(Sannyasnews is happy to publish this letter, but that is not to say that the Editors agree with everything in it!)
The Osho Meditation Resort Pune/ India- End of June 2012
An era of 26 years is ending for me now. I had come to Pune to sell my flat. Everything around the sale went fine. An endless number of forms and contracts had to be obtained, filled in, signed, counter signed, again signed. Since I had gains I’m eligible to pay income tax. So I need an Indian PAN-card (Personal Account Number) from the income tax dept. That kept me busy too: proofs, requirements, copies, clarifications, more forms, electric bills…
The first time I came to Pune was in 1986 when Osho was still in Kathmandu. Then I kept coming here every winter until I moved my main place of residence to Pune in 1993. I stayed here for 7 years. I left then, right after the new millennium had started (summer 2000) & went back to Germany to settle in Freiburg.
The reasons for leaving this place back then where several. One of the main reasons was certainly this one: what used to be a wonderful Osho Commune International had changed dramatically over time. From being a vivid, multidimensional place with friends from all over the world with a large number of people in the management, the same was taken over by a very few individuals. Most of those who where appointed by Osho either left or were made to leave directly or indirectly.
Simultaneously an important part of the activities- therapy groups- was also streamlined in a way, that most of the somewhat free souls and individuals would find it difficult to cope with all the new rules and partly stupid regulations the newly in charge had come up with.
While all this happened a number of people opposed to the new developments where banned from coming to the commune. They realized that not only their spiritual home had changed its spirit, now they where not even allowed any more visit “their” place!
Not being able to meet their friends where they had been at home for years, not being allowed to sit in the Samadhi, where Osho’s urn is located. The management never seemed to feel any necessity to explain such banning policy. Nor did the remaining people feel courageous to question such decisions! Who wants to be thrown out as well? Many of us had no plan B for being in or near the Commune and being thrown out was a bit similar to becoming an outcast.
Whosoever questioned the management would soon listen to the killer argument of being ‘negative’ and not understanding Osho’s vision properly. It was understood and obvious, that the management would underline their prerogative of interpreting the spirit of Osho by simply kicking out people voicing a different opinion. They probably have no idea how many people left with sadness and bitter feelings- never to come back again.
Now the place is an aesthetically beautiful place compared to the city of Pune generally- but where are the people? Apart from the management there are others living also in the place that is now called a ‘Meditation Resort’. It would be highly unfair to say that those who live there without asking questions of the management are spineless. But they know that their risk of being thrown out is real and high when they dare to oppose, raise questions or if they just demand explanations for decisions made. As to my perception this place has died as my spiritual home. For it has lost its spirit when it was taken over by those claiming to have the sole right to interpret Osho in their way while establishing an atmosphere of fear.
Newcomers or people who come only for a short time or those who come just for a short time, consume and leaving again might not feel and know any of the above. But to me it has lost the right to claim to be a guardian of Osho’s legacy. Because THAT right derives from a time when it was still what it once was: a meeting place of thousands of friends who would come and spend time here every year in the spirit of the master: truthful to the moment, courageous, authentic and inviting the change, experimenting with life. Working together full time, part time, whatever was suitable to the work and to the visitor. Back then we participated in Commune life and were not just reduced to consumers of services like today. Services rendered today by uniformed employees who have no connection with Osho. A person like me feels awkward moving around in a maroon robe and being served by uniformed employees- rather colonial! As a visitor it has become impossible to just jump in and help a bit. They don’t allow that anymore! Why? For me it was always that daily applied attitude in work and activity, where Osho’s spirit would manifest in us and come to life. Laughter and fun would just happen and needn’t be prescribed. THAT- together with meditation was the living spirit of Osho for me.
Let’s jump to now, 2012:
There is someone who became very annoyed about the way the current management is running the place and demands transparency about the decisions made. Particularly the management’s attempt to shift certain properties from one trust to another under dubious surrounding circumstances aroused the attention and suspicion of a group of Sannyasins headed by Premgeet and Anadi. They explain their activities on this website:
Guess what happened to them? Sure enough they banned Premgeet along with those who support him from entering the place! The resort management will try everything to bluff their way through the court case ahead: by claiming, they are not answerable to individuals etc. By twisting things- the typical lawyer liar trip. Factually there are 2-3 people that are responsible for all these years of management resulting to an almost empty place. Jayesh, Amrito, Mukesh…
Premgeet is receiving support from many people- also from within the resort, but under the request not to be named publicly. They fear troubles because people opposing know well how the system works: they can be escorted to the exit any time and life inside the resort is only lived at the behest of the management!
This is a typical drawback I have observed so many times during my 30 years being with Osho:
Herd instinct; people are shit scared standing for their truth because they could be thrown out from the flock. And the herding dog knows: just biting one sheep every now and then is enough to keep them together. Others see it and are warned. Specifically the instrument of banning people from common activities has become the most primitive tool to keep in power.
While suggestions, sharing and a critical discussion here and there is needed and normal in every healthy commune in order to develop and stay healthy – in this place everyone asking critical questions comes under suspicion of being negative, shaking the resorts credit and risking being ushered out. The speed when people will be kicked out depends on the social standing of the person.
To open up the place again and fuel it with fresh life would be needed so much to overcome a state that is depressing to those who knew what the place once was! Whats needed for that? Not only would the management have to admit that they don’t know how to reverse the process of so many people having left over the years never to come back. Many with bitterness and frustration in their hearts. They would have to admit not knowing how to invite the people again rather then hurting and snubbing people by treating them inadequately and patronizing. They might know how to erect impressive buildings – but not how to attract people and how to invite Osho’s spirit again into a living commune. Needless to say that they would have to stop claiming, that only they know how Osho is to be understood. A side-trip here and there from rigid ideas always helps to see things new. It is felt so unbearable listening to those in charge with their constant attitude of claiming perrogative interpretation of Osho! Without a change in their attitude I would not even consider talking to the management. Who wants to waste his time and end up having to listen to the very same yesterdays versions again and again with reference to what Osho said? While Osho’s very words are being edited by people who do not enjoy peoples trust! Osho’s own words are actually being changed, dates removed and often taken out of context, streamlined according to Amrito’s American taste.
But also those others living there in the resort and outside, all those who are concerned about the place: why chicken out?! Is that the spirit of Osho? Be an apple-shiner with cheek muscle hurting automatic-smile on the face?
I for my part see no reason why I should go to the resort if my option is to just consume. And to listen to dressed up explanations why the place has come to such pitiful emptiness. People who are interested in transformation and aspiration for truth and honesty don’t usually come to places where their inspiration is suffocated, where they find a system of yes-man. Change that, invite more help and ideas into the management and many might come back! If it is not too late yet!
If I will be banned now too from visiting the place which was once my home – then be it! Who wants to give in to fear?!
Wendelin Ackermann
Actually Amrito is English, and very English public school. So not American, Wendelin. English Public school boys basically half run the world. Scratch many African, Asian, Commonwealth and South American leaders and you will find they have been educated at English Public schools, particularly Eton and Harrow.
It’s a strange concoction: they train them in a certain elitism which seems to transfer into an overweening but successful ambition of leadership. They also network closely with each other, much more than is ordinairily realised.
They are not “public” schools in the literal sense at all. Parents pay a great, great deal of money for their offspring to go there, and even then their names have to be put down at birth, so there is absolutely no equality of access. They are very elitist private schools despite the misleading name.
Amrito was ambitious from the start in the temporal organisation around Osho. Sleeping with people where he felt it would raise his status and access to Osho. Also public speaking (spouting the sutras at lecture), public speaking being a special training in English Public schools, etc. And his somewhat self-forced early relationship with Vivek. Also, he only ever did 3 groups on his own admission, so none of that necessary self-examination for someone with such inherited right to rule.
Nonetheless Wendelin, don’t forget that Amrito in particular was there in the inner circle with Osho since 1979. He would have at least some claim of both knowledge of, and even interpretative knowledge of what Osho wanted, if anything, to happen with the Pune ashram. Also one can not but have some sneaking regard for someone whom Sheela tried to kill.
As for banning, well, it always used to happen – and when Osho was alive. The Pune One guards always had a list of those who were banned. So nothing new there. I understand that there is now an “unbanned” list also!!!
Frankly, if Pune is not for you now, then it is arguably time to move on anyway. Jain monks moved every three days so they did not get attached. And don’t forget that Osho was a Jain. Creating or helping to create a place where you and your friends can be together would seem a better use of your energy than just harping on about the Resort and acting like you want to “take it over”, like some army coup, and live there like you did 20 years ago?
Hello.
Wendelin’s fedback is beautiful and heartful.
His words are full of love for the “Osho Commune International” and full of understanding about the “Jayesh Resort in Pune”.
Two very different spirits! Great insight.
Good Wendelin. Very good.
Parmartha, how can you possibly understand Wendelin as someone “who wants to take over the Pune Resort like some army coup”?
Parmartha, you are way too agressive. What happend to you? Or better: What did not happen to your heart?
I do underline every sentence of Wendelin and add just some fact,
because we are living in a word of couses and effects. It is very easy to see what we are in for and why:
Amrito is the first born son of an British Ray Officer from Australia, being stationed in Bombay. Amrito’s father divorced from his mother, a British citicen and party queen, and left India to go back to Australia after India became free from the British Ray System. Amrito wanted to stay with his mother and left India for a future in good old England. Amrito was raised in England under a mad grandfather, who always had strange and stupid insights into how to be a proper church member. And he acted his madness out by harassing other church members! In telling them how to behave
spiritual in the right way! We all know that Amrito never did any groups, nor any therapy. And we all know he always runs around with great insights (since Osho left his body), telling everybody what Osho wants. And more over, he does harass people with a mad drive, telling new and old how to behave spiritual. As if that is of any use at all. It is simply the old and mad behaviour of Amrito’s grandfather. Amrito did take it on at a jung age and is acting it out until today. It would only need some light therapy to come to a non-identification status with his grandfather, mother side. But if you do not do your home work, who does it for you?
And moreover, Amrito’s farther was a British Raj Officer. Amrito is made out of the same wood like his father! And sadly, Amrito seperated at a jung age from his father and could never see, no way to mention transform, that old British Raj spirit in himself. Rather than seeing, accepting, understanding and transforming, Amrito is serching unconsciously the spirit of his father by getting drunk. He became an alcoholic a long time ago, because he went too often into the same unconscious habit to conect with his father while getting drunk.
All together that is why we ended up having a Colonial Resort in Pune. Amrito changed “Osho’s meeting place of friends” into a “British Colonial Club”. Of course this is all unconcious for Amrito. He lives only the way of life of his father. A very different way of life and certainly not that of the New Man, Osho’s lovers and Friends.
And more over, Amrito is only the weapon Jayesh is using for his trip. Jayesh was raised by his father to be the prime minister of Canada! And Jayesh is acting like a prime minister with all the dirty stuff you must do to raise to the top.
It all ended with Jayesh at the death beed of Osho. Osho did ask Jayesh how much money do you have on your bank account? Jayesh told him a number and Osho demanded: That money belongs to me! And Osho went on telling Jayesh how to spend it for the commune. Later that day Jayesh came out of Osho’s bedroom and told to us all: Osho just gave me everything. And he is still keeping thatt up until today.
So we have Jayesh and Amrito who both are living the dream of there Fathers. We who left Pune, we all can see that this are the old, stupid and rotten dreams of the old man. And Parmartha, defending them is participating in the wars of the old man! Is that the dream of your father or grandfather? Or is this what you have learned from Osho? Is this the way to transfrom yourself or are you just being a victim of the old mans world?
Parmartha, do your homework first and find out in what you are in.
And when you have found out what you are in with your dreaming
consioiusness, find a way to come out. And when you are out of the deep mud of your ancestors you can share your way out of it. But do not sit in deep mud while telling others what they are in.
Parmartha, how can you call Wendelin someone who wants to take over the Pune Resort like some army coup. This is so way off and out of joke that i can call it only as deeply sick.
Love Ramarshi
Ramarshi,
I also heard that Amrito’s great-grandad was Jack the Ripper.
Hello Frank,
Amrito’s grandfather declared in his old age to the press, that he actual knows who Jack the Ripper is. He has writen all down in black and white, but was not willing to go public with his findings as long as he is alive. Amrito’s grandfather did find out that his own father (a med doc, too) was the famous Jack the Ripper. After Amrito’s grandfather died, the press wanted the writings on Jack the Ripper. But Amrito’s family destroyed the papers and told the press that it was all just bullshit.
Jack the Ripper is Amrito’s personal great grandfather and the mad killing drive of Jack the Ripper runs in the blood of Amrito too. It is in fact in the 4th generation after the killer the strongest (in outcome). And we all know Amrito’s readiness to use that killing power. Just see how easy it is for him to have the drive to tell thousends of Sannyasins to leave the Osho Commune in Pune between 1992 and now. Each time it was one kill complete in itself. Until the whole commune is almost empty. It was much too easy for Amrito. And thousends! You can call that a strong killing habit. And moreover, Osho played with Amrito about that issue at Rajneeshpuram and in Pune 2. Amrito was a few times in the marketplace trying to find the best poison to help Osho out of his body. Osho told him to find it. And Amrito never even had a glimpse that this is just a device from Osho to make his killing power conscious (in Amrito) while he is in it (non-repressed).
This readiness to kill in Amrito was an issue for Osho since Rajneeshpuram and it is an issue for the Osho Commune since, too. But it seems that Amrito does not come to a point of transforming that energy yet. You can only call this spiritually retarded, as far as the ability to transform is concerned. Which, by the way, is the right diagnosis for all participants of the good old British Raj System and even more for each member of the elite of that system. Amrito’s father was an ‘active and all for it’ British Officer in that System of exploitation. Now if you wish you can find out who was behind the British Raj System, who profited from it the most. And what System replaced it and is now in power. You will find in every single member of the elite of that system and in all the participants who want to rise to the top the same readiness to kill as you find it in Amrito until today. So, our beloved and far out Master did not only put his consciousness upon Amrito, he did it to all who are in that readiness to drop atom bombs — just for maket shares. Most of the Sannyasins actually do not get the work of Osho yet, but if Osho would have not found a great way to work with it — we all would be in a nuclear desert by now. Specially we in Germany.
Love, Ramarshi
Hi Ramarshi,
What kind of evidence do you have that Amrito’s grandfather knew about his own father being Jack the Ripper?
And surely Amrito was the victim of a murder attempt?
It is a bit of a stretch to equate banning people with murder, isn`t it?
And what kind of evidence do you have, Ramarshi, that Osho’s work has saved us from a nuclear holocaust? Isn’t that just wishful thinking, a sort of ‘fervent-disciple-speak’?
You know the sort of thing, surely:
“My Master was – no, is – so great, so powerful, he has saved the whole world from destroying itself! By the way, not many people – not even his disciples – know about this yet. I do though, just as – unlike generations of investigators – I know the identity of Jack the Ripper and consequently, that his great-grandson was/is also a sort of ‘murderer’ too. (That special knowledge makes me pretty special, of course).”
I think it is an interesting “coincidence” that Osho’s period of enlightenment while in the body, ie 1953 to 1990, does more or less coincide with the dangerous period of the Cold War, when a nuclear holocaust was possible.
Are you seriously suggesting that Osho’s presence here was a significant factor for there being no nuclear war during his lifetime, Alok?
If so, why not also include the many other spiritual teachers, ”realised souls’ (known and unknown to us) whose numbers seem to have grown in this time, our lifetime?
But what about the proliferation of nuclear weapons during and after Osho’s lifetime, making the likelihood of an eventual holocaust ever more likely?
Not to mention the ever-increasing numbers of wars, civil strife, torture etc…?
Hi SD,
I thought you would come back on that.
“Are you seriously suggesting that Osho’s presence here was a significant factor for there being no nuclear war during his lifetime, Alok?” Of course you cannot prove it one way or the other.
“If so, why not also include the many other spiritual teachers, ”realised souls’ (known and unknown to us) whose numbers seem to have grown in this time, our lifetime?” Well IMHO Osho was very exceptional indeed. I think some of today’s ”realised souls’ are fakes. Others, for example, Krishnamurti did not have the spiritual power that Osho did.
“But what about the proliferation of nuclear weapons during and after Osho’s lifetime, making the likelihood of an eventual holocaust ever more likely?”
Well maybe. I am not sure.
I also mentioned “the ever-increasing numbers of wars, civil strife, torture etc…?”
I wonder what the Vietnamese or Cambodians, for example, might make of this, Alok?
Or perhaps the numerous Africans and South Americans embroiled in unspeakably vile conflicts over the last few decades?
Tibetan buddhists? Bosnians? Israelis v Palestinians?
To name but a few…
(Not to mention the Islamists, my God!).
Surely there’s more than enough evidence that things out there are getting worse, not better? So, humanity hasn’t yet got around to pressing the nuclear button…Well, maybe it won’t actually need to….
Hello Alok John,
Here is a cool work by a Japanese artist. It explains itself. So you can have a glimpse onto the madness (of the old man). And what happend to that madness, when Osho left His Body.
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The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
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And Satyadeva,
There is a war going on between Light and Darkness.
This is all that i share. Just making some side notes to that play between Light and Shadow. It is a great drama and i just like to blend in some notes. That’s all.
And Arpana, in the war between Light and Darkness — Light always wins. No need to be paranoid about the Darkness.
Specially there is absolutely no need to be paranoid about paranoid projections. But nice barking.
Love Ramarshi
“And Satyadeva,
There is a war going on between Light and Darkness.
This is all that i share. Just making some side notes to that play between Light and Shadow. It is a great drama and i just like to blend in some notes. That’s all.”
And by “notes” what exactly do you mean? That you’re just speculating? Or that you think you know something that hardly anyone else does?
SD wrote : “Surely there’s more than enough evidence that things out there are getting worse, not better?” I think it is hard to make a judgment about this. In the second world war 50 million were killed in six years. If you add up the deaths in the conflicts you mention, you do not get to that figure.
There is a book called the “The Rational Optimist”. I cannot remember the author. It is worth reading, or maybe just the reviews of the book.
It’s not really a question of the death-count, it’s the degree of conflicting world-views, especially of anti-Western sentiment, spearheaded by Islamist terror.
That, plus nuclear proliferation (whereby in worst-case scenario, bang would go that 50m world record!!) makes this a very uneasy, fragile age.
Such books as ‘The Rational Optimist’ would seem to be superficial stuff, frankly.
Also, Ramarshi, it occurs to me that if Osho could save humanity from itself, how come he was unable to prevent his own commune from imploding, and also his own ‘partner’ , Vivek, from committing suicide?
Or are these somehow ‘unfair’ questions?
Hello,
Vivek died because of overdosing with heroin. It was not a suicide.
It happend in Jayesh’s hotel room in Bombay. Vivek had no money to purchase that stuff. She became the lover of Jayesh a few months before she died. It must have been Jayesh who made it all possible for her. What has that to do with Osho not being Osho? Vivek left Pune (and Osho) — first for days, then for weeks — to be with Jayesh in Bombay. I don’t see Osho as a saviour. If that comes up in someone, it is because old and stupid ideas (the old man had about his god) pop up in you.
Vivek simply lost it. And Jayesh helped her to slip down.
Now that raises some real questions.
Love Ramarshi
Well, Ramarshi, I say again, if the power of Osho’s presence (or Presence) was not enough to prevent his ‘partner’ of many years from self-destructing (taking heroin may not technically be ‘suicide’, but especially for a vulnerable manic-depressive it’s surely well on that self-destructive road); and – which I note you haven’t responded to yet – if his presence (or Presence) was not enough to prevent his own commune from imploding, then it’s barely credible that his influence could prevent the powers-that-be – who had no contact at all with him – from starting a nuclear war.
It just seems like straightforward common sense to me, nothing complex there at all.
You say you don’t view Osho as a “saviour”, yet credit him with having ‘saved’ the world from nuclear holocaust. That sounds rather close to some sort of a saviour concept, although not a full-blown ‘Only Son of God’ pile of bullshine, doesn’t it? No need to project on to me, thank you, I’m just responding to what appears to be a flawed – and, as even Alok says, unprovable argument.
Interesting that this kind of paranoid twaddle is now projected onto Amrito by you with a sannyas name, and is the same kind of paranoid twaddle that was being projected onto Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh in those days, before he changed his name, by non sannyasins. Hmm!!
Thanks for your opinion, Ramarshi.
Osho was the “rich-man’s guru”. I loved when he say in an interview, “SAll the gurus of the world are taking care of the poor people, I want to be the one who takes care of the rich.They are doing their job, let me do my job!”
I have heard there were a ot of not only rich but influential (or sons of the influential) who had taken sannyas. A list would be appreciated, if anyone knows some names.
In this way it makes sense to say he had helped the world if he has helped these people to become more conscious and more human, ’cause the world is led from this elite of which they were part at some level.
Actually there were hardly any influential people who took sannyas.
I’ve realised I like the quiet way you stick to your proposals.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Better_Angels_of_Our_Nature
Come off it, John…
What about Terence Stamp?
He`s got his own brand of gluten-free crisps….
Everything changes, nothing stays the same.
Last thing someone booking a fortnight’s holiday in a resort needs is disgruntled old timers whingeing on about how awful your ‘now’ must be compared to their super ‘then’.
You can hear that at work any time, why fly to India?
Nostalgia ain’t what it used to be.
Want an Ashram?
Start one.
The era in question actually drew to a close when Osho died. Obviously more than a few don’t get that and are still hanging out with Osho’s ashes, thinking there is something spiritual about it. Sorry folks, worshipping ashes is just the sort of thing Osho would have cracked a joke about, because they are absolutely dead. This whole Poona controversy is for the dummies that didn’t pass the Osho test, including the losers running the show there. It is so old hat it is totally stupid to even think much about it and if you are I suggest you try and get hold of a life somewhere, before it is too late and you are in the astro zone waiting in a line for another body, wishing you had not wasted so much time on dead issues during your previous incarnation.
The good news is that Osho’s legacy, which has nothing whatsoever to do with a geographical location, is alive and kicking in the hearts of those who were truly touched by the man.
LOL
Thanks for this letter.
Having read similar reviews and having spoken to some Indian sannyasins, it appears to me that Resort’s problems are beyond banning people, being against Indian sannaysins/worshipers, cost problems etc.
People simply do not feel good there, do not get nourished, do not feel transformed, do not feel friendly, welcomed etc. basically, they do not even feel as good as in the family-run hotel. Some, in comparison to old times, some (like me), in comparison to other communes.
I do not think it is about “moving on”, “forgetting the past”. The Resort gets it wrong irrespective of their understanding of Osho. What is there to understand?? What colour of building it should be, at what time to serve breakfast? LOVE and MEDITATION is the basis of Osho communes and they cannot be forced. They say everything comes from the top.
When old sannaysins went to Pune I am sure they didn’t go there for anything else than what it was making them feel – better, lighter, happier, quieter, juicer, lovelier?
I am sure deep down the ones who run the commune know that the train is passing by. Apparently, the Resort gets less busy every year. There are hardly any sannaysins and people just pass by. No openness and friendship. That can not nourish the top either so they also suffer – no doubt. But power must be so sweet to not admit the failure!
Let them carry on until they totally collpse. No fear! And regrets! At least it shows to people who criticise, diminish Osho what happens when he is not in the body!
Osho Viha printed an article this month by returning visitors, and first time visitors, which says you are wrong.
This is as much a part of the problem as are the ‘failings’ of the people who run the ashram.
Is Your Glass Half Empty or Half Full?
How therapy helps us change perspective.
Published on March 14, 2012 by Jennifer Kunst, Ph.D. in A Headshrinker’s Guide to the Galaxy
Buddha remarked on the enormous impact of perspective on human psychology when he said, “life is a creation of the mind.” Shakespeare put it this way when he said “there is nothing good or bad, but thinking makes it so.” And Flip Wilson’s character, Geraldine, brought this idea to life with a laugh when he said “what you see is what you get.” A big part of therapy is working to understand that what we see in our lives has a lot to do with how we see it.
Perspective influences everything. We do not see our lives in purely objective terms. We are subjective creatures. We see through a filter. We have biases. As I like to say, everyone has a personality. And that personality alters our perceptions. Introverts see life differently than do extraverts. Pessimists have a different take on life than optimists or even realists. If you have a leaning toward depression, your sense of life takes on that gray sheen. If you are somewhat anxious, everything revs at a slightly higher speed.
I think that these filters are relatively fixed aspects of our personalities. Some of you might feel relieved to hear that. I know a lot of folks get worried that a therapist is going to try to turn them into a completely different person! Let me be the first to reassure you that cannot happen. What therapists seek to do is to help you shift perspective so that you can see the world more accurately and therefore live your life more effectively. That’s what I mean by filters being relatively fixed. There is room for tweaking.
The good news is that when relative changes can be made in one‘s basic approach to life, it makes a big difference. A modest change in your filter doesn’t change who you are at the fiber of your being. It helps you become a better version of yourself.
Think about it this way. A cognitive behavioral therapy corrects distortions and misperceptions. If you have a basic distortion like “nothing ever works out for me,” you inevitably won’t invest in your life with much confidence or effort. If you can come to see that, in fact, sometimes things work out and sometimes they don’t, you are likely to try harder and with a more hopeful attitude. Just that shift can change a lot.
Or think about it in another way. Since Carl Rogers, most therapists have a basic approach to clients of empathy, understanding, and positive regard. It sounds like such a simple approach but it really can be transformational. Sadly, many people have never had someone listen to them with great interest, understand both their troubles and their talents, and affirm their best qualities and efforts. Just having someone understand and believe in you can change the filter you have about yourself and about other people—which can make life seem more worth living and living well.
One of the unique aspects of the psychoanalytic approach is that the client’s perspective on his or her relationship with the therapist—what we call transference—is the focus of attention. The therapist allows himself to become a guinea pig in the client’s psychological world, considering and exploring the perceptions and misperceptions that the client has of him. The therapeutic relationship becomes a laboratory in which the client can live out these biases in the relationship with the therapist in a way that is more vivid and emotionally alive. This experience paves the way for deeper understanding and those “aha!” moments in which the client can see how he or she is distorting reality in real time. That can lead to transformation of perspective in the root of the client’s personality. And that is why the changes that people make in psychoanalysis tend to stick.
It’s challenging to take the risk to get into therapy or to keep at it once you’re in. But if the experience could help you shift perspective so that you could see your life as half full and live accordingly, wouldn‘t it be worth it?
Those Were The Days, My Friend
Once upon a time there was a tavern
Where we used to raise a glass or two
Remember how we laughed away the hours
And think of all the great things we would DO
Chorus:
Those were the days, my friend
We thought they’d never end
We’d sing and dance forever and a day
We’d live the life we choose
We’d fight and never lose
For we were young and sure to have our way
La la la la la la
La la la la la la
Then the busy years went rushing by us
We lost our starry notions on the way
If by chance I’d see you in the tavern
We’d smile at one another and we’d say
Just tonight I stood before the tavern
Nothing seemed the way it used to be
In the glass I saw a strange reflection
Was that lonely woman really me?
Through the door there came familiar laughter
I saw your face and heard you call my name
Oh, my friend, we’re older but no wiser
For in our hearts the dreams are still the same…
ok, then can you please list me the people who are still sannaysins,who had built the ashram, who still come there? Close to nothing.
You don’t think that might be something to do with a lot of them are dead, then there are all the infirm sixty, seventy, and eighty year olds, or people of those ages who enjoy a book and a bit of telly, and are much less inclined to go charging of to India now; and then their are all the fifty pluses, who might not be feeling so ready to bounce around like teenagers and twenty somethings these day.
My dear, dear friend Sat died at the beginning of the year. He was sixty six. He hadn’t been to the ashram in years, not because of the evil management, but because hes been suffering from arthritis since about aged fifty, although still living a rich, full, engaged life, and not a glass is half empty life, and loving Osho,
He like me was neither for the management or against, but against sweeping statements, nagging, glass is half empty attitudes. Pouting, sulking, door slamming negativity. Against people who always blame everybody else when life doesn’t suit them.
I worked with a woman some years ago, and came to realise of her that if I was to give her £499 she would have been in the pub an hour later, bitching about what a tight fisted bastard I was because I hadn’t rounded the money up to five hundred.
I have no personal information about the people who run the ashram, but I do have direct experience of people like that woman, the likes of Shantam and that fool Osho rajneesh. They are the people poisoning the sannyas world, and so damn many of them.
If I was running the ashram I wouldn’t listen to them, and if you are reading this Amrito, dont give in and pay attention to nagging Shantam, or hysterical negative Osho Rajneesh, because if you do Osho’s work will be finished.
If the ashram was swarming with people who are still sanyasins, who built the ashram, you and nagging Shantam would complain about that.
Osho once old me that people who complain a lot are egoists.
Chetna, Arpana is right. Anyone who built the ashram is going to be over 60 now and probably too old for jaunts to India. Things change, you know. How many foreign 60 + year old at Tapoban? Not many, I guess
I’m over 60, travel to Asia regularly and during the heat of the Spanish summer lead with my wife a small group of swimmers along the deep water coastline of Ibiza. It is not unusual for us to be in the sea for two hours and cover a distance of 5 or six kilometres. I dance whenever I get the chance and have a name as a shit-hot funk DJ. This autumn I plan to organize a monthly event for free form dancers, where I supply the toons. I still enjoy making love and can’t help noticing that women are sometimes attracted to me for some mysterious reason. I enjoy driving fast cars and am actively involved in creative arts. If nothing else is going on I jump on my bike and cycle to the nearest village. So Alok, perhaps your vision of sixty-somethings could do with a little bit of revision, because I know a number of people who are older than me and are fully engaged in leading a life even more active than mine.
Who knows, Lokesh? I am not like you. We all age at different rates. I am sure you are right that there are plenty of people like you.
Chetna.
You’ve got a rose-coloured view of Poona One, you know.
People felt earth-shatteringly miserable at times.
Any unresolved pain, or grief, or self-judgement, fear of disapproval, need for approval, surfaced like a sponge being rung out, with Bhagwan engineering the wringing.
aye,my sponge was well wrung out….
there was frigging in the rigging,too..
by god you should have seen us…
etc….
What many forget to add to the equation of what Poona One was all about is the fact that they were young when it was going on and today they look back upon those times like some golden age, because their youth has disappeared in the valleys of time.
Shantam Prem
Any sannyasin from any country, who has spend some considerable time in Pune will not hesitate to say that there is NO OTHER PLACE so intense yet so light for the inner seeker as OSHO’s multi dimensional ASHRAM.
Those tens of thousands who got so much nouirshment must come forward to restore the glory.
Osho has not left any successor but a joint decision making commatee, where each member has a saying not more than 5 percent. We need to restore that faith, where 20 disciples who have drunk His vision work and meditate together and give the call to all His people, ” Come come yet come again.”
OSHO Pune is a Home where the Heart is and not some bloody bed and breakfast kind of Hyde Park one!
History of past and present day despots gives clear indication that there are always people who adore their leader and then there is silent majority who will spit on the face of the leader, once he is no more in Berlin!
Even the worst dicators do their best to built some kind of show piece infrastructure. Football stadium in Kiev (Ukraine) is one such latest.
Like Lokesh and others here, now in their sixties and beyond, okay we made a contribution and helped build the ashram, etc. However, what I learned there to carry beyond that place, was one carries on finding places where one can live a creative, stimulating, and loving life – SOMEWHERE OR OTHER. And where some days are sometimes touched by the mysterious, and a feeling of being beyond the beyond. That’s it.
If these guys posting here, for whatever reason don’t find they are happy in Pune, etc, then this is the ace card in the Master’s pack to help them move and create some situation elsewhere where one is.
The idea that somehow the place where a Master did his thing, or where his ashes are, have some special magic represent a belief system from the 4th century. My God they found the Higg’s Boson today, wake up! It’s all old Indian Hindu nonsense.
Osho is no longer for imbibing, now is the time to allow him to act through you, and then you can become a fount of his energy and love in a place where Jayesh and Amrito will never cross your mind, as you will be totally taken up with creating something for Osho elsewhere. Then people will start to imbibe you.
Now that is something I can relate to.
Arpana, when was the last time you visited Pune and had a hearty chat with someone who is not your immediate neighbour but had come to Pune due to some unknown pull, some kind of longing?
It is not my wish to say that those who don’t go to Pune will not reach any where, have not covered their miles.
Neither I have this magnificiant illusion that without Osho, there is no inner growth. Billions of people have no inclination towards Osho or any other living gurus in the world, yet I am sure none of them will prove a loser in comparision to those, who have all the luxury to be with the creme de la creme.
It is your free choice to believe what you want to believe, to my own path, i am obliged to write the notes with as much authenticity as possible and I stand with this notion, that change from commune to resort is done not as per the wishes of Osho but because of the suggestions given by high profile corporate lawyers in Mumbai.
It is one of the biggest bullshit to think that other than Sheela, nobody else can be corrupted by the power and after her, palace intrigues have washed away by the all herbal meditation soap.
Osho has taunted all the religious powerhouses for their priestly power and domination, therefore it becomes even more important that His people create better, more transparent and inclusive structure.
Osho did that, till 2000 that spirit was the driving force…but then came over ambitious mind set….let us create that Resort where investment bankers will come for quick fix for their corporate sins.
None of them have come and none will ever come.
Did you learn to nag from mother or father?
“Osho is no longer for imbibing, now is the time to allow him to act through you, and then you can become a fount of his energy and love in a place where Jayesh and Amrito will never cross your mind, as you will be totally taken up with creating something for Osho elsewhere. Then people will start to imbibe you”.
Parmartha, instead of Osho, put Jesus and you have a punch paragraph for any Sunday sermon in any of the world languages.
Why one should create for Osho anything?
Is this not a third century Buddhist belief?
Has the Existence become barren not to produce living Oshos anymore?
Problem is people want to worship a mummy but after surgically removing her magnificant boobs, the boobs which were annoying the women in the town!
Shreek Shantam says, Any sannyasin from any country, who has spend some considerable time in Pune will not hesitate to say that there is NO OTHER PLACE so intense yet so light for the inner seeker as OSHO’s multi dimensional ASHRAM.
All this conveys to me is that Shantam needs to get out more and expand his very limited horizons.
I woke up this morning recalling how I was very resistant to the whole sannyas trip when I first arrived in Poona in the very early days. This of course soon changed once I met Osho and, like so many others, was overwhelmed by his incredible aura of what I can only describe as love.
Back then Greek Mukta was the main conduit for getting up close and personal with the old man. Now Mukta is an old lady with Alzheimers. My memory still functions well and I can remember very clearly her saying to me, ‘Lokesh, you’ve talked to Bhagwan three times this week. You will have to wait a couple of days before another darshan. You have to allow space for other people who want to see the master.’
Now we have people like Shantam, ranting on about Osho’s legacy as if his life depended on it and I suspect he never ever actually sat at the old boy’s feet and talked to him face to face. He uses expressions like ‘multi-dimensional’ but reading his words it is very apparent he has not a clue as to what that actualy means.
During the sixties we had a name for people like Shantam. We called them squares. It meant that they lived in a square…a two dimensional reality, lacking any real depth. A square knows nothing that lives outside of 2D, has no idea that other dimensions beyond what he knows exist. Only a square would limit creative intellegence to a pile of ashes in a fixed geographical spot and ignore the living presence that makes this whole show turn. Perhaps Osho made a mistake allowing such people to join the gang…he was very interested in accumulating followers, due to his vision of creating a global shift in consciousness…and it is therefore he embraced anyone who wanted to join his club. The problem today is that the squares want to and have taken over the organizational aspects of the sannyasin movement. Extra dimensional people simply can’t be bothered with all that, because it is a power trip and political…boring and uninspiring for those who see their reflection beyond such mundane and dumbed-down lower chakra games. When I look at the faces of such people they look like the world’s politicians to me in the sense that they don’t look like any of my friends or members of my expanded global family. If the squares want to run the resort let them…it will not make any difference to me or anyone else I am close to. If fools like Shantam wish to declare and I quote again, NO OTHER PLACE so intense yet so light for the inner seeker as OSHO’s multi dimensional ASHRAM. Let them. It is not my problem, although they obviously have one it is not for me to sort out. Life will take care of that, sooner or later.
In the meantime I address all those who were genuinely touched by Osho and the mssage he delivered back in his heyday, which was one of celebration, love and peace, by telling you a short story.
The other day I met a friend on the dusty lane that leads to my house on Ibiza. Let us for privacy’s sake call that person X. X lived in Osho’s house for many years and as it happens is a very beautiful human being. We talked about how strange it is that Mexican Rupesh is no longer with us. At one point X looked into my eyes and said, ‘We will be together again. We always find each other every time we return to the Earth.’ Coming from X I really took that on board. X’s statement has many aspects, and expanding on it I see that when everyone gathered around Osho it was an incredible get-together of people who knew each other from other times. Everything passes and that most wonderful of events drew to a close and we all dispersed in the marketplace.
It is marvelous to understand that real spirit is undestructable, that real spirit is not confined to time and space, and needs no name and form Like attracts like. Let the squares have the resort, the children simply need a kindergarden to slowly grow and develop in. Meanwhile those who know who they are roam the multiverse and spread a little love, light and laughter wherever they go…just like Osho told us to.
“It is marvellous to understand that real spirit is undestructible, that real spirit is not confined to time and space, and needs no name and form Like attracts like. Let the squares have the resort, the children simply need a kindergarden to slowly grow and develop in. Meanwhile those who know who they are roam the multiverse and spread a little love, light and laughter wherever they go…just like Osho told us to.”
Amazing statement, Lokesh. So agree …
It is interesting how mixed-up this topic becomes – inner and outer all on one plate. Like the life itself, not clear where it begins and ends.
Cool, Chetna.
More and more I come closer to the conclusion that many of the Western sannyasins were Brahmins in one of their most influential past lives. These scholarly people, the wise people who are the first ones to get attracted to all those religious books, have all the traits of thousands of years of rationlisation.
One of their traits is to avoid all kind of confrontations with anyone who has some worldly authority and secondly, head priest, the brahmin who is the care aker of the temple is appointed by the Deity itself, therefore position is beyond question.
Indian history has so many instances, where hundreds of priests praying in the temple, treating Deity as God, offered no resistance to Muslim invaders, they covered their non-action with the thought: Universal Spirit ,The Atman, is beyond destruction, it can not be burnt, it can not be drowned……
Shantam, back at the glue-sniffing again, I see. And people wonder why you are so stuck.
shantam prem,
Brahmins… seriously? I dont get that at all, if anything Osho’s Sannyasins were beyond any caste identifications whatsoever. Osho considered the caste system as an ugly thing as he did manu samhita.
cheers
For those, like me, who’ve never heard of Manu Samhita before, it’s an old Hindu scripture, very ‘conservative’, very controversial (ie bordering on the inhuman at times, ie par for that particular sort of course).
Fair comment but a white English sannyasin with a pocketful of rupees can live like a nabob over in India.
Worked for me for five years.
Any way up you look at it, exploitation’s happening. Sometimes that’s a two way street but by and large we’re no better than Brahmins for what use, apart from our spending power; we are to the locals.
Seeking-enlightenment self-interest is fine up to a point. But beyond that, maybe our best work’s to be done back ‘home’.
The resort’s a business providing a marketable service. Nothing wrong with that at all, they deserve to prosper. But it’s a long way both geographically and spiritually from what could be effected wherever we happen to live.
OK, we don’t proselytise. But why fade away as the unique local manifestations of Osho’s anti-’message’ that we might be, were local sannyasins to work together just a bit more wherever they cook their rice?
‘Ananto’ said
But it’s a long way both geographically and spiritually from what could be effected wherever we happen to live.
Good one.
What a waste of energy and time and effort, if the only place we could live well was on that few acres.
PS.
You remind me of someone ‘Ananto’. Hmmm!!!
Once upon a time,there was a beautiful magic place,in a mysterious land,where everything become possible,where love fills the air and laughter was all around and celebration was the main occupation!
Then an ugly bunch of people make it an orrible resort…lets kick them out brothers!!
I would like to have a life where things are so simple.
It’s more easy to worship the past than to live the present.
When the party is over,is over……when the trip is over,you have to come out from the train.Then you can search for a new train,or simply sitting silently in the middle of the station.
But if you want a confortable consolation,start to worship the train as an holy place….in India there are so many place for a pilgrimage,full of history and legends,why go to that polluted unbreathable big city?
It’s a piece of history of modern times,still interesting for “seekers” of today for a short visit….take what you may need….and then go out.
Time and again, Osho has given new meaning to the old terms. He has shaken the centuries of dust and misinterpretation given by priests to the inner treasures of sages.
While speaking on Krishna´s Geeta in ten bulky volumes, Osho has many discourses making it clear that four division of classes is based on psychological traits and not social hierarchy. A military General´s son who hates war material but prefers to read Eckard Tolle kind of books has Brahmanical traits while Father is a Warrior.
To know thyself is almost equal to Krishna´s Sav-Dharma (individual religiosity, very personal Tao).
One of the most famous sayings of Krishna is, ” It is better to die for one´s own religion, as to follow the others is dark as hell fire.”
This sentence is used quite often by religious right wings to provoke social clashes…Osho has spoken in length on such vital topics….
Still remember those days in 1984 when I was reading these discourses in the bus on the way to Law college, and preparing me to get retirement from cut-throat way of success and join an NGO.
During Osho´s second homecoming to Pune, it was a call not to return back. Many mystics have given similar calls, ” Burn your home and come with me”.
You have too much resort.
Well it looks like a nice place,obviously provides jobs for locals and if people didn’t want to go there it would close down. That’s not likely to happen anytime soon although this recession must have hit their revenues same as it has to all Indian tourism this past three or four years. Not the sort of thing I’d fancy though, bit too posh for a hairy-arsed old sannyasin. This stuff can all be done anywhere hence my comment about opening Ashrams if that’s what people want to do. Quite frankly though, these days most people like a bit of comfort and their own space and place.
All this “no other place” stuff….
who was that old Shivaite poet from the 12th century who said,
“my backyard is the true Benares”?
He was a smart dude.
8 centuries later still this fighting about the “holy of holies”?
To be fair ,man is a territorial animal, just like the others…
and being clever, he has devised more interesting excuses to have a fight for…
“It is my holy shrine, no othe place will do” does spice up the fight considerably and make the monkeys think that they are actually involved in something greater than fighting about rotten bananas, Isuppose….
I wasn`t keen on the Samadhi, myself.
Full of self-righteous prats in their white socks thinking that just by standing in a particular room near a pile of bones they don’t even know are actually there, they were going to earn them spiritual merit of some sort.
Retarded pygmies, most of `em…
mind you, I did have a satori in there…
as i meditated, I started to hear this soft sound ssss…, a kind of hissing sound which seemed to be coming from deep inside and the room next door…..then I heard the sound of a man laughing….
both sounds grew slowly louder, the hissing was like air coming out of a balloon yes….
sssssssssssssss…
then the laughter hohohohohoho….
ssssssss….. hohohoho…sssss..hohoho…ssss….
sohohohohossshohohosho…
osho…
Dassimayya reckoned his hero’s
Front yard was the true Benares.
Dodgy ref, bro.
Yer man was the Shivaite Billy Graham of his day. Mission to convert Jains to ‘the one true path’.
Didn’t catch on, apparently.
There’s some do say that xtian Alpha course is a straight lift from Dassimaya tactics.
Where did I see the Resort is knocking out fragments of Osho handwritten notes for big bucks? Say it ain’t true, skipper.
If it is, they’ll maybe be flogging indulgences next.
Do tell if this is a tad presumptuous from one who has never visited the Resort, but tale to tell its populatity amongst some young single middle-class Indian chaps was not so much the meditation opportunities but rather the proximity of western laydees of allegedly accomodating persuasion. Sorta in house ‘have it away day’ sex tourism.
Nowt wrong with that, but you mention the Resort in some Madras circles and BComs of a techie persuasion do tend to either look a bit furtive or giggle.
Ananto,
you are right, I got the quote a bit wrong.
It should have been:
“My backside is the true Benares”
Benares or Benidorm….can`t remember….
My backside is the true Benares -
and cannot be found -
even using both hands.
It is pity that Soso resort has not built old people´s caring home as a life extension of Osho commune. Young sannyasins wheelchairing the senior ones into meditation hall; one more branch in the portfolio of work as meditation series.
I am sure, Frank would not have come back home.
Shantam, it’s a good idea…
thanks for the offer…
I think that wheeling an old whiteskin subject of Her Majesty around the place in a wheelchair could be part of Osho`s vision, as it would provide you with a good opportunity to drop your ego….
Also, it would get you off the dole and give you a proper job…
and finally, restore a bit of order into a mad world….
You have to admit that you`re a bit lost not having anyone to take orders from….
Come on, drop all these new-fangled ideas about freedom..
you`re a sannyasin sepoy at heart….
now run along and fetch me my gin and tonic, theres a good chap……..
Dear Friends,
I believe that it’s possible to make the place alive, full of celebration, dance and music. I see it’s no longer important for many people, but it’s still very important for many people too and those people would like to see things change. My understanding is: it is through the actions of management that ashram is in current state. If through my action, I can make ashram alive, full of celebration, dance, music, I am happy to do that, whatever it takes. I would love to see ashram flourish, expanding, I think no one can make a religion out of love, celebration, dance and music but it’s easier to make a religion when it’s serious, ruled, full of fear and controlled. Love
Do share some of your first hand experiences at the ashram.
I was at the ashram for the 21st anniversary party in ’95.
It was a right piss-up.
There was loads of indian folks drinking cans of super-strength lager and trying to dance to techno…
It was like a cross between holi festival, a bad rave and Saturday night in Middlesborough…
It was weird, man.
And that was the “good old days”, before everyone got banned.
‘alive, full of celebration, dance, music’ People in Europe looking for such activities usually visit Ibiza. The island also enjoys some of the cleanest air in Europe, and is surrounded by what the locals call the Mediterranean Sea. It is crystal clear most days and there is nothing in it that wants to eat you…touch wood as I do 5km swims most days. Plenty of sex if you want it, streets of gay bars, thousands of restaurants, every New Age therapy you can imagine, local gurus and shamans, dozens of yoga centres, many sannyasins hiding in the woods, ayahuasca sessions for those so inclined, amazing clubs, the best discotheques in the world, friendly locals, uncontaminated beaches….hey! What are you waitng on?
Even if the ashram gets going again, how many international seekers would fancy it, I wonder?
Even if you do learn how to watch your mind and wash your ass, you might still get it blown off by Al Qaeda..and that’s if you haven’t already been hospitalised with carbon monoxide poisoning or been mown down by a truck going the wrong way while you`re trying to get a rickshaw to get you across north main road!
Still, live dangerously, I guess.
Well, as soon as you manage to kick out those public-school boozers, drop me a line and i`ll get my sevak, Shantam, to wheel me in there and we can have a proper party….
Blessed are those who ignored Osho´s call because they ignored the free lollypops and dared to walk their way with their tradtion or without it, just out of their own.
As time has shown, His initiated disciples are thinking in the same terms.
PS: Frank, I am working in the old people´s home. right now on sick leave because of broken arrm.
Whenever want a place, let me know.
Lokesh, you have forgotten to add the best USP of Ibiza.
Is there any other island in Europe where so many breasts are on public display as if they are the apples from the garden of Eden!
Metaphorical question is why people go to beaches like Ibiza?
To dip their body in the salt water?
Some wise self-sufficient seeker can remind them to add some salt in the bath tub.
You see naked women’s breasts so often on Ibiza, during the summer that is, that you don’t really notice after a few weeks, unless one spots a pair that are exceptional, and that in itself is a very personal taste. Some guys dig bare ass more than bare boobies…all depends how you look at it. The other day, there was a naked red-head on the rocks from where I usually head out to sea. As I swam by she was going through a set of asanas that would driven a healthy young man bananas.
At the peak of the gay scene a few years back it was not unusual for men to have a dozen sexual contacts in a night, without a word being exchanged. Last week a cruise ship with 1500 gay men on board docked in Ibiza. Over on Salinas beach at this time of the year the lads call it sillicone beach because of the massive amout of upright breasts glistening in the sun. Personally, I’m not interested about any of those particular aspects of island life, which does not mean that I don’t notice physical beauty when I see it in pairs.
The whole purpose of a spiritual sanctuary, like the current Osho ‘resort’, ultimately needs to be questioned. As the flame of the master ebbs, now past 22 years since he departed, it becomes increasingly clear what the legacy actually is. In Osho’s case, we have:
1. His books, and his recorded lectures.
2. His meditation techniques.
3. His people.
4. The Pune resort.
Within a few more decades his ‘people’ will be mostly gone, and what will remain will be those whose experience of him has been only via his books/lectures. These people will comprise the congregation of a new religion, basically, and especially if they attempt to organize in any way.
In the case of a crazy-wise teacher like Osho, his books/lectures are scarcely a reliable means of learning, because of the wide disparity on what he was saying. (Compare, for example, his lectures from the early 1970s, to those just before he died. It is almost as if they were spoken by two different men).
The meditation techniques definitely are useful, but these do not need a central temple to be performed, like some quasi-religious rite. We do not need to face in the direction of Pune in order to do Dynamic meditation.
So what is the ultimate purpose of the Osho resort? To become a shrine, a temple, a holy relic like the Buddha’s tooth?
In Jerusalem, there is a spot called ‘Golgotha’, allegedly where Christ was crucified. About a thousand years ago some Christian Crusaders built a church on the site, where pilgrims still go to pay homage. I went there about fifteen years ago while on my way to Egypt. It was interesting to see, but the place itself is a cold, dark, dank mausoleum. It’s filled with fat Western tourists and pious South Americans, the same ones who pray to Santa Maria for their football team to win. Outside is something called the ‘walk of sorrows’, where Christ supposedly dragged his cross. Right on that route is a big garish Kodak sign, beside a shop with glossy postcards.
Somehow I don’t think Osho would ever have wanted his name to be enshrined, his memory to be preserved in some marble temple. He was a mystic, not a founder of a religion. He should be allowed to go the way of a Bodhidharma rather than a Buddha. The former vanished from history, the latter has had more live-action figures made of him than Michael Jackson.
It is now, and probably will be indefinitely, a place for some, so many, to project onto, all their ideas of Utopia, but on the other hand a place for vast numbers of individuals to project all their unconscious crap about Authority, (Or both alternately. ) And when Amrito and co die, which they will, that will continue.
All these people who don’t meditate, who at most might talk about meditation, which I increasingly suspect, is most of the people who connect to Osho, and this has always been so.
Arpana,
I don’t see that the idea that “all those people don`t meditate”, which is why they are projecting utopias and authority trips, is at all accurate.
I would say that they do meditate, it’s just that when they do, they attach different value to their experience.
That is to say, meditator A jumps/sits around…naturally these activities get you into various hypnagogic states….she imagines these are special states and on the strength of that starts to have ideas of “feeling Osho’s energy”, “being connected to Osho”, or “seeing his vision” etc..etc.
Then, every time he meditates, she subtly expects and creates similar things…and the more slightly altered staes she experiences, the more the feeling of being connected, being right etc. etc. comes…
This is how cultism of the meditative variety works…
Meditators in the same group feel the same way about their altered states, value them in a special way, and a “cult” or mystery school is born…
It’s not a problem. it’s par for the course.
In fact, it’s all jolly good fun..
I would reccomend it, for a while.
Yet, like boozing, partying and tripping and so on..
you probably have to realise the limits…….
And so if sannyasins want a mini-jihad, Oshi`ites against Sunni-asins, devotionals against scientists, marble-kissers versus boozers, in the end it’s just a play of the divine spirit…
the humanimal at cosmic play..
like spiritual mods and rockers,
roundheads and cavaliers,
cowboys and indians…
all fun games, no?
Frank, Frank, Frank Frank. Frank
Sigh!!!
Yes.
Very good, Teertha. I enjoyed reading that.
Not so sure about that ‘ebbing flame’ Teertha. Call St Martins Press what you like but those dodgy compilations of Osho snippets are fair flying off the booksellers shelves.
Shock-horror to old order purists no doubt but the flames pretty strong. Maybe even the odd brushfire starting up here and there.
Maybe it’s this recession but old Ma’s ‘n Swamis in the fortune telling trade have seldom been busier. Folks is hungry for something different.
Ananto — yes, Osho’s books certainly continue to sell well. ‘Ebbing flame’ was meant rhetorically, as in ‘receding in time’. Probably not the best metaphor. I think Osho has been marketed quite well and his influence will last for some time, although I suspect he’d be horrified if ever his name/brand become some sort of watered-down spirituality for ‘happy living’ in the distant future.
It’s what he asked for.To be available to “as many people as possible”. That was his way. Stop making him a victim of business. He had called businessmen to work for him. We can discuss if it was a good idea or not, but the ashram/resort as it is right now is just the logical result of his actions. Stop to put it down as if he was crucified.
I quite like those Osho Greatest Hits themed compilations. They make great gifts too. Maybe the resort is a reification of that riff where he says …
‘I am a simple man, I simply like the best’.
Plenty of sannyasins, esp in SA, pull in a nice living offering various therapies, body work and related services and any amount of lucrative businesses have done a straight rip-off of one or other facet of his teachings. There are no poor Homan Method therapists, for example. That’s nice work if you can get it. Every other micro-business on the UK psychic festival circuit started out from an Osho book or set of cards. The demographic is on Osho’s side. We’ve an ageing population in Europe. Best Marigold Hotel movie has alerted a fit retired generation to the bargain fun India and related ideas has to offer towards filling up those long work-free weeks and months.
Osho had quite a bit in common with Michael Jackson.
He was big in the 80′s.
Wore tops with over-sized shoulders.
Had a lot of brothers who looked like him.
Was a recluse with his own ranch..
Had a private doctor to prescribe him his pills…
Jacko was probably a better dancer, tho`….
Wise man Teertha, can i see your face somewhere?
What we write and feel depends very much on our individual and cultural conditionings, your post above looks as clean and healthy as potatoes from the farmer´s home, but not as juicy as lemons should be.
Whether Osho wants to be like Buddha or Bodhidharma; most probably you have read both the names from Osho´s books. Don´t forget Buddha was an originator of a brand (legacy) like Osho, Bodhidharma was a manager (follower) of that great school.
You are almost comparing Osho to Apple´s CEO (what is his name?) rather than to Steve Jobs….
Shantam, you can see my ‘potato’ head here:
http://www.ptmistlberger.com/
As for the rest, I was a martial artist, Gurdjieff student, and practitioner of Zen Buddhism before I’d heard of Osho (I took sannyas in ’83). And yes, Bodhidharma came from the ‘school’ of Buddha, but he also made it into something completely unique (the Zen lineage). Osho had his own influences as well — Nietzsche, Socrates, Buddha, Atisha, Hakuin, etc., and the three key mentors of his youth (Magga, Pagal, and Masta Baba, as he spoke about in ‘Glimpses of a Golden Childhood’) — but he took from them and built something unique, much as did Bodhidharma, if the legends are to be believed.
Hi Teertha, checked out your site. Looks good. Already read your bit about Cohen/ Poonja…In my case and in the case of dozens I met and knew in Lucknow, Cohen played no part in my being there. I’d never heard of him until I left Lucknow and from what little I know of him I am not in the least interested in him.
I really dug Poonjaji. From a distance he seemed like a lovable, dottery old man…one on one he was a very powerful chap to encounter.
PT.
That’s an interesting site.
But, do you really take Cohen that seriously?
He seems to me to be a complete and utter twat.
His books are narcissistic, rehashed rubbish.
His followers are a few fries short of a happy meal.
…Apart from that, he doesn’t seem to have much going for him….
Frank, I think Cohen is noteworthy if only because he’s not the typical ‘placid’ guru who smiles beatifically and never has an ill word to say about anything. He pushes buttons and has offended many, which puts him in the general company of the ‘crazy-wise’ teachers — of course, one has to decide with such types what, if any, ‘wisdom’ is also there.
i imagine you must have heard the story about the old jewish woman,i cant remember her name,who went to india in order to seek out a guru.
she was a tough old bird and she sought far and wide,checking rishikesh,tiruvanamalai etc etc .
she eventually she heard about a certain wise man,and she immediately “just knew” this was the man she was looking for.
she went straight to where he was.
the guru had a fearsome reputation as a no-nonsense crazy-wisdom exponent….with his unorthodox methods,he had crushed countless egos with the skill and dexterity of a lizard dispatching mosquitos in the hot season.
standing in line to see the guru,the old lady was informed that she could only speak one sentence to the master.
she was totally undeterred.
“that will be enough.” she said with a steely determination that impressed the other disciples greatly.
finally she was brought in front of the gereat man.
she looked him straight in the eyes and said
“hymie,you silly boy,stop this nonsense and come home with your mother immediately”
Frank, I also think the guy looks like a twat. Maybe we are wearing the same specs. I met a few Advaita guys giving twatsang. Last one I went to the guru says, ‘Any questions?’ I said, ‘What on earth are you talking about?’ He said, ‘You’re trying to hijack this satsang?’ I scratched my right ear, to check I wasn’t having audio hallucinations. At least it made a change from ‘who is asking the question?’
Lokesh, do you recall how you first heard of Poonja? I’m curious about this because I’ve been led to believe over the years that Cohen was the main source of Poonja’s publicity, i.e. without Cohen it’s questionable whether any sannyasins would ever have heard of him. I’m not sure how true this is. Back in the late ’90′s I became friends with a Californian psychologist who had been a student of Poonja and was given the name ‘Hanuman’. Poonja sanctioned Hanuman to give satsangs, which he did for a few years, mostly in the Pacific north-west. I questioned Hanuman once about Cohen and he replied that his treatment of Poonja had been deplorable. I was admittedly fascinated by Cohen’s earlier book, ‘Autobiography of an Awakening’, which was luridly honest (if brutal) in places. I gathered from a recent blog of Cohen’s that he has reached some sort of forgiveness of Poonja and again recognizes him as an important guru. (Cohen had accused Poonja of lies and malicious attempts to manipulate people against him). I always thought that the Cohen-Poonja falling out was reminiscent of Ouspensky’s falling out with Gurdjieff. I don’t think Osho had any equivalent of this (perhaps Paul Lowe or Michael Barnett/Somendra, but these latter never really ‘turned against’ Osho; they merely left and set themselves up as teachers).
In ’91 my wife went off to India for a few months. One of my closest Scottish friends was becoming Poonja’s star disciple, much to my friend’s astonishment. I was busy doing my winter trip on Ibiza.
Prita comes back and tells me about the scene in Lucknow…encapsulated in ‘you gotta meet this guy!’ Poonja had told his followers that Prita was a Buddha. Much to her astonishment. I groaned, thinking, ‘awww no, India, gurus, not again!’
I phoned up my mate and asked, ‘What’s the secret with this Papaji geezer?’
He replied, ‘You gotta have a brass neck.’
Few months later I was sitting at Papaji’s feet….brass necking it. I remember thinking that I had been placed there. The old boy took his kid gloves off when addressing me and I really dug him. Great guy. I learned some great lessons.
Like Osho, I haven’t a clue if Papaji was enlightened in the Buddha sense. I find the whole enlightenment trip like a golden carrot… who is the donkey chasing it? Heee haw!
A circle in my life, that I had not known was still open, drew to a close when I left Lucknow.
I had friends in Lucknow who were close to Papaji and most of them were not from the sannyas school, Quite a number of sannyasins who met Papaji became gurus in their own right. We all have our problems.
Well ,according to exes, Cohen is an abusive bully. Give him a wad of cash and he’ll have you stand in a lake for ages freezing your arse off. There’s one born every minute and exes are maybe not the most positive referees you’d think of asking first, but having read a bit of his guff and considering some of the chancers Cohen runs with, after studied reflection I conclude that Frank is close to the truth in asserting, as he does above, that Cohen is a “twat”.
And have you seen his mate Ken Wilber?
He`s a waste of space, too.
They`ve got a kind of double act: “the pandit and the guru”
If that`s enlightenment, you can shove it..
I`ve seen better on the end of Blackpool pier.
Mu aunty Manie has a booth by Pricebusters by the Tower. Palms and Cards. Makes a fortune and I’d back her against Cohen &.Co any day. That said if I had his money and Cohen had a feather up his arse then both of us would be tickled.
Jacko was getting audience and fans, Osho was attracting disciples and devotees.
If I give example from the world´s best theme, Sex: fans are like cum falling on the hand or on the tissue after an act of self-induced joy. It is here now, gone in few minutes, leaving behind empty cans of coke, broken beer bottles and crushed cigratte buds. All in the name of entertainment.
Students are like careful lovers, always with rubber. Disciple goes all the way in the merger of the two.
If life grows inside, it becomes an act of devotion; almost like man becoming a father, disciple becoming devotee.
As every act of love can not attract life, every disciple also can not become devotee. At least he has more skin-to-skin fun than the student with rubber!
,
Shantam, one could imagine from your writing that masturbation is a big part of your life. Time to go out into the real world and try the real thing…even if you have to pay for it.
Frank-you are hilarious! such a good observation…
When it comes to funny, Frank is king of SN.
Well, thanks, Lokesh…
but I think Shantam is after my crown…
I can only dream about coming up with lines like:
“Disciples are like cum that falls on the hand after an act of self-induced joy”.
As Eric Morecambe used to say,
“there`s no answer to that”.
Yes, Frank, I know what you mean. One night I was hanging out with my son and reading out some of Shant’s comments. The pair of us were in stiches. I sometimes wonder if his buffoonery is conscious, but kind of doubt it, It does not really matter because it’s the laughs that count.
In fact, Frank, I have a proposition for you. Why don’t you go and head up the Pune Resort? You will certainly make us all laugh, then a bit of gibberish followed by silence – job done!
I love people with humour – we need more of them everywhere, especially in the ashrams….
Look at Osho? He just had a laugh and we are making a mess out of it.
Chetna, you say, Osho just had a laugh and we are making a mess out of it.
That is quite a general statement that falls a long way short of being entirely true. What do you mean exactly by saying Osho was just having a laugh? Who exactly are the ‘we’ and what is it that the we are making a mess out of? You don’t think Osho was responsible for a few messes in his life? You don’t think that sannyasins have a laugh about the ridiculous sides of Sannyas?
Chetna,
I think that Osho himself could have benefitted from having a court jester…someone who didnt grovel and tell him what they thought he wanted to hear all the time….difficult job because he was overpowering in many ways…
Instead, he swallowed the input of idiots like Sheela…who, as far as i can make out, must have had her sense of humour surgically removed…and all the rest of the grovellers looking for brownie points.
I`ve said it before, but he could have done with a no-nonsense northern girlfriend too…
“What time d`ye call this then, and where the bloody `ell have you been?
The dentist? Again? That’s the 6th time this week, no one`s got that many teeth in their `ead, I`d say he must be the first dentist to be corgi registered…
I dont trust that doctor of yours either, are you sure he’s got your pills right? I saw hin staggerin’ about legless with an empty bottle of gin and a fag hanging out his mouth t`other day, doesnt seem very healthy to me…
Oh, and that secretary of yours called round today, something about rewiring the place…she`s bent as a nine-bob note, that one, I can’t think why you don’t fire her…
And those disciples of yours, they`re mostly daft as a brush…
You need to get out more, I don’t know…sitting round the `ouse all day watching telly, and what’s that you’re watching now? Patton?
Again?…while there’s trouble at t`commune?
Give me strength, I don’t know why I bother, I really don’t…
That’s it….Until you get out there and sort out your bloody commune, it’s no dinner, Chucky, and that`s final….”
Frank.
Shut up about Sannyas and Osho,
and tell us some more tales of you and your northern girlfriend.
I see a sitcom coming up.
And when I say coming up, I don’t mean in the Shantam sense.
Arpana,
the northern girlfriend would be someone like Janice Garvey from the sitcom “Benidorm”
Just came across Osho’s forgotten and not anymore used quotation, not from 1970 days but during the time His boat was ready for the other shore -
OSHO: I love my people, I love their laughter.
This is my world.
When was the last time such words were published from Osho Pune? They behave as if Osho is dead, therefore the term “my people” is no more valid.
No, Sir, Osho`s work will be taken care of by His People, for His People with the same spirit as if Osho is sitting in His bedroom but His energy is all around. We must not forget Osho asked to change the marble in His bedroom and exchange the noisy air conditioner.
Mr. Jayesh, please respect the feelings of Osho and His people. Restore the original software or leave the place with dignity.
You will be always welcome as seeker.
PS: Once the magical emotions of His people are again on the scene, I am sure it will push all kind of sannyasins a bit further. Right now, most of us have gone settled in a lukewarm comfort zone, SNews writers and readers included.
The religious people always go on showing humbleness: “I am nothing, I am nobody.” And if you look into their eyes, their eyes are saying just the opposite. If you watch their behaviour, it is always a projection of holier-than-thou. They go on saying, “We are nothing,” and they go on in a subtle way, in a diplomatic way, proclaiming, “We are saints.”
Osho.
Ah, This!
Chapter #3
Chapter title: I am Higher
Whenever you think something about somebody else — watch. Don’t be in a hurry. First look within. The cause may be inside you. But you don’t know yourself so you go on confusing your own projections with outer realities. It is impossible to know anything real unless you have known yourself. And the only way to know oneself is to live a life of vulnerability. openness. Don’t live in a closed cell. Don’t hide yourself behind your mind. Come out.
Osho.
Ancient Music in the Pines
Chapter #5
Chapter title: The Ultimate Secrets of Swordsmanship
‘Don’t live in a closed cell.’ Coming from Osho that is a bit rich. Then again, maybe he meant its okay to live in an airconditioned cell with marble walls and 24/7 cell service provided by attractive women in red.
Shreek Shantam says, ‘Right now, most of us have gone settled in a lukewarm comfort zone, SNews writers and readers included’.
I reckon that there might be no such thing as an objective reality and therefore we star in, direct, produce, film and project our very own movie, which therefore means that Shantam has settled in a lukewarm comfort zone….or maybe he has simply zoned out entirely.
Shantam ji you write,
“Lukewarm comfort zone”,
Like that was somehow a bad place to be. It isn’t, it’s just another place ‘to be’.
Super place to set off from it is too.
Starving folk want bread, not sannyas.
Ananto said.
‘Starving folk want bread, not sannyas.’
Splendidly succinct.
Ta.
OK then where to next?
Ya got the old timers who want a shrine to worship in.
Newbies who can’ be arsed about what Priti said about Sheela’s taste in shoes in their hearing.
Returners who enjoyed the ride back in the day but then needed to earn a living and see it as a retirement hobby post-corporate job. Then there’s Ms Self Help book buyer and YouTube Osho clip viewer who has read a St Martin’s Press Osho Greatest Hits themed compilation or two and wants to find out more but doesn’t know how as there is only the resort website published in the book and for most that’d be too much, too soon and too expensive.
Maybe it’s time we had denominations:
the resort as Vatican and the old timers as Catholics.
Returners could have a sort of loosey goosey episcopalian set-up where most things go.
Ms Self Help books sorts could then decide which denomination to join. The Catholic old order or Protestant other.
Each side could produce literature to attract converts….
Oooops
Is my face red?
Just realised that’s what’s happening already.
Sorrreeeee.
On the surface it looks western people are very free from their religious luggage. On a one-to-one basis they are; free, innocent, flexible – almost like leaves of a big tree.
But the tree itself i.e. their society, their collective mind is made of tough wood. It is very much rooted into the Christian superiority complex.
In case of Tom Cruise-Katie Holmes divorce, all the western media has joined hands to favour her; in rhis way, they can throw all the mud on Tom´s beliefs and the strengh he draws from Scientology.
In case of Osho too, western media created so much hoo haa hoo as if devil has taken birth in the shape of Osho.
Thanks a lot Teertha, for sharing some biographical info.
With this small act you have given a human face to your thoughts. Now you are not a name hiding behind the veil of anonymity but a being who stands for his thoughts and actions.
Shantam, in my parts, talking to someone like you have just done to Teertha, would get you a name of being a patronizing fool. A delusional one at that. Is this how you see yourself?…..’a being who stands for his thoughts and actions.’ You have to be joking.
Air of martyrdom.
Puerile and specious moral high ground game.
Laughably obvious attempt at manipulation.
Does that come from mummeee or dadddeee.
Shantam says, ‘Western media created so much hoo haa hoo as if devil has taken birth in the shape of Osho.’
It might have had something to do with India’s sex guru flying into America, trying to build a city on a farm, collecting Rolls Royces for a hobby, telling the press that the Pope is an idiot and the American president is an imbecile, some of his disciples poisoning the local population, including children, in order to manipulate local elections, etc, etc. But then again, you never know.
Well, it was a slack news year.
Surprising to see that hoary old mish-mash of misinformation and half-truth on a site like this though.
The press had a field day conflating some of what Osho SAID with what some idiots surrounding him DID.
I live in the UK. Britain royally screwed India back in the Raj.
T’aint my fault though, guv’nor, honest.
Do some of you collect gurus?
Is it a hobby?
Mockery of Meditation. Fascism in the name of festivity.
http://www.osho.de/2012/06/osho-festival-in-riccione-en/
If elephants start taking notice of washermen’s donkies, there won’t be any procession.
Forget Rajneeshpuram, Lokesh, even at the time you came to Bhagwan as a high school passed youth, He was already the target of bad press; any patron of any religion can not expect newcomer in the market to make his space adjacent to the established names.
Religious market is more brutal than the competition among the smart phone brands.
l
“washerwomen’s donkies”, Shantam? You wouldn’t be referring to the female anatomy again, would you? I believe you would….
I will not forget Rajneeshpuram, because there is much to be learned from it. Number one….don’t join the sheep.
…unless you wanna go sheep-shagging….
“Air of martyrdom.
Puerile and specious moral high ground game.
Laughably obvious attempt at manipulation.
Does that come from mummeee or dadddeee?”
Arpana, are you describing your late Indian guru? Show some courage, drop the name given by the orphanage, Mr.Arthur!
To be true I will really be ashamed to carry a name given by a man of that culture I know not even ABC about.
Not big fan then Shantam?
For those who are bitching about Andrew Cohen…
You had all the chances to support a super store called Osho, no…you did not because organised retail is bad for Indian small traders and organised religions are bad for western big egos…
Now, when someone like Cohen opens a small kiosk with big flashing signboard, it also nerves you.
You had your own Living masters who are now ashes lying somewhere…millions of other young people have also the right to chose their living master, howsoever “doff” they may look.
I was surprised to find this video of Andrew in dialogue with Shantam, Arpana, and Frank:
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
For some reason I pictured Frank with a full head of hare.
yeah,i remember those guys.
two of them tried to sell me a broken down used car,and the guy on the left tried to sell me his wig….
luckily,i managed to get out with my wallet and my ass intact…
but seriously…..
4 gurus sitting around complaining about how hard it is to be a guru these days…
i get a flash of a new age reworking of monty python`s “four yorkshiremen”…
Inevitable quips aside, actually found the discussion not uninteresting. In particular, a few remarks at the end related to an experience I had about twenty years ago, just after I’d got myself a new studio, in an open plan, top floor of an old warehouse.
The space was divided up 15 times, with chalk marks, and I was actually quite happy that there were no physical barriers between me and other people, but one by one the other occupants of the studio went out and purchased boards, which they put up to mark out their territory, and I just kept not getting round to doing this, until eventually, without spending any money or effort to put barriers up between me and the other people, I was as boxed in as everybody else.
Was a revelatory moment for me. Was interesting to discover I didn’t need to set barriers up in the way I once would have, because everybody else’s barriers shut me out as effectively as if I put them up myself, that those boards were physical manifestations of the walls people build around themselves, that I didn’t need those barriers, because at that time I was physically healthy enough to deal with what happened with people in an ongoing manner, (Now I’m older I just have to keep my distance, keep people at a distance.) and that experience seems to me to stretch out to the rest of life.
Arpana,
So humanimals are territorial.
No surprise there.
These gurus are like dogs trying teach other dogs not to bark!
And their disciples try to be barkless dogs whilst the gurus bark at them for getting it wrong!
What a silly, silly game.
And , could those 4 guys live together in peace and harmony in close community with each other?
They would drive each other nuts, each having to listen to that pompous, self-important drivel about how much they are sacrificing themselves.
(`I’m sure they all keep a good distance from their disciples, have loads of privacy and special treatment,too).
Yet they sit there and bemoan the inability of their disciples and their lack of consciousness and ability to live in peace…
Oldest profession in the book, anyone?
Frankus,
Old bean.
The only problem with this is you sound like you are saying you are past all that, which is pretty much what you are criticizing them for saying when you say they are not.
PS.
Are you giving me a hard time for wot I writ, or just chipping in?
Arpana,
Just chipping in.
As the only sane, unmisguided, incere person in the world.
I have a moral obligation.
I don’t have any sympathy for the disciples, either.
Anyone who thinks that they`re going to get something for nothing from those guys probably deserves to be humiliated, abused or whatever, before they finally “get it”.
It’s S and M stuff really.
It’s not my scene, but if you want your ass, soul,..whatever, beaten in a dungeon, I will support your democratic right to it…
good luck….
Do you genuinely believe that you are the only person in the world who’s not misguided, who’s not insincere?
…as the zen cow said to the zen bull…..
“mu”!
Frank.
Fair play. Your last word invariably makes me laugh. ( This remark isn’t intended as the last word. It’s a respectful comment on your last, last word, but if you really want to have the last word, and have something as witty to say as your last last word, take it as read I will be amused, but I won’t comment, so it’s all yours. )
Arpana,
Yes, I Iiked your story, but at the time I was busy with the narrative of “the four gurus”.
The game you can get sucked into with “enlightenment” is
the idea that in order to make any comment about so-called gurus, you have to be “enlightened” or perfect yourself.
In this way any criticism is effectively nullified by the self-appointed enlightened guy.
That’s why I say it’s an old trick.
It’s a new-age version of apostasy…
It also makes people desperate to be recognized as “enlightened” as otherwise they dont have any credibilty amongst “seekers”.
That’s why you get so many crap gurus declaring themselves all over the place…
It’s not rocket surgery.
And scientists now say that it’s possible to grasp it with less than 50% of the brain functioning.
And you are right -
He who laughs, lasts….
A good story which I might steal and tell as if its one of my own ( a sympton many sannyasins exhibit when it comes to Osho quotes). I suppose that is just one of the dangers of posting good comments on SN. Dangerous for whom, one might well ask. Are the moderators going to use comments from SN to form a book tenatively titled, ‘In through the back door’, publish it and retire to Ibiza with the massive profits? The plot thickens.
To return to the Mistle Bhurger video and his feeble attempt to manipulate me and Frank and some other bod into having an identity crisis, but that Frank look-alike was making some interesting points about keeping a community of a mere 150 together, the problems that ensue.
He sounded quite genuine to me. He sounded to me as if he was talking from personal experience.
Teertha aka P.T. Mistberger,
Since I have seen your website, this question was waiting to come out.
So, how you treat yourself when you see mirror in the morning; one of the new breed of Enlightend beings in the world, like Andrew Cohen, Samarpna, Maitarya Ishwara and other few dozens, wandering satsang givers?
Or you think yourself as The one better than all the rest, who has new product in his sleeves looking for funding sources?
As one can see, the undercurrent of all the guru wisdom is, ” I have found my inner source. now I need your financial sources to spread it further .Be my disciple. Funding is exempted by the tax. Don’t bother about black or white, in the work of divine, all colours are accepted”.
PS: Teertha,
Maybe you are having new product up your sleeve, adding USP to undercurrent of guru wisdom by putting some pictures of naked breasts from the Ibiza on your website , so a question is waiting to come out like cum on the sleeves of this disciple in a profusion of self-induced joy…
As a therapist-cum-satsang teacher, can you prove you are better than Indian corner shop kiosk or westerners with big egos and other organs, who are stealing washerwoman’s donkies from Osho superstore and selling on top shelf at a profit on top shelf of corner shop in brutal religious market?
Shantam, everyone on here already knows you are an idiot. Why bother trying to reinforce that image with such absolutely daft material? Your dunce’s cap is in the post.
Shantam, it is everyone’s inevitable destiny to become a ‘guru’ of sorts — that is, we all have a contribution to make to the evolution of the human race, in whatever fashion. It’s just a question of gathering courage to make that contribution — to stop playing small.
Guru-trashing is one of the more recent trends of the Web-era. Everyone and his brother wants to have a go at the evil ‘lesser gurus’ and their arrogant pretentions. I find, however, that so often these ‘armchair guru-critics’ are afraid of their own shadow — brave on the Internet, but probably no place else. A good example is Sarlo, and his ‘guru-ratings’ website — funny stuff, but ultimately rather nerdy and petulant.
As for myself, I have not given satsangs since 2004. I did it for two years, after being ‘asked to’ do so by a satsang-giver who themselves had been sanctioned by Poonja. At that point I had already been leading groups since 1992, so had experience with sitting in front of a group of people. But after two years of eye-gazing and processing-lite, I got tired of it all. My body kicked up a fuss; I had a kidney stone that needed to be operated on. After the operation I felt like Dostoyevsky’s character in ‘Notes from the Underground’. I realized I was done with satsang (and my 35 followers). So I returned to forms of inner-work I’d earlier been engaged with.
As for ‘enlightened’, that I am not (nor ever claimed to be). Nowadays, I work relatively quietly as a therapist and a writer (and am in the midst of finishing two more books). However, my conception of enlightenment has changed over the years, and I now see it as something of a ‘Grail’ or ‘Rose-Cross’ symbol, i.e., more a device to keep us growing, rather than a discrete condition that is somehow to be attained in some absolute fashion.
I think this was a great conundrum that Osho faced, i.e., how to speak of something like enlightenment in such a fashion to keep his people inspired. But I think he knew himself that enlightenment is no black and white affair, and certainly not some 24/7 state of blissful repose.
Re Sarlo, he even has me on his page of Osho’s ‘self-declared enlightened heirs’ (the second group below the first) — this despite the fact that I repeatedly denied anything like ‘enlightenment’, much less being an ‘heir’ of Osho:
http://www3.telus.net/public/sarlo/Yosholineage.htm
One wonders how these things get started. It sheds light on how historical myths become lodged in people’s minds.
I’ve never looked at that site, and the only time I ever hear about it, is when someone is complaining about the entry Sarlo has put up about him or her.
Gurus are first and foremost performers.
Once you venture onstage in whatever medium, they are at the mercy, to some extent, of their audience and the public at large.
Hecklers are par for the course.
Even a totally positive response can have harmful effects…
Maybe Osho was like Ziggy Stardust
“He could lick `em by smiling, he could leave `em to hang…came on so loaded, man, but when the kids had killed the man, they had to break up the band….”
And coming onstage declaring you`re enlightened is like claiming legendary status before you`ve even cut your first album…
Risky strategy…..
Audiences like to make up their own mind, even when the guru tells ‘em not to have one….
The satsang explosion was a bit like the punk rock phenomenon.
People showed up at Sex Pistols gigs and thought:
“Those guys are onstage, they can’t even play their instruments, they`ve just got a nerve, some bottle, the X factor, whatever, and now they`ve got a crowd.
I could do that.”
and they did.
Guruing can be bloody hard work.
You’re only ever as good as your last gig and the competition is ferocious.
Merchandising is the way forward: a trusted accomplice out in the foyer knocking out literature, DVD’s and malas. Good margins on wrist malas, cost pennies wholesale from China and sell for six quid or ten dollars a pop. A well-stocked merchandise stall can treble the door take on ticket sales.
Down at this end of the game [stage mediumship and fortune telling], you don’t come across willing millionaires waving big wads of cash in your direction, more’s the pity, but little and often pays the bills.
Not easy work though, albeit reasonably rewarding.
Good luck to Cohen and his ilk. The old scallywag says somewhere that ‘logic needs to be balanced by illogic’ and as far as these post-Osho wannabe gurus are concerned around the Cohen and Hayes publications camp, then none of ‘em have fallen off yet so their customers, in the main, must be getting what they want from ‘em.
Shantam is surely an idiot but not stupid, the stupids who cut queen’s photo from newspapers and think it is a hundred pound note.
Should I count how many are here and there!
Lokesh, you are one of those who support a politician as long as he is up to village/town level, once the politican grows in size, you change the party. Is there a need to patronise Teertha? Is he your alter ego?
No comment for Frank!
No one knows how comical and cynical we become in our old age, when shit past looks more here and now, than the promised golden future.
During last four years, most of the quotations worth quotating are written by this Shantam. If I am one tenth as ambitious as Lokesh seems to be, the words would have already been edited and published in book form.
I don’t think moderators of this site have also such intention to collect the uncut stones from others and sell them as precious gems.
Anyway, all the material together can be good for sannyas archives to understand the mind of the seekers who were close to the Living Osho, as far as money potential is concerned, it is not 50 shades of grey!
“During the last four years,most of the quotations worth quotating are written by this Shantam”.
Indeed. who can deny it?
Can i suggest erecting a golden statue of our great bard…
standing in classic posture…naked except for a pair of chuddies, holding tissues in his left hand, leafing through a guide to topless beaches in Ibiza, in his right hand an organ as humble and unassuming as the man himself, as he emits his seminal wisdom in a massive act of self-induced joy onto the pages of sannyasnews….?
Frank, I hope I am wrong in my interpretation of your words of praise for the great bard of SN, Shantam. The thing is, I do detect a subtle hint that you believe the chap is a bit of a…. Golly! I don’t want to say it in case I am mistaken.
Lokesh,
My Sanskrit rhyming slang is a bit rusty too, but i believe the expression you are looking for is…shiva shanker.
Or, as they sat down the east end of Varanasi…
What a burning ghat!
The past and the future are prosthetic devices for manoeuvering in the present.
Well, Shantam, I see it like this. Our brains interpret the input from our sensory organs by making a model of the world. When such a model is successful at explaining events, we tend to attribute to it, and to the elements and concepts that constitute it, the quality of reality or absolute truth. But there may be different ways in which one could model the same physical situation, with each employing different fundamental elements and concepts. If two such physical theories or models accurately predict the same events, one cannot be said to be more real than the other; rather, we are free to use whichever model is most convenient.
PS. Guess who.
Teertha and Lokesh, your posts seems to radiate good energy, but before I read it fully I must leave my computer. Told to my Swiss one, “Just going in my room for a minute to fetch my reading glasses, rather than saying fullfilling my addiction”.
I think the way world is in two human beings, one cannot be always honest to other people.
I fully understand men and women who have someone else also in their life! ( Even it is just a facebook).
The sannyasin scene on Facebook is like a room full of very old people, talking about the good old days whilst waiting to die. Anyone want a game of Scrabble. Where did it all go wrong?
Ahh, but when some old sannyasins do get together, Lokesh-ji, we can partay like it’s 1984.
Osho Leela next month, anybody?
Ananto, I’m off to an all-nighter at midnight. So, I will by partying like it is 2012 on Ibiza.
I told you already.
Where YS?
Ageism. New guns in town wanna take out the old gunslingers and establish their place at the top table in the saloon. The old hands can’t be arsed one way or t’other. ‘Twas ever thus here in the not so wild west.
In India, outside of Mumbai and Delhi, you’ll look long and hard to find an old folks home but over here us old ‘uns aren’t just as wanted somehow.
Elsewhere, I’ve trailed the idea of self-governing communes for us oldies. Anyone needing extra care we could all chip in and hire some buddhist dalits [very clean, stoical folk] or hungry young sannyasins on minimum wage to do the necessary cooking and cleaning up with a bit of gardening on fine days to stave off boredom. Pool our ample resources for facilities and live like Rajahs on the surplus from selling our big old houses. Plus side being you get to have fun amongst like-minded chums and your kids don’t get their sticky paws on any inheritance cos you’ll have spent it.
Down side…
well, I can’t see one.
Pune resort is missing a trick not focusing on the ever growing, prosperous -by Indian standards – retiree market.
Just received the following news.
I thought you might like to know……thru Shiva Dhyan:
For those who knew Maitreya Ishwara (previously known as Swami Anand Bhaskar), I just heard from his son Chaitanya that Maitreya dropped the body in Christchurch hospital NZ around 2 hours ago. I heard unexpectedly from Chaitanya yesterday that Maitreya had just had major heart surgery and there were other health problems, although the doctors didn’t know what caused it. Apparently, he had been unwell for 2-3 months and admitted himself to hospital on Monday. After surgery, his blood pressure wasn’t reponding to the drugs and he passed away. Although I hadn’t seen Maitreya for over four years I’ll always be grateful for his help on the path. Maitreya became an Osho sannyasin in 1975 and did a lot of meditating with both Baba and Samdarshi during the 1990′s. God Bless.