Democracy and Autocracy; is there any difference for a Sannyasin?
Shantam states:
As one looks at the period of Sannyas during Osho´s life time, the large majority of people who took sannyas were from the developed countries of the world, especially at that time when the drift between developed and under developed countries was oceans apart. In defining developed countries I mean; not just their strong currencies, but because of the highest level of their democratic institutions, and societies where human liberties were cherished as part of the new ten commandments. I think most of the people who took sannyas then took these liberties and democratic system as granted, the way teenagers now think about Ipods and pads, as if these things were always with us.
The hypothetical question which I would consider is:
Let us imagine, Europe and America reverts back to autocracy, there are no elections, and kings and queens and dictators chose their ministers from their courtesans. But at the same time – personal freedom like choosing the vocation, sexual inclination and religious choice is not curtained – they remain the same as it is now. It means a France where Sarkosy does not relinquish his position this week, yet everything else remains the same.
My koan is whether meditative and aware citizens, let us say for the sake of argument Sannyasins and Advatists of those countries, will take part in protest demonstrations and marches or will simply shrug their shoulders with a smile, “ Why to waste energy in irrelevant and mundane issues; what does it matter whether it is autocracy or democracy; my work is to remain happy, healthy and prosperous and yes…go on meditating”… …
shantam,
the answer to your koan is:
“silly as a box of bollocks
and guaranteed to ensure early brain-stem death”
You make me crazy, everything again from scratch? All optical deception, nothing has moved or changed since 3000 years, it’s simply a question of profit and maintaining power. To see what actually happens to the people he would have to be ready to leave and the standards are about to move the boundaries given to us. Most modern people, including meditators, are packed with half-knowledge. Each of us thinks only to be understood correlations. I notice that some sort of protection has been built up in the psyche. As a rule a sort of Arrogant / ignorance.
Behind this democracy, the same hidden hand, they have more pull. It decides where relax and where it’s allowed confident ignorance. It decides where must be tightened to achieve the long-term desired destination. What is autocracy, more than absolute monarchy? There is no difference between the democracy and autocracy, is hidden behind the increasingly hermetic same microstructure. But you can indeed be happy to turn in circles; my English is bad and makes it impossible to make me express clearly.
Saw an old film again recently, “The Magnificent Seven”, it was so clear. A perfect lodge consists of a core of seven people. “The Magnificent Seven” symbolize Skull and Bones. The German performer H. Buchholz embodies the young George Bush. This, we must know that Skull and Bones is the American Arms Lodge. Very interesting from that perspective seeing the old movie, couldn’t believe what I saw, strange and clear.
The hopes of the people are known to all. If a microstructure standing at both sides holding the reins in their hands. But behind the same interests hidden, what will be the change for Humanity? Apart from apparent alteration through provoked violence, that we find all over the world. At the same time, with good words and a lot of money, the microstructure is tightening their interests. I’m almost unable with my limited English expressing it well.
We can continue to turn in circles; especially there is a circle which has been given. Or do we push aside the curtain and see the monster in the historiography, because it is a monster and only we Humans have the capability to defeat it.
Have been always asked to remember the morning in my taxi listening to a Discourse. Osho was asked, what is the truth? Osho replied: ‘The truth is cruel. Cruel based on the microstructure that stands between freedom and slavery.’ Yes, exactly, that is it, people like Osho are making us despair. They start using strange means but are simply trying to tear aside the curtain. What is meditation if freedom and peace can not prevail?
“If rationality prevents looking over the Edge, it becomes foolishness!”
Shantam, I can’t help, upon reading your latest effort, that you are someone who somehow manages to confine himself to living in a small world. The first thing is that there are millions of people on the planet who are meditating, who have nothing to do with sannyas or advaita.
Secondly, the idea that meditating is some kind of selfish pastime is pure nonsense, something which, intentional or not, your closing statement implies. There is nothing wrong with taking it to the street if you feel strongly about it. But the point you seem to be missing is this: Down through the ages enlightened people have always said that the greatest tool that we have at our disposal to bring about change in the world is our capacity to close our eyes and go within. Meditators benefit society immensely. This is by now quite an established fact.
Thirdly, a koan is a teaching tool used to break down the barriers to enlightenment. There is nothing in the way of a koan in your question. Just another manifestation of the fact that your vision of life is myopic. Meditating on a Zen koan is meant to assist the meditator in transcending daily thought patterns to arrive at a more enlightened state. Nothing you have written here does that.
“Down through the ages enlightened people have always said that the greatest tool that we have at our disposal to bring about change in the world is our capacity to close our eyes and go within.”
Indeed. But after you come to some realization or understanding, you also have the responsability to live it in your daily life. By meditation one can come to realize that everything is connected so the pain and ignorance of another being is mine too. And this has nothing to do with moralistic norms from any kind of church. So then responsible action in the outside world is also needed after you have gone within.
And this second step, in my opinion, is where Osho and his movement have failed to the max. Just go insideand find your innermost core and then everything will fix and the world will become a paradise. Who cares about the poor, ignorant people outside? All the Rajneesh saga, from Poona to Oregon and back, has proved this way to be a total mistake.
For the rest there is still a lot of good and useful teachings and insights from him, still very useful and needed from all the people of today.
Just take him out from the golden cage and let his flow run free on the streets of the world, he will find his way to the right people.
Yes, a point where maybe the commune and all of us have failed. Unable to realise Osho’s heritage, “I leave you my dream”. The dream can only be the creation of a parallel society, an alternative.
I’ve always been a great fan of koan.
I particularly loved the version sung at the 2008 x factor competition, although if you look on you tube the grand Zen buddhist monk who came out of six years daily zen practice and shaven head to bring us Ten new songs and Hallelujah really remains par excellence in his 70′s….
if you wonder if koan can do it for you and those who have ears to hear.. here is proof….. enjoy….
open the windows and play it loud …
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and play this one to your lover….
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the world touched by the master….
come on marty,
surely the jeff buckley version is the best…
no way….times 5000billion trillion gazillions plus whatever you say plus one….
You old people know your music.
Fantastic version.
Jeff Buckley…the starsailor. Sweet Surrender…you can’t get away from the devotees!
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i love all those old wasters…
iggy pop is a hard-meditating buddhist these days..
and lou reed`s got his own personal taoist master and chi-gung instructor….
get blasted off your face for the half your life until it gets boring and the drugs dont work any more,
then get into some heavy meditation for the next half…
those guys aint dumb!
from medication to meditation….
thats the way you do it…
way to go….
…..apparently being in a state of no mind , which most Nebraskans are quite blissfully unaware of to their credit, also includes surrendering taste and the subtleties of discrimination which , as in Louisiana ,involves viewing grainy footage of 1960′s black and white film.
What has all this to do with poor taste, a song’s cover version and lend us a coin ?
Well i dunno… but it looks paradoxical ….and that’s good enough for me as a key to principled thought , connected action, sublime experience and a jam sandwich….
oh one more thing… many insightful seekers thank Shantam for koan and say with heavy japanese koant-ed accent……Ahhhhh So… (careful with pronunciation)
If one is intelligent and has eyes”, it is no use to fight for the rotten infrastructure in one´s own village. Why to chose such a small cause, when one can fight for global warming!
Average person only have sex,..Intelligent person with eyes, do Tantra and find the godly treasures too…
Take Sannyas…get eyes!
(when Soso Resort has enough money to give Tv Ads.)
Shantam, in response to your question re what ‘spiritually aware’ people would (or was it ‘should’?!) do in such circumstances – well, it all depends, doesn’t it? Depends on what someone’s moved to do, or not do…What’s right for you may not be right for me…Simple, really, isn’t it?
also i am having the rotten infrastructure in the skull.
average person only can have sex. those with eyes,like me and everyone who reads a bit of porn, can use eyes to see about tantra centrefolds and retro action (88-90) on freeview tv ads!
The goose is out! Shreek Shantam is Leornard Koan…hallelujah!
remember this one from zenard koan`s greatest hits…?
“shantamme takes you down
to his place by the river
you can hear his thoughts go by
you can waste your time around him
and you know he’s half crazy
that’s why you don’t wanna be there….”
Yeah, Frank Ifield covered that one.
No secret here. Leonard’s “Koan” owed a great deal to his seven year zen incarceration, his being betrayed by his manager whilst in his cave, and those encounters with Ramesh when he emerged in 1999.
That’s why those of a spiritual inclination like Martyn pick up subliminally on that, and prefer the 2009 Len version to the Buckley version.
In Old Ideas and those 2008/9 concerts, (by the way he is supposed to be giving a live show in Sept in the UK,) he transcended the pop medium. Commentators here in London seemed unable to explain how a seventy five year old man could “conjure” something so powerful, but those experiences are the key.
whoops.i betrayed my lack of “spiritual inclination” for saying i prefered buckley`s version….
sorry about that….
i promise to do 7 years devotion,7 years enquiry and a few “hail mary`s” to get myself back on the path!