Simond explores the Borderline between humour and cynicism
On these pages, we discuss and debate various topics of interest to a smallish selection of largely older Sannyasins. Much of the correspondence and topics have a humorous vain to it, some is more serious, and others simply more historical in form.
I dropped in about a year ago, to seek out what was new and to enter the debate. One of the initial responses to my posts was to find that if I offered an opinion or idea, or speculated on a subject, some contributors were initially suspicious, cynical and even hostile. There were specific responses which indicated I had no right to an opinion because I questioned some aspects of Sannyas or Osho himself, and others that saw me as being too self righteous, thus the nickname, the Rev was born.
Humour and cynicism often slip into each other, and the notion that to mock or to laugh at any contribution is much lauded amongst many Brits. It’s a style much loved here to laugh at and to ridicule our peers and especially to mock ” authority”. It may ensure we aren’t too serious about anything and less prone to ” belief”
But what is humour? There’s an argument here that has raged for a long time and the debate reached a new zenith with Charlie Hebdon…
In many discussions here on this site there are often very polarised views. What often happens is that rather than engage with the correspondent, and allow a real exploration, the reactions are often cynical and antagonistic. On a wider level look at the reaction of the public to a Russell Brand, who has attempted to cross over from humour to politics and discussion of religions and philosophy. He, and others who step out of line are ridiculed by the cynics.
Another example from my own history: When I met Barry Long,(at first through a single page ad in the national Sunday paper, “the Observer “) Who was he, an Aussie to talk of enlightenment and God ? The arrogance of the man! I was hostile and deeply cynical – without even looking any further, because I was already entrenched in my ideas about what these things meant. How could a westerner have knowledge of enlightenment? Impossible! My cynicism and antagonism were a direct result of my thinking that ” I know best”. I was closed to a new way of thinking, without ever having explored this chap at all.
Is it not true that as we age, (as many of us here at SN) we tend to become more conservative, more closed to new music , new fashions, new ideas, what ‘we know’ becomes safe and comfortable, and I’ve seen this tendency in myself and in others. “War worn cynicism”, is a privilege of the old man, stuck in his ways, and these tendencies creep up on us unseen and unnoticed. Often it is younger people who show us our self importance and our narrow minded vision. It takes some real discipline to ensure we don’t fall into this trap.
Another aspect of this cynicism is the tendency to be safe in our pain, in our past and in what we do and don’t know about new ways of thinking. By safe, I mean that we tend to have given up looking afresh at the issue of consciousness and to think we’ve seen it all before and there ain’t no possibility of change. We quote Osho or others, rather than explore from the presence of today.
Many of us remain safe in the knowledge that enlightenment is for others. Safe in the knowledge that pain will always be with us, safe knowing that there isn’t any true hope, or anything new under the sun. To sneer at others less mature and informed than we are. To laugh at others, because laughter ensures that we can retain our sense of self identity.
I seem to remember the man, asking us to rid ourselves as far as possible from the safe confines of such self identify and plunge into the chaos of the new. His laughter often served a purpose .. To make us laugh at ourselves, at our beliefs, at our cherished notions of who and what we are. I don’t recall him being cynical?
Simond
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9mp3s2gpy8
My heartiest regards, (Rev.) Simond, for a thought-provoking piece. It is a nice read before going to bed.
Like many other contributors I don´t read ‘Who am I?’ and ‘Who Are You?’ kind of Advaita literature before sleeping’; your kind of articles are perfect for me.
They give the feeling of op ed page in a classic newspaper! (MOD: PLEASE CLARIFY “op ed page”, SHANTAM)
I looked up “op ed page” on my search engine, it says: “a newspaper page opposite the editorial page, devoted to personal comment, feature articles, etc.”
Thank you, Shantam, good to know about this, I thought since you didn’t bother as yet to answer, I felt like sharing with Mod & others.
When I came to Sannyasnews I did realise that there most of them were much older than myself. Since I have lived my formative life with my grandparents perhaps I am more used to being among matured beings, it did take me little time to find my own nourishment!
Of course, the age/sex barrier has not mattered much to me in relating with anyone. When I opened myself up here it has been very therapeutic for me, although initially very traumatic, & right now I’m quite at ease (& I tell myself whenever it shall seem stressful I can always take a break from SN).
Cynicism from outside has brought out my inside cynicism too, or whatever other response have made me even more open to that aspect, & I have realised that the paradox is, only through identifying myself , shall I be able to be totally free from self-identity. I could be wrong about that!
Simond seems to be the new hero of SN. And he certainly has some quite extraordinary psychic powers that enable him to (apparently) know exactly what goes on inside other human beings, what their motivations are, how they live their lives etc. And not least what their motives are when they disagree with him – which, of course, can only be due to some psychic defects in the deluded bastards
And like Richard Dawkins and other staunce sceptics, he is firmly convinced that whatever he himself has not experienced can not exist. So if others talk about spiritual learnings and experiences then the conclusion is obvious: they are dreaming, hallucinating, or caught up in wishful thinking.
In other words, Simond is the epitome of traditional closed-mindedness of the rather fanatic kind that denies whatever is beyond his own limited understanding. And funnily enough, all the while he is accusing his ‘opponents’ (= anyone with a different worldwide) (MOD: worldwide? OR world-view, PERHAPS?) for being closed-minded and for playing it safe.
But Shantam and most others here seem to like it, so everything is fine. And for (true/sincere) sannyasins there are lots of constructive activities on fx FB. And there is the great Oshonews website for us old, stale and conservative people who feel that the best way for us to grow(!) is somewhat related to Osho and his visions.
That quite a number of younger folks also seem to be interested in Osho these days is, of course, a source of irritation for the Lokesh and Simond type, but also that can be explained away with some (pseudo)-psychological cliches.
But sleep well, Simon, I have no right – and no interest in doing it – to disturb your self-satisfied slumber.
MOD: HEEREN, PLEASE SEE MY QUERY, 3RD PARAG.
BH, you come across like a real smug twat.
Bodhi says:
“And for (true/sincere) sannyasins there are lots of constructive activities on fx FB.”
I bet he`s got a Blue Peter badge and a Crackerjack pencil!
“Simond is the epitome of traditional closed-mindedness of the rather fanatic kind that denies whatever is beyond his own limited understanding.”
Strange comment this, Heeren, as in fact I find Simond one of the most open-minded contributors to SN.
To clear the confusion, perhaps you could elucidate precisely what “is beyond his own understanding” (according to you), please?
If Bodhi has his way, he may even hire ISIS gunmen to protect the heavenly territory where he thinks he will get a villa with other like-minded people from Oshonews.
He may grin with satisfaction to see left-leaning sannyasnews contributors sleeping on the pavements. With blind devotion one gets good accommodation is a universal myth. Neo-sannyasins have not invented it.
MOD: PLEASE EXPLAIN THESE LAST 2 SENTENCES, SHANTAM.
Devotion is beautiful as a tool but not as a way to condemn others. It can be vice- versa too.
People like Buddha, Jesus, Guru Nanak, Osho provoke devotion and reverence. Bodhi Heeren kind are full in all the religions. Then there are ‘gay’ type. Headstand anti-devotees. Sannyasnews has majority of such people.
I think with Osho one becomes bi-spiritual. This just-born word, BI-SPIRITUAL, should be added in the language like bi-sexual.
One can have fun all the way is not the unique contribution of Osho. I know there are puritan types who prefer one way, Hindu way. These kind of people came to Hindu Osho or Zen Osho, but not to Osho.
Simond says:
“On a wider level look at the reaction of the public to a Russell Brand, who has attempted to cross over from humour to politics and discussion of religions and philosophy. He, and others who step out of line are ridiculed by the cynics.”
Innocent spiritual seeker ridiculed by `cynics`?
Oh dear, Simond and everyone else who gets a boyband thrill when they think that a media-produced celebrity endorses their philosophy on telly.
Did you know that Radhanath Swami, Brand`s guru, who he hobnobs with on a regular basis, was caught up in a very nasty murder conspiracy where a member of the Krishna temple he was presiding over who was about to spill the beans about the sexual and physical abuse in the temple got his head pumped full of lead in an LA car park?
Amazingly, altho` information about the whole sordid incident and others like it are easily accessible on the net, the press,`cynics` and people who would `ridicule` Brand for being ‘spiritual’ don`t ever mention such an obvious reputation-breaker.
Why not? Because Brand is doing a better job of making anything so-called ‘spiritual’ look even more idiotic than any cynics could! His desperation for attention and adulation makes him a perfect servant of the media`s overall thrust:
“Spiritual stuff is for narcissistic, attention-seeking idiots who don`t know what they are talking about.”
He`s the man for the job alright.
Faceless Frank with fingers hidden in the gloves:
To me it reads like this article is not about Russell Brand. He is just an example to explain the broader picture at sannyasnews.
Most probably you are one of the main characters when writer must have thought to write this piece on British cynicism.
No shit, Sherlock.
My posts are currently selling on the black market on E-bay.
Favourite Topics…
How to Enter and Exist
The joy of plotting a retributive act
Road Runner and Coyote…Endless fun with your nemesis
Being very conscious and highly-developed at parties
Improving your status without inherent good looks
Growth, personality and descending sperm counts on the Path
Heartfulness and transcendence whilst wondering when and where the next shag will come from
Rememebering best shags at the launderette whilst on a drying cycle
Chatting endlessly about consciousness whilst eyeing the talent
Selflessness, bodhicitta and mind training, if she’s attractive enough and worth impressing
Massage, meditation and hourly rates.
Simond says, “Is it not true that as we age (as many of us here at SN) we tend to become more conservative, more closed to new music, new fashions, new ideas, what ‘we know’ becomes safe and comfortable?”
Bit of of a general statement to say the least. As far as it relates to my life and many people I know, it simply is not true.
I suggest somebody open a new site: ‘Sannyasnews for Dummies’ – I will be there.
This highly intellectual text from Simond does not appeal to me. Thanks, Frank boy, for bothering to explain about Brand, on the spot. Thanks, Lokesh, for explaining the age issue.
If somebody would like to learn a bit of humour, I suggest to read the texts of Frank and Yogi. Humour needs intelligence, maybe that’s why many can not get it.
About cynicism, Shantam could teach a bit of that.
Tan, I would hardly describe Simond’s text as highly intellectual. If anything, it sounds a bit self-indulgent and long-winded. That said, at least the man is trying and I personally find what he has to say more interesting than old vids of Poona 1.
On that note, I have always found that a lot of Poona 1 vids and photos tended to focus on the ‘in crowd’, which I find to be a bit of a drag. because my favourite people during those times were more fringe personalities and not ashramites.
Was Osho a cynic? He certainly delivered one of the best versions of that archetypal cynics` tale: ‘Diogenes meets Alexander the Great’, in which even Diogenes` dog laughs at Big Al’s pretensions.
The same Diogenes, godfather of authentic cynicism, famously said:
“Of what use is a philosopher who doesn’t hurt anybody’s feelings?”
Would Osho have disagreed with that?
Was Osho a cynic? Of course he was (plus a whole lot more, let’s not reduce him to any narrow definition) – who wouldn’t be, given the job he had in a world like ours, and with people like us?! But his cynicism was of a different quality to ours, I suspect….
Frank,
My recollections are that Osho wasn’t a cynic and he would definitely have agreed with Diogenes, as do I. He laughed a lot at the stupidity and high-mindedness of people, he ridiculed the pretentious and the self-important. And his jokes could sometimes be cruel and to the point, and definitely would have hurt the feelings of some.
That said, his humour had purpose and significance, his cruelty highlighted the ignorance of any position, and I didn’t sense he laughed at people; he was laughing at their ideas, not at them.
It’s not an easy balance to strike. How he did it is somewhat mysterious, but his humour seemed to hinge on his ability not to criticise without also offering a solution of sorts.
Much of his life and purpose was aimed at helping others out of ignorance, rather than judging their ignorance. This expresses to me, a definite lack of cynicism.
Good post, you expressed it better than me, Simond.
Yes, a very good post, Simond (4.14 pm). And thank you for putting up the topic as such.
More than once I felt here like a psychic crash test dummy facing what was proudly called ´humour´ here. My own experience is that when hurts go very deep, cynicism comes into play and doesn´t leave even an iota of space for relating with an issue/a topic or some human responding.
Cynicism, in my eyes, is a relating-killer (inside-out) and mostly also used as such, and what it also hinders is any expression of empathy with a responder; it’s more like a primal scream. Very painful – either to him or her screaming or for those who are on the receiving line.
And yes, you are right: “It’s not an easy balance to strike.”
Madhu
Diogenes posited that a man, for all his pretensions, is, all told, no better than a dog (hence the name ‘cynic’, derived from `canis` – Latin for `dog`).
Here is a version of the same sentiment that you have probably come across:
“If you can start the day without caffeine,
If you can get going without pep pills,
If you can always be cheerful, ignoring aches and pains,
If you can resist complaining and boring people with your troubles,
If you can eat the same food every day and be grateful for it,
If you can understand when your loved ones are too busy to give you any time,
If you can overlook when those you love take it out on you when, through no fault of yours, something goes wrong,
If you can take criticism and blame without resentment,
If you can ignore a friend’s limited education and never correct him,
If you can resist treating a rich friend better than a poor friend,
If you can face the world without lies and deceit,
If you can conquer tension without medical help,
If you can relax without liquor,
If you can sleep without the aid of drugs,
If you can say honestly that deep in your heart you have no prejudice against creed, colour, religion or politics,
Then, my friend, you are almost as good as my dog!”
Nice, Frank.
The $64 million question is: Can you?
The sentiments expressed are truly not easy to fulfil. I fail on a few.
How you doing? Is there anything to learn from the humorous ditty?
Or, on the other hand, Rev, if you just don`t like being laughed at, I can cross you off my hit list…for a small fee!
Frank,
You laugh at me all you want. I’ve been hit so many times, I’m already full of holes. A few more hits and I’ll be dead.
Poor you.
I have never known pain.
I have never been hurt.
Never felt demeaned.
Never been mocked.
Never felt I wasn’t good enough.
Never known rejection.
Poor you.
You’re surely not now trying to ‘rescue’ Me, are you, Arpana?
I ain’t worth the trouble.
And you don’t want to change a habit of a lifetime, and lose your inner bastard, do you?
Calm down, Rev.
Remember, sarcasm is a gateway drug to cynicism!
You`re on a slippery slope!
Yes, indeed Frank, I indulge myself!
Because you’re so caught up in being a rescuer you see everybody else in terms of villain and victim, with the occasional hero in your vision; but now you’re beginning to slip into victim, which is very healthy because that’s the part of you you need to explore, along with your even more repressed perp.
MOD: perp?
Perpetrator/villain.
This is cynicism without even a creative writing. One can write with passion and gusto and some illiterate shows the superiority by commenting, “Poor you.”
$64 million for a hand job?
Oh, alright then…
Go easy…I want to be aware for as long as possible.
Never, ever, dear Frank, I could or would compete with your dog. Too bad that he doesn´t write here, isn t it?
Madhu
P.S:
Btw…who is Marge?
Scuse me for butting in…
but…
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marjorie_Proops
The doyenne of early forms of agony aunts and spotty teens issues, everywhere during our formative non-online years.
Osho was at times extremely cynical. Perhaps there was something benign behind it, but I doubt all of the time.Simond declares, “That said, his humour had purpose and significance, his cruelty highlighted the ignorance of any position, and I didn’t sense he laughed at people; he was laughing at their ideas, not at them.”
I think that ranks as bullshit. Osho tore people like Mother Theresa and Moraji Desai to pieces. Osho did not laugh very much in public, but he encouraged everyone to laugh at certain revered personages.
To say “his cruelty highlighted the ignorance of any position” could also be applied to his audience in certain cases. Osho delighted in saying, “God is not your uncle, because he isn’t nice.” Often a true word is said in jest.
Lokesh, my first thought after reading Simond’s 28 October, 2015 at 4:14 pm post was quite similar to yours & would like to add that a majority of sannyasins I have come across don’t use their own discriminating ability; these days I find non-sannyassins more in the moment.
Somehow I am glad we have space here on SN to vent it all!
P.S:
Sannyasnews to me is just a name for this existential space & not an organisation.
“Sannyasnews to me is just a name for this existential space & not an organisation.”
I think this is the best compliment any website ever got. It means sannyasnews is a new religion on the block.
You and your ironical statements!
Cynicism…jeez, its so very, very annoying.
Why, just the other day I was in my heart and full of the pain contained therein, minding my own business, or at least being forced to by way of some awful traumatic conditioning, trying to offload the same by sharing my truth (hah) with the occasional fellow seeker, online, almost in the moment but not quite, when someone whom I had never met before offered me assistance.
Well, I naively accepted, as you do if you’re slightly religious, opened myself trustingly, gave my all to ths particular person, flung myself upon the barren rockiness of my own fatal presumptions, bemoaned and acknowledged the utter stupidity of my foolish ways…and you know what, all I got was utter, vain-glorious cynicism for my efforts.
As far as the eye could see it was nothing but a jeering sneer of contempt with a veener of castigating ‘humour’, which when challenged, was replied to with the familiar, “Can’t you take a joke, mate, just kidding.”
Well, that just made me so, so, so…bothered and annoyed.
Well, yes, I watched my thoughts for all of ten seconds, including the one that strangely included throwing Aztec religious funerary items into boiling cauldrons of chocolate, under a storm-laden sky, but to no avail.
Bothering remained bothersome.
Like trying to get lettuce out thats awkwardly stuck in the gums.
Life…just one long testing, trying moment.
If it wasn’t for the unrippled lake of consciousness that awaits us with a knowing ‘told you so’ look, then life really would, almost, well, almost be like detention at an English public school, complete with those repeated lines: “I really must be more conscious, I really must be more conscious”, written out a thousand times.
http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20151027-what-really-annoys-you
Gosh, Prem Martyn, surely your pointing to us reading or listening to the BBC is a betrayal to your nonsensical anarchist/Lennist sensibilities.
No self-respecting anarchist should be listening to the right-wing press. Next, you’ll be suggesting we read the Daily Mail.
I am deeply offended!
(Ed, I do apologise, I seem to be descending to cynicism, even sarcasm)….
Rev. Simond,
Yep, the more non-sensical the better…
P.S:
You mean…
Bruce Lennyist? Of course!
Rev.,
It should be noted that the embodiment of truth is arrived at and was arrived at by those who in the search for liberty put pen to paper and informed, via poetry, via satire, via cartoon. It is to their enduring esteem that we can find the delicacy of the English romantic and the playful thespian in our heritage.
I have but little reading, in truth, but I can honestly say that names such as Godwin, Wollstencraft and the Shelleys provided a unique contribution legacy to the ethics of libertarianism, which is fully implicit as consciousness. Consciousness is libertarian and free. Anarchic really. Condemning others’ lack of congruence is wholly welcome.
You obviously want to change roles, but are fixated, in both your reason and your justifications, so please partake freely until you get what you need in whatever small measure, here.
“Sarcasm is a gateway drug to cynicism!”!
It’s also the lowest form of wit.
Probably sometimes the lowest is vital to go higher .
This article from Simond has inspired me to study few websites to find out the difference between Sarcasm, Cynicism, Irony, Satire.
In real terms, here is my understanding. Greek Arpana is the winner in the category Sarcasm. He likes to throw eggs on people’s faces who think differently.
Faceless Frank is the expert in cynicism. All his taxpayers-sponsored spiritual journeys towards India create good laugh.
Yogi has the knack to create best satires.
And in the catagory Irony, if the jury agrees, Indian Shantam, living in self-imposed exile can propose his name.
It is an irony of a kind, Shantam, who has not done any groups and therapies, who was just one in the crowd, thinks he can be the best Chairman of Osho Foundation International to bring the Vision on track.
It is a fact.
Can I request Mr.Sarcastic to say few words!
Irony in the service of Monumental Self-Delusion would be another literary theme worth researching, Shantam. Guess where you’d find hundreds of examples….
Monumental Self-Delusion…
Have I ever thought myself as an Avatara?
Have I ever sold myself as divine incarnation?
Have I ever told my words are sanctioned by Existence?
I wonder what adjective you will use for the woman in the photo submitted whose words are, “First of all, I bring down the Light and establish Peace, also I help the people to surrender to the Divine, to remember the Divine and to be faithful and sincere to their religion or to their belief. I help people to be happy in their families.”
How stupid you are.
Religious feelings must be hurting!
I am sorry.
No, Shantam, no need to patronise, I simply mean you’re just stupid, that’s all.
Well, ok, to stay off getting too personal, let’s say what you’ve written is just stupid.
Hail to SD, master of less is more.
rotflmao.
This is the point.
Connection with ABC is classified as personal, but not with DEF. Why we don´t measure our adoration for any public figure with same yardstick?
Why people feel it is their right to stitch needles in other people´s dependency?
My request, Satyadeva, use the similar tools of psychoanalysis for those who hang Meera´s photos in their homes. Can you do this?
Why ask me about people I don’t know, even online?
I address you and your stuff only because you pretty well sit up and beg for it here.
Btw, especially after reading about your Ibiza visit (and even before that) I’m sure you’re an ‘ok chap’. It’s just what you come out with here that ruins you!!
Progress indeed.
I agree. I am the most sarcastic poster here. That you are able to make these distinctions means you maybe marginally more intelligent than a gnat.
Now if you could only recognise the truth of what SD has just said, I would see that as a sign you are actually growing up. LOL. (That’s NOT sarcasm by the way, that’s a known fact, because growing up is clearly not something you are capable of).
“I am the most sarcastic poster here,” suggests Arpana.
Would you care to explain why, and what the purpose of your sarcasm is?
No.
Sometimes I wonder, as an Indian we are conditioned to have the initiation from some person who projects himself as master. We have so much poetry, so many songs, so much literature about master/ disciple thing.
While living in the West, I cannot imagine someone can be so Kaput to go to some Indian proclaiming themselves as divine incarnation of some kind; the holier-than-thou Indians who have shit idea about the real life of West.
From the modern psychological point of view of western civilization, I think many people who have chosen such path must have felt very embarrassed during mature phase of their life.
Sannyasnews being frequented in majority by UK and its territories’ nationals, the posts of such people show this kind of bipolarity, some kind of foreign element is haunting them.
Shantam says, “Some kind of foreign element is haunting them.”
It is not a foreign element that is haunting them but rather a fifth element. In ancient Greece, all material things were said to be composed of a mixture of the four elements of earth, fire, water and air. There was also said to be a more subtle, fifth element. This was called the quintessence (literally, ‘fifth element’), implying its very delicate or refined state of existence.
This quintessence has been given various names in traditional Eastern thought and practices – such as prana, chi, qi, and mana – but it can be better understood by calling it vital life energy or etheric energy. From a physics perspective, the most concise term is etheric energy, which implies a more subtle energy than electric energy.
In sannyasin parlance, quintessence is more often described as good vibes, positive energy and cosmic thing. These expressions have now become part of popular culture. A good example of this can be found in the B-52s’ electric prayer, ‘Cosmic Thing’, the message of which appears to be shake your honey buns. I can dig it. Maybe you can also by following the link…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxa09aZ6ZN8
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oxl2sWuKjJ0
Och aye….
Beautiful.
Man, Ivor is living testament to how eccentric a Scot can become.
I ‘discovered’ Ivor Cutler when I was 17, via a radio series, then, quite a few years later, I delivered his letters while working on the Christmas post. Lovely fella – and, btw, very different in ‘real life’ to his professional persona.
Now, this is very interesting, at least to me. Tell us more about your impressions of the man, Satyadeva.
Well, he seemed pretty happy with life and greeted me most warmly. He also appeared much ‘larger’ than he does in the videos.
Thanks. xx
Few people have videos and audios of their up-in-the-sky-residing spiritual thirst quencher. Few have books and statues and paintings. It becomes easier to believe when something is there, even if the entity is made of sand and stone.
In the world of beliefs and trust in the dead ones who are not dead in memory, I think followers of Islam have unshakeable belief. They have not a single real or imaginary photo, no statue, and yet billions of people talk about their prophet every day as if He is here all around.
When I hear from my fellow-travellers that Osho is everywhere, they speak in such a way as if it is the discovery of 21st century.
P.S:
Is this post ironic, cynical or factual?
None of the above mentioned, to me it’s got satirical tones.
“It becomes easier to believe when something is there, even if the entity is made of sand and stone”
Believe in what exactly, Shantam?
Believe in the omnipotent, omnipresent, invincible power of the figurehead.
It is not only others who believe, I also bow down before the photos at my altar, in the temples and churches. Maria with child is my favourite deity.
“omnipotent, invincible” – for what purpose, in which particular areas? In your life, for example, Shantam?
Isn’t Sannyas, for you, very much the same old, same old traditional religion – spiced up by the sex factor, without which it wouldn’t have been worth bothering?
One should be intelligent enough not to answer nonsense and ignore the dog shit on the way. When so-called spiritual minded people write bullshit, it really stinks like dog shit.
Shantam spouting spiritual-minded bullshit, it really stinks like dog shit.
Absolutely so, Shantam, I should never have bothered responding to that rubbish of yours.
Shantam, I thought all of what you wrote is dog shit but found my own nutella & shared it! Btw, I think I’ll try & refrain totally from responding to your dog shit or nutella because your nutella is shit-flavoured to me!
Shantam, seems you have not had any real contact with any Muslim. I have had Muslim neighbours during my teenage years and their son & I were in a relationship & to them first of all, the prophet & Allah are not the same.
Btw, the majority Muslims do worship the land where their prophet & his family members lived.
In fact, I am quite amazed that one of best New Age websites, ‘Home of Life’, was started by a Muslim. Of course, now it’s no more available on the internet.
“Gautam Buddha said as his last statement: “Be a light unto yourself.” The day I leave the body please remind me, so that I can make my last statement: “Be a joke unto yourself.” That is far more joyful than being a light unto yourself. What are you going to do with a light? Light your cigars, or burn people’s houses? But being a joke unto yourself, you will be a bliss for everyone.” (Osho).
Whether sarcastic, cynical, or whatever, at least that state of mind can eventually lead to humour, to that being a joke unto oneself. And people have to begin somewhere to get rid of the worse sin, seriousness.
Look where seriousness has led Islam, Christianity, Buddhism, Jainism, and many more. Their theologians are all ‘serious’, and it has led to all sorts of madness and murder. They are all a joke, but if you point it out, they will kill you. Compared to seriousness, cynicism is harmless.
And why is humour rare in men? Because of the terrible fear that develops after the first joys of childhood. Fear paralyses and fear creates seriousness. I was with a one year-old child yesterday, every third minute so it seemed, she saw something to laugh or smile about.
Parmartha, you are talking as if Seriousness is not in Sannyas. Put some cut piece of Osho talk on youtube and see how serious the matter becomes. Do you think all the court cases are being fought with humour in the heart?
Problem with religious fanatics is, they see shit on every other side, on their side only Nutella.
“Problem with religious fanatics is, they see shit on every other side, on their side only Nutella.”
You’ve summed yourself up perfectly, Shantam.
This sums up the difference between irony and sarcasm.
Irony is general, sarcasm is personal.
Sarcastic people are mean by nature.
You are always the victim, Shantam.
You too readily put people in boxes, Shantam. Plenty of people are sometimes or occasionally or often sarcastic, but likewise ironic, likewise comic, likewise ‘crazy’, or any number of things.
With apologies to Charles Dickens, all I can add is:
See the facts, sir, the facts, it’s facts that are important in this life, sir, facts, facts, facts! Wake up, sir, wake up, the facts of life do not necessarily follow your emotionally-driven mind’s preferences, sir!
In the mirror – what do you see?
I find this image so warming. Seen it a few times.
This is you with your delusions of grandeur.
The rituals set up around Osho, including hushed silences, bland conversational exchanges, generic linguistic collusion, deference to a state of otherness which no-one could claim to be in but wished they were, sheer bloody-minded authoritarian unapproachability given to those with a few bits and bobs of experience and studied poise, who still to this day try to outfox others who pay them to borrow, not self-worth, but undeclared benign arrogance – all that goes by the name of spirituality. Inner fascism.
Because whilst it is happening, it has no forum for examination. No invitation, no wish for anything other than imposition or extension of itself, without declaring as much. Presumptive spiritual behaviour. This inevitably attracts the autistic loonies who copy behaviour, comprehend its power of imposition, yet are utterly incapable of, themselves, submitting to anything at all. Incredibly talentless too. In fact, handing out obeisance is what attracts them. Even cathartic communes are not freed from this amateur theatre.
Religious groups/teachers/nutters all play the same game. You couldn’t imagine anyone in the audience calling out a heckle about wanking could you? Oh nooooo, never. But how many zen-koans have you enjoyed in life, compared to nature’s little secret?
All the same, of course, going to these people, groups, retreats is a sign of your endemic love of life. Not a sign of personal failure at having to live with one’s own density and being crushed by the very same consciousness that condemns to the depression of mind as well as uplifts beyond it. Oh no, suddenly a complete failure of locked self is now a dole-it-out seeker.
I went to meetings of the great Ozzie doctrinarian…that famous seeker of streuth… To be fair, I can’t remember a thing, other than I might as well have booked for a convention of NCP car park attendants to have obtained insight into the same, of nothing happening much. Yet oozing Ozzie struthfulness in bearded bucketloads, because the true blue eyes were set to alpha centauri in the cosmos, and we were still suffering…suffering ourselves…which is the greatest bondage, mate.
Poor old playfulness and plain old messin’ about. Not a lot of people are that ‘good’ at it, or can’t enjoy it. Some get quickly overawed and suffer huge spasms of inferiority complexes. They just have never played, not as adults, and have forgotten their childhood.
Unlike consciousness, you don’t need to be qualified by the amount of bollocks, psycho-crap studies that most wannabe therapists have added to their online profiles. If you find one who includes ‘taking the piss’ as one of their qualifications…book the group immediately. It’s not because insight is a supreme value, but because absurdity isn’t, that we have status-laden growth-bludgeoning religion. It is also addictive and full of petty, nutty egos at work. Go to any buddhist meetup and report back please.
Playfulness, unlike, say, the ‘seven steps of mind training’, won’t admit an elite. You’ll admire the craft of stupidity, but it will be only your joy that determines its worth. Anyone who can do that with and for you, especially amongst the bed sheets, is worth a thousand weekends of watching the mind. But that doesn’t get airplay because its far too commonplace, unsellable, untrainable for – and quite simply ‘magic’.
Sensuality, laughter and song…indulge ad infinitum…as nature intended, and love will not be packaged thereafter by deference to anything or anyone. And once that becomes intrinsic memory, it can leave a long afterburning glow. Is any of this true for me? Let’s just say like that Chinese sign said…
https://img0.etsystatic.com/016/8/662790/il_570xN.415323934_a8i5.jpg
or even…
https://freelanguage.org/files/resource/chinglish-sign-dont-bother.jpg
Watch at: 5.54 to 7:17 (whilst on the subject).
The great, late, wonderful, Rik Mayall together with Ade Edmondson.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lH07qf87swI
One type of people I am quite allergic to. These people take pride in their spirituality and treat religious-minded people below their level.
They are the New white who think religion produces blackish hearts, therefore in their make-believe world such people are no good to get some brown chocolate called Enlightenment.
If someone fits with the above description, I request such people not to interact with me on one-to-one basis. In my little world, rainbow has many colours and I wish new rainbows with even more colours.
Velli eenteresteeng!
I am sure we all here at SN wish your rainbow gets more colourful but you yourself are stuck with a rainbow of shades of only one certain colour.
Shantam, here, even if we two do interact directly on this platform it’s as much as we can be impersonal with each other, as for now the two of us do not exchange personal correspondence since May 2015 & this too is an existential occurence in my life.
One type of people I am quite allergic to. Shantam type who takes pride in his religiousness and treats anyone different, people below his level.
He is the old type who thinks anyone different has a blackish heart, therefore in his make-believe world such people are no good to get some brown chocolate called Enlightenment.
Or…
And…
Keep calm and…
And…
Males with white skin who once came to Osho can be cynical towards anybody; it can be God, it can be master, it can be religion, it can be country.
Their cynicism drops dead when they see boobs and pussy. Swamis are mama´s boys!
No wonder, path of love and tantra groups are the bread, beer and heart of Sannyas money trails.
Shantam, who once came to Osho, is cynical towards anybody who isn’t like him; it can be God, it can be master, it can be religion, it can be country.
His cynicism drops dead when he sees boobs and pussy. He is mama´s boy!
Shantam, your latest comment is written in the very worst taste…Have you been spreading dog shite on your morning chapatis?
Let me rephrase the same:
Males with white skin who once came to Osho can be cynical towards anybody; it can be God, it can be master, it can be religion, it can be country.
Their cynicism drops dead when they see women offering their heart and uninhibited, imaginative sensuality wrapped in mother-cuddling.
Sannyasins or non-sannyasins, males are by nature Mama´s boys.
No wonder path of love and tantra groups are the bread, beer and heart of Sannyas money trails.
Shantam, demonstrating yet again his racist cynicism towards white male sannyasins who are not a carbon copy of him.
If your words don´t leave behind haunting questions, then it is good to write erotica (next Buddha in 3015).
I must say, this article of Simond was a thought-provoking one. Irony, satire, humour quite often leave behind some question mark; sarcasm is proverbial washerman´s wife nagging the neighbours!
P.S:
This post is jointly dedicated to Arpana and Kavita!
More Shantam nagging.
Btw, Shantam, you are one who is nagging everyone non-stop. Anyway, all the best to all of us, dear.
Those who were cursing their birth religion Christianity got existential gift from Osho to create something better. They fucked it up!
In nutshell, this is Neo-Sannyas past Osho.
I am nagging everyone non-stop. Wonder how someone can get such an idea. Maybe few people think sannyasnews is a salon for mutual ego-massage.
I am not interested to have any kind of personal communication with majority of the bloggers here. You write your thing, I write mine. Yhough there is a possibility of getting some inspiration from here ‘n’ there.
Shantam, I think you can count yourself very fortunate that you’re allowed more or less free rein on here – free rein to bore the backside of anyone who bothers to read your repetitiously irresponsible rants.(Frank has nailed it, 6.26pm & 6.36pm posts).
Even if I/we here on SN do rarely mutually ego-massage, it’s probably with a pinch of salt!
Well, here’s how that someone can say that and that is because a Swami complains to me about your writings on SN, every time we meet/bump into each other (& thank God it’s not often) – that’s not an idea, my dear. Just to let you know I can’t live in ideas anymore.
Sorry, dear, to me definitely no inspiration from you, at least until now!
Btw…
No need to go to any Halloween extra party this whole day long; just to open up and look into this day´s contribution´ UK internet-web-exchange in Blame-Shame-Blame as a Horror trip was/is enough.
If you were any better, any more evolved, it wouldn’t bother you.
Madhu,
The reason you are so unhappy is because you look outside yourself for happiness. You always want everything to fit with you, just like Shantam.
We are just going with the flow. Stop your sulking and get a hobby, for God’s sake.
Guess that what Satyadeva mentioned recently is true, that you are paid for contributions of that kind. Why not better stick to your colour brushes and paint instead of shedding your unwanted comments; you are sick and sickening as well as some others today.
And that was what my response was all about, which you didn´t refer to.
In Russia (Moskow), they have employees who don´t have other to do than to get involved in chats worldwide to destroy the whole communication. Listened to a Russian woman in an ARD report about such a criminal crab, who quit the job (well paid).
Come to your senses, if you have any left! And stick to your counsels to others yourself!
Madhu
You should be grateful, you paranoid horror. I have handed myself to you on a plate to spew up your venom on, without taking any responsibility for it.
Your violence is always someone else’s fault. Just like the Rev and Shantam.
The game is up!
Vladimir Parmarthutin and his team of crack ex-KGB inner circle propagandists have been exposed by the heroic truth-telling of Madhu ‘Julian’ Frantzen of Wackoleaks!
It turns out that Parmutin`s moles are being handsomely rewarded for emanating a constant stream of propaganda from their call-centre in Poonagrad, the aim of which is to undermine Madhu and Shantam, the true upholders of Osho`s dream, by fiendishly making the truths they utter appear like garbled, badly written, angry, paranoid, racist mumbo-jumbo!
Wackoleaks today released this picture of the masterminds Parmutin and his devious propaganda minister Yuri Nidiot out enjoying themselves….
One can laugh at this post. It is like a Jihadist giving lecture to Yazidi woman: “We are just going with the flow….”
That’s your advice, Arpana? To “get a hobby”? Gosh, I’m sure your mum and dad would be proud. That’s the sort of insight Aunty Maud had too…Get a hobby. Play with your train set? Sew a little? Play ‘patience’?
Thanks, Arpana. Your ancient Wisdom will be of real help.
You’re just going with the flow…? More hippie wisdom.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O9DHgnKeAxo
Be very careful about trying to rescue Madhu. God help you if she realised what you’re up to.
“The reason you are so unhappy is because you look outside yourself for happiness”
When i hear or read such sentences, first impulse is to look intensively at the person´s face. Linings of the face don´t lie. One can see title of the books wise man has read.
If one is not a teacher or a master to the other, such sentences are simply obscene. The way human beings expose their genitals in an intimate environment, same is about the wisdom. One does not get the right to teach without consent.
I will utterly feel ashamed if (un)consciously I tell to some seeker on the path for many decades this kindergarten cliche, “The reason you are so unhappy is because you look outside yourself for happiness.”
Shantam,
The truth hurts, doesn’t it, you ridiculous pontificating fool?
Much safer to blame Jayesh because you don’t have a sex life.
Joy for the warrior of light is to go on mission to eliminate some monarch. Bad luck is when he is assassinated by the eunuch guarding the palace doors.
Anyway, those who live by the sword die by the sword. Therefore best option is to read Osho´s ‘Rebel’ and use that energy in the bathroom.
Shantam:
The Miss Faversham of Sannyas News. Alone and wanking into a flannel.
Those who think Shantam is a racist, here is the pictorial proof of the books I have read or reading recently. Not a single author is from India..
Shantam,
You are on the defensive. You know you are a racist, but blame us for it.
Those shells are beautiful – and btw, I am impressed with the photo composition!
I came across this answer to a question about ten minutes ago.
Seems relevant in immediate terms, but not intended as a ‘Rev.’-type post.
http://en.textsave.org/jpNb