SN thought this might interest our bloggers. Just ordinairy life in Poona one, just hanging out, just doing some work, just being around in the commune, and outside of it. Difficult to find in present time, but one guesses it’s there somewhere.
The dating of this footage is probably a bit out. It looks like earlier than 1980 to us.
Great piece of footage.
How amazing to have made a contribution to that place, that wonderful gathering.
Really moved me.
Like a film of a dream for me.
Thanks for posting.
Quite a lot of clips of people working, in ‘working meditation’, presumably after passing through various groups etc. Happened to come across this, I think highly relevant quote from Freud yesterday in an article in my local paper, the ‘Camden New Journal’:
“No other technique for the conduct of life attaches the individual so firmly to reality as laying emphasis on work. For work at least gives one a secure place in a portion of reality in the human community.”
Lot of ‘meaning of life’ in work, although there is work as wage slavery, and work as the opposite end of the spectrum.
(Occurs to me, ‘meaningful work’ is akin to having rapport with someone. Just a thought).
Energy field…
Love is in the air…
Dear SN Folks –
You write: “Difficult to find in present time, but one guesses it’s there somewhere.”
I say: No need of a guess, knowing , that ´it´s there somewhere´is enough.
The seeds belong to the wild plants, its not a clone-copy affair, has never been btw.
And ?
It has been always at any time been difficult, to discover the extraordinary in the ordinary. Also in the times of very much …so called …great measures and numbers ….
Needs more than just organic eyes to SEE, not to speak of other senses.
With love and gratefulness for what you posted ( as a thread topic)
Madhu
Wow, I recognised my friend Nini @ 16.30 mins! And also Auro Soma ma.
Another planet this, for sure!
P.S:
Though it’s quite choiceless to be here now on this planet!
Wiser than wise can ask, “Why such footings touch us?”
Was it needed, good, beauty, innocence dies untimely?
Far from the first time, I hear the drone of heavy snoring…
“Wiser than wise” can possibly realise that expecting any situation to last ‘forever’, especially perhaps, an ‘ideal’ one, is asking for trouble.
Otherwise they’re no longer “wiser than wise” but “most foolish of foolish”.
Then, realising the magnitude of such an error, “the most foolish of foolish” might begin to perceive that they have been led astray – probably from the very beginning – by nothing other than the figments of their fevered imaginations.
And that constantly yearning for the outer forms of that now dead past, however psycho-spiritually ‘glorious’ it was, is just another version of the very ordinary universal human foolishness of longing for ‘the good old days’, ie out of synch with reality where all forms pass away.
Then, perhaps, there’s a choice:
Reject reality and continue this seductively bitter-sweet but resentful victim’s dream – or see the point, that you’re the author of your own suffering, no matter how apparently plausible your reasons, give it up and wake up to Now.
Difficult? Of course – but who told you this whole life was all supposed to be easy?
Cleaners in the Casino never win, never lose. They visit regularly and get their salaries month after month. Bottle collectors in the pub do the same thing.
(Common sense observation dedicated to Satyadeva).
So, if I get the drift of these figures of speech, Shantam, and you regard yourself as some sort of ‘heroic gambler’, how come you spend your time, day after wretched day, week after week, month after month, year after year, complaining about how much you’ve lost and blaming the new casino managers for changing the rules and even theft?
Nothing remotely heroic about that, as you should have realised how the great Casino of Life is run, ie ‘You Win Some – and You Lose Some’. And the decisions of The Management are final.
If you don’t like it – tough, it’s the price of membership of every casino (and applies to all players, btw, including the cleaners and bottle collectors).
You have been and still are naive about such matters, probably because your emotions have always outweighed your reason in such matters, leading to unbalanced expectations and decisions. Then, laughably, you think you’re able to discern what’s “common sense” in the situation!
I suggest you need to go back to ‘square one’ and re-evaluate all your conclusions. Either that, or resign yourself to perpetual – and basically self-imposed – suffering.
On the topic of impermanence and the futility of expecting anything ‘out there’ to last, here’s something rather beautiful to meditate upon, Shantam…
https://youtu.be/ebtC3ORg9fU
P.S:
You’re not the only one, we’re all in the same leaky boat, y’know!
Shantam dost promote the idea that present-day Pune is a microwavable, turd-dumping ground for hapless zen ipod consumers and meditators and changed from the wholegrain, organic version that we see in these clips of the 70s and 80s.
But what of the astro-physics, the large planetary balls in space and how they revolve in motion and affect life on this world and that of the ashram?
And who is revolving these balls? Or who has set these orbits into perpetual motion?
Are not the revolutions of the solar system affecting ashrams and the lives of Earth citizens?
Hast Shantam made a chart for the future of the ashram?
A real commune can work only if it’s split along socio-economic lines…and with a caste system…then one wouldn’t have to mingle with oiks and those below one’s station – of petty bourgeois greed.
It could also have different ghetto areas for differing sexual orientation with the lower castes being kept in their places by limiting access to self-development classes and having them do the menial work on 12 hour shifts. Perhaps taking skull measurements to indicate the scientific proof behind their limited abilities.
Also, if one had a pronounced uneducated voice, the equivalent of a cockney accent in whatever language, that could limit access to food queues after evening discourse. And there should be strict dividing lines between the races, especially in the toilets. Then we could build a master race that could live for a thousand years.
I think Osho was only an amateur at this and obviously he didn’t understand good breeding.
Absolutely, Martyn old chap.
Not sure about these gurus though. Most of them are decidedly non-U, don`t you know? A lot of them were really ruffians who weren`t even very well spoken.
Gurdjieff, according to reports, apparently spoke with a strong south Caucasian accent, which is something like a strong west-country accent: sitting on his tractor, `avin a fag and going: “Loif only be real when oi bee” and telling tall tales about his grandpa Beelzebub, who was from Brizzle, whilst quaffing a few pints of scrumpy mixed with Cider Brandy. Rather an unsavoury affair.
Ramana Maharshi was a bit of a wurzel too, poor chap couldn`t even afford a pair of trousers, staggering around in his oversized underpants down on the farm talking to the cows and goats. “Ooo arrr, who am oi?”
Terribly vulgar But I`m afraid gurus in general are awfully arriviste and dreadfully common parvenu vulgarians. Look at Amma these days. She`s from a fishing family – oily hair and no doubt she`s got a kind of Grimsby accent as well.
Being a guru is really about deplorable levels of social mobility – you go from zero to hero in flash of enlightenment. One minute you’re on the bins, next you’re sitting on a throne. It`s like the Akashik lottery. It`s soooo nouveau…
Even Osho used to have a go at the Maharishi for being from the underclass from a village of sudras, which must have been the equivalent of Hackney, but people forget that he himself had a midlands Madhya Pradesh accent, which is bit Brummie-like.
“Inuff fer tediye?”
It’s also time for re-branding so that in the spirit of reality-checking and getting a modern message out there, we should learn from IKEA, that other denizen of the sacred, hushed and approving white go(o)ds man, where everything is perfectly hung.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/newsbeat/article/38263400/ikea-renames-some-of-its-products-in-america-and-sweden-after-internet-searches
For far too long, many fairly ordinary and unnoticeably nice people were subjected to meditation practices that were fancifully named and a million miles from what actually happens when a bunch of people perform night after night in their night robes.
So from now on, White Robe is to be renamed as:
‘Very Important Moments Pretending to be Deeply affected by Nothing at all, especially nothing remotely connected to what I tell people I’m meant to be doing’.
‘Watching one’s thoughts’ is to be renamed:
‘Sitting alone because my friends are tired of listening to me going on and on’.
Kundalini Meditation to be renamed as:
‘Being utterly sincere about meditating at 5pm (unless I have something better to do)’.
Dynamic Meditation to be renamed as:
‘The only way to bring an end to consumerism and the threat of global suicidal war, unless of course you can’t be arsed to get up and go nuts that early in the day, in which case just keep snoozing’.
Malas and names will still be given in their time-honoured way in some swooning and primary school rendition of ‘I Believe’ by Frankie Lane
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=–j7wvtOi1s
Thank you, now please fasten your safety belts and have a pleasant flight.
@ frank says:
21 November, 2016 at 3:06 pm
“I AM ALWAYS LOOKING FOR SIGNS OF MOVEMENT, DIFFERENT ENERGY STATES, TELEPATHIC HAPPENINGS, EVEN NEW GREY HAIRS WILL DO. SPIRITUAL MATERIALISM, YES. BUT WHAT TO DO?”
https://justpaste.it/mindisnothingbuthankering
Thanks, Arps!
You never fail, always pasting the right one.
It is unbelievable how Osho can be spot on, always reaching the very core in a very simple way! No other ‘master’ can be compared to him, he is, undoubtedly, the best!
Cheers! XX
@Tan says:
11 December, 2016 at 12:28 pm
‘ No other ‘master’ can be compared to him, he is, undoubtedly, the best! ‘
I second that emotion.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sti_tuBiv5g
Arps, unfortunately, I can’t open the link, they say it’s unavailable.
Love your pic from the balcony! Hope we really have a glorious day tomorrow! XXX
Try this, Tan.
One of them is bound to work.
https://goo.gl/y4b4YJ
Thanks, Arps. Love it!
I am laughing because I am certain half of the guys here in SN can’t understand. Everyone on their own path, I guess!
Cheers! XXX
It is a childish comparison to say our master is the best. It is always the disciples, disciples and disciples who need to be judged and compared if there is a need to compare, who has the big ones.
It is even a shameful attitude on behalf of sannyasins to go on hiding their mediocrity behind master´s greatness.
Shantam, I know it’s difficult to understand what “comparison” means. I will try:
I can tell you that a English teacher born and bred in England is much, much better than an English teacher born and bred in India. Am I comparing?
Got it?
Cheers!
Here is the photo of disciples blowing the candle on world´s biggest cake at their late master´s 85th Birthday festivity.
Sri Chinmoy and Osho, both were born in 1931. Both became hit in overseas market. One can guess whose disciples created this event covered by world press?
At first glance, this looks like something from the Nazi era. Where was the photo taken?
The vid came to my attention last week on Facebook and since then have watched it three times. Not because of nostalgia but rather to show my grandson what his dad looked like when he was eight or so. He appears at 5.57 in front of Krishna House, hustling for money with his pals, and later at 16.49 for a close-up. In fact, he pops up in his little orange hat a few times.
My feeling about the video is the usual for old Poona 1 vids, a bit like watching ‘Woodstock’, a wee vignette of the good old days, when there was a lot more hair everywhere. The ashram was always a hive of activity. My wife watched it and felt it carried a meditative vibe.
I occasionally meet some of the kids from those days, most of whom are now in their forties with kids of their own. One thing I notice is that they are all mostly very cool, fun-loving people. We must have done something right.
Yes, Lokesh,
Also in me, although I don´t have kids of my own, there were warm feelings watching by first watch of this very well digitalized compilation-fragments of quite some private, intimate ´family-commune´ impressions and listening to Prem Joshua’s music while doing it.
Very playfully done all that, and also, to use your own words, pretty ´squeaky clean´, leaving out anything that could have caused any irritation.
A family album around Christmas and New Year’s Eve, a time where almost every culture uses the chance (when no war is happening by chance) to meet as family members and cherish golden moments of the past together. Virtually or otherwise (in flesh and bones and face-to-face).
Took some time for me to let go of the greedy eye to recognize the one or the other (which surely happened).
Saw some who have passed already (like Santosh…then saw others, like beautiful Turiya amongst the kids and friends and lovers). And decided for a break. To wait and see what happens in the HERE & NOW and the UKSN chat. With this beautiful invitation. So many topics in that topic, aren’t there? Re raising kids, work as a play…and so on.
You already mentioned that the kids we see in the vid have kids by now themselves and ´playing´ it all in other ways. Sometimes truly settling some accounts with whomsoever then in the foregoing generation.
Some of German stock are meanwhile working in the media and film making area, for example. The way how the movie `Summer in Orange´ came into the world with a special version of it all. Ought to be that way. The movie was well revieved by a majority. Some other docs I watched and there are quite a lot.
(Btw, that you mention ´Woodstock´ – while watching the vid – there I can not follow you. I was more reminded of some Findhorn practitioners or similiar in terms of eco resorts up to nowadays).
Could – as an invitation – have been a UK SN chat little peace-train, but didn´t develop that flavour up to now. Sorry.
Attended yesterday a Sannyas Meditation Satsang Meeting after having had a break from these Sundays for quite some time. Beautiful musicians and such a deep quote of Osho to sit in Silence with. Before and after, same, same old gossip and intrigues played out as ever.
What was it that Prem Martyn recently invented? ´Trumpism style´ with operations the smartphones on board.
Ought to be that way? I don´t know, but it´s still extremely hard for me to take it.
I was able to go there after also reading other stuff, like British Madhuri´s Poem with the title ‘We thought, we love each other’, which I really recommend as well as her paintings included (Osho News, 11 Demeber 2016).
And what even made me more decisive to go out for life, was that I stumbled in the Net about a TED Talk with contributions of Marina Abramovic (a Serbian worldwide rightly famous performance Artist).
‘The Artist is Present’ (recommend to see and feel that to UK SN punters).
Quite enlightened stuff, if you really can´t stop to (mis-)use that word but in any case very enlightening!
So – this was my inner companionship throughout the last two days of experiencing. Experiencing myself and others and the Sannyas Realms and the rivering of that. And experiencing that there is no border anymore in Digital Ages and the Quest, how to cope with that.
Madhu
Madhu,
Being something of a poetry fan myself,I also read Madhuri’s poem, ‘We Thought We Loved’. It is quite poignant and a reading of it came to mind that may not have been the writer’s intention, I don’t know.
I imagine that she seeks to intimate (excuse the lit. crit. – it is like dissecting a joke, but what to do?) that in devotion to the master, the love between the disciples is all for and from Him with a capital H.
However, what struck me was a sadder shadow that spoke that because of the relationship with master who was not intimate in the regular human sense, the disciples ended up not really loving each other, even though they were in close contact.
A divine love trumps the human love…
Or a dream of it that really fuels cut-offness and alienation?
Thanks a lot, Frank, for responding and to share from your ´inner-work-play-station´. Something is growing inside, inspired by your lines and question. Takes time to grow…
Just this:
There are ´dreamings´, which neither originate in the judgemental area of some suspicious christian sect and cult-watcher section, nor do they originate in the informal settlements (and programmings) of some avatarish mathematical solutions for expansion and profit and competitions, the latter more than less cannibalistic style, seeing humans as (data) material.
I have been always – and still am – touched in my heart by those who seemingly (in my inner eyes and heart) have not lost their awareness of an inner-string connection as natural born from the ´Tree of Life´. On this little planet. They are called quite often ´pagans´ or aborigenes.
About ´divine love´ or ´trumpeting´ you will rarely hear them speak though, if ever…
And yet they have in their roots of wisdom much more respect (and reminders too) for the planet and their fellow beings as suffocating majorities, who more than less consciously decided to exist in a mathematical indulged filter bubble (algorythm-style).
You may have heard about the recent resistance of Dakota people against the business of building a major pipeline in the US? No poetry but prose (the latter) and yet much poetry in it.
…..
Just an hour or so ago, the machine electro screwdriver started to spread its noise in the walls of the small house which I am living (and writing) in just now. So excuse me if my lines are a bit scattered. They are working on some renovation of the flats above.
You write and question, Frank:
“Or a dream of it that really fuels cut-offness and alienation?”
I wouldn´t say that. I would suggest that it is forgetfulness that cuts off and alienates.
Sometimes, some poets or prose writers or even those we call (just) ´dreamers’ are much too often in contest, reminding us of our forgetfulness.
Have a nice day.
All of us.
Madhu
I recall years ago beginning to realise I/ we had to exercise more discernment in my/ our dealings with individuals with sannyasin names.
The thing is, when were were near him, there were so many of us, it was easy to avoid those we didn’t get on with, and I am not saying they weren’t ok; although some of them were toxic, for large numbers of people as well.
We created a stereotype for sannyasins, didn’t we? And it was just a load of rubbish. We never really always got on with each other. The early days of sannyas was a honeymoon period. The shit hit the fan and the honeymoon ended in Oregon. Classic co-dependent breakdown en masse happening.
As I personally let go of stereotyping sannyasins, my relationships with non-sannyasins got better and better, worked better and better for me, and I mix with a more diverse range of individuals, than I once did.
The poem is poignant and honest.
Totally agree with you, Arps! In my experience, I have never met a sannyasin that I got on with.
All those last 30 years or more, it was and is just about Osho. To be honest, the most stupid people I have met were sannyasins, don’t know why. Maybe it was attraction from my own stupidity or just unlucky!
Cheers!
I’m not convinced Sannyas is meant to be a mass movement in the sense of the old days. (I’m increasingly convinced it isn’t).
All that mass gathering was to wean us of co-dependency clique behaviour, move us towards individuation, and away from being propped up, propping up. Away from villain-victim-rescuer behaviour.
There are two polarised versions of people: the decent ones – and the rest.
It is natural that the innocence of youth when given the right conditions seeks expansion beyond itself…to dissolve and merge…trustingly…like children.
With experience – and negative experience at that – one withdraws (imo) from abandoning oneself, either ideologically or emotively and focuses instead on direct mutual investment where there is an immediate quid pro-quo of one’s identity. Less commune, less master, more lover, more me, less of ‘it.’
I suppose that is why I have a long-term partner, having known each other for the last 30 years and been partnered in more solid yet also elliptical ways for over half that time too. I never liked those ambiguous, sexually profane relationships that went nowhere but were full of borrowed, half-baked ideology and trashable. Sannyas was full of that experimental stuff, full of usurists.
Now one is simply informed by insight and the language and sounds of it. How that can possibly create the wherewithal for life, the securities and responsibilities and maturities still remains a chess game, despite years of human evolution and the aeons of relatives who have all played the same game previously. It doesn’t seem blithely easy, even at the best of times.
Osho added to the brightness, turned the lights up, brought religion out from the dank monasteries and spooky, unattainable schools of weird oriental behaviour and mistakes-ism.
I have no sense of obligation to the world to have it represent my values. I’m amazed there can be any degree of conviviality in any civic sense, when there is little that authentically binds people, unless one chooses to remain moronic. The streets are places to avoid each other, not to meet. How different from Osho’s commune intention.
I also still ‘wish’ to be part of something more accessible en masse, but I have less idea of what that looks like. I don’t believe watching religious videos or listening to audios is a way of life. No more than anything else we do to give meaning to the evenings.
It’s the universe’s game.
And whilst on the subject of what freely given work and guaranteed income will become as we understand that living is not a punishment exercise imposed by exploitative authority, try this…
http://www.bbc.co.uk/guides/zt2py4j#z94jmsg
Oh goodness, gracious me! We’ve got an unusual and “wonderful gathering” going on here as well, haven’t we? Arpana and Shantam seemingly pulling in the same direction for a change, reminiscing on a dream-like, halcyon period of innocence. With SD also party to the proceedings, fondly musing on what could be perhaps described as ‘onward Osho soldiers’ busy with their various and noble work pursuits!
These accounts are, to all intents and purposes, I feel sure, accurate and authentic in some ways at the time experienced. Personally, however, I suspect that what we really witness in the film is a very cynical exercise in marketing strategy – the ‘special offer’ that was made available for a limited period only, before the real deal became effective once sufficient numbers of punters had been ‘taken in’ by the sales hype and the free samples, so to speak.
Lest we forget, the gooey cameos of shared purpose, playfulness and camaraderie pictured, were to be replaced later by a rather ‘sticky end’ scenario on the other side of the world – where in some hell-hole of a ranch, loyal followers were left abandoned by the ‘Master’, stranded and penniless, after enduring cynical financial exploitation, as well as mental and physical abuse!
From that perspective, folks, things don’t feel and look quite so warm and fuzzy, do they?
You are writing about something you are imagining, Ashok.
This is truthful analysis with typical British sense of irony.
Ashok, you should tell a bit about your Sannyas biography.
“…where in some hell-hole of a ranch, loyal followers were left abandoned by the ‘Master’, stranded and penniless, after enduring cynical financial exploitation, as well as mental and physical abuse.”
As Arpana says, you’re not really qualified to pronounce judgment as you weren’t there.
Also, given all that, I think you should explain why you bothered with Sannyas, 20-odd years later.
Ashok…
From now on and in the spirit of neo-Marxian-post-Osho-neo-Freudian Trumpism, I shall define responses here as belonging to a sub-set of economic class origins, defined by family, aspiration, economic control and the lack of …and the work ethic. The notion that the universe further sets up this whole pantomime to sponsor knowing itself will also be addressed through the metaphor of the underclass and the benefits system and online spirituality.
It will take some time before my oeuvre is complete but in the meantime behave as if you know something that others want…it tends to work at parties and when impressing the opposite sex.
Ooops, looks like I’ve been spotted again!
@Prem Shantam
Thank you for your comment, Prem Shanty, re. my “truthful analysis” of events. Once again, if I may say, you have demonstrated superior critique and understanding to the likes of Arps and SD, despite their constant attempts to denigrate you, clearly exhibiting symptoms of the malady known generally as ‘involuntary and uncontrollable senile delinquent odour disorder’ – more affectionately known as ‘Silly Old Fart Syndrome’!
As per biography, naturally I have delved into works like ‘The God that Failed’ (H.Milne), ‘My Diamond Days with Osho’ (Shunyo) etc. But more importantly, imo, I have received first-hand accounts from many sannyasins who participated in the events considered – in the flesh – and not forgetting of course, the odd tid-bit, picked up here and there on SN.
@Arps & SD
Gentlemen – yes, some of what I wrote is to some extent ‘speculative’, but surely neither of you would deny the veracity of the ‘goings on’ at ‘the Ranch’ – would you?
As far as going to Pune some 20 yrs later is concerned, SD, I was blissfully unaware of the Oregon chapter – turning up, like so many others before me, I guess, as a very ‘innocent little lamb’!
You are trying to rationalise the fact that nobody in the sannyas world thinks you are as important as you think you are. That nobody recognises what a big deal you are in your own mind.
I see, Arpana! From what you’re saying then it would appear that I am suffering from some serious kind of malady – a ‘Walter Mitty-like’ disorder, it would seem?
Well, thank you for pointing it out, I shall be on the ‘look out’ for the blighter the next time I go surfing the SN air-waves.
Now, as I am aware you have been waltzing down ‘Memory Lane’ recently, I felt I wanted to share with you a mincing litte trip down one of my own ‘back-alleys’, which was prompted by the submission of a video clip re the notorious figure of ‘Flashman’ by one of the other local parishioners, just a few short days ago.
The ‘back-alley’ in question was ‘Tom Brown’s Schooldays’, to be precise! Did you read the book as avidly as I did when just a strip of a lad?
Christ almighty, but you gild lilies or paint black with black paint, and a bit of whitewashing when it suits you.
You said you were a good Christian, Ashok. You really should dwell on that.
Ok, Ashok, so, having become aware of and apparently disgusted by “the Oregon chapter”, not least by what you’ve today described as “loyal followers…left abandoned by the ‘Master’, stranded and penniless”, I ask again, why do you still bother with the Sannyas created by this, as you seem to suggest, ‘so-called’ “‘Master’”?
THE FOLLOWING WAS WRITTEN WITH THE LOCAL ‘PONGOSCENTI’ IN MIND, BUT IS NEVERTHELESS, SUITABLE FOR GENERAL CONSUMPTION:
Well, SD, I’m not sure if it’s healthy for me to delve into my personal life – as it could be judged an
‘off’ topic by the local authorities! Moreover, I don’t think it expedient to pander to your oft exposed penchant for personal in-depth analysis, with the object of attempting to ‘rip’ SN-virgins like me, ‘a new arsehole’! I feel you’d be better served to attend to your own, duckie, if you don’t mind!
Notwithstanding that reservation, since you’ve asked more or less nicely, I’ll just say this: I, like another enigmatic, vague and little-understood, yet sometimes brilliant SN act at this year’s ‘Royal Gala Performance’,
feel called upon to ‘spear-head’ the charge of a new wave of sannyasins tasked with the mission of ‘cleansing’ and ‘rebalancing’ original and wayward members of the flock of ‘yesteryear’!
Mention of which, reminds me of the scenes of ‘half-naked’ young men brazenly cavorting in the revealing film clip of Pune 1. My heart goes out to you, SD, knowing how such an assault on your physical senses and acute sensibilities would’ve tortured you! Not to mention that it must’ve cost a small fortune in smelling salts just to survive the ordeal!
Luckily for me, by the time I got to Pune, strict rules re apparel had been imposed and enforced e.g. no robe more than 2 inches above the ankle etc. by a fine upstanding Englishman – the resident Headmaster – surely a descendant of that illustrious Victorian educator, Dr Thomas Arnold of Rugby School? Good show, eh?
Now, just to be on the candid side a little bit, as I know you have a ‘serious tooth’, SD – I doubt very much if I’d've gone to Pune in the first place if I’d been made privy previously, to the ‘Ranch affair’! Which would’ve been a pity, as you and others at SN might well have missed out on the joy of my ‘heavy-weight’ celebrity body on this renowned organ of communication! Not to mention, of course, the ‘magic moments’ of personal enlightenment that I would’ve perhaps missed out on.
The sannyas experience obviously wasn’t all bad, although some things I definitely wasn’t and am not prepared to swallow! Consequently being of a devout Christian nature, I was prepared to forgive, but not forget, some of the past indiscretions I gradually became aware of!
Curiously enough, not long before I went to Pune for the first time, I met up with my old college flat-mate, who was instrumental in getting me into the ‘brave new world’ I was readying myself for. And on the occasion of having a drink with his aging father, a self-made man, very grounded and street wise, the ‘old boy’, came up to me right out of the blue at one point, and said in a rather dramatic prophetic manner, reminiscent of the ‘double, double toil and trouble’ witch scene from Macbeth:
“Never forget Paddy – out of good can come evil, and out of evil can come good!”
Turns out that the poor old fellow was beginning to show the first signs of losing his marbles. Nevertheless, what he said has stayed with me ever since and has provided what I feel is a wise way of looking at some things – sometimes!
Get your gnashers into that, Fido!
With much love,
Ashok xx
Well, Ashok, if your habitually verbose and bum-ptious manner here is anything to go by then you yourself would appear to in some need of “‘cleansing’ and ‘rebalancing’” before you deem it your role to correct or ‘reform’ anyone else, particularly your more experienced elders!
And I’m afraid I’m not letting you off the hook here as you’ve avoided the matter of your view of Osho, having in your earlier post placed ‘ ‘ around the word Master, thereby indicating a reservation which would appear to be at odds with regarding and projecting yourself as a sannyasin.
Perhaps you’re a bit of a, er, ‘playboy’ and just like the ‘scene’ and think using an unusual, ‘exotic’ sounding name makes you a bit ‘special’?
“…apparently disgusted by “the Oregon chapter”
In the line of his duty as a missionary to pagan and ungodly lands (and not as a result of any personal interest), Father Dougal Ashok, a very devout member of the Christian Brothers, was being shown round a brothel that had a reputation for specialising in exceptionally deviant tastes.
First, his holiness was shown into a room where there were many titties on show, men were drinking beer and raucous language was being used. On leaving the room the good father was so shocked he involuntarily mumbled: ”I`m fucking disgusted.”
He was then shown into the next room, where men, women and goats were all getting a piece of the action. In the next room, it was worse still: all sorts of strange contraptions were being used on all sorts of misshapen shadows in the dark.
Again, devout man of the cloth left the room. “I`m fucking disgusted”, he uttered, shocked to the core, his faith in the good Lord being severely tested to breaking point.
He visited more and more rooms in this den of iniquity, and in each successively, increasingly depraved acts were being performed, until he finally was ushered into a room where, in the corner, he was astonished to see a large black man with his penis immersed in a large bowl of yellow liquid.
“What on earth is this man doing?” cried the god-fearing priest in a deeply shocked tone, bordering on panic.
The black man replied:
“I`m fuckin’ dis custard.”
Mmmmmmmhh! Yummy, yummy…How long afore the cream shows up, Frank lad?
HAPPY BIRTHDAY, OSHO.
Yes, Kusum. He would be 85. Left too early in my opinion. Maybe he was tired! Love the pic! XXX
I was thinking too…
If alive, Osho would have been 85. Not an impossible age nowadays. Just think about Rupert Murdoch, same year as Osho, even few months older and yet capable enough to swallow Sky News in a multi-billion dollars deal.
Master who was robust and stout whole life paid heavy price in the process of creating Provocative Spirituality.
Somehow, well read master could not grasp the pulse of people around him. In this age, it is no advantage to play spiritual terrorist and get crucified.
Disciples care about entertainment and not sacrifice!
What a fucking suprise.
Someone has wished Osho a happy birthday, and fucking Shantam has put a negative fucking spin on it.
You idiot, have you wished Osho Happy Birthday anywhere?
On this page, Shantam´s post is the first on on 11th December mentioning Osho’s Birthday, and look at my facebook page for cover photo!
Shantam: Another of your puerile attempts at manipulation.
What is not lacking in the world of sannyasins are the points of view and, hopefully, the ability to see the root of them: categories, attributed consciously or not; each domain of reality has its own, almost.
Reality is a phenomenon immersed in the mystery of its origin (natural or divine). Men have expressed views on this mystery by giving themselves time and space co-ordinates.
The spiritual reality of what happened and continues to happen around Osho can not disregard what he said and did, and, for the disciples, the grace he has put into it.
To express opinions here on what he has said and done, but denying that grace, is the source of many misunderstandings, especially if someone continues to use the name ‘sannyasin’.
I See That grace in the footage.
Hug,
VF
Pune 1 or 2 footage and also footage of Rajneeshpuram touches deep in the heart because energy was of trust and innocence and master was alive.
Those who think master is still alive should check their nearby psychiatrist or someone earning the livelihood through channelling.
Spiritual movements’ post-founder´s demise can remain inspirational only if followers pour their collective intelligence to keep the sharpness on cutting edge. If this is lost, anybody will ask, what is wrong then to remain part of established religions?
Shantam, are you familiar with the apparently inevitable split that occurs after a great master has passed on, the chasm that develops between ‘esoteric’ and ‘exoteric’ disciples/followers/devotees/friends?
I suggest you look into this and realise that you are entrenched firmly in the ‘exoteric’ camp, while all or the vast majority of others who post here at SN are on ‘the other side’ of the psycho-spiritual fence/street/world/universe.
I’m fascinated by your contention that “Spiritual movements’ post-founder´s demise can remain inspirational only if followers pour their collective intelligence to keep the sharpness on cutting edge.”
I wonder exactly what you might have in mind (if anything) re practical measures to retain this “cutting edge”? The issue is, of course, that “sharpness” has to be maintained – at all costs – and within such an imperative, demanding an uncompromising policy, lie the seeds of…well, here are a few predictions:
A return to mandatory wearing of mala and orange…Signing in for meditations, records of attendance to be inspected and fines imposed on those who fail to turn up for at least 95% of them…Or perhaps that wouldn’t be a priority for you and more to your “cutting edge” taste would be compulsory participation in several annual celebrations, with random spot-checks to monitor how sincerely intense and ‘heart-ily’ individuals are chanting, singing and generally cavorting? And, but of course, how about all foreign women under 30 to have to engage sexually with at least one Indian over 50, at least twice a week?
Extreme, of course, but that’s what can happen through sheer ‘zeal’, starting off with seemingly ‘harmless’ rituals like communal ‘prayers’ and ‘no-thought for the day’…
Anyway, just a few ideas, and I’m sure you, as the obvious ‘man for the exoteric job’, have plenty of other ideas to inspire those whom you regard as ‘true’ sannyasins to fall in line and do their utmost to regenerate the entire ‘communal thrust’ of ‘Osho’s work’.
Kindly share your practical proposals, Shantam, Osho’s exoteric world is surely eager for inspiration….
Further to these lucid and razor-sharp thoughts…
“In truth, Mr Shantam, though to himself the most upright of men, who prated about high moral principles and benevolence, was an awful hypocrite, full of meanness and treachery.”
“Some people likened him to a direction-post, which is always telling the way to a place, and never goes there.”
Pecksniffian Pronounced /pɛkˈsnɪfɪən/
We are in the company of Messrs Pumpkinskull, Sweedlepipe, Bumble, Tappertit, Honeythunder, Pumblechook, and Muddlebranes, whose names all came out of the mind of Charles Dickens. His ability to create memorable and frequently sarcastic names for his characters, his villains in particular, is surely unmatched in literary history.
Pecksniffian derives from his Martin Chuzzlewit of 1844, in which Seth Pecksniff is a land surveyor and architect, though the author remarks that the only surveying of land he did was of the view of the countryside from his windows and that “of his architectural doings, nothing was clearly known, except that he had never designed or built anything.”
In truth, Mr Pecksniff, though in appearance the most upright of men who prated about high moral principles and benevolence, was an awful hypocrite, full of meanness and treachery. Dickens remarked scathingly that “Some people likened him to a direction-post, which is always telling the way to a place, and never goes there.”
In common with some other Dickens’ characters, including Gradgrind, Micawber, Podsnap, Scrooge and Uriah Heep, Pecksniff has become an archetype. He was turned into an adjective, meaning unctuously hypocritical, as early as 1851 and later became a noun, Pecksniffery.
I see the names who have commented on my comments, for few names there is no need even to read.
It is useless to discuss Osho´s work with those who are married with books or who have changed the boat long ago.
And yet, Shantam, you demonstrate in your next post that you have read what SD posted.
You read everything posted to you, Shantam. You revel in the attention. Makes you feel important.
“Shantam, are you familiar with the apparently inevitable split that occurs after a great master has passed on, the chasm that develops between ‘esoteric’ and ‘exoteric’ disciples/followers/devotees/friends?”
Who knows Osho Himself was not aware about this? We must not forget, Osho did not leave the body suddenly. It was long process of slow and painful yet fully aware death.
He must have carefully considered all the options, including leaving behind one person as successor or a disciples’ parliament of 20 chosen few disciples from all walks of life and from many countries.
My point will always be, whether you call yourself esoteric or exoteric or any other erotic-sounding adjective, the fucking EGO will still lurk behind and it is not that easy to be free from the germs of priestly and political mind even if you claim to be with any master for unlimited period of time.
Once this humility lands in our brain, much is possible.
I don´t think in the world of Sannyas it will land that easy, majority of Swamis (Tom), Bodhisattvas (Dick) and Ma (Mary) think themselves as esoteric!
“I don´t think in the world of Sannyas it will land that easy, majority of Swamis (Tom), Bodhisattvas (Dick) and Ma (Mary) think themselves as esoteric!”
If you think that’s the case and that, according to you, the majority are wrong, then the prospects for your agenda don’t appear that good, do they, Shantam?
I see you as a homeless misfit, not belonging in your homeland, or in Europe, or anywhere else, and consequently clinging to your concept of what Sannyas is about as a way of finding a ‘home’.
Thus you are at risk of confusing your purely personal wants and needs with your version of what ‘should’ be the case in the Sannyas movement. Coming from such a needy place, your ‘vision’ is bound to be (and in my view is) innately flawed.
@Shantam Prem
“…if I had your faith
then I could make it safe and clean
if only I was sure
that my head on the door was a dream.” (The Cure)
Are we speaking about the event of Pune 1? Ie the Space (Pune) and the Time (1) around a Man with a Dancing Heart that is going on to call people like me, beyond that Space & Time?
Sorry if right now I can’t hug you…my shrink is on holiday and he left me safe in my orange straitjacket.
VF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BjvfIJstWeg
“Are we speaking about the event of Pune 1? Ie the Space (Pune) and the Time (1) around a Man with a Dancing Heart that is going on to call people like me, beyond that Space & Time?
Sorry if right now I can’t hug you…my shrink is on holiday and he left me safe in my orange straitjacket.” (Veet Francesco)
Aaah, Veet Francesco, I had such a so-called ´bad day´ on the bumpy city roads, encounters with fellow beings.
And for my first smile and laughter in the evening here (home then) the credit goes all to these your lines. Hilarious.
Thanks,
Madhu
The lure and promise of dream-like scenes of splendour presented in the footage of Poona 1, undoubtedly suckered in many innocent little lambs for whom I only only feel respect, compassion and certainly no blame for giving the project a chance at that stage. However, to carry on being suckered into a ‘Master’ trip after the Oregon debacle, would seem to indicate guile-ass cretinous idiocy.
Regardless of what the explanation/excuse for those tragic events might be, whether deviant commercial design, dangerous irrational thinking brought on by mental sickness or whatever, the actions spoke for themselves, and consequently, the more discerning and alert people decided to it was time to go somewhere else whilst the main protagonists were still ‘in situ’ or Pune.
Whilst it is not necessary imo ‘to throw the baby out with the dirty bath water’, due to some good things coming out of what Osho put together, it is surely essential to drop the deranged naive, holy, infallible ‘Master’ journey and related behaviour patterns, leading as they can to fanatical, unconscious and violent consequences.
Peace, Love & Understanding to all Brothers & Sisters at this time of Christian celebration!
Ashoka
MD & ‘Master’-baiter, hooker, trapper and skinner of K9 Synthetic Furs Ltd.
(Former international playboy and erstwhile movie-star of ANUL Cinema Productions, Bollywood).
Dear friends,
Here is one photo link from facebook. It is interesting to see the childhood town of Osho. It is really amazing to see from where it started.
Osho´s life is not one of the typical rags to riches story of a business tycoon but one of those rares who dared to install themselves into the exclusive club of Krishna, Buddha, Jesus, Mohammed kind.
It matters not, end result is fiasco yet what a rare power of truth and courage.
https://www.facebook.com/bhoopsingh
MOD: POST EDITED.
@Ashok
Dear Friend (s),
Like you, I was born and conditioned as a Christian and probably, with the same “guile-ass cretinous idiocy”, I believed in the infallibility of the Pope and in a water-walking, dead and resurrected Messiah, yet someone who never existed for historians of that era.
Like you, I guess, I grew up as an irresponsible ready to run to the priest to confess all the times that the Devil instead of the Moon pointed me to the pussy.
When I met Osho, through books, videos and especially people who’d originally got almost the same moral chains (Catholic and Communist) I was very interested to apply my holy canons to Him.
I was not there to tell you what I would have done during the Oregon days, really do not know if I would have been part of the lady-pope Sheela team; if as a Christian I could bear those (so familiar) power trips, as a form of atonement, if I would have fled or…if I would have stayed and protected Osho.
Today, it is not a big deal for me to call Him Friend or Master, there remains the Gratitude: for showing me how to watch in the Here & Now at all options available, with a relaxed Innocence, suspending judgment, and let the thing, in that moment closest to my being, happen: like now.
Hug and smile,
VF
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0mYBSayCsH0
Dear Shanty!
With regard to the study entitled ‘The Semantic Antics of a Senior Delinquent’, dedicated to you personally, I feel that in the interest of arriving at a balanced view in your studies, it would be worthwhile looking at a parallel work entitled ‘The Semantic Antics of a Juvenile Delinquent’, which also attempts to define the key-words – esoteric and exoteric, in the following manner:
Esoteric = describes those of a rather sensitive and delicate nature, ‘a long way up their own botties’, wishing (not unsurprisingly) to distance themselves from their fellow but extremely ‘common’ man like some of the exoteric grunts on SN, for example.
Esoteric adherents are known to favour small pongoscenti groupings, where the sacred ritual of chewing on the ‘Holy Cow’ beef jerky is celebrated, provoking a transcendental state known as ‘squeaky-bum flatulence’, directed especially towards one (but perhaps two) very special targets in the exoteric peer-group.
Other noxious substances regularly abused by members of this group include Brylcreem and smelling salts, and further addictive behaviour extends to the compulsive and excessive downloading of lengthy, mysterious, large, space-filling quotes from the internet.
In general, esoterics are highly susceptible to being ‘led up the garden path’ with fairy stories and other kinds of ‘mumbo-jumbo’ and assorted Irish gob-shoite, that no exoteric in his/her right mind would bother with in ‘a month of Sundays’!
Notable individuals exhibiting these behavioural traits, to a greater or lesser degree, include the following: The Senior Delinquent, The Quotation Fart, The Mother Superior, The Editor-in-Chief and The Wannabee-Nat.
Exoteric = describes a group of very average, down-to-earth Joes, of extremely limited ability and scope, also ‘a long way up their own botties’!
Of a more popular community-minded disposition and aspiration, this type is noted for being thick-skinned and resilient to scathing verbal abuse and criticism, even when it makes sense.
Similar to ‘esoterics’ this grouping shares a fascination in sexual matters, but unlike the latter, whose sexual interest is generally, and thankfully, repressed, the exoterics are at times seen to venture to the other extreme i.e. indulgence in ‘porky-pig’ exhibitionism, the open and flagrant sharing of naughty pictures, as well as exotic verbal and written displays of innuendo and all things related to toilet behaviour and fetishes, in their own version of ‘Happy Hour’.
Disgraceful members of this group include, to a greater or lesser degree: Shantypants, Jockeypants, Juvenile Delinquent and Flasher-Frank.
(Special Note: As it is proving extremely hard for academic researchers to categorise the ‘special case’ of Dai Areeah ‘Gobbler’ Jones due to the complicated nature of the profile characteristics involved, it has been decided that this case will remain ‘unclassifiable’ until such time that things become clearer!),
I hope this additional info is of some value with your ongoing educational efforts.
Yours sincerely,
Ashoking Juvenile Delinquent
Also worth watching on youtube:
Osho: Rajneesh Ashram somewhere in 1977
https://youtu.be/K9o5smi_5rg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LAFyuLiBG7w
Thank you, Kusum, for giving the clip ‘Rising Moon’ a try again here; it´s decades, I haven’t seen it. A kind of ´History Channel’, which – by its very nature – opposes all cynicism, which is meanwhile ´on board´….
Merry Christ-Conciousness, Friends,
Madhu
This has been a long string.
I liked the footage for a particular reason which does not seem to have been mentioned: it was just ordinary life in Poona 1 as I remember it. It was what most of us who lived there for more than a few months did with most of our hours. And it caught the flavour.
Encounter groups, mass meetings (which many of us did not go to so much) were not at all ‘central’ to Poona 1 life.
Just ordinary life, attentiveness to our work, and plenty of ordinary moments which had the flavour of love within them, which were not actually tantric or orgasmic.
I hope that future historians won’t miss that.
I am glad the footage is still up.
Parmartha, you sound like most of the British film scripts which mainly focus on ordinary daily human life.
@Parmartha:
Yes, ‘Encounter Groups’, of course, I was forgetting – so not everything was ‘smelling of roses’ at the ‘Elysian fields’ of Pune 1, then? Indications of violent happenings to come were already there, it would seem!
@Francesco:
Good post, my friend, and congratulations on your English. Knowing that it is not your native-tongue, it surely cannot be easy trying to work out what some of the very ‘native’, English mother-tongue speakers around here are trying to say! I often find it a trial, myself!
Yes, Osho is deserving of some gratitude (esp. as a very inspiring and brilliant teacher of meditation practice), like you say – I wrote about my own experience in this regard, here on SN a couple of years ago.
Thank you for the gift of ‘Smash Mouth’ on the video clip provided – *’a dainty dish to set before the king’! My ego is tempted to latch itself onto that one! However, I don’t think we should become over-identified with certain names – should we? Especially when they’re used to denote membership of elitist esoteric clubs.
A big hug for you too, compagno, amico xxxxx
* A fragment from the nursery rhyme entitled ‘Sing a Song of Sixpence’.
@People-spotters:
Analysis of Pune 1 footage reveals ‘rich and famous onward Osho soldiers’ called to duty in the cause e.g. the tall and lanky, bearded figure of Pranesh (Pascal Sacher, heir to the family fortune of the famed Hotel Sacher in Vienna, internationally known for its trademark dessert ‘Sacher-torte’) at 7.42. mins.
Pranesh is now engaged in his own lucrative business activities at ‘The Womb (!#?X*!) Meditation Center’, in Thailand, including the development of his own version of a strobe-light, ‘energy-re-balancing’ machine which works on the pineal gland, and quite possibly others too! I am reliably informed that Pranesh’s energy tool when fully developed, is expected, upon release, to retail at the ‘toss-away’ price of around 500 US smackers for those interested, and with the necessary cash to burn.
At 17.31, Turiya (Princess of Hanover) appears, I believe with her husband Vimalkirti, Prince of Hanover, and late cousin to Prince Charles of the UK, and their daughter Princess Saskia.
Turiya now operates a very lucrative little earner herself, known on the spiritual/therapy market as ‘The Path of Love’, where for the bargain basement fee of around 2500 US smackers all in, you can treat yourself to ‘a once in a lifetime retreat’ of 7 days and nights, in the company of an authentic, bona-fide real-life princess!
Mmmmmmm! Path of Love! I wonder what that means exactly? I seem to recall hearing Turiya say that she used to like masturbating in front of pictures of Osho!
Well, you never know, do you? Might be worth taking a look if you can afford it?
“Who wants to be a millionaire? I don’t!
Have flashy flunkies everywhere, I …?”
,
,
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
The way the video seems so effete and innocent. Well, guys let me just add a couple of words…
Rajen, the posh-voiced English therapist was like Somendra and Teertha, just arrogant cunts. Yes, that’s right…They mucked people around with egos the size of warehouses, which Osho promoted as being the latest craze since lighting your own farts. This kind of muck has surfaced and resurfaced in Sannyas as authoritarian reverie for holy-moly crappism.
I was recently exposed to the idiocy of Ma Dharm Jyoti in Mystic Rose, sitting in her ancient, dinosauric Osho inheritance as if there was something special about being po-faced, ancient and in command. Osho bred that kind of authoritarian muck. Videha, the idiot sufi practises the same mouth as tight arsehole gibberish. Rafia from the Path of
ve is a self-sponsoring goon.
When you arselick Osho’s dead balls, remember it’s not the same thing as being filled with light…it’s the same muck that the buddhists and male-dominated sufis have sponsored for years: kow-tow and keep your mouth shut to receive the infinite blessings of the spiritual boot campers. Fuck off with knobs on to all who made it into a religion and who get kudos from wool pulling.
That’s one advantage we have over the other nutters – we learnt profanity for sanity. Thanks for that, Osho, learning by inversion was a great way to tell people to stick their unconditional proto love up their arse from whence it came.