A Verse from Sosan : The third Zen Patriarch
(Osho called Sosan’s book: The Book of Nothing )
To live in the Great Way
Is neither easy nor difficult,
but those with limited views are fearful and irresolute:
the faster they hurry, the slower they go,
and clinging cannot be limited;
even to be attached to the idea of enlightenment is to go astray.
Just let things be in their own way and there will be neither coming nor going.
Obey the nature of things (your own nature), and you will walk freely and undisturbed.
When thought is in bondage the truth is hidden,
for everything is murky and unclear,
and the burdensome practice of judging
brings annoyance and weariness.
What benefit can be derived from distinctions and separations?
If You wish to move in the One Way
do not dislike even the world of senses and ideas.
Indeed, to accept them fully is identical with true Enlightenment.
The wise man strives to no goals but the foolish man fetters himself.
There is one Dharma, truth, law. not many;
distinctions arise from the clinging needs of the ignorant.
To seek Mind with the discriminating mind is the greatest of all mistakes.
Sosan
Here He comes along, one of these Gardeners, visiting the caravanserai.
What a beautiful and surprising gift around after midnight coming home.
I am having a glass of red vine –
and enjoy -
Him – as a Human Being
Comes as a flavour of spaciousness.
Yes, there are moments you (me) again trust that an ´Arche Noah ´of consciousness exists.
And the best is the feeling that you don´t need to be ´a chosen of the few´ at all, as your seat as part of the boat people is already booked by the very fact that you exist: so simple as that and ever again forgotten.
These visitors, honoured by those who had tasted the tongue tip taste of TAO. And they do not care about being honoured or not being honoured. That´s Greatness without looking great Wanderers.
Ever so enjoying such ´News` from ´Visitors´, and have a Toast on This and on those who posted that!
(Means for me, besides other stuff, that some ´synapses´ in the Big Internet-Brain c a n RELAX or cool down.
Madhu
How beautiful: The book of NOTHING, isn´t it?
We are Blessed ones, aren´t we?
Without master
Without the disciples
Great words are like
Used tea bags.
Collectively we
Go on dipping them
In cup of hot water,
While watching
Ads.of Lipton!
Nice ‘poem’, Shantam – another for your stage act! I can already hear the roars of delighted applause from the stalls and the galleries…
However, the problem for you remains, as I see it, that you’re unable to come to terms with being alone, without access to a large, cosmopolitan crowd of fellow-travellers.
I can understand it might well not be easy for you to link up with other Osho people in Germany (although I’ve never heard that you’ve ever actually really tried to do this), that you might well feel uncomfortably like a fish out of water over there – but at the very least, can’t you find something, anything, in Osho’s words that you can make your own, that you can actually live?
If not, and you just depend on a ‘crowd’, chronically disturbed as you clearly are, then what has been the point of Sannyas for you?
Satya Deva, Life is not what it looks like. We don´t even see the tip of the iceberg and start analysing the depth. So I must say, you are right and also not right.
Now few questions:
1.When was the last time you have met some Other Osho People?
2.When you have done any of Osho meditation with other Osho People in London?
3. Are you married, divorced or in civil partnership?
4. Do you have children?
Let us be honest with psychoanalysis.
Let me tell you, before one even judges the situation, one must have the glimpse of life story. Every story has its own scriptwriter in accordance with the celestial.
Through this background, I will say again and again, words without master and disciples are used tea bags.
When Osho was speaking on Zen during the last leg of His life, He is heard saying many times, “These are the rare gatherings.”
Therefore Zen is the name of the car!
Shantam, you like questions, so here’s a question for you:
Why on earth do you imagine I or anyone else would rush to answer any of your questions when you consistently ignore posts about or addressed specifically to you?
PS:
Btw, if you don’t wish to be misunderstood (‘psychoanalysed’, you like to call it!) then providing more concrete evidence – this is an official court and you’re on trial – about where you are in your life, rather than making obscurantist statements about the “tip of the iceberg” and your ‘celestial story’ (which won’t stand up to legal scrutiny, Mr Could-Have-Been-A-Lawyer-What-A-Waste) might be a good start.
Until then, as I’ve said before, you might as well call yourself Swami Prem Propaghanda.
Now this is getting real, Satya Deva.
Four questions are still valid, and don´t try to play smart. Be Innocent.
Even ignorance is beautiful, if it comes out from honesty.
So drop the priestly cunningness.
No need to be such a pseudo-spiritual hypocrite, Mr Propaghanda. Apply your advice to yourself, please.
I repeat:
Why expect others to respond to your bullshine when you ignore them so often?
I asked a few questions over the years, SP, of you. Never got any replies, so odd you are making such a point of this. I am always suspicious about how much of posts other than your own you read.
In general, you seem a bit off-beam – bit like a Facebook type of person wanting to pigeonhole people etc. I am sure SD can answer for himself, but questions 1 and 2 are silly to those who know SD.
Bertrand Russell once said,
“The trouble with the world is that the stupid are cocksure and the intelligent are full of doubt.”
Arpana, are you talking about your Sugar daddy in Pune? He and bunch of people around are cocksure, thugs don´t even say, “We have heard Osho saying.”
In my eye, you are just one of the crowd; if not Orthodox Christian crowd than O Orthodoxy.
One of the criteria of crowd is they think their priests are driving power from the Messiah or even God. So they will lynch every rebellious one in their breed.
Shantam,
You and your Sugar daddy in Pune.
In my eye, you are just one of the crowd; if not Orthodox Sikh crowd than O Orthodoxy.
One of the criteria of crowd is they think their priests are driving power from the Messiah or even God. So they will lynch every rebellious one in their breed.
So are questions 3 and 4, as far as I’m concerned!
Swami Shantam Propaghanda seems very much attached to the forms and values of his Sikh Punjabi conditioning, notwithstanding whatever ‘Sannyas-speak’ he comes out with.
Again, in the light of this, the very idea that he can seriously think he knows what’s good for ‘Osho’s movement’ is, well…I hesitate to say it in polite or even impolite company!
The baboondogs like Satya Deva, who are stuck in the western mind which knows nothing of mindlessness and nothing other than mind will never understand how religions must evolve!
Shantam has made it clear in his post, 6 Sept 2010:
“I am a sannyasin…but a Sikh sannyasin and does not crave to be anybody else. My name is Shantam Iqbal Singh, and when death knocks me down, I wish to say goodbye with the customs which were before my birth and will be afterwards too.”
Noble sentiments and clearly the words of the man who knows what is best for the Osho movement and should be installed as CEO in Pune at the first opportunity!
Seekers of the one true truth will immediately hurl themselves at the feet of Shri Shantam, possessor of the wisdom of mighty Bhorat!
He is an absolute Bhagat who has never for one moment wavered from the religion of his forefathers and even whilst enjoying the favours of loose gora women displayed his unswerving bhakti by never once removing his holy underwear!
Yahoo!
Hari Om!
Waheguru!
Parmartha, if I ignore your questions, I am sorry. To write spontaneous is very easy, rest is like preparing brief as an advocate, that requires discipline, which I lack.
Satyadeva´s questions are not honest. He always comes from a moral high position as a priest of psychoanalysis.
I don´t like people who operate from camouflaged hide-out.
Shantam’s questions are not honest. He always comes from a moral high position as a priest.
The simple fact is, you don’t like your cosy view of yourself to be challenged, Swami Propaghanda.
Do you know your very denial makes the truth about you even more transparent?
(I blame Freud and Jung myself)….
“The burdensome practice of judging brings annoyance and weariness.”
Yawn…Ehm…erh…Did Meistar Sosan have a crystal ball and see within it a Sikh Wallah in chuddies apearing on SN ome time in the future world? Or was he perhaps a time traveller? Questions…questions…questions….
Beginners Zen Art Class :
http://www.uvm.edu/~inquiryb/webquest/sp08/shoffman/kalalau-rocks.jpg
Advanced Zen Art Class Tea Time :
http://www.marketing-schools.org/images/brick-and-mortar-marketing.jpg
Zen Fantasies
http://thedomesticsoundscape.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/brick-tower.jpg
Zen Cleaning and Sweeping :
http://www.theportobelloartsclub.com/wp-content/uploads/BanksyCleaningUp.jpg
Ga-Za-Zen Wall Staring :
http://www.localnomad.com/en/blog/wp-content/uploads/2013/11/banksy-palestine-gaza-wall.jpg
Dukkha, all is Dukkha
http://www.yourperfectcanvas.com/img/gallery/banksy05.jpg
Thou Art That :
http://oneeyeland.com/inspiration/banksy-love-one%20eyeland.jpg
Wonderful – every photo and your Zen captions.
Good stuff, young Martyn.
SP and PM…
Glad you enjoyed.
Ta.
M
Christian children’s playgroup influenced by Japanese Buddhist ideas, shock.
http://www.thebricktestament.com/the_life_of_jesus/the_last_supper/mt26_20.jpg
Reading, ‘To Live in the Great Way’ left me tears rolling down…
Talking about my own experience, my great way is…facing conditionings, ongoing an ongoing stumbling, crying, stealing, being more honest, hiding, couraging, laughing, connecting, more crying, gratefulness…coming out again and again. I thought one can come out of the egg only once really but more often ís possible, getting crazy, laughing, more awareness, more alive, less serious…holding… OshoOshoOsho
Tarangita provides a great example of someone caught in a time warp.
This third Zen Patriarch doesn’t sound very Buddhist to me – except for his thing about attachment to the idea of enlightenment. Guess it shows how much Buddhism and Taoism was mixed up when Buddhism first reached China for much of the text is Taoist.
I can also feel something here – not precisely what Tarangita feels, but reading such wisdom leaves an aftertrace for a while.
Sadly. as they say, it doesn’t last all day!
I’d say this is Taoism at its most concise.
“Sadly, as they say, it doesn’t last all day!”
Uuuhhh – so true, Parmartha.
Such wonderful English, your wise remark.
Need to celebrate that, with the juice of good grapes (from Spain just now;
the bottle has the counterfeit of Don Quixote painted on it, he is riding his horse sitting on it the wrong way – looking backward-forward).
How do we say: ´human conditionings’….
Wow! Prem Martyn, I can relate to nearly everything per daily everyday-life (besides the zen-fantasies and Dukkah – Dukkah stuff. Most of the time, I am in that ´local nomad.com´ after doing a bit zen-cleaning-sweeping).
And I am a kind of hopeless case, as I ever so often disappear ´nomad-wise´ into the holes of the pics… carried away by balloons…
This was/is wonderful contribution of yours.
Thank you for taking the effort.
Madhu
Thanks, Madhu…foremost, of course, to talented merry-prankster Banksy, who with that crucifix pic’ reminds us during the festive and sacred season to, as we say in the UK. ‘Shop till we drop’….
About Zen…
If not from others, at least for Parmartha, I wish that he watches the whole discourse where this Sosan poem is mentioned, or any other discourse in such kind of series.
From Beginning till end, that atmosphere, that pin-drop silence, that oneness as one is in existential womb and then participating in the daily life…OSHO Has shared the taste of Zen, the impact of that is still so strong, the heart still craves for that.
And if Pune is still relevant, it is just and only for the evening meditations, where Zen is created every day. This gathering is more or less the same, as Osho left.
Yes, I don’t doubt it was wonderful – but if it’s gone right into you, Shantam, it’s done its job, there’s no point in craving for more of the same (which in the way of things isn’t going to happen anyway – you know, stepping twice in the same river and all that?).
So, apart from returning to Pune and immersing yourself in the evening discourses there, it seems you have two realistic choices:
Follow whatever you take as Osho’s most relevant teachings for you (do you know what these might be?) – or find another living teacher who can help you move on from being as ‘stuck’ as you apparently are.
Because you’re doing nothing worthwhile by hanging around complaining every day, that’s for sure. If you think you are, then you’re a deluded fool.
El Chudo provides a perfect example of fundamentalism. A yearning for the good old ways, when everything appeared to work so well. Faced with today, it all seems chaotic and out of control. If only we could return to the past. Taken to an extreme, such thinking is what powers the warped minds of the likes of IS members. They are 100% sure that the old ways are the best ways and are willing to die and kill to enforce such a mind-set.
Meanwhile, the revisionists try to reform and move on, saying the old ways are either irrelevant or obsolete. Their only reference to the past being that the old ways might once have worked but they no longer work now.
Sosan’s ancient wisdom is just that…ancient. What place does it have in our highly complex world, peopled by complex beings? Back in the day, life was much simpler. people did not think so much and thus Sosan’s wisdom was easier to understand. Enlightenment was a real possibility in people’s lives. Today, it is simply a word whose meaning is buried beneath the detritus of modernity.
Even in ancient times enlightenment was for the few and remains such even today. Why is that? Could it be that there is only so much enlightenment to go around?
The good side must surely be that it is only a few who are interested in enlightenment and most people are not at all interested in their tiny share. On that level at least, the situation has not changed at all since ancient times.
SD, if you believe you are not stuck because of your tenacity to change the tubes to the destination called Enlightenment, Nirvana, Om state (ENO is a antacid in India), please go for. We may see each other in few lives.
On the side, people like you may not get it, my so-called complaining is a push…and as I see, each and every Osho disciple is stuck – REALLY STUCK in their mind.
If spending life at Osho´s feet I am a deluded fool, God bless the people who are just reading the shit. And what a shame it is, even after licking the dust of this and that guru, you are still hanging at Sannyasnews.
What kind of idiots exist in the world, I cannot perceive. So many masters and still full with mind rubbish.
Yes, well, once again you damn yourself perfectly with your own words.
Anything you don’t agree with – which is anything that comes uncomfortably close to the truth about you – is “mind rubbish” – yes, of course it is, Swami Propaghanda, of course it is.
Just carry on taking the denial tablets and you’ll feel fine, ok?
Enough of your waste matter for today? I think so.
Yes, SD, recycling anything that does not fit El Chudo’s cramped world-view into the “mind rubbish” basket is his way of running on the spot and avoiding any changes that might be seen as obstacles and thus require some real effort on his part to overcome.
What he misses is that if a person has some intellgence he/she will actually seek obstacles to overcome, because that is the way real growth on a being level comes about.
El Chudo’s defence for this would perhaps run along the lines of his crusade against the infidels in Fort Resort is repesentative of a great obstacle to overcome. Of course this is a lie. No obstacle exists there. It is a fantasy. And all fantasists are egoists at heart.
To give you the credit, Satyadeva, I must say you are 60% right about me, me what one sees through my outburst-like writing. About 40% it is the mix cocktail of your mind.
After all, we all express our perceptions, our realties. Let us say, in a plane crash, someone lost his wife he was supposed to divorce after her return, and someone lost his beloved.
But in any way, thanks. Maybe heartily thanks.
Well, ok then, Shantam, fair enough, I acknowledge your self-recognition and the spirit it seems to have come from. 60% down, 40% to go then…
But doesn’t this mean that the vast majority of what you post here is to be written off, by your own admission, as worthless nonsense?
So how are we to discern the remaining 40%?
Now there’s a conundrum….
About 90% of my words, I take full responsibility, for example spiritual and emotional blunders committed by the Osho Management.
It is like seeing the bullet being shot and blood marks on the tiles.
If sannyasins cannot see their priests and politicians and their ploy, it is a cowardly shame.
Last night you conceded, “To give you the credit, Satyadeva, I must say you are 60% right about me, me what one sees through my outburst-like writing.”
Now, with your usual impeccable logic, you say, “About 90% of my words, I take full responsibility, for example spiritual and emotional blunders committed by the Osho Management.”
Good to hear you take ‘fool responsibility’ for the vast majority of your nonsense, Shantam!
But that other 10% is a worry though…Ever thought of thinking before you write here? Or checking your ‘spontaneous’ outpourings? I know it’s difficult, hard work and all that, stemming the flow of waste matter – like a second course in potty-training – but now you’re ‘coming clean’ at last, how about taking even more responsibility for those premature verbal ejaculations?
Ever crossed your blinkered mind, Swami Propaghanda, that what you think is true for you might not be true for very many others – or even not true at all?
El Chudo declares, “If spending life at Osho´s feet I am a deluded fool…”
Yes, well, deluded fool about sums him up. This is because he did not spend his life at Osho’s feet, but rather spent his life at the feet of a fignment of his warped imagination.
Again the deluded baboons misunderstand the holy truths of Bhorat as clearly stated by true disciples of Osho such as Shantam I Singh!
To despise and seek regime change for the Anglos-Saxon alcoholic baboons who have destroyed our religion and turned our Samadhi into a bar is not fundamentalism!
Nor is it fundamentalist to hope for the glorious day when the true disciples will return to the holy shrine in a blaze of glory with the depraved religious hijackers finally cleansed from the holy shrine and removed forcefully from the bowels of mighty Bharat!
It is the one and only truth!
Also, it is not fundamentalist behaviour to get jiggy with gora girls whilst keeping the sacred desire to return to the fold of one`s birth, to be dispatched to the next world wearing the holy underwear, penknife and holy hairstyle of one’s forefathers!
It is the spirit of true devotion itself!
This can only be understood by those who understand how religions evolve! All those who misunderstand this, are, as Shantam perfectly correctly points out, idiots full of mind rubbish!
Do not make the mistake of trying to psycho-analyse a soul such as he!
Did Guru Gobind Singh lie on Freud`s couch and tell him about his fantasies?
Did Guru Nanak talk to Reich about his latent homosexuality?
Did Kabir relate his repressed desires for a bit on the side to Jung?
No!
We who have suckled at the mighty mammary of mighty Bhorat do not need therapy!
Mind rubbish is like rubbish; in holy Bharat, we simply ignore it! There is no need to get involved!
It is for psychoanalytic priests and street sweepers like Satya Deva, who is totally STUCK UP HIS mind which knows nothing of mindlessness simply because it is nothing other than mind rubbish!
Yahoo!
Love!
Hari Om!
I take it in your eyes, Anand Yogi, Swami Propaghanda Shanty Pants is a baboon, but not deluded.
“(I blame Freud and Jung myself)”
Dear Satydeva,
I am sincerely interested to read/hear what you mean herewith -
Madhu
Ah, Madhu, take it easy, it’s nothing ‘serious’, only a bit of ironic humour (which I definitely won’t try to explain!).
“…So they will lynch every rebellious one in their breed…”
“Father” Darwin reloaded, yes, and I came and I am coming to know about that one, Arpana.
The biology and the so-called spiritual, not two sides but two aspects of one.
Wilhelm Reich gave that a ´take´ of understanding, others too.
Amazing that you mention it precisely at this point of field subject of ´discussion´.
And as the morning is still fresh and new in ´our´ book of nothingness (small letters) and as my schedule today is to visit here the international youth library to study a book I have ordered to look at from the magazine (store), I am yet in good mood.
The book is titled ´Angels and Other Feathered Beings´(like, for example, chickens, ducks, swans too, and many other flying creatures). It’s a book from a poet and painter for kids and the kid in grown-ups. And a book of satyricon insights too.
That will be presumably my ´day´ with the balloons after a bit of sweeping and housewife stuff.
Send you my love written on a balloon to UK.
Send you all my love.
And don´t shoot the balloon if you see it passing, please.
Madhu
Madhu said, ” ‘So they will lynch every rebellious one in their breed’. ‘Father’ Darwin reloaded, yes, and I came and I am coming to know about that one, Arpana. The biology and the so-called spiritual, not two sides but two aspects of one.’ ”
Is this disapproval or approval? Can’t tell! o_O
P.S:
These days, inner and outer skies have so much traffic going on, my goodness, so much traffic. It´s hard to hold the line.
I am immensely grateful when being reminded of people like Sosan, who walked on Earth, a solitary, teaching by His very Existence – like others mankind can be proud of – one thing:
There must be – THERE IS – another way, besides the ways we are used to use in coming-and-going..
Once again, we are blessed ones – to come to know about that too.
“Meanwhile, the revisionists try to reform and move on, saying the old ways are either irrelevant or obsolete. Their only reference to the past being that the old ways might once have worked but they no longer work now.”
I contradict that part of your contribution, Lokesh, and as far as I am able to see it, you also contradict yourself there later – in your last chapter of the lines.
It is a significant point though – and needs a ´peace allowing´ peace-force…
Have a beautiful day,
Madhu
“So they will lynch every rebellious one in their breed”.
Did you forget, Arpana, that this sentence-one-liner came from yourself? Obviously.
I said, I have come to know that such stuff is happening – not only in Middle Ages but also up to today.
You then ask if in my lines are approval or disapproval?
Can´t believe it, to look at such cunningness of verbal gymnastics of yours.
If I disapprove, what I am indeed feeling about a MOB on lynch paths, it won´t change the MOB as such.
I presumed you know that too, but maybe I am wrong.
Yes, maybe I am wrong and overestimated your sense and sensitivities .
And if your way of responding is GAME stuff, then fuck it….
Madhu
Ok.
Madhu, I admit I do contradict myself from time to time…a clever ploy to see if anyone is actually reading my posts and paying enough attention to pull me up on it. This is a brilliant device I learned from Osho, who used this ploy day after day for decades.
It is very clear, Lokesh has quite a high dose of narcissism in his spiritual aura.
Contradicting oneself is a brilliant device till the point cook does not fall in his own soup.
So better to use it while making tea.
Spouting drivel is a brilliant device till the point cook does not fall in his own soup. So better to use it while making tea.
It is very clear, Shantam has quite a high dose of narcissism in his spiritual aura.
“Mind rubbish is like rubbish; in holy Bharat, we simply ignore it! There is no need to get involved!”
I understand, Anand Yogi, and can relate to that.
Just one question:
Why do YOU use the Internet of a SN chat then?
If YOU ARE what YOU write?
Please ´enlighten´ me on that point, if you are willing to.
Madhu
Madhu,
Perfectly correct to ask me to enlighten you! It certainly shows a spark of consciousness in an avalanche of mind rubbish that would more than fill Satya Deva`s dumpster!
I believe that everyone who is karmically challenged deserves a little karmic relief and should be enlightened a little!
I am ready for the task, but are you?
The answer seems unfortunately, no!
Looking into your Akashik records, I see that the chances of you obtaining karmic relief in this lifetime seem remote!
Yet, out of almost infinite compassion, I will keep trying!
Charaiveti!
Charaiveti!
Cheer up!
Lokesh, I wasn´t bothered by your contradiction. I experience contradicionary stuff, different according to different contributors and how I feel able to get more acquainted with them.
Or not.
In fact, most of the time, reading you, your ´contradictions´ are none.
Its not my mother tongue here, i hope what I mean comes through.
I had a kind of sad and painful day with Sannyas News responses today, and have to integrate that, if possible , and look inside.
I am writing here with the longing to connect with others; and for an exchange, a sharing.
May we all have a good night/day. (according to www-time-scedules..).
Souls in bodies, bodies in Souls.
Madhu
Madhu confesses, “I had a kind of sad and painful day with Sannyas News responses today.”
This sounds absolutely ridiculous to me. To be affected emotionally by the comments posted on SN to the point of experiencing sadness and pain suggests that Madhu must be daft.
Madhu concludes with the following, “Souls in bodies, bodies in Souls.”
This statement comes with a number of givens:
What exactly is a soul? #
Do you automatically have a soul by finding oneself in a body?
If you know you have a soul who is it that is aware of this, because to be aware of such a phenomenon surely one must be separate from it in order to make such an observation?
Did this soul exist before the body existed? Will it remain when the body dies?
If so, who or what is it that is aware of these things?
´Confession´, Lokesh, is not my cup of TEA. If you declare me “daft”, by sharing emotions, well, so be it.
You know, you are not the only one whom I met or meet in the Sannyas realms, who had an apparent or real ´break-through´ by meeting Papaji. Your otherwise then added ´lecture´ is familiar to me.
My own experience with these fellow-travellers has been quite often that one element is missing:
I have called it ´Loving´.
That can not be measured or not measured. Is simply to be felt. Or not. And can not be ´ordered´ or asked for too. So don´t misunderstand me here.
One thing I guess we agree on, neither Papaji nor Osho can be imitated or parroted.
And on this agreement, what I presume and trust that we agree on that standard, I am responding to you.
So – thank you that you made my response possible (triggered it ) here-now.
Madhu
That is all very well, Madhu, but you are not addressing the questions that arose because of your statement, “Souls in bodies, bodies in Souls.” If you are not interested in anyone understanding what you are talking about, that is your business. If the opposite is the case, why not simply answer, for instance, “What exactly is a soul?”
By coming away with the likes of “Your otherwise then added ´lecture´ is familiar to me” is a cop-out, likewise referring to Poonjaji etc. In other words, convenient pigeonholing that seemingly allows you to avoid the questions.
I did not give a lecture. I posed some questions, none of which you answered. Instead, you come away with bunk like, “That can not be measured or not measured. Is simply to be felt.” Vague at best. Playing the abstraction game, i.e. those who come away with the greatest religious abstraction have the highest religion.
If you wish to play it like that, why not answer the following?
Is this feeling of yours an amplified emotion?
Is it physiological?
Seeing as how it has been observed, who or what is it that does the observing?
Just because something is felt, does that give it extra value and make it more important than other things, like thoughts etc?
Thank you, for responding, Anand Yogi -
Madhu
It’s good to know, amongst all the arguments and back-biting between people at various stages of their spiritual odyssey, that there’s at least someone posting here who elicits almost universal respect.
As I’ve previously noted, Anand Yogi is clearly in his outspoken, fiery, ‘rajasic’ phase of realisation, and the likes of Kavita, Madhu, Shantam, I myself and, in the quite recent past, others here, sense where he’s coming from.
Futile it is indeed to cross swords with this brand of spiritual authority. And it’s reassuring that, despite certain appearances, SN attracts discriminating ‘seekers’ well able to see the wood for the trees when it’s put before them.
Yogi is very funny at times. Once in a while he sounds like he is struggling to keep it fresh, but all in all I find his comments good for a laugh.
I trust, like a number of other good judges here, you also discern his intense, ‘rajasic’ spirituality though, Lokesh? He’s a breath of authentic (though volatile and at times rather windy) Indian fresh air here – for the discriminating ones – is he not?
Sannyasnews has many Zen experts.
Does the tradition of Zen masters still exist or industrial revolution sucked it off?
I remember from the days of Pune, Osho in his usual storytelling style was telling similar like, “A Zen master (Sudoko, Nitando or Suzuki) pushed his disciple from the balcony and jumped over him and asked, “Tell me, have you got it?”
Disciple said, “Yes…Osho.”
To hear such stories, many people who could afford their trip to Japan really went in search for such Zen masters.
Shantam, I don`t know if all the Traditional Zen masters have, by now, been “sucked off”, as you put it.
I would be interested to get the low-down on that.
As one of the “zen experts on SN” I will have to give you a quick Zen lesson:
Traditional Zen was about a bunch of guys with shaved heads holed up in monasteries in the mountains in a hugely militaristic medieval country, staring at walls, eating too much porridge, asking each other ridiculous and absurd questions, then when they got the answers wrong, slashing, thumping, beating the hell out of each other.
It was all very organised and the “masters” did the beating and the young `uns got the beatings.
Cats were cut in half and kids` fingers sliced clean off to prove gibberish-based philosophical points.
It was all misogynistic, too. One nun was so good-looking that she had to slash her own face off. Disciples were hurled from upstairs windows and one disciple was beaten to death for simply glancing at a woman.
What they all did for for sexual relief is, unsurprisingly, not recorded.
On the other hand, Beat-Zen was a bunch of beatniks driving round the States in beat-up cars, high on Dexedrine, booze and dope, reading whacked-out Japanese and Chinese poetry, shagging their brains out, living it large and partying hard.
Osho Zen: Leaning towards the beat, but traces of the trad.
Frank.
am incredibly impressed at the degree of self restraint you have shown here.
Indeed I feel privileged to have been at the unveiling of this hitherto unrevealed facet of your good self.
(Can feel the energies vibrating through the akashaic ether. )
Good, relevant post, Frank.
Frank, my dear brother,
While reading your post I felt like sharing my research. You guys can throw stones on me for this but I must share. The most Zen-like porn comes from Japan. Women depict more feelings than all the Angelina Jolies and Jennifer Anistons combined together – and that too in mainstream cinema!
Feelings and West: almost like potato milk shake…Does not mix quite well.
And to be true to my own land, world´s worst porn as well as mainstream cinema comes from India.
Indians are good in writing about love and meditation.