they`re bouncing off your `ead,like…..

    i still chuckle when i remember osho`s pronounciation of
    “skin..heads.”

  137. Lokesh says:

    Especially now that I am a skin head. Well, I can remember when I had hair down to my tibura……zzzzzzzzzzz,

  138. Forest Gump says:

    Hmmm, Very good reply..Lokesh, However I disagree with Bubbie, he is just parroting Osho’s word, not offering any personal insights.

    My quest on love further narrows to explore Celebration, Tears, Gratitude, and Master and importance of Sangha.

  139. frank says:

    get way too many bootmarks on your ass
    get way too many tears on your shoes..
    get way too many laughter lines on your face…
    get a pocket full of cash…
    bet it on the sunrise
    lose it on the sunset….
    sell your soul to a white lady…
    drown in someone elses sea…
    ride a tiger `till you can`t dismount…
    step into the front door of a rolls royce
    fall out of the back door…
    into a muddy gutter in a dead-end alley at midnight
    no moon,raining,no dawn coming….
    and then we`ll talk about
    love,enlightenment,gratitude..

    maybe…..

  140. Forest Gump says:

    Frank,

    I liked the poetry, but Seems like too many conditions came from a conditional mind.

    Does it have to be so complicated?

  141. Forest Gump says:

    OR

    It can go in this way:

    If you drop all the conditions….
    May feel the love and gratitude in the sudden flight of pigeons……
    Maybe…

    Love—-

  142. Forest Gump says:

    Frank,

    By the way…Is this your life story at a glance?

  143. frank says:

    not really.
    i prefer haikus.
    this is one from that most unlikely of zen masters
    john cooper clarke.

    to con-vey one`s mood
    in se-ven-teen syl-la-bles
    is ve-ry diffic-

  144. frank says:

    come on forrest,you are jumping the gun here.
    dont forget old alexis zorba in the zorba the buddha equation……

    “what is life but to take off off your belt and looking for trouble..?.”

    to which i would like to add..
    “when you take off your belt,the trousers will come down,also….”

  145. frank says:

    “and go looking for trouble”

  146. Lokesh says:

    The mud elephant leaves no tracks as it wades into the ocean.
    The Fugs.
    I am the source of your knock up.
    The Fugs.
    No more slurping of the Nartaks.
    The Fugs.

    Three of my favorite Haikus.

  147. Forest Gump says:

    No Frank, there is no gun here..Just trying to keep up with your poetic haikus.

  148. frank says:

    here`s one for the unconditionally minded…..

    completely outstripped mahavira
    stood patanjali on his head
    turned more of a profit than mohammed
    his women made krishna`s gopis look like a rugby team
    nailed jesus crackpot`s comeback plans
    threw complaining buddha out of his jacuzzi
    told hotei a few he hadn`t heard
    talked the hind legs off zarathustra
    gave rama some flying lessons
    turned the zen bull up to 11….

    set out to provoke god
    and just about everyone else

    quite somebody
    for a nobody
    this fellow
    osho.

  149. frank says:

    my all time favourite haiku has to be….

    nobly,the great priest
    deposits his stool
    in bleak winter fields
    -buson

  150. when i came home on the crutches after a full anesthesia surgery, and to walk till the bathroom looks like a work; Love and meditation, master and enlighenment seem quite luxurious words.

    When the staff in the clinic asked, will some body come to fetch me home, and i have to think for a while before answering, ” yes, my son will come after his school”, some where in these moments of loneliness, i thought , ” beautiful theory and poetry apart, am i one of the foot soldier of Osho´s failed social engineering?
    Or Master is speaking much before its time has come?

  151. frank says:

    shantam,
    you`re probably just a loser.

  152. frank says:

    only joking.dear.
    remember.
    only losers can win in this game!

  153. frank says:

    btw.
    sounds like the lobotomy was a great succes….

  154. When the belly is full, money is in the bank account, fear of invaders is almost Null, hormones can stay active till the twilight zone of life.

    In this atmosphere one gets the courage to look at the history of 2000 years with scorn eyes, and far away little hilltops look like peak of human evolution.

    Fall sick or go through an accident, may be only than one can see the light of hope radiating from the cross in the hospitals.
    May be than we will look at the nunn with eyes of thankfullness because her presence is saying silently, ” Be sure, you will get the best possible treatment.”

  155. frank says:

    shantam,
    you are learning one of the principles of christianity.
    this is known as “cringe or starve”.

    people with full belly and bank account have no fear of invaders?

    i am not sure i would agree with that.

  156. Newly baptised atheists or agnostics in the western Europe take great pride in their Individual Thinking, if they open their eyes a bit more, they will be surprised to see, they are simply following a new trend, a new fashion.
    A crowd full of people before a Sushi bar thinks, they are getting Zen!

  157. Frank, if one looks at the life with open eyes, one can see beauty and ugliness as it is. With vested interests, one highlights the good parts and put the blanket over the rest.
    Christanity is no exception.

    With sannyasins, it is something modren. Buy the latest push up bra to increase the cup size.

  158. frank says:

    as i said,the lobotomy seems to be working,kind of….

  159. Lokesh says:

    Lobotomy, I’m so glad I’m not the only one.
    Shantam get well soon. This planned obselesense nonsense with these bodies is a dirty trick. Just when you start getting in a groove you have to start thinking about bypass surgery, strokes, fart attacks and alzheimers…eh..um what were we talking about?

  160. In the real world, if one is not a dcotor, lawyer, investment banker or reality TV star etc. it is almost like a loser. One can console oneself with non ambitious attiude, but reality is not of the winner.

    Winner are the people who create facebook and maintain its constant growth, but not the people who are feeding this growth.

    In the Sannyas Inc., when the blue chip share are now penny´s worth, You are right Frank, i am a loser, and their is no consoling in the statement only loser can win this game”.

    MAy be you can shed somelight over the winners too.

  161. To see the situation in a war, a soldier who was running away , stumbles upon a person in a Bush.
    To see the stars on his shoulders, He fumbles, ” Sorry Brigadier, i was not thinking to come so far away from the front line!

  162. frank says:

    re winners and losers.
    a guy once said to me when he found out i was interested in eastern and western philosophies.
    “i see,well,i suppose if you dont have a porsche,then you need a philosophy!

    hahaha.

    je suis un perdant
    soy un perdidor
    ich bin ein verlierer
    i`m a loser…..

    long live diogenes the cynic

    and his dog……

  163. prem bobby says:

    lot of good posts lately.
    some classic insights embedded.

  164. Prem bubbie goes through lobotomy and is now prem Bobby or Bobby is somebody else?

  165. Shantam says:

    So true somewhere,” If you don´t have Porsche, you must have a philosphy.”
    And if you want to have Porsche again in the next life or in heaven, ” Donate one to your Guru.”

    Autos in Rajneeshpuram are the testimony.

  166. Shantam says:

    OSHO INTERNATIONAL MEDITATION RESORT

    I think it is an unspoken tradition to carry forward the names and terms of your culture and language, when you expand your work in different countries or to add words from local customes to give the feeling of integration.

    IKEA for example. All the names and terms are derived from Swedish culture.
    Rajneeshpuram in Oregaon, America. Krishnamurit lake or Rajneeshdyan Mandir; the classic spirit of enterpreneourship.

    And Now we have OSHO INTERNATIONAL MEDITTAION RESORT.
    Which word gives a feeling of original source.
    Is this the call centre for American Express?
    No wonder…..

    Somebody has to be snide!

  167. Lokesh says:

    Well I don’t have a posrche, but I do have a Mustang and a philosophy that runs along the lines that everything passes and you never really know what is a curse or a blessing. A lot of rich people live on Ibiza and after studying them for some time(26 years) I have concluded that happiness does not come as a direct consequence of having lots of money. Money can keep some of life’s hard realities at bay but hey….I met a shaman the other day who had very little money, but he did have a big bottle of ayahuasca and he was probably the happiest guy I met in a month.
    Most valuable is good health…if you have cancer all the money in the world won’t help.
    Be positive..transcend mind…be negative…self-destruct.
    Luv.

  168. prem bubbie says:

    Who’s parroting osho? i just listened to his comments years ago and lived them, i wanted to see for myself and in others what love is, that’s what it’s all about with osho, he says something, if you really want to find out if it’s true- live it, live it totally! In this case, it is true, the love as a child is one of pure attachment, of need, for a child is TOTALLY reliant on the parents or adult for it’s needs and nurturing. Gump/dump: i can be honest, you’re just chicken shit – a big pussy, we know who the biggest parrot posting on this site is, forgot you past insane posts? Dick Head!

  169. prem bubbie says:

    This life is all about selfishness/ and the need for others’ company and approval. The herd mentality, just because we are human and are arrogant, doesn’t mean we don’t share the same traits as other animals…. Boneheads posting on this site… Rump/Gump, Shantam is singhing think they are above it all… very sad. but i’m laughing too.

  170. Kavita says:

    FG .. haven’t figured out what love is .. but perhaps when there is absolute lackness of words l use this word
    ‘ love ‘ .. which is very rare

    Shantam .. good to see u write already .. get well soon Dear ..

    latest puppetji vid .. njoy all of u guys


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  171. Lokesh says:

    Bubbie rocks! And yes, it is true, somehow everyone is selfish. It is almost as if you have to be selfish to gain entry to this world.
    Squawk! Time for an appropriate Osho quote:
    I teach selfishness. I want you to be, first, your own flowering. Yes, it will appear as selfishness; I have no objection to that appearance; it is okay with me. But is the rose selfish when it blossoms? Is the lotus selfish when it blossoms? Is the sun selfish when it shines? Why should you be worried about selfishness?
    Well in answer to that last question I’d say that it is because of selfishness that so unnessecary suffering exists in the world. But then again, perhaps that suffering is needed for some mysterious reason.
    Comments?

  172. Shantam says:

    Selfishness is also natural but how much.

    Few examples from real life. as i can say from last 24 hours being on crutches, theoratical and Virtual knowledge is not enough, a tatse of reality, good or bad, love or hate- is mind bobbling.

    The other week, a relative of mine, 65 years old Widow was waiting for Rickshaw after daily work in the market. Some women with her daughter simply appear, took her hand and sympthetically tell her, ” Come with us, we will drop you home in our car. It is raining too strong.”
    Journey of few minutes took long, under the pretext, roads are block and when my aunt was finally out from the car, she was feeling dizzy. Few hours later she realised, the gold she was wearing has been taken away from her hands.

    One of the regular events in India.

    Lot of dowry cases were happening in India so the govt. changes the law. Onus to prove innocence lies with man´s family.

    So a young woman who could not fit into my cousin´s family, left for her parents. There was discussion going on how to solve the issue. and suddenly there was a police case against this cousin. Woman has accused torture and dowry pressure.
    As i know both the sides, it is a fabricated lie to get as much money as possible as out of the court settlement.
    India has the same legal system as UK.

    Most of us have the stories when we are on the receiving end of somebody´s too much selfishness.

    When the mother of my first child was pregnent, i was openly flirting with someone else, in the name of experimenting with love.
    I am still paying the bill for my act of selfishness!

  173. Kavita says:

    We have to pay for everything .. not only selfishness …

    Even though l inherited everything l own .. l still have to pay for its upkeep .. so in that sense nothing is free ! hahaha

    whether we experiment in the name of love / pure selfishness .. pay one has to ..

    http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=30789048&fbid=1361352845888&op=1&view=all&subj=469970273668&aid=-1&auser=0&oid=469970273668&id=1593578729

  174. Prem Abhay says:

    What is the essence of Osho? If I walk around the resort and ask the question, the repeated answer is that it is Zorba the Buddha. What then is Zorba the Buddha? Well, apparently it is a synthesis of celebration and meditation.

    At Zorba the Buddha resort you can play tennis but it is called Zennis. You can go to the gym, dance, get drunk, smoke cigarettes, pick up an over-night date…oh yeah, I almost forget, and you can meditate. Though it looks like a typical resort, I am told that the key difference is the encouragement of an underlying thread of awareness throughout.

    It is regularly repeated by the establishment and regulars that it is the very core of (Zen) Buddhism infused with life positive style of Zorba the Greek – eat, drink, and be merry. This is the New Man I am told. This is the revolution in religiousness.

    At the resort the term Zorba is equated with celebration. Looking at the new facilities, the types of events staged, and from asking the regular believers, I have the view that the definition of celebration is narrow in scope. You will certainly not here that celebration is anything to do with gratitude, or trust, or surrender, or love.

    I was shocked to find in one book, a view of Osho’s that stands in stark contrast to the above position had been completely deleted from the compilation. In the deleted text, Osho said that in the past there had been mystic schools for lovers (such as in Sufism) and for meditators (as in for example Buddhism). His approach was something completely new, and it was to bring these two separate paths together in a synthesis.

    He clearly stated that his unique and new offering to the world was a path that brought together love and awareness (or meditation) into synthesis – in the text, it is very clear that he is talking about one path, and not two separate paths running in tandem. This, he said, was his uniquely new offering to the world, and would lead to the all important New Man. In the deleted text he made it absolutely clear that this was Zorba the Buddha, and that Zorba was equated with love. There was no mention of celebration at all. In the text Zorba was not some narrow definition of celebration, but rather it was love. In more deleted text Osho goes into what this quality of love means.

    Maybe it is that Osho also gave a similarly clear and detailed description of Zorba being a narrowly defined type of celebration. Even so, an alternative view of the essence of Osho was deleted out of the text, such that anyone reading the book(s), would not be familiar with this point of view. If they read a compilation that is biased by omissions, they will form a view that is not consistent with the message as delivered in discourse by Osho.

    So let’s say a seeker reads a particular Osho book, and so did not read the sections where Zorba is equated with love, because it has been deleted. The person becomes interested in Osho, and comes to the resort. The newcomer either has no real understanding of the concept of Zorba, or has an incomplete (and biased) view. Then the resort either introduces or reinforces an incomplete (and biased) view. It is in the culture at the resort to equate Zorba with a narrowly defined concept of celebration.

    Of course it could be argued that this is not the case with all compilations, and may be the case with just a few. From what I have seen I wonder if such a view is a little naïve. Perhaps it is the case that only on the key issues – like on the essence of Osho’s approach – there are severe and systematic biases. Does that sound OK to you? Sounds like a good plan to cover your tracks if you ask me.

    To create such a situation needs planning by the establishment. The publishing team, the Inner Circle, and the resort management, have a fixed belief about what is the essence of Osho. It is a religious belief system, or more accurately it is a narrow religion. Regular customers to the resort are presumably in accord with the establishment, and newcomers become indoctrinated.

    Believers say that Osho transcends all religions, or that he offers a new religiousness. The establishment says that the majority of its actions that create controversy are to stop a religion forming around Osho. The destruction of the pagoda, the dismissal of notable days, and all such moves are to stop Osho becoming just another religion. Yet we have a deleted text that is clearly a reference to Osho talking about the essence of his path. It is a synthesis of love and meditation. Zorba in Zorba the Buddha is equated with love.

    All the actions by management that have created controversy is essentially about putting a stop to conduct that has the element of love involved. Management do not see this has involving love, but rather the negatively defined aspect of worship or devotion. Yet, it is the type of conduct that is typically on the path of love. Osho does not say he is synthesising some new form of love with an old form of meditation. He states very clearly that his path is the merging of two ancient paths into one. Hence, management cannot rightly say that acts typical of the path of love – that have been an integral part of the seekers path when Osho was in the body – are empty worship, are religion forming, and should be stopped. On the contrary, they are an essential half of a mysterious mix put together by a religious mystic that left no successor.

    If Osho’s new offering to the world is a religiousness that synthesises love and meditation, how can this work when the element of love has either been removed, or has been shunted off into becoming a narrow form of celebration? The religious path as offered by Osho has been shut down out of fear of creating a religion. The result is to create a fracture between love and meditation within the Osho movement. Ironically it also means that they have created one new religion, and possibly two.

    Below is Swami Detective’s listing of some deleted texts (with his delightful commentaries) in a few Osho compilations. Perhaps the most important quotation of any of Osho’s words – stating simply and clearly what the essence of his approach is – has been deleted! Also, the fundamental point of distinguishing between surrender (out of love) and dependency (out of fear) has been deleted. In the new religion of ‘Osho Zen’, all surrender is considered only as dependency – as blind worship. Issues like rebelliousness and social critique, which are seemingly inherent in any of Osho’s views, have also been deleted. If you like to equate Zorba with celebration, then this type of deletion narrows your understanding of celebration in the context of Osho. I suppose the last joke is whether SannyasNews gets a warning from OIF for hosting Osho literature that has been maliciously deleted.

    http://oshothedavincicode.blogspot.com/2010/05/swami-detective-may-2-2010-at-1142-pm.html

    Swami Detective (SD): The following has been cut from the Book of Wisdom and Life’s Mysteries.

    IS THERE A POSSIBILITY THAT THE DISCIPLE’S LOVE FOR THE MASTER WILL NOT BE THE LAST BARRIER IF LOVE AND AWARENESS CAN GROW TOGETHER?

    ….Zorba is love; Buddha is awareness. It is easier to grow one, but is far more juicy to grow both together. And if both together can be grown, then the master will not be the last barrier, because in love and awareness you will become one with the master.

    On the path of awareness the master is a barrier. That’s why Buddha said, “If you meet me on the path, cut my head immediately.” That is the answer on the path of awareness, because in Buddha’s teaching there is no place for love.

    There have been schools of love like the Sufis. A Sufi will not agree with this. He will say, “If the master meets you on the way, become one with him.” But if you are understanding my approach… it is a little bit complex, because I am trying that your love and your awareness both go hand in hand….The world has known both kinds of people — the lovers and the meditators — but the world has never tried both together. This synthesis will bring a new kind of man. For this kind of searcher, the master is not a barrier at all.

    SD: It is argued that Osho’s teaching evolved from devotion to zen. The above points to a different philosophical position from Osho about his own teachings. All this talk of love for the Master is not very helpful when you want to kick out all the lovers of Osho.

    The fifth question:
    Beloved Osho,
    How can we know the difference between surrender and dependency, not just with You but with all that comes up in our lives?

    Veereshwar, the difference is so absolutely clear that once you have experienced surrender you will never miss understanding what is surrender and what is dependency.
    Surrender is out of love, dependency is out of fear. Dependency is a relationship in which you are hankering for something, desiring something; there is a motive. You are ready to become dependent — that’s what you are willing to pay for something. Surrender has no desire in it. It is sheer joy, it is trust, it is unmotivated….

    ….How does this poetry happen? It happens in surrender, it happens when the part gathers enough courage to surrender to the whole, when the dewdrop slips into the ocean and becomes the ocean.

    Surrender is a very paradoxical state: on one hand you disappear, on the other hand you appear for the first time in your infinite glory, in your multidimensional splendor. Yes, the dewdrop is gone, and gone forever; there is no way to recapture it, to reclaim it. The dewdrop has died as a drop, but in fact the dewdrop has become the ocean, has become oceanic. It still exists, no more as a finite entity, but as something infinite, shoreless, boundless.

    And remember, let me repeat it again: when you surrender to existence you are not surrendering anything real. You are simply surrendering a false notion, you are simply surrendering an illusion, you are surrendering maya. You are surrendering something that you never had with you in the first place. And by surrendering that which you don’t have, you attain to that which you have.

    ….It is only when you can trust the unknown that you can trust a master, never before it, because the master represents nothing but the unknown. He represents the uncharted, he represents the infinite, the unbounded. He represents the oceanic, he represents the wild, he represents God.

    ….That’s what sannyas is all about. Sannyas is going to undo all that the society has done. It is not just accidental that priests are against me, politicians are against me, parents are against me, the whole establishment is against me; it is not accidental. I can understand the absolutely clear logic of it. I am trying to undo what they have done. I am sabotaging the whole pattern of this slave society.

    My effort is to create rebels, and the beginning of the rebel is to trust in oneself. If I can help you to trust in yourself, I have helped you. Nothing else is needed, everything else follows of its own accord.

    ….You may be the last generation which has the possibility to rebel. And if you don’t rebel, there may be no more chances: humanity can be reduced to a robotlike existence. So rebel while there is still time! I don’t think there is much time left, maybe just this last part of the century, these coming twenty or twenty-five years. If humanity can rebel in these next twenty-five years, this is the last opportunity; otherwise people will be utterly unable to, their unconscious will dominate them. Up to now, the society has only been able to pollute your conscious mind — through education, through the church, through propaganda — but only your conscious mind; your unconscious is still free.

    ….If you are emptying yourself you will become more and more blissful, because you will become more and more spacious. You will become more and more available to God and to God’s celebration. You will become open to existence and all its joys and all its blessings.
    ….Beloved Osho, What os those who take sannyas in Poona, only to drop it back in their home environment

    Anand Lionel, they are assholes. And they are assholes not because they drop sannyas but because they take it. Their idea is that by taking sannyas here they will gain something, and then back home they can drop it….This is how the mob mind functions. And sannyas is not for the mob mind, it is not for the sheepish mind. It is for lions….A lion, asking such a question?

    ….This is the beginning of real sannyas.

    A middle-aged American lady whose husband had recently died went to a spiritualist to get in touch with him as she was feeling lonely. Contact having been established, she said, “Hello, honey! How you doin’?”Honey: “Fine. In fact I’m a hell of a lot better off than I was before.”Lady: “How do you pass the time, honey?”Honey: “Well, I wake up, make love, have breakfast, make love, have lunch, make love, have supper, make love, sleep, make love, wake up, make love — day in and day out.”Lady: “Where are you, honey? In heaven?”Honey: “No, I’m a bull in Koregaon Park, Poona.”

    That possibility is there, you can misunderstand me. And there are also others at the other extreme. [Anybody who chooses one part of my teaching is bound to misunderstand me.]

    SD: The words in block parenthesis have been retained.

    ….The fifth question:
    Beloved Osho,
    Why do You call people cabbages and assholes? It seems so disrespectful.
    Anand Swaghat, cabbages are also people, and very innocent people. What do you mean, “It seems so disrespectful?” Disrespectful to whom? To cabbages? In fact it is more disrespectful to cabbages to compare them with men. What have they done?

    Just look at man’s history, and the history of cabbages. You will not find more innocent people than cabbages, they are all buddhas — so silent, so happy, so meditative. And you are saying, “It seems so disrespectful.” To man?

    And what can I do if somebody is an asshole? I am not condemning him, I am simply stating a fact. Do you want me to lie? An asshole is an asshole, plain and simple. And remember, it is perfectly okay to be an asshole.

    But why, Swaghat, are you worried? Are you a cabbage or…?

    ….So, Krishna Prem, the controversies will become more and more. And because I am controversial, my people are bound to be controversial too. Because I am controversial, you will also be offensive, you will also have to suffer. You will also have to be ready to be persecuted in many ways.

    But remember one thing. To live a life of compromise is worse than death. And to live a life of truth, even if it is for a single moment, is far more valuable than to live eternally in lies. To die for truth is far more valuable than to live in lies.

    ….That’s why love, which can open the gates of paradise, only opens the gates of hell….Man is very close to God, the closest. Hence the responsibility and the danger, the hazard, the adventure. You can fall. And what is the fall?…. It is not because you are lower than the birds, it is because you are higher and much more is required of you. It is because you are higher that God’s criterion for you is higher too….If the parents insist, “Cleanliness is next to God,” the children will start living in every kind of dirt.

    ….There is every possibility their love may go deeper than your love, may have a higher quality of intimacy, may have something more of poetry and more of God in it.

    ….Don’t make Wicked Jokes

    SD: The above phrase is a deleted chapter title.

    And, slowly slowly, I will turn the commune into an energy communication….That’s what you have to remember when you come to me for an energy darshan, for a “close-up.”…. When you are in an energy darshan with me, when you are partaking of something of my energy,….

    ….That’s why it happens to many sannyasins…. Just now Haridas has said that he used to go outside the ashram; now it is becoming more and more difficult to go outside. Why is it becoming more and more difficult to go outside? Nobody is prevented from going outside, but it becomes difficult on its own, because you see so much nonsense — and you have to see it, because it is there; you have to listen to it.

    SD: Here is a reference to the value of being in an ashram. Of course it has been deleted! Jayesh and others argue that Osho discarded the old ashram model, and replaced it with a more worldly (zen) vision. If this is the case, what is the need to hide the benefits of the ashram model? Are such statements now wrong?

    ….In the new commune we are going to introduce all kinds of meditations. Those who enjoy swimming, they will have opportunities to go for a swimming meditation. Those who enjoy running, they will have their group to run for miles. Each according to his need — only then this world can be full of meditation; otherwise not.

    ….The master is one who is not, the master is one who has already disappeared into God….When the disappearance also has happened to the disciple, the first experience is that of meeting and merger with the master — because the disciple does not know what God is, he knows only the master. The master is his or her God….Hidden behind the master’s hands were God’s hands, hidden behind the master’s words were God’s messages….Your prayer is going to be fulfilled in this life.

    ….Beloved Osho, Please explain the difference between a sannyasin and one who is not, yet lives with a deep commitment to truth.

    ….Unless you see somebody who has committed that suicide and still is — in fact for the first time is…. You will have to look into those eyes which have seen truth, and a glimpse of the truth will be caught through those eyes. You will have to hold hands with someone who has known, receive the warmth and the love… and the unknown will start flowing into you….

    SD: Here Osho alludes to the necessity of a living Master. Of course this flies directly in the face of Jayesh’s deep insight into Osho that even people who have not met Osho can get everything they need from Him. This extreme devotional position also demonstrates a religious zeal at the centre of the current supposedly hard line non-devotional ‘zen’ style Osho model pushed by Jayesh, Amrito, and the team.

    SD: Another theme not demonstrated is the seemingly taboo subject of death. Often times there a major deletions when this is mentioned. Hence in the book Life’s Mysteries, we have the following amendment.

    I HAVE HEARD THAT YOUR SANNYASINS CELEBRATE DEATH.
    I have heard that your sannyasins celebrate everything….

    SD: More from Life’s Mysteries

    ….I am not saying to you, escape from your love affairs: go deeper into them. I help my sannyasins to go into love, because I know love ultimately fails. And unless they know by their own experience that love ultimately fails, their search for God will remain phony.

    ….The difference between a politician and an English lady…
    When a politician says yes, he means maybe. When he says maybe, he means no. If he says no, he’s no politician.

    When an English lady says no, she means maybe. When she says maybe, she means yes. If she says yes, she’s no lady.

    SD: Another recurrent theme is the deletion of crude references to politicians. Other rather crude jokes are also regularly dismissed.

    ….It happened that I was expelled from a college…. I was expelled from many colleges and many universities; that way it gave me great richness. Nobody has belonged to so many colleges and so many universities. In the city where I was there were twenty colleges; time came when not a single college was ready to accept me.

    SD: The entire explanation of Osho being a very naughty boy has been deleted. It is of course bad for the image to reveal such things. Fancy Osho being ‘banned’ from all those universities.

    ….An American, a very devout Catholic, had tried for years to get a private audience with the pope. When his request was finally granted, he flew to Rome, and within the hour was kneeling before His Holiness. Kissing the ring after the pope had blessed him, the man said, “Your Holiness, I want you to know this has been the most inspirational experience of my life. I am deeply grateful. I would like to share my favorite story with you: There were these two Polacks…” “Excuse me, my son,” the pope interrupted, a little offended, “are you aware that I am Polish?”

    “Ah yes, Your Holiness, but don’t worry. I will tell it very, very slowly.”

    SD: It seems that politicians are not the only ones to be appeased through deletions.

    OFTEN I HAVE THE FEELING THAT I AM NOT DOING SOMETHING I OUGHT TO BE DOING, OR DOING SOMETHING I SHOULD NOT BE DOING; THAT SOMETHING HAS TO CHANGE AND FAST — A SCHOOLDAYS’ WORRY THAT I AM NOT GOING TO MAKE THE GRADE, THAT I MIGHT BE EXPELLED.

    SD: Most of the answer to this question has been deleted. It discusses issues surrounding rebelliousness and guilt.

    ….You say, “I feel like the tiger in the story awakening to its true nature.” No Vasumati, that tiger has not felt anything awakening in him. He has just encountered the awakening — out of nowhere. The tiger was simply looking in the water, seeing the reflected face of the old tiger and his own. He simply gave a tremendous roar and the valleys resounded it. It was not a longing or a thinking or a feeling or a desire — “let us think about it, let us consult a few wiser people.” It was spontaneous, without a single thought. And that is the way to be awake.

    Let your tiger explode into a wild roar. In that roar your false identity with a sheep will disappear, will be gone. It is not a decision by the mind, it is an outburst of the being itself.….You have become a thinker. To hell with all thinkers, just act. There is not much time to think about what is right and what is wrong….I think it is time, Vasumati. Do something, legal or illegal, but do it. Enough of thinking.

    SD: This sounds a lot like Osho encouraging a disciple to be rebellious. Better delete that one, it might create fear of major civil unrest.

    SD: Another theme I have noted is that, in highlighting a positive aspect, Osho first expresses the negative aspect. This can be considered repetitious, and so often times the negative is removed, especially if it has been talked about in general, leading up to the positive statement. It is considered redundant, yet I cannot see how anyone other than Osho can have the authority to remove it. Since he did not in his talks, then presumably he would not have considered it redundant (else why did he use this particular linguistic style).

    ….With an [un]alert mind the (same) energy becomes [violence; with an alert mind the same energy becomes] compassion.
    () added[] deleted

    ….My only contribution to human evolution is a sense of humor. No other religion, no other philosophy has [accepted] (attempted) humor as something religious; it seems to them that it is something profane.

    SD: The interchanged words are entirely different in meaning.

    ….You all have to risk, and you have to risk all that you have. And risk it with great joy! because what can be more joyous than to give birth to a new man, to become vehicles for a new man, for a new humanity?

    It is going to be painful as every birth is painful. But the pain can be welcomed if you understand what is going to happen through it. If you can see the child coming out of it, then the pain is no more pain — just as the mother can accept the pain of the child’s birth. The pain is irrelevant: her heart is dancing with joy — she is going to give birth to life, she is being creative. She is making this world more alive; a new child is being born through her. God has used her as a vehicle; her womb has proved fertile. She is happy, in great joy. She rejoices, although the pain is there on the periphery. But when this great joy is there, the pain simply functions as a background and makes the joy even more loud. Remember…

    My sannyasins can become an energy womb, an energy field. A great synthesis is happening here. East and West ARE meeting here. And if we can make this impossible thing happen, man will live in a totally different way in the future. He will not need to live in the same old hell. Man can live in love, in peace. Man can live in great friendliness. Man can live a life which is nothing but a celebration. Man can make this earth divine.

    Yes: this very earth can become the paradise and this very body the Buddha.

    ….It is painful to be purified! It is like taking pus out of your body — it hurts. Although it is GOOD in the long run — if the pus is out, the poison is out and you will heal soon — but it hurts. To take the pus out is painful. But to leave it inside is to help it to grow; it will spread all over your body.

    One can only be ready to go through purification if the desire is so total that one is ready even to die for it if that is needed. And it is a kind of death — because the personality that you have always thought you are will have to die. You will have to drop all that you are identified with. And THAT has been your ego. You will have to surrender all that you have been claiming up to now and bragging up to now; all that has been precious to you has to be dropped as utter rubbish. It IS painful. It feels as if you are losing your kingdom and you are becoming a beggar.

    SD: This is the raw truth of the ultimate search. Better tone it down and make the spiritual search sound nicer.

    SD: There are many other deletions (and additions) in the two texts I referred to.

  175. frank says:

    william blake had a go at this one.

    “the clod and the pebble”

    love seeketh not itself to please
    nor for itself hath any care
    but for another gives its ease
    and builds a heaven in hells despair

    so sang a little clod of clay
    trodden with the cattle`s feet
    but a pebble of the brook
    warbled out these metres meet:

    love seeketh only self to please
    to bind another to its delight
    joys in anothers` loss of ease
    and builds a hell in heavens despite

    “contrary states of the soul” he reckoned.
    probably irreconcilable.

    mettez vos jeux,mesdames et messieurs….

  176. frank says:

    so its loco luca and mustang sally
    ridin down ibiza high street

    cruisin and playin the radio
    with no particular place to go

  177. frank says:

    and abhay?
    there goes a man who hasn`t got a porsche.

    get on yer bike,
    and get a job,mate..!

  178. Kavita says:

    Maybe this Prem Abhay is the editor of Sannyass news .. probably … he has this site for his own sharing .. only wish he could make it short .. he sure might be a Tantra Master .. making it so long … Oh poor-rich guy !

  179. Shantam says:

    Abhay, in a very articulate way, you have raised the core values of Osho and the ground zero situaion of today.
    No wonder… neither sannyasins nor the other 6.5 billion people feel impressed by what is being offerd.
    At the root level, it is the under utilised facility and those who can afford to create little oasis all around, they have chosen Poona 2 Model left by Osho rather than resort model.
    No wonder..all these places have Buddha Hall, not Buddha groove!

    And i also know, protest of few will not change the situation at Pune, and why the beneficiaries of Osho´s work are unable to open their mouth fully is a matter of research. Whether it is due to the lack of emotional involvement or we have become too rational, too intellectualised Enlightend.

    As far as individual journey is concerned, science and media has made it all possible… million times more books are available than few centuries before, self help profession has increased leeps and bounds…one organisation´s failure does not stop the business at Wall street or Wal mart… Life goes on…

    Fundamental issue is the same…Power and Control…with meditation or without…with Osho Giberish every day or without…

  180. Shantam says:

    and abhay?
    there goes a man who hasn`t got a porsche.

    get on yer bike,
    and get a job,mate..!

    Frank,please, send this little note to Pope also, he may be is just a walking distance away from your home.

  181. frank says:

    come near my home?
    he wouldn`t dare.
    i`ve got richard dawkins on a leash in the garden,and i haven`t fed him for weeks…….

  182. Lokesh says:

    Yes, glancing at Abhay’s latest outpouring I have to admit that he does have something to say. Unfortunately, Abhay has not learned that less is more and thus that something is lost in a bilious cloud of hot air composed of personal conclussions, none of which seem to have much to do with, quote: In that roar your false identity with a sheep will disappear. Well, that may be true but Abhay sounds more like he is bahing as opposed to roaring, as he is trading in the same old hat that has been being passed around for over thirty years now.
    The conclusion of his Abhay/Osho comment, and I quote again, It feels as if you are losing your kingdom and you are becoming a beggar.
    Mmmh…I beg to differ. It can also comes as such a relief to simply be nobody. All this nirvana the last nightmare stuff is very dramatic, but then Osho loved theatricks. I also feel that it is also not needed to take everything the old boy said seriously…after all that was also a core element of his teaching. Squawk!

  183. frank says:

    just wait till they translate osho books from hindi.they will have to delete like crazy.
    as he talked to the people who were in front of him,you find all sorts of guff like
    “in america,they have conducted tests ,there is a man who reads people`s minds.swami rama came to see him and people were amazed,there were no thoughts etc etc ”
    its 2010.
    james randi is around.
    maybe that`s why they are so slow to do these translations.
    he had to speak in autostimulationofayogi-speak to pull in the whackhead hindus,just in the same way he said jesus was enlightened for the westerners then changed his tune to jesus crackpot,mentally il…..

    they already cut out risque stuff even when he was alive,didn`t they?
    for example his call for everyone to make loudly in their rooms to irritate the local church-goers in crete,was that part of “socrates poisoned again etc…”?
    i didn`t see it.
    but his persecution by the church was…..

  184. frank says:

    thats “make love loudly”
    but you knew that,

  185. Shantam says:

    In 1987, i met four other Indians in the ashram, who were “my type”, the back benchers in the parliament.

    All five of us came to be in the ashram, leaving behind families and carrier, and also it was a first hand attraction and repulsion about western sannyasins around, a healthy revelry.
    All these four friends got disillusioned from the working style of the ashram. “To surrender does not mean to bow down before white monkeys”, therefore all the four went their own ways even before Osho left the body…..

    One of these friends Shashwat, was from my area. Young smart advocate, who came to Pune in 1986 with his beautiful wife and daughter.
    The wife could not find anything worthful in the ashram, so she left with the daughter, and Shaswat stayed like warrior on the path.
    Those who can burn their home, must dare to walk with me. (Jo ghar baare aapna, Chale hamere sang)
    So when in 1987, i met these people, their first question to me was, ” are you Virgin?”
    Forget about meditation. so much opportunity is available to explore, sex and love.
    Shaswat, being a rustic from Haryana, was typically a bull, does not know when to stop. Ma´s were behind him, but he became disillusioned from them too. After the sex, what should i do with them. i miss the intellectual stimulation with my friends….
    During these meetings with my friends, my metaphor and astrological mind started working. ” These women are very attractive, but like the seasonal crop, how one can grow the trees around them” or “you plant the wheat today. one week later you see rice growing.”

    It was the persuasion of these friends, that i came in contact with one of Shaswat´s ex.
    in 1988, when she came with me to my parents home, my mother´s reaction was, ” i am happy to see you communicating in fluent English.”

    Many people warned me in my home town and Pune, please, Iqbal don´t love her or any other visitor with your emotions. You will cry utterly. My reply was and still is my philosophy (born out of Hindi songs), ” This pleasure and pain of love fascinates me. i want to explore this from all the corners”
    “I have heard, love blesses the one, who gets wound on the heart, but does not complain”
    (suna hain usko mohabbat duvaye dati hain… jo dil pe chot to khyaye.. magar gila na kare…).

    Shaswat being a Virgo has immense sense to create jokes from everyday life. During the lunch break at Mariam kitchen, he will make so much fun about sannyasins and Osho.

    Few sentences out of hundreds are still in my mind-
    Osho is like a spoiled child. when you toss a coin, he will say, “head is mine. tail is also mine.”
    To his four five secretaries, he gets all the news of happening in the ashram and gives instructions, but in the evening he will say, ” i am here only as a visiter. spend my whole day in my room. have not even seen the ashram.”
    “Sheela is one of the most beautiful and intelligent woman i ever came across.” Few weeks later, “she is a perfect bitch.”

    “Family is out dated. But takes his mother with, where ever he goes.”
    “To third world will get destroyed during nightmarish nineties. But Jayesh.. don´t forget to build a Olympic size swimming pool”

    One of Shaswat´s main character was, Dahiya sahib, his senior advocate in home town.
    In his story, he takes somebody from the ashram to Dahiya sahib. ” Namaste Dahiya sahib. ABC is so and so in the ashram. has spend years in meditation and direct service to Osho etc.
    Next day, Shaswat will ask him,. ” what was your impression about ABC.”
    Dahiya sahib will say, ” Oh..yes.. i think person was nice. But i warn you Shaswat, not to bring such people again in my chamber”!

    Ps-I hope Kavita shares her opinion. in my flat first seeds of Shashwat Kavita love story was flowered.”

    My purpose to tell this story is that, it is not just Dynamic Kundalini but living personal interactions have always played significant role in any sphere life.

    One can read all the required books of MBA in few weeks but to be at Hayward or London school of Economics has its own significance.
    and yet.. to be a successful business men it is not important even to read a single book of economics or finance.

  186. Kavita says:

    Shantam … you did bring a smile to my face .. when you mentioned Shashwat … this guy’s sense of humour is
    simply just amazing … and what to say .. to me he is .. the only REAL MAN .. l have ever met in my life ..

    Only thing is lam not good at telling it all .. when lam told to … it needs to flow from my within .. to share .. and anyways all love stories are just ‘ STORIES ‘ Dear

  187. Lokesh says:

    Shantam, I read your last comment through. I could hear your voice and yes, I understood, or seemed to understand that you were going to make a good point, conclussion. Then you bring in a metaphor beginnining with: One can read all the required books etc, and I just cannot see the connection. Kavita obviously enjoyed your comment so I take it I am missing something. Please explain in a language that even a dumb Scotsman might understand.

  188. Shantam says:

    Let me try to explain my mind, when i write.
    Example sake, i take the last paragraph of last post-

    “One can read all the required books of MBA in few weeks but to be at Howard or London school of Economics has its own significance.
    and yet.. to be a successful business men it is not important even to read a single book of economics or finance.”

    Just to write about my friend will be very ordinary as we all have some friend with unique talent. We all have some story to tell.
    When i write some pictorial view happens in my brain connected with the thoughts-
    I am also telling the story of a frozen city, once i was part of it, has seen its spring and autumn.
    The impact of it has become part of my life…

    Deep down, in every single thought connected with my days with osho, there is an inbuilt wish to bring in focus the need of commune, Sangha, Matha, ashram, monastery, even when i was writing about Shaswat, the man who after the relation with Kavita, went back to his home city Rohtak, the conservative Hindu heartland, became a famous Yoga teacher lives like a Hindu monk, speaks about Pune phase as some foolhardy decision of the youth, than fall sick, connects with Kavita, she brings him to Pune, take care of him in the best possible way and when friends were thinking now they will stay together, she let go of him to pursue his individual journey.

  189. Kavita says:

    No Dear we both let go .. to pursue our individual journeys

  190. Kavita says:

    Journey is always individual …
    even though they might appear to be a Caravan

  191. Shantam says:

    Journey is individual, but it does not make the value of air, sea or road trasportaion industry´s contribution less worthy.
    on the contrary because of them every tourist with a master´s card, can think himself as Vasco de gama or Columbus.

  192. Kavita says:


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  193. Shantam says:

    A SMS joke

    If columbus had a wife, he might have never discovered America becuase wife:
    where are you going?
    With whom?
    How are you going?

    To discover what?
    Why only you?
    why don´t you take me with you?

    What should i do when you are gone?
    can i come with you? No, i come with you.
    When you will be back?

    Will you miss me?

    Colubus..Mama mia.. i don´t go. happy now!

    (Le meri Ma. Nahi Jaata… Ab khush!)

  194. Kavita says:

    Some use visa cards and the purpose is served .. probably .. and then there is no need to think who he /she is probably .. Vasco or Columbus

  195. frank says:

    a hoop ye wuz peen attenshun,ye domb scoatsman,
    cannae ye nae onderstaand a lobotimized unjun,or wha`?

  196. Lokesh says:

    Oh, man, they folks are aye gawn their pan loves, likesay. A wee counsellin’ seshun we Begbie wid get thim sorfed, like. Nae messin, ken. If Begbie goat his hans oan Kavita they’d be awa with a mixer an if big bouy Shantam stepped in he’d get a Glesca kiss fur his trouble, likesay. Noo where’s ma collecturs copee o’ trainspottin? Dinnae tell me sum rajge has ripped me aff.. Shite, it mustabin wan ey they lobotomized Indian gadjes.

  197. Shantam says:

    ALLAH JANTA HAIN- only Existance/God/ Parmatma knows -

    Translated for Pope as well as Richard dawkins-

    what is good or bad- Allah janta hai
    what is in the human heart, What is earth or heaven,
    what is hidden behind the curtain-only Allah knows.
    After going from world nobody comes, what is that place-only God knows.
    how much you hide your good or bad deeds, Allah knows it
    Look at the light and darkness, look at day n evening, why this is all happening-Allah janta hain.
    What is fate, all know…what is written in the fate….Allah Janta Hain…


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  198. frank says:

    aye,begbie wud sey:
    ur ye gonnae get tha` rulujus shite oot o ya sustem,oor ama gonnae huv t` keck it oot…?

    aye an` ee`d be reet an`all.

  199. frank says:

    to claim that allah knows implies that you know that he knows,thus putting yourself “in the know” with him.

    it`s religious egotism dressed up as humility,to me.

  200. frank says:

    just nobody knows.

    why bring nobodaddy into it?

  201. Shantam says:

    Frank, touch the pussy of your woman as if if is an approximately 10 gms. of skin, all greasy…what to say about eating it for years, not even worthy of a bite…
    it will be a sure way to transcend sex….
    Kill the god…. but don´t Kill the poetry…!!

  202. Kavita says:

    lagsba jadstur osyhit njks lmbcu dix hasni inma


    The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.

  203. Shantam says:

    Sex is such a holy matter and woman are sooo important for men´s survival. Frank and Woman in the above comment are used as a generic term…otherwise you and your girl friend will think, this asshole indian has no respect for …….*

  204. Kavita says:

    l go to sueño now .. get well soon lqbal

  205. prem bobby says:

    Abhay,
    you are clear in your thoughts and feelings,
    but,
    you have an agenda, just like OIF does.

    All of the quotes of Osho in your above posts are Abhay’s edited, chosen excerpts of a much larger complete resevoir of Osho’s 35 year outpourings.

    Remember, every time you use the ‘ellipsis’ of 3 dots (…) in your Osho quotes, it means, by definition, that something came before those dots, or after them. In other words, you have edited Osho’s words.

    I don’t see anything wrong in it, in fact, it’s a necessity.
    Even if you offer a complete, unexpurgated, uncensored, unedited Osho discourse of 2 hours to an audience, there was a discourse that came before that, and one that came after that. And those 2 ‘pre’ and ‘post’ books would surely flesh out the one book you have just read — give you a more extensive picture of Osho’s views.

    If you give a complete, original Osho book transcript to the world’s readers, remember, there was a book that came before that one, and one that came after it.

    Listen to ALL the Ranch interviews and discourses, and you will get only a skewed idea of what Osho was about, because there was all the Pune 1 block that came before it, and all the Pune 2 block that superceded it.

    And on and on….

    Although Abhay, you purport to speak for the holistic view of Osho (Zorba and Zen, love and meditation, etc.), in reality your focus on the Resort and OIF’s vision of Osho belies your self-created image of bringing the Complete Osho back to the people.

    To wit:

    The Pune Resort is just one place on this large planet Earth. Osho wanted his vision spread all over the globe, like seeds scattered in the wind. So you have a geophysical constraint in your views, not in tune with the Complete Osho at all. Even if OIF tries to control whatever “Osho Centers” there are existing around the world, so what? That is just a minute fraction of the world. Let more centers be created. Create one yourself, and run it any way you like. Offer unedited Osho books, offer love, offer meditaiton, and whatever else you want. Who’s stopping you?

    This is talking about space, and it’s unlimited potential.

    Then, the next area is time. Same arguments hold sway here.
    When the current generations of Osho sannyasins are dead and gone, there will be new fresh rivers of seekers. There need be no confinement for these people of a Central Mecca to have to go to, and any contention re the carving and molding that has gone into it. That is a mistake religious fundamentalists have made many times in the past. Live and learn.

    You can create a new Oshopuram in America, or if you have some more guts, an Abhaypuram in Australia. Or, if the Operation Abhay Machine is big enough, you can blast off to Jupiter and Beyond…why limit yourself…?

  206. bob says:

    frank and lokesh,
    enjoying your Scottish banter here,
    language is a real documentation of the human migrational journey, much more interesting (and funny) than the current DNA Genome model being thrust out now by the scientific community…
    I had heard even that Sean Connery, a native Scotsman, had to go through language training lessons to give his 007 Bond character the right British sound in those movies…Dr. No, From Russia with Love…
    In the States, they did the same with Dan Rather, the CBS national news anchorman. He was a native Texan, so they put him through a language school so his voice would be more flat Midwestern English, and acceptable to the US audience. A nemisis to the Ranch people in that time era, I hear.

    Osho’s English…funny, he doesn’t really have that British Indian accent like you would expect, actually sounds more American on the whole, pronounces his r’s at the end of words, h’s at the beginning….did he say “skin ‘ead”…? that would be a surprise…

  207. Shantam says:

    Prem bobby..some introduction about you will be very interesting.Also it is a matter of etiquette, convention and decorum, though i also know.. more the person thinks to understand Osho, more he rebels against the basic values.

  208. oshobob says:

    I have all of Osho’s English books in unedited PDF files on my website, 1600 mp3 unedited Osho audio talks there too, copyrighted photos of Osho all over the place, Chinese translations, Osho quotes, used the name “Osho” for myself and the website name…

    and I have never had one problem with OIF, The Resort, Global Connections, The Gang of Two, Ma Vatayana, Sw. Pramod, or anyone else. No legal threats, no nasty emails, … nothing.

    Maybe you should just drop “sannyas”, forget the master-disciple setup, and you may have more freedom in your actions, rather than trying to battle it out, as to who has the best idea of the real Osho Vision….

  209. oshobob says:

    Shantam,
    prem bobby…
    “prem” means love.
    bobby is a nickname for bob, which is a nickname for robert.
    enough for today.

  210. Shantam says:

    now we have bob and Oshobob, Prem Bubbie and prem bobby, shantam i singh and shantam….
    Who is who?

  211. Shantam says:

    This is a mathematics. Oshobob is also prem bobby
    and the real name, Robert. Full name may be Robert Mugabe?
    No wonder, OIF does not want to take any Panga!

  212. bob says:

    there’s more to come, just stay tuned…
    it should get interesting, shantam…

    Aim name kohre linken bora lakeh, seem kohre keet raman pale….

    (“when the fish climb up the Himalayas, the rats run and hide in their nests.”)

  213. Forest Gump says:

    Bob,

    Looking to forward to hear more from you…You are only one who endorsed “love” without any prejudiced or conditions or expressing love in Bubbie type of hatred. You just said three words “Love Love Love”…that I somehow go in tune with, although my quest is still intact. I appreciate Lokesh’s lovingly described insights about fake love and selfishness.

    I don’t know why my mind want to convince me that Love used to be FAKE and now it has become TABOO. More and more people are unable to scrape off their fears about love, and feel restricted and conditioned to make mockery of this beautiful phenomenon in life.

    My love to you..

  214. prem bubbie says:

    You can “love” all you want, Dump. Simply said, you can either acknowledge what human love is or be in denial…. Admission of something is the first step in “healing”…healing what , i don’t know. You Mr. dumpster diver, don’t want to heal, don’t want to live sincerely, don’t want to face life as it is. Go on loving, it’s just another way to chase your tail….It’s all of the mind anyhow. Talk about Osho’s message, no need to babble on like Prem Abhay, or shantam D. Singher.

  215. prem bubbie says:

    yo frankie baby, me likee your poetree, anee more quotes from other poets?

  216. Forest Gump says:

    Bubbie, my dear friend..

    You say: It’s all mind, (Hindi: Sara Jagat maya hai) –Life is illusion – Goose is Out…Preaching …Parroting

    I have known that theoretically for long time, so then what? ignore the love? Ignore the songs of birds, ignore the beauty of vast sky..Ignore the compassion in one’s eyes. Ignore the fact that life yields so much without asking for it?

  217. Forest Gump says:

    Wanna get healed tonite? Come; take a dope; fly off Christian colors and feel the “no mind”.

  218. bob says:

    hey, talking about Christian colors, FG, looks like the Pope is in white tonite, in Londontown. Hobnobbing with the Archbishop of Canterbury at Westminster Cathedral, the first Pope to ever worship there. Looks like the Church of England is softening up a bit to the Holy See — everyone has come a long way baby, since the good old days of Hank the 8th, Ann Bolyn and Jane Seymour on the Brits side, and the Nazi Youth League and weinerschnitzel on il Papa’s side.

    Makes me think of all the so-called neo-satsang givers from the Osho camp — they all shy away from what was their master’s bread and butter, blasting the Pope and all religions, the Presidents and all governments. Not a peep on these subjects anymore….just this advaita mush — “we are all One”….almost sounds like the Catholic line, the World Community global Oneness stuff…

    any of you guys here from the London area got an Invite to the big Show in town….?

  219. prem bubbie says:

    parroting , that’s a laugh…. No, it’s the truth , something you’re not familiar with mr. dump. Arrogance, stubbornness, aka. having one’s head up one’s ass while living. for something of the mind needs a physical root and that’s the brain…dopehead!!! you have known “that theoretically for a long time”… oh really, you’re only in your twenties by your own admission…. what, you knew that since you were sucking on your mama’s titties? You try to fool everyone with your bullshit “my friend” and “with love” phrases…. your arrogance and stupidity flower every time you post…. chulip.

  220. prem bubbie says:

    if people like forest gump and shantam i singh are the “new” sannyasins—- fucking heaven help us!!!!

  221. prem bubbie says:

    love you create in your head—- what love and beauty are to some- ugliness and nastiness are to others. In the eyes and “hearts” of the beholder.

  222. Forest Gump says:

    Bubbie the Pretzel prick got really burned in fire of humbleness. It’s obvious from his well defined rants so far that his mama didn’t give him chance to suck her tits. There is another is well possibility that he bit it so badly that she kick his butt off from her breast to give him the cause of becoming so insensitive.

    Talk about love. It sucks Bubbie. It itches him like fire ants crawling under the pajama on chronic scabies.

    It feels good to have fun with him though, out of love..ha ha

  223. Shantam says:

    “…. if you want to stay the bishop,dont mess with the pope…..

    Frank has written this absolute truth kind of statement in the last thread.

    it looks like, people like Jesus are born only once and gone for ever, but popes and chairman´s have conitinuity of successors.
    So if someone wants to enjoy the deep cool water of a sea for eternity, must not create enmity with Crocodile.

    Jal main reh ke Magar se bair…….Na baba na

  224. Lokesh says:

    Some great comments and seeing as how Shantam is using more and more Hindi in his post I feel fine about saying, geeus a brek, Jimmy.
    Forest, don’t you have some more pals that you could get interested in commenting on this blog. I feel sorry for you, having to take all the shit. We could share it about a bit. But then again, seeing as how you have a special connection to Osho all these comments are absorbed by that divine love you are basking in.
    Okay, mate, time to tear a scab off a bluey. (That one is for Bob to work on.)

  225. Shantam says:

    Brothers in arms: Both the Pope and the Archbishop of Canterbury spoke at a joint service at Westminster Abbey

    Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1313025/POPES-UK-VISIT-Benedict-defends-Christmas-warns-religion-sidelined-Parliament-speech.html#ixzz0zrn6UVz7

    Representatives of OIF(Osho international Foundation) and OFI( Osho friends International)…TAKE NOTICE.

    If all of Osho´s medittaions are unable to break the frozen communication, next option is to do some workshop in ARC triangle of Scientolgy!!

  226. Shantam says:

    No Hindi, No scotish accent, just Indianised English-

    “When the cat is away, the mouse will play,” which means that if the teachers is away, the students will do something.

    SO true in the world of spiritual history of humanity.

    Since 1990, world is watching also a new phenomenon- Cat is away and is pronounced dead..so one has to create a new proverb-

    WHEN THE CAT IS DEAD, MOUSE WILL BE THE CAT.

  227. Lokesh says:

    You have it wrong, Shantam.
    More correct would be to say: When the cat is away the mice will play.The reality is such that there is not simply a mouse in the house, but rather mice – dozens of them – and the situation is made even more complicated by the fact that the mice all use the same name….’I’.
    Now then, that’s enough Gurdieff for today.

  228. Kavita says:

    True .. Lokesh
    & its really sad this ‘ i ‘ finds others disillusioned

  229. Shantam says:

    Is “I” , the new devil in the block?

  230. Kavita says:

    no the perpetual Devil in the block

  231. Alok john says:

    Bob wrote : “I have never had one problem with OIF, The Resort, Global Connections, The Gang of Two, Ma Vatayana, Sw. Pramod, or anyone else. No legal threats, no nasty emails, … nothing.”

    I think there are problems when people attack them in some way, otherwise not.

  232. Shantam says:

    Perpetual means also Forever/Everlasting/occurring continually.

    If “i” has this everlasting reality.. why than this effort to be free from this “I” or to make it Coleststal free and Omega 6 rich.

  233. Kavita says:

    if this is a question ..
    then you need to find out for yourself ..
    otherwise nothing / everything is effortless

  234. Shantam says:

    Kavita once you have written, where is the vatican of Buddha?
    I just thought, answer may be is-

    Beijing

  235. Shantam says:

    Bob has written the other day, “Makes me think of all the so-called neo-satsang givers from the Osho camp — they all shy away from what was their master’s bread and butter, blasting the Pope and all religions, the Presidents and all governments.”

    To blast the vested interests in the soceity, one needs to be beyond them.
    When one is not an inch better than these pope and religions, to blast them requires a dumb head courage of a suicide bomber!

    Bob gives a social commantry, than he wears a monk´s robe and becomes Oshobob.
    Oshobob has not got any problem from OIF, he should say thankyou to Osho friends International (OFI)
    It was the effort of these unorganised people that OIF lost the land marked case against their own co travelers who were dancing at the tunes of the same master at the same time in the same circus.

    If by chance, osho foundation would have won the case, than it was a question of a cyclo styled legal notice to other 60, 70 small players in Osho distribution.

  236. Kavita says:

    Probably Biji ke jaang me .. would be better answer

  237. Forest Gump says:

    Lokesh,

    I have so many pals that most of the time I have to work around the situation to get out of them. You guys are my “on demand” pals. For now, being stuck in front of my computer for work, you guys offer the best company that I can look out plus talking about my master/my love Osho, just about anything of him nourishes me. I appreciate your love and blessings that you feel concerned about me. I love you too.

  238. Lokesh says:

    Gulp!

  239. Shantam says:

    Lokesh, please initiate young gump into sannyasless sannyas in the name of Osho, and chose a Scotish name to break his ” conditioning”.

  240. Forest Gump says:

    Love is hard to digest; Love is always young irrespective of physical age. Only unloving people grow old.

  241. Forest Gump says:

    I don’t know who said that..

  242. Shantam says:

    Gumpy, you have the vail of annonymity, everybody here has accepted this, before you speak so much of love, it will be relevant to tell something about YOU, the man who works on computers, somewhere in the world. When was the last time, you had the bra of someone, and someone else hands were on the the Tits of that someone!

    Once i heard the couplet of Galib, which is not in his compilations…it does not matter who wrote this. It is quite hard hitting-
    Ishq wo sheh nahi Galib, jiski londe baat kaarne..
    Gand phat jati hain sadma sehte sehte…

    (Love is not that thing Galib, guys are talking about..
    It is pain in the ass, to bear the consequences)

  243. Forest Gump says:

    Shantam,

    You have been complaining about my anonymity from the very beginning, and then you conveyed that it doesn’t concern you anymore. I am just like anyone else in this forum loving, hating, fighting, abusing…there is no tag it.

    However I admire you the way you are.

  244. Forest Gump says:

    By the Waah…Waah…on the Galib’s quote…It made me laugh to the belly…..Yeah, Gand tou Phatathi hai, Per kya kare..( Its pain, may be take a Tylenol)

  245. prem bubbie says:

    “ignore the songs of the birds”…. songs, maybe to you, it’s just communication between birds,; that’s how they communicate, not like the insane gibberish you call communication. “ignore the vast beauty of the sky”…. What if the sky is dark and gray? from forest fires…. or the smoggy air… I forgot you’re from India, the great arm pit of the world… where the fragrance in the air to love is human shit decaying, the sky, being so brown from pollution; the birds singing… what birds? all dead from polluted air or killed by starving people so they can fill their stomachs. Want some more…. well take your head out of your ass, maybe you can see and hear for the first time… oh i forgot, no need to, you have osho on your side…. First you take your anti-psychotic medicine, then you can post here.

  246. Shantam says:

    India, the great arm pit of the world…

    wow. what a metaphor!

    And America?
    So much shaved pubes..one can think, hairs down there never grow..

  247. prem bubbie says:

    BTW Check out friday’s (U.S. time) Larry King Live CNN. probably available online….scientists talking about the latest in scientific research on the human brain/mind….. Yes Osho was a strong advocate for science unlike the dim wits posting on here…. bunch of backward country hillbillies!!!

  248. Forest Gump says:

    Bubbie,
    I agree that beauty and love lies in the eyes of beholder.

  249. prem bubbie says:

    shantam: the last 5,000 years of india’s history speaks for itself… no need to be angry dude…. what the fuck are you people waiting for in India? you’re soooooo spiritual and love driven… are you just sadomasochists in disguise?

  250. prem bubbie says:

    so gump, how does it feel to get a breath of fresh air? all of that methane does damage the brain…. stay clean and breath right!!

  251. Shantam says:

    Were the scientista telling that Virgin birth is possible, if one inserts artificial ovary, therefore they are born again christians.
    May be there were telling to Larry king, because of some brain damage, he was unable to love any of the 8 women he married.
    or were they telling, ” Enlighenment is the biggest rip off of last few thousand years.”

  252. Shantam says:

    I am not angry. that is why i have complimented your metaphor..India the arm pits of the world.
    You may know.. the 5000 years history of India, so try to read present Indian media reports.
    We are one of world´s most self critical nation, and most of the jokes are directed towards one´s own race and system.

  253. Forest Gump says:

    Bubbie,

    Seems like you work in a coal mine. Buddy, when the air is polluted, use mask. It’s a common sense. When there is no money in the pocket, find work. Making living conditions more suitable to body is a part of life.

  254. frank says:

    when the cat is dead.
    the mice can do what they want…..

    diogenes` dog will just laugh….

  255. Forest Gump says:

    Shantam,

    When you pull the carpet up, you will find dead cockroaches and all kind of dirt at same the place where you enjoyed your most serene moment. India has no carpet or May there is no need to put it. In west you find 80 years old females getting Botox injections to hide the wrinkles. This phenomenon hasn’t occurred to India yet, especially not in the rural part or so called “backward” part. Mother still enjoy his motherhood and children still bask under the shadow of tree in hot summer and enjoy playing in dust.

  256. Shantam says:

    So romantic notions i don´t have for my homeland.

    Mother still enjoy his motherhood and children still bask under the shadow of tree in hot summer and enjoy playing in dust.

    This is not just about India. Latin America, Africa, Asia; more than 5 billion people can relate with such notions.
    and these people have one hidden wish.. how to aquire the status of western people….

    West is the trned setter for million and one things, we think we need and this confidence has made them to think.. they are the masters of the inner treasures too.
    But this unneeded arrogance in one form or another, we all have.

  257. Forest Gump says:

    Haven’t heard of many mystic raised from basking rural of Latin America or Africa. India is mystical, there is no arrogance about it, it just a plain fact. I don’t have such romantic notion for the land either, but I don’t ignore its offerings provided to me in a subtle form. However I am equally thankful to west for its offerings in gross form. A balance is good.

  258. Shantam says:

    This is even more praiseworthy, that rural of Latin America or Africa did not raise so called many mystics, and still the people survived and kept their sanity in all kind of circumstances.

    When i think, Wasudeva Kutumbakam.. The earth is a family, than everybody and every part has its unique contribution even those parts, which look barren and non fertile.
    (It includes Muslims too, if they refind themselves as a race a little more, if they speak more and more in the style of Farid Zakaria rather than Hizbullah..)

  259. Shantam says:

    For us sannyasins, Osho is the best mystic, world has ever seen. We are the blessed ones to sit at His feet.
    we wish the whole world should listen His words of sanity in this fast changing world.

    For this reason, should we get the compassion awards, should we get a quota in UNO?
    Should every country reserve some seats in the Parliament for the sannyains of that country, because their meritocracy can bring new insights.
    During the time of conflict, sannyasin can recommend, few minutes of Gibberish and than silence..afterwards one can take the best decisions for nation´s interest.
    Summary- HEALER HEAL THYSELF. or we are like those masons, who built buildings for others, but live their whole life in leaking huts.

  260. bob says:

    that’s right Shantam, i would have liked to see some Osho Gibberish Meditation in Westminster Abbey last night…Pope Benedict, the Archbiship of Canterbury, Tony Blair, and even Maggie was there, by God…that would’ve been a sight to see…even in the back there, yappin’ away, or was he laffin’…it was Diogenes’ dog!!! Holy cow, good God Almighty….!!!!!

  261. Shantam says:

    Pope Benedict and the archbishop of cantebury have broken the dead lock, they have met in a cordial atmoshpahre, possibilty of dialogue has arisen in their sphare of action.
    Gibberish is not there mantra.

    Let representatives of Osho International Foundation and Osho friends IOnternational meet and do Gibberish, how much possibilty you see on this front, Bob.

  262. bob says:

    no, i was looking at that photo closer…that wasn’t Diogenes’ dog…that was frank, for god’s sake, doing some sort of British street theater/situational comedy stunt…!! holy jesus!!!

  263. Shantam says:

    It was in my mind the whole day, that if the Osho´s work is done as a joint responsibilty, i will forward your name, the name of osho´sbob for
    “Osho website of the year award.”
    A single man, without any institutional support has treasured Osho´s words in such a maginficiant way, moroever has translated them in Chineese, without any cushy office at Park Avenue New York, it is a shame for those people who boast, what they are doing and with how much money, the work for Osho.

    Small small hands joined together have carried the stones to built the maginficinant catherdals, in each and every age in the name of influential masters.

  264. bob says:

    OIF and OFI meeting cordially in the same room?
    can’t really picture it Shantam, but who knows,
    a lot of strange things happen you don’t expect…

    like….

    did you see that video floating around on Facebook, with Maggie T. standing up in Westminster Abbey and demanding the Pope to get down off his bully pulpit, stop lecturing us on Charity for the Poor, and bad ethics being the cause of the financial meltdown, and all such rubbish…

    “You just get your booty down here Benny boy!” demands the Iron Lady.

    And the Pope goes down like a guilty choirboy, and he and Maggie start cuttin’ loose in the center aisle in the Hall, boogying like you wouldn’t believe, the Watusi, the Mashed Potato….the astonished crowd was snapping away with their cellphone cameras, flashes poppin’…it was a sight, i’ll tell you.

    so, if something like that happened, i suppose the battling Osho factions could come together in some way too…anythings possible…

  265. Lokesh says:

    Does the Pope smoke dope.

    All you Indian wallahs waffling on about the great mystic tradition that your country has produced, and how the West is gobbling it up and no other country in the world can offer this.
    This kind of reasoning only serves to show me how out of touch you guys are in relation to current spiritual trends on this planet.
    The thing about the sannyas movement that has changed is that Osho is dead. One can imagine some special connection to the master but his physical presence is irreplaceable, because the man was a spiritual dynamo. In the early days one could have personal conntact with the master and there was a powerful, life-changing exchange taking place that could permanently change the course of one’s life. This had nothing to do with words. It was an energetic transmission. These days sannyasins are pretty much free to do what they want because the guiding hand that Osho was is no more. It was only necessary to sit in relatively close proximity to the man to get a clear reflection of where you were at in terms of the search for a true spiritual identity. Bullshit was burnt in the flame of awareness that the master represented. Nowadays we have clowns imaging themselves to be vessels of inner emptiness when in fact they are overflowing tea cups of arrogance. They get away with this because the cat is dead and the mice rule the roost. In other words, the master is no longer there and neither is his zen stick to wallop the ego.
    The Indian guru trip has not lost the credibility in the West of say the Catholic church, I mean everyone pretty much realizes that the Pope and his cronies are a bunch of wankers, everyone that counts, that is. The masses still turn out in droves to watch a drive by with the Pope-mobile but they don’ really count. And so it is that Osho’s drive-bys in his rolls royces did much to tarnish his credibility ratings in the guru stakes. Remember, in the world at large, Osho is remembered for the shambles that was Rajneeshpuram…you know, the only biological terrorist act perpetrated on American soil etc. Not at all how Shantam fantazizes it, quote: Osho is the best mystic, world has ever seen. Dream on.
    So Indian gurus’ image is in general image-wise a tarnished one.
    Now there is a new movement going off big time around the world and that is the ayahuasca experience. By drinking a glass of the Amazonian brew the seeker can be presented with a life-changing experience. This is not some Mickey Mouse lets get high drug trip, but rather a powerful spiritual experience and right now nothing the east has to offer can compare. So, sorry my Indian amigos, something has come out of the west that has toppled the eastern masters from the throne that monopolizes the ‘spiritual’ experience and this has happened in part because of the gurus oftentimes childish and immmature behaviour when physically arriving in the west and falling Foul of the traps that come with money in abundance.
    As guruji Bob Dylan sings in one of his famous hymns: ‘You better start swimming or you’ll sink like a stone, because the times they are a changing.’

  266. Shantam says:

    Lokesh, read my comment again, where i said about Osho, the best master.. may be you see another meaning as you thought while writing the above comment.

    And secondly..”The thing about the sannyas movement that has changed is that Osho is dead. One can imagine some special connection to the master but his physical presence is irreplaceable, because the man was a spiritual dynamo”

    It is one of the myth that to be with a living Master is like getting the kiss of Aids, sure shot death for “I”.

    The disciple with a thirst can purify even the gutter water, and those who take Ganges as granted, use it also for dumping their sewerage.

  267. Lokesh says:

    Shantam, very profound!

  268. Shantam says:

    Buddha or Jesus kind of people have expanded because of the power of their message, and people´s willingness to integrate that message in their life, what so ever may come on the way contrary to that.
    Osho´s spiritual dynamo can work with the same principle, but how to ignite, is our work.
    And when a new comer sees that even those who got instructions directly from manufacturer are unable to incite that power, they will discard the product. To do so is their right.

    Therefore my observation is that, don´t go into this missionary trip to spread Osho, to use such kind of words, ” I am doing Osho´s work.”
    Man has left more than half million initiated disciples, create an environment where these people feel enriched and cared. Their mutual stimulation will create enough milieu to spread the Neo Virus out of its own.
    “All we need is(meditative) love.”, not just song in our mp3, not just hormones in our veins…but love in action.

  269. prem bobby says:

    some very good points made both by Lokesh and Shantam, though by unfortunate necessity, partial views never illuminate the whole picture, so on we go trying to fill in the holes…

    “love in action”, says Shantam. Ok. Sounds good, but now the interpretation of that arises. The Catholic Church, Christians in general, and the Pope in particular, interpret that as Charity. First you need the poor, sick, drug-addicted, uneducated…then the “loving ones” can give money, medical care, AA workshops, and schools as “love in action”, i.e., charity.

    Osho had a different view. Clean your conditionings through meditation, on an individual basis, and love will be your natural fragrance, 24/7. Sounds simple, but in reality it’s a lot of hard-living experiences that gets you to that Zone…gradual to instant, as the Zen guys have modeled it out through the centuries.

    Lokesh seems to have this idea of being in the presence of the living master will do the job the best, but that is not really borne out by reality. I mean, all the so-called “Judas’s” of the Osho movement — Teertha, Sheela, Shiva, etc. were sitting there in the front row for years…and, what happened? I don’t think that holds water at all. If it did, Osho could have had his sannyasins walk by him daily for individual meetiings, up front, up close, 10 seconds each, eyeball to eyeball. Would have been very easy, with only a couple thousand disciples in attendance. He didn’t do it. Not to say that couldn’t happen, either — spiritual evolution by being in a Buddhafield — but I don’t think it’s a formula to attach yourself to. Can you say Jesus’ 12 disciples did much great work, or Buddha’s? What was Mahakashyap’s output? Can you even name the 28 enlightened Zen masters from Mahakashyap to Bodhidharma? I’ll wager anyone on sannyasnews couldn’t come up with 2 or 3, and that’s just the names, to say nothing of what great things they did….if they even existed!

  270. frank says:

    how rich are you and how much will you wager on that,bobby?
    oshobob will take you on for sure.
    oshobob,get those names out and we`ll split the takings!

  271. frank says:

    the “get into the presence of the enlightened master and you`re sorted” is a pretty suspect idea.
    i have never seen such a bunch of nutters,
    apart from when i gave satsang in the lithuanian electroshock hospital….

    and ahayuasca?
    a bunch of longhairs drinking green sludge,vomiting and turning their brains into rainbow custard ….?
    quick,pass me the bucket,i am about to have a spiritual experience………

  272. Shantam says:

    Frank. Ohsobob being man of the truth has clarified the other day, he, Bob and Prem Bobby are one and the same person.

    Three coats for different occasions!

    He may tell, which one is from C&A, which one is from G&D, H&M or
    frorm Z&O (Zen and Osho)

  273. prem bubbie says:

    Lokesh, I disagree with you about the catholic church and its relevance today. Everyone doesn’t know the church is run by a bunch of wankers. You have about a billion people who still call themselves “catholic”, though many not adhering to the “traditional” catholic dogma. A billion isn’t chump change, they may have felt the humiliation of the sex scandals, but out of what i describe of a “great fear”, they figure they might as well stick with those guys and continue on walking in a zombie like state to oblivion. A great fear to live, to fly free, to celebrate, to discover and a general, primal fear of letting go, the Great Attachment… just like any other relationship created out of loneliness.. but this relationship has been created from childhood by fearful and lonely parents… that superstitious creation called “god”….. it is/was in all of us, that small corner of the mind where no challengers dare tread, by the penalty of death if you upset that fictitious creation….. I believe no matter what ugly truth may be brought to light the church and its sorry-ass bunch of followers will always exist…. the history of the church proves that.

  274. prem bubbie says:

    regarding osho being the best mystic the world has ever seen, that’s a matter of opinion, prior to osho, bodhidharma was the greatest mystic, then jesus, buddha, lao tsu, etc. etc. in ten years, who knows? A bit of arrogance on your part Shantam, and that’s the issue i’ve been bringing up time and again, the sannyasin arrogance, and also arrogance of every group since humans’ existence on this planet. Prem bobby said”… clean your conditioning through meditation”. That is not true, it was more like, through catharsis, then go into meditation… another point to repeat… most sannyasins think that doing an hour of dynamic or kundalini or doing the mystic rose, all will be fine…. for our modern dense mind, way more than an hour of catharsis is needed to clean out the trash in the head, then there’s a better chance of meditation happening….. It’s the “Lazy man’s guide” to enlightenment still speaking, i would have thought by now at least some sannyasins would realize this…. more stupidity in the sannyasin home.

  275. oshobob says:

    good post, bubbie. some focused insights there…

    frank, here’s The List of 28 Zen Masters from Mahakashyap to Bodhidharma — all “Indian” guys. i won’t take bobby’s money, i’m sure the kid needs it, he just forgot about me, that’s all, a lapse of memory — acutally, I can’t remember these guys’ names either, that’s why I made the webpage…

    http://www.livingworkshop.net/indianzen.html

    There is no record that I’ve ever seen of these dudes in any Indian literature, it all comes from the Chinese as far as I know. And you know the Chinese — if they want a mountain, they will BUILD a mountain!

  276. frank says:

    nonsense,
    a couple of glasses of amazonian jungle juice….
    vomit my ego into into a bucket…..
    then out dancing with brian in vilnius……
    problems?
    they are for the unconscious masses…
    ya-hoooo……

  277. bob says:

    good correction bubs,
    first comes catharsis, then comes meditation, then come Buddha in the baby carriage.

  278. prem bobby says:

    i would shy away from putting anything in my stomach that i can’t pronounce or spell easily…ajahuatrl, ayahuatoctl…forget it…
    i did enough puking in my teenage years drinking Southern Comfort on the streets…let the Peruvian shamans drink that slop all they want, i’ll stick to pasteurized, homogenized milk…

  279. Lokesh says:

    Yeah, well I just chucked the jungle juice story in the soup to give a bit of Amazonian flavour….not interested personally. Thing is, some excellent comments delivered. Thank e kindly, gents.

  280. oshobob says:

    btw, frank, i was meaning to ask you, bro’…
    how did you hustle your way into Westminster last Friday night at the big shindig with il Papa and the upper-crust of the London Who’s Who? That was a coup de gras if i ever saw one…or is a faux pas a better phrase for it…

  281. Shantam says:

    bob, prem bobby and oshobob_one person with three identities has log in the time span of 15 minutes.

    Is this the Zen-osphy from Robert Mugabe´s
    Zim bob way?

  282. frank says:

    plus,bob he has obviously downed a couple of pints of the old green sludge…

    and i would take any zen bull from a guy whose name i couldn`t even spell..

    mackashstrap…..manolito….avagoson….

    what a bunch of bodhidharma-bums…..

  283. oshobob says:

    hey Shantam your slip’s showing…
    ‘Zim bob way’…that sounds almost like a Frankian Slip…
    not bad, bro’….

  284. bob says:

    and speaking of ‘bobs’,
    did you guys hear that bob dylan has dropped his Christian trip, and is now a born-again Zen Buddhist, yeah really…
    he’s changing his lyrics on that song too…now he sings,
    “it’s not light yet..but it’s gettin’ there.”

  285. Lokesh says:

    I always liked Dylan but I was never a fan….that is, until I got a phone message that said, ‘Hey, want to go and see Bob Dylan tommorow in Rotterdam?’ Yeah. So, 15,000 people behind me as I sit in the middle seat in the front row with Mr Zimmerman 10 feet away. The man was brilliant, I just wanted him to go on and on and on. So, yes, he’s been through a few weird chamges but he’s delivered so many good lines. Quote:
    I don’t care about economy, I don’t care about astronomy
    But it’s sure do bother me to see my loved ones turning into puppets
    There’s slow, slow train coming up around the bend.

    Prem Bobby asks: Teertha, Sheela, Shiva, etc. were sitting there in the front row for years…and, what happened?
    The times changed, I suppose. I mentioned in a previous post how Osho came out with it one morning and said that the ones sitting closest to him in morning discourse were the ones most in need of his help. Or maybe he was simply a bad judge of character. Sheela, before her rise to infamy, was an obvious spoiled brat, head up her own arse etc. Shiva didn’t have his head up his arse but there was something sharp and pointed jammed up there that was making him look uncomfotable, that is going by the look he had on his face, behind his mask of hyper vigilence. Teertha, I liked him, basically because I was young and inexperienced and a bit in awe of his psychic powers, man. Wasn’t much of a stud when it came to sex though. As described in my first book: The brief sexual encounter took on a bestial quality, like watching a horny old bull in a muddy paddock, mounting a young cow after he’d cornered her. Strange as it appeared, she’d put up no resistance to the situation. She’d been passively receptive to having sexual intercourse with a man who could have passed for her great-grandfather. Old Teertha probably thought he was in heaven. Ah well…..another one bites the dust.

  286. frank says:

    zen bulls talking zen bull in order to mount zen cows…
    i suppose that counts as a “transmission outside of the scriptures”
    and ,if nothing else,at least the zen bulls` balls got “enlightened”……

  287. michael says:

    ~ having just discovered another world of ‘osho’ in regards to ‘followers’, all I can say is… hahahahahahaha, ffs wake up… to those who have not quite got what Osho conveyed so many times in so many ways…
    He stated that his views changed continually to give everyone an oppertunity to try and understand what goes on…
    He stated that he was quite mad and never takes life seriously…
    Wow, what a guy… so much depth of Wisdom and Truth…
    For some, I am not sure why they bother to involve their-self with mudane word-fighting, others I see their ego and intellect showing so clearly that I get visions of monkees and parrots whilst reading…
    If anyone should be offended by what I have written, then obviously they are relating these words to their-self…
    Everything is valid in their-own-life, and life is for living, for happiness and transcending…
    BTW, I was in jail, serving a life sentence for being a vigilante when I came across Osho in a certain book … and it was his wordage on the Purpose of Life = Transcending the consciousness of whom we are now, that changed my life…
    All glories to Osho, to his words that help in the transcendence of many an individual…
    Whooohoooo… lol in love and peace … :)
    If anyone should nod with agreement, then