BBC Staff object to Swami Arun’s talk at London HQ

This was published in the (UK) Daily Mail yesterday!

Quite Amusing really!

(This text below is extracted from a longer  more scurrilous article there)

  • Last week Anand Arun gave a talk on ‘mindfulness in an era of the 24-hour news cycle’
  • Around 50 staff attended the talk at BBC’s London HQ New Broadcasting House

BBC staff have complained after a religious guru who follows a highly controversial Indian mystic gave them a talk about meditation.

Mr Arun is a swami for a religious order called Osho Tapoban, based on the teachings of Osho.

Anand Arun was invited to the Corporation's London headquarters New Broadcasting House last Wednesday to give a talk on 'mindfulness in an era of the 24-hour news cycle'

Anand Arun was invited to the Corporation’s London headquarters New Broadcasting House last Wednesday to give a talk on ‘mindfulness in an era of the 24-hour news cycle’

Photos from the talk on the swami’s Facebook page show him in a room full of staff with their eyes closed and wearing a BBC identity card.

Swami Arun works from an Osho Tapoban meditation camp in the forests of Nepal, whose website states: ‘Swami Anand Arun is a true devout and lover of Osho.

‘His undying love for the master, his simplicity in life and his compassion for everyone are his true gifts that have given birth to beautiful Oasis of Osho around the world.’

The website adds that he met Osho, who also went by the name Bhagwan Shree Rajneesh, in 1969 and ‘took initiation’ from him in 1974 before begin ‘instructed’ to return to Nepal to ‘pioneer the Osho movement’.

Jatinder Sidhu, a senior producer on Radio 4’s Today Programme, complained in a letter to the BBC’s in-house magazine Ariel, which is published online.

He wrote: ‘I’m a bit concerned that something called the BBC Faith Forum has invited a man who claims to have been inspired by Osho, aka Swami Rajneesh, to give a “discourse” to BBC staff.

Photos from the talk on the swami's Facebook page show him addressing a room full of staff wearing a BBC identity card

Photos from the talk on the swami’s Facebook page show him addressing a room full of staff wearing a BBC identity card.

‘As an organisation populated by a large number of journalists and (hopefully) critical thinking intellectuals, I’m not sure we should be promoting people who legitimise cults and criminals.’

Another BBC worker, who asked not to be named, said: ‘How they let this guy in is incredible – if he believes the teachings of Osho then he’s not someone the BBC should be inviting to talk to our staff.’

Osho claimed a previous Pope had been gay and said: ‘If the pope is homosexual – and popes are infallible – it creates great suspicion, because Jesus was also hanging out with twelve boys. It may be something coming down from Jesus himself.’

The chair of the BBC’s Faith Forum, Susan Hayman, said the aim of the Forum was to ‘promote greater understanding’ among BBC staff and would never lend its support to Osho

And he said: ‘AIDS is a religious disease. It started in the monasteries where monks were put together and no woman was allowed. It is the ultimate result of homosexuality, it is a by-product of homosexuality.’

The chair of the BBC’s Faith Forum, Susan Hayman, said the aim of the Forum was to ‘promote greater understanding’ among BBC staff and would never lend its support to Osho.

In a reply to Ariel today, she wrote: ‘The BBC Faith Forum is a forum governed by its own constitution and supported by BBC Diversity.

‘The main objective of the Forum is to promote a greater understanding and awareness to BBC staff, in general, of the faiths and related faith groups that make up the audience and source of BBC output and in order to do this we have begun to organise various events to be held from time to time.

‘For the first of these events, the BBC Faith Forum decided to invite Swami Anand Arun, a meditation guru from Nepal.

‘His presentation was well received by the 50 strong audience which was testimony to the interest it generated.’

She added: ‘The BBC Faith Forum has no position regarding Osho or any other religious or spiritual gurus and we would like to clarify that the Forum will not be used in any way to promote any cult, sect or groups so as to hurt deep personal sentiments of BBC staff.

‘We welcome suggestions and constructive comments from all BBC colleagues.’

The BBC said that events organised by the BBC Forums were entirely independent.

A BBC spokesperson said: ‘BBC Faith is one of a number of independently-run staff forums which organise their own events and choose the speakers invited to participate.’


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107 Responses to BBC Staff object to Swami Arun’s talk at London HQ

  1. sam lucas says:

    I think it`s very important for us to be careful with the teachings of the `Bhagwan`, aka Swami Rajneesh, and his teachings, which are found attractive by the members of the Osho group.

    We can remember that the Bible, that contains the true teachings of Jehovah, is always a fountain of knowledge and wisdom that we can turn to whenever we are looking for advice on any particular issue.

    If we have a look in the Bible, we can see that Jesus states that “Many false prophets will arise and mislead many” ( Mark 13:22).

    So from this statement it is clear that there will be false teachers who, although appearing very attractive to those with genuine spiritual interest, may not be acting under the jurisdiction of Jehovah.

      • satyadeva says:

        Brilliant! A fine, well-chosen stroke there, Arpana, through the covers for four!

        • frank says:

          Let me remind you that Jehovah regards laughter in his jurisdiction as a serious offence.

          In the Bible it is written: “The wages of sin is death”.
          And you godless souls who have made a pact with a false prophet are well on the way to picking up your paypacket.

          Read the Bible and renounce your false prophets before it is too late.

          “There she lusted after her lovers whose genitals were as those of donkeys and whose emissions were like those of horses.”
          Ezekiel 33:22


          “No man whose testicles have been crushed or penis cut off may become a member of the assembly of God.”
          Deuteronomy 21


          “Whoever utters the name of God must be put to death. The whole community must stone him, whether native or alien.”
          Leviticus 24:16

          Repent now!

          • Arpana says:

            Praise theLord.
            Frank has seen the light.

          • sam lucas says:

            I’m very happy that you’ve been reading the Bible, Frank, it really is a treasure-trove of wisdom.
            In fact, the Prophet Isaiah said of the Bible:
            “This is what the Sovereign Lord, Jehovah of armies, has said” (Isaiah 22.15).

            But please be careful which version you read, as I’m afraid that not all of the translations are accurate – I’ve
            never seen the passages you quote anywhere!
            What we Witnesses like to recommend is to read
            ‘The New World Translation of the Holy Scriptures’,
            which is an accurate, easy to read translation of the Bible.

            Actually, contrary to your opinion, Lord
            Jehovah does sanctify laughter (at the right time, of course!):
            “He that sitteth in the heavens shall laugh: The Lord shall have them in derision.” (Psalms 2:4).
            “Then was our mouth filled with laughter and our tongue with shouts of joy; then they said among the nations, the Lord has done great things for them.”
            (Psalms 126:2).
            “Till he fill thy mouth with laughing, and thy lips with
            rejoicing.” (Job 8.21).

            So we can see that our Lord Jehovah does sanctify
            laughter, in the right place.

            I can see that there are a lot of Indian-sounding names
            at this site, I can guess that a lot of the writers here
            are from the subcontinent?

            I haven’t been to India since my last preaching mission in 2000, but I guess you may ask, “Is the Bible
            a white man’s Book?”
            The Bible’s answer:
            The Bible wasn’t written by Europeans. All of the men
            that God used to write were from Asia. The Bible doesn’t promote one race as being superior to another. In fact, it states:
            “God is not partial, but in every nation the man that
            fears him and works righteousness is acceptable to him.”
            (Acts 10:34).

            • satyadeva says:

              As a matter of interest, Sam, do you work at the BBC, or are you just a ‘Daily Mail’ reader? Or simply always on the look-out for poor, misguided souls to preach to?

              Not sure about the first two, but if you’re the latter, well, you’ll fit in perfectly here, mate. I say unto thee, verily the Sannyas Movement is nowadays overflowing with such people…

              By the way, may I ask your age, please? Also, what in your life brought you to your present orientation (presumably, it was significant suffering?).

              • frank says:

                And Jehovah spake thus unto his witnesses:
                “Go thou forth and seriously irritate people on their own doorsteps.
                Take no heed for the fact that the sinners have no interest at all and be not perturbed by the fact that thou hast marginally less brain cells than the scrapings off an emotionally challenged baboon’s (with severe learning difficulties) ass.

                Shove thou the Bible down everyone’s throat and forget not to chop the end off thine own dick (Genesis 17), abuse thine own children and crush the testicles of sodomites, for it is good in my sight.”

                • prem martyn says:

                  Shagging a pretty Jehovah’s Witness girl who works at the BBC, having had some cake and exercise with Uncleji, writing it all up as a story on the ‘Daily Mail’, and blaming a Muslim for inciting Osho to talk bollox about genocide for the purposes of goose-stepping out of our comfort zones, and then making up stories online to pass the time with…

                  That’s my idea of living…

                  Next week: Martyn goes to live in a vegan free love commune in Europe that attracts lots of girls…don’t laugh, lads…just by chance, I found one…I didn’t know such a thing would exist…there is a God after all…(ps: you can’t find it by googling…you’ll just get cake recipes). Don’t all rush at once….

              • sam lucas says:

                Hi Satyadeva, I remember your keen interest in the activities of the Witnesses before. I do hope you’ll come along to your local Kingdom Hall sometime.

                My age, by the way, is 45, as a young man I was a bit of a ‘rocker’ and used to follow a bit of a ‘rock and roll’ lifestyle.
                I used to listen to the Rolling Stones and Cliff Richard, and to be honest, I used to drink a lot of alchohol in those days.
                I must confess that, at one point, I actually tried smoking Cannabis, which is an illegal drug.

                But my life changed unexpectedly one Sunday afternoon when a lovely couple came to the door and gave me a copy of Watchtower’s magazine, ‘Awake!’

                I then learnt about the coming of the Armageddon and the destruction of ‘Babylon’, and how Lord Jehovah sent His only Son, Jesus Christ, to redeem us.

                I learnt about the Good News, that Jesus will save all Witnesses from certain destruction during Armageddon and ressurect us to live on the Earth eternally, in Paradise, under His heavenly rule.

                No, I don’t work for the BBC or the ‘Daily Mail’, but I do enjoy reading the ‘Daily Mail’.

                However, what I would really recommend for you to read is our ‘Awake!’ magazine and the ‘New World’ Translation of the Holy Scriptures.
                Always a great source of inspiration and knowledge!

                • Arpana says:

                  Poe’s law
                  From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

                  Poe’s law, in broader form, is:

                  Without a blatant display of humour, it is impossible to create a parody of extremism or fundamentalism that someone won’t mistake for the real thing.[3]

                  The core of Poe’s law is that a parody of something extreme by nature becomes impossible to differentiate from sincere extremism. A corollary of Poe’s law is the reverse phenomenon: sincere fundamentalist beliefs can be mistaken for a parody of those beliefs.[3]

                • lokesh says:

                  We don’t need to request that you play it again, Sam, because the record is permanently stuck. I was shocked to hear that you smoked an illegal drug called cannabis. Perhaps the evil substance has damaged your mind irreparably and that is why you imagine that the shite you talk will raise any interest on this website…a snicker of disbelief perhaps, but that is about it.

                  Once in a while a couple of Jehovah’s Witnesses appear at my garden gate and I usually invite them in for a cup of tea and a chat. To me, they appear like schoolboys fascinated by a new book they have discovered, in ths case the Bible. Their understanding of the Gospels reflects their superficial take on life…their interpretations are entirely exoteric.

                  By the time they leave my kitchen they are, quite understandably, puzzled that I am well read in regards the holy book, yet completely uninterested in the ideas they are trying to promote. I find these people sweet and completely misguided.

                  So, sorry, Sam, you are barking up the wrong tree in these parts. All the regulars who comment here will more or less view you as a misguided fool, whose book learning, holy or not, simply does not cut the mustard, curry-flavoured as it happens.

                • satyadeva says:

                  Thanks for your kind invitation, Sam. I do believe there’s a Kingdom Hall near me in Camden Town, north central London. Have you heard about this area, one of Britain’s greatest tourist attractions, apparently? It’s teeming with young people seeking so-called ‘pleasure’ – drink, drugs, music, shopping, so-called ‘hanging out’ – and worst of all, of course, what people like to call ‘free sex’!

                  Indeed, Osho’s most successful London centre used to be located close to the centre of this very area. No coincidence, I imagine…

                  It’s occurred to me, since you arrived here at SN, that a cornerstone of Osho’s teachings is to endeavour to “be a witness”. I’m just wondering whether he might have been giving a message – albeit perhaps well hidden – to move, eventually, towards the Kingdom you yourself are virtually already in (if I understand you correctly), so that when such a Call arrives, the fortunate ones who heed it might turn and follow the Path to their Salvation. In other words, from being a mere “witness” to flowering into a true “Witness”!

                  What do you think, Sam? Am I on the right lines here, do you think? Or has my (and others’) affiliation with Osho already secured my and their Fate – presumably, eternal Death?

                  PS: I recall when I was a teenager, a friend became very interested in the Jehovah’s Witnesses, attended meetings, knocked on doors etc., and he said, according to the Bible, God’s Kingdom only has room for 144,000 people. Is that correct?

                  If so, how many are already safely in? Perhaps it’s too late already? Have I missed the boat to the Other Shore? Or, is it that even those who have secured their place in Eternity must remain ever-vigilant or risk being thrown out by the Lord, on to the Mean Streets of hell-holes such as Camden Town? Thus leaving hope for those late-coming ‘qualifiers’ waiting in the ‘queue’, as it were?

                  I’d greatly appreciate a swift response, if possible, please, Sam, as this has been disturbing me a lot these last couple of days – and, worst of all, I’m afraid it might interfere with my enjoyment of tonight’s two World Cup matches – which, I suspect, shows my level of spiritual ignorance, doesn’t it?

                • satyadeva says:

                  PPS: I see you enjoyed the Rolling Stones and Cliff Richard in your earlier years. Presumably, you renounced the Stones a long time ago – but Cliff? Isn’t he acceptable to the Witnesses? If not, why not? Apart from his admittedly rather risqué youth, I’ve always thought he sang very wholesome songs in a very wholesome way, suitable listening, even for Sundays.

                  And btw, aren’t one or two of his former band, The Shadows, also Jehovah’s Witnesses?

  2. lokesh says:

    What I find relevant about the article is Arun’s efforts to bring respectabiliy to Osho’s name. It is going to be uphill all the way.

    All this nonsense about Osho’s legacy is pure bullshit and he will never be respectable. Basically, Osho found respectability to be a loser’s game. Those who seek respectability are basically going to receive a booby prize if they manage to achieve it.

    As for Osho’s vision in these matters, he wanted rebels for disciples, and while alive one had to rebel to be around him…well, at least up to the Ranch.

    Osho, it would appear, was homophobic…I’m sure that might have changed had he seen the earning power from ‘pink’ currency. I find his Jesus joke amusing. I mean to say, that is really asking for it. I am also quite sure Osho was well aware of the esoteric aspects of Christianity and appreciated it.

    Now the martyrs are out with their interpretations of Osho’s legacy, which is fine by me if they can’t find anything better to do with their time. Thing is, as long as they try to make Osho appear like some holy guy they will be torpedoed left, right and centre. I’m sure he would find the whole carry-on quite amusing were he able to witness it.

    In the early days at least, rebellion was a cornerstone of the Sannyas movement. Now, it all looks like just another whacky cult. I am sure Arun is a lovely guy and all that shite but if he is representative of the public face of Neo-Sannyas don’t you know that you can count me out.

    • Anand Newman says:

      A person sitting all the time with a loincloth, middle of nowhere in Tiruvannamalai, doing nothing, didn’t travel anywhere, no media to cover – how come Ramana Maharshi got so much respectability? Some, even westerners, come and settle down permanently near that place in Tiruvannamalai even today.

      There are numerous mystics like that in India who don’t do things which are respectable to the society, but attained highest / deepest level possible experience in their life time. The words they utter come as if they are coming from the very source. If you stand in their presence, you feel as if there is a vast ocean behind them and they are lingering as waves only to share the joy with others.

      So if you have to go by respectability, who cares for these half-naked ragamuffins? Only difference with Osho is he lived as both half-naked monk and a lavish & stylish mystic.

      Shame on you, some of you UK folks, who are ten times communicative compared to a ESL ( English as second language) person like Arun. You could not do what he has done.

      • lokesh says:

        “You could not do what he has done.”

        I have no desire to do what he has done, whatever you imagine that to be.

        • anand yogi says:

          Yes, Newman, shame on the Britishers who cannot do what half-naked fakirs of India speaking the pidgin English can!

          Half-naked ragamuffins with the energy of the ocean coming from the behind have lingered on this shore whilst even westerners have visited them in one horse towns like Tiruvanamalai!

          Yes, Newman, for yugas the lineages of enlightened ones, sometimes only wearing underwear, have achieved the mighty heights only known in mighty Bharat!
          Just by virtue of being born in India you have this knowledge, otherwise how could you possibly know it?

          Arun is showing true compassion, spending his energy trying to awaken the English homosexuals who have invented AIDS, who, as Chetna rightly points out, are “fast asleep”.

          I bow humbly and deeply in a state of higher consciousness at the feet of Arun, the embodiment of Zorba the Buddha and the living pioneer of the Osho Movement, without whom we would be drowning in the mud of unconsciousness and homosexuality of those who have abused the freedom that Osho has given them!

          Hare Om!
          One India! Great India!

    • Dhanyam says:

      Isn’t respectability the reason why OIF edits all of Osho’s works (to make more money)? Is your posting the same to OIF?

      Remember what Osho said about the media:
      “If they say something positive, thank them. And if they say something negative, make sure they spell my name correctly.”

      • Parmartha says:

        The motivation of Arun and the motivations of OIF have similarities. I am not sure in either case it is ‘just’ about money.
        I feel it reflects where both are.

        In the case of OIF and Arun, I suspect at bottom they would even like Osho to be more ‘acceptable’ to mediocre consciousness because they themselves are mediocre. They select what they like about Osho, but cut out the wild man who had a go at almost everything and everyone. Arun’s commune is said to be quite ‘straight’ and ‘immoral’ behaviour is frowned on.

        The point I make is that if Arun, Keerti, or anyone of the new pretenders want to take over the ‘Ashram Resort’, then in many ways it might even be worse than what is there at present.

        The full Daily Mail article quoted Osho making jokes about concentration camps and Jews. I am not sure at all whether Osho’s own view that all publicity is good publicity is true in that regard, when the press do that totally out of context.

        • frank says:

          It’s not about editing.
          It’s about mental health.

          Look at this Arun clown with his crypto-fascist posturings.
          It’s been going on for a while.
          Quite a few years back in a dispute about the Resort, he denied that Osho would have ever have asked for the pyramids to be painted black as he knew that black was “a negative colour”.

          He has been sliding into Wacko land for a while and now he is getting some clout he`s really beginning to lose it.
          “embodiment of Zorba the Buddha”,
          endorsemnets of genocidists etc. etc.

          Of course, when he says of Modi and others that history has not been about “sleeping masses”, but about been about great men “imposing their willpower” he is talking about himself!

          For me, the guy`s not so much on the way to Buddhahood but nutterhood…

          On the mental health front, little needs to be said about Brian Rajneesh – he and his gang have expressed themselves clearly.
          And they are singing from a similar hymn sheet.

          What has never been done in the world of psychological research is to enquire into what the effects of adulation are on the one who receives it.
          This would be fascinating to see the effects of this powerful complex of the drugs – power and adulation – from very devoted groups.

          Any performer, be it stage actor, rocker, comedian will tell you that being up there in front of a crowd is the biggest buzz of all . The ultimate orgasm.

          What happens when that button gets pressed repeatedly, or even 24/7?

          It seems that there is a kind of tipping point – and it works for celebrities too, who are a lot more like gurus than most so-called spiritual seekers would like to admit – where the receiver of adulation starts to act in an intoxicated way. It could be the serotonin builds up to a trippy level and then things get weird.

          This question is not asked by followers as, of course, they are participating in the high and, in any case, they see the gurus as being ‘beyond’ that kind of enquiry.

          They are not.

          Power and adulation acts as a drug.
          And just like drugs, if someone takes a big dose you don’t really know how it will affect them. Its a roll of the dice, depending what they’ve got floating about in their unconscious.

          Btw, you know the classic idea of mental hospitals being full of guys who think they are Napoleon or Jesus Christ?
          Now that India is modernising and they have more and more hospitals, including mental, are their mental wards full of people who think they are Gandhi and Osho?

          Or are they all on the loose in the world, becoming gurus, spiritual and temporal leaders??!!
          The Indian version of “care in the community”?

          • Arpana says:

            Something of the Emperor sitting on his throne about that photograph. A pose used by artists of the time to denote greatness. Think Napoleon.

        • satyadeva says:

          “I am not sure at all whether Osho’s own view that all publicity is good publicity is true in that regard, when the press do that totally out of context.”

          I’ve always thought this, as ‘misrepresentation, virtual crucifixion and death’ by media is par for the course for any sensationalist – or easily twisted to be such – stories. Perhaps Osho didn’t really fully understand this, especially in the context of the western world.

          It reminds me of the arrogant and aggressively dismissive, ‘Nothing can touch us!’ attitude taken towards the local people by the ‘rulers’ at the Ranch, which rebounded in everyone’s faces (and how!).

          You only have to look at how critics (eg the recent ones at the BBC) can simply drag up the Ranch crimes, Osho’s exclusion from many countries etc. to see how instantly easy it is to defame him and his movement.

          Arun making a deliberate effort to go in another, apparently ‘ultra-moral’ direction is, come to think of it, pretty well an inevitable outcome – you know, opposite and complementary to the flawed past – especially as otherwise he almost certainly wouldn’t have got anywhere with the Nepalese powers-that-be, including that country’s own media.

          As for his currying favour with PM Modi, well, unless he’s really ‘lost it’ in the way Frank maintains, isn’t that also almost certainly based upon fear, ie fear of the Sannyas movement being persecuted by ruling Hindu Party elements? As such, one might simply regard this as the careful strategy of an essentially politically and spiritually ‘moderate’ man, dealing with difficult circumstances in the ‘real world’.

          Unfortunately though, along the way he might well be abandoning something precious, arguably essential, ie something of the essence of Osho’s Sannyas.

      • Arpana says:

        When you say “edit”, what exactly do you mean?

      • Fresch says:

        So true. Just the same, Anthony wrote about ‘editing’. They (OIF) try to make Osho respectable for homosexuals by editing Osho’s words.

        T hear there are many gays in Sannyas (also in Pune). They should let them study and look into ALL kinds of things he said about that.

        One gay sannyasin friend is totally at ease with it. He said Osho is ok about it. It does not need ‘editing’ more than any other issue.

        • Arpana says:

          “I’m gay and I want to ask if it is a hindrance in my development, and if it is, what can I do to get free?”

          OSHO says, “No need to be worried-it is not a hindrance, nothing, mm? Only one thing is a hindrance in spiritual growth-that is a rejection of your self. Gay or not, that doesn’t matter-if you can accept totally, there is no hindrance. If you reject it, then there is hindrance. The hindrance comes not from your being gay; it comes from your rejecting it. If you accept, it is perfectly okay, mm? It is irrelevant in a way.”

          “Is there a possibility for gay people to transform sexual energy in a tantric way?”

          OSHO says, “Yes – as much possible as for any other type. There is no problem in it, mm? Accept yourself totally and enjoy the way you are; don’t put unnecessary pressure on yourself. And from every place one can move towards God. There is not a single place from where you cannot move, mm? So nothing to be worried about – just be happy and come back! Good!”

          ‘This Is It’
          Darshan Diary
          Tuesday, May 10, 1977

          “Sex is such a fundamental activity in nature that the ego of man started trying to get rid of it.

          The first thing I would like you to remember: sex is natural. There is no need to make any effort to get rid of it – although I know a moment comes when you transcend it, that is something totally different. It is not by your effort that you can get rid of it; if you try to get rid of it you will fall a victim of perversions. Because for centuries man has been trying to get rid of sex he has created many kinds of perversions.

          Homosexuality has arisen because we have deprived people of heterosexuality. Homosexuality was born as a religious phenomenon in the monasteries because we forced monks to live together in one place and nuns to live in one place, and we separated them by great walls.

          Still now there are Catholic monasteries in Europe where for twelve hundred years not a single woman has entered – not even a six-months baby, female baby, has been allowed to enter. What kind of people are living there who are afraid of a six-month-old girl? What kind of people? Must have become very much perverted, must be very much afraid they might do something. They cannot trust themselves.

          Homosexuality is BOUND to happen. It happens only in monasteries and in the army — because these are the two places where we don’t allow men and women to mix. Or it happens in boys’ and girls’ hostels; there also we don’t allow them to mix. The whole phenomenon of homosexuality is a by-product of this whole stupid upbringing. Homosexuality will disappear from the world the day we allow men and women to meet naturally.

          From their very childhood we start separating them. If a boy is playing with girls we condemn him. We say, “What are you doing? Are you a sissy? You are a boy, you are a man! Be a man, don’t play with girls!” If a boy is playing with dolls we immediately condemn him: “This is for girls.” If a girl is trying to climb a tree we stop her immediately: “This is not right; this is against feminine
          grace.” And if a girl tries and persists and is rebellious she is called a tomboy; she is not respected. We start creating these ugly divisions. Girls enjoy climbing trees; it is such a beautiful experience. And what is wrong in playing with dolls? A boy can carry dolls, because in life he will have to meet dolls and then he will be at a loss as to what to do!”


          ‘Be Still and Know’
          Responses to Disciples Questions
          Talks given from 01/09/79 am to 10/09/79 am

          10 Chapters
          Year published: 1981
          ‘Be Still and Know’
          Chapter 1
          Chapter title: ‘Always on the Rocks’
          1 September 1979 am, in Buddha Hall

          • Fresch says:

            Thanks, Arps, there must be even much more about the subject. As you see, it’s impossible to justify any discrimination or ‘goody-goody’ by quoting Osho, he has most often totally opposite ‘statements’ about anything.

            Also, taking anything out of context is bound to go wrong. I remember giving these little booklets, compilations of Osho on sex, as presents to some friends 20 years ago, which I would never do again. So, it was interesting that Anthony thinks even the content can be changed.

            It makes me think there should be a copyright that prevents current OIF from publishing Osho’s words. Until now, it’s been as if these 3 people in Pune know better than anybody else about the editing AND content (what is that, if not interfering in people’s inner journey?).

            I am not against Indians, but I need to be aware about their interpretations too and the rest of the cultures. So, free copyright for all would bring the awareness to the readers whose interpretations we are reading.

            • satyadeva says:

              These are good points, Fresch, showing the limitations and inherent dangers of picking and choosing, or of interfering with, censoring, ‘sanitising’ Osho’s spontaneous statements.

              In fact, discussion about differing interpretations of Osho’s statements – indeed, the very use of the word “interpretation” itself – further indicates the beginnings of a very slippery slope towards an ever-more-rigid sectarianism, the “we know better than you” mentality, characteristic of all religions that have followed the passing away of the original master.

              Seems inevitable, but at least here we have a ring-side view of it as it happens…Yes, most edifying; yeah, what fun.

            • jivan_rupavajra says:

              But this IS in context…the ‘one liners’ quoted by most for degrading based on own jerk reactions are ‘out of context’.

              Appears that Osho still stirs up great controversy – whether positive or negative, it does not matter.

  3. PremAnanto says:

    Seems like everyone and his holy uncle are jumping onto the Mindfulness bandwagon these days.

    Those BBC gigs pay well and the publicity won’t have hurt Swami Arun.
    Good luck to the lad.

    Just remind me where Osho mentions Mindfulness in its contemporary context though?

  4. Parmartha says:

    I pick up on something the Daily Mail repeats from Arun’s own Tapoban website:
    “…and ‘took initiation’ from (Osho) in 1974, before being ‘instructed’ to return to Nepal to ‘PIONEER THE OSHO MOVEMENT’.”

    This last statement is self-aggrandisement. Many people were told by Osho at leaving darshan to go back to their own country (Arun was Nepalese), start a centre and do his work there.

    Early names were Shyam Singha (sent back to London around the same time and who was the first to bring Osho to London) and Ma Poonam, who started a wider focused movement in the UK a few years later.

    My own brother, Prabhupada (Pada), was sent back to Ireland in 1977 with the same instruction, but sadly died on his way back.

  5. Parmartha says:

    I can only echo from a different direction what Lokesh says. The whole experience of this setting out Osho’s stall in London within an arch- respectable place like the BBC has of course led to later negative publicity, which is the opposite of what Arun wants.

    This Osho made sure of during his own lifetime with all those withering and mischievous remarks about everything….Like Lokesh,I thought the gay joke was very tongue-in-cheek and gave me a laugh, but I am sure ‘Stonewall’ would not be amused!

    Osho was a public relations nightmare and it WAS intentional!

  6. Shantam Prem says:

    Why British sannyasins don´t come on the front and face media and its trial?

    After all, many of them were the closest disciples when Osho was in body and many of them are still in public domain.

    • prem martyn says:

      Because I’d have to contact my teenage old flames who I haven’t seen for years and ask how come they became very famous in the national print media whilst I just blog online with a chuddie monster…And then they’d laugh when I remind them I went to India…whilst they went to Oxf and Camb…and cocktail parties with prime ministers…

      Arun expecting to spread Osho at the BBC…I must contact and tell her…She’ll piss herself silly….

  7. Shantam Prem says:

    “Osho was a public relations nightmare and it WAS intentional!”

    Again, experience from the phase which ended in 1985.
    As an editor and seeker, Parmartha, please get private coaching from the people who were with Osho during His Pune 2 phase.
    It will surely benefit you to see how Osho rose as phoenix from the ashes of the past.

    Is it not a matter of curiosity, with the name change, Osho dropped all the baggage from the past?

    His PR work was not nightmare but one after another, creative master strokes.

    • Shantam Prem says:

      I was surprised too, why few of my posts simply disappeared. I was not abusive or hitting anyone under the belt and yet they were censored.

      Good to know it was not SN team.


  8. chetna says:

    “This last statement is self-aggrandisement. Many people were told by Osho at leaving darshan to go back to their own country (Arun was Nepalese), start a centre and do his work there. Early names were Shyam Singha (sent back to London around the same time and who was the first to bring Osho to London) and Ma Poonam, who started a wider focused movement in the UK a few years later.”

    With a small difference that Tapoban is still alive and thriving and UK sannyas is asleep and snoring….

    Nice to know the world still remembers Osho and the news is still shocking and negative! Bring it on!

    • frank says:

      You are a supporter of Arun.
      Why is Arun calling the genocidist and Hindu nationalist fanatic, Modi,
      “a great yogi” and “an embodiment of Zorba the Buddha”?

      Is he just sucking up to him for political reasons,or does he really believe what he is saying?

      • chetna says:

        Frank – I don’t know – I am not his commentator. I hope he doesn’t, and he actually cannot, thinking it through.

        There is a massive gap between Nepal and India, so why would a PM of India listen to any Osho sannyasin from such a poor country like Nepal?

        • prem martyn says:

          Because when we are listening, with cup of jolly fine Liptons chai in hand, to jolly fine British BroadMindedfulness Corporations and hearing the midnight pip, pip, bong of the Big Bens, then one is thinking…By Jove, I am recognising this voice and ohh, my goodness, yes, it is that famous BBC Worldly Wise services and Teach Yourself Basic Breathing Co-ordination programme again with the uncle of the Auntie BBC, see…that is why we are listening…alll overrr the fine Bharat Mother India to the very fair mindedfulness Britishers….

        • frank says:

          Chetna, you ask,
          “Why would a PM of India listen to an Osho sannyasin from a poor country like Nepal?”

          Good point.

          I tend to be of the view that he believes what he says. That’s the impression he gives.

          Arun’s take on Modi’s involvement as state minister during the ethnic cleansing and massacre of muslims in Gujurat is:
          “In order to misrepresent him as an extremist hindu leader and deprive him of 20% muslim vote, a well-planned defamation propaganda was raised against him, because of which American govt. denied him a visa.”

          That is appalling ignorance at best, and complicity in mass-murder at worst.

          Maybe you neo-neo sannyasins feel you missed out on Osho and want to have your own “taste of fascism”…

          Watch out, kids.

      • Parmartha says:

        He is suffering ‘delusions of grandeur’.
        One gets this feeling from what he has written recently, and also he’s rewriting history to suit himself. I also understand that from a few who have been in contact with him of late.

        In the Nepalese context, something which calls itself ‘Sannyas’ may well become the state religion, give it a few more years!
        But it is nothing to do with anything.

        For me, the retreat into the past that Arun represents is the real sleep. Chetna does not seem to ‘understand’ what Osho was about at all. It’s an invisible thing, but if you can’t see it, then what can one say?

  9. prem martyn says:

    Can someone put some speech bubbles into the photo of the sitting listeners, please?…I really need to know what Jenny from Digital Post-Production Video and Global Marketing Department (2nd floor main building, turn right past Vrindavan and Meera main office) thinks about this.

  10. Shantam Prem says:

    Parmartha, to be fair to one and all, why point out a single person with a statement, “He is suffering ‘delusions of grandeur’”?

    As per the reports in financial magazines, every 10th Swiss is a millionaire. Most probably with another kind of benchmark, minimum every 10th sannyasin can be classified as suffering ‘delusions of grandeur’.

    Simple fact is, words of Osho are spoken in a simple, lucid language and have the maximum intoxicating effect, and then with this feeling to be closer to Osho at some point, it can take ages for soul to get humbling effect.

    And secondly, as far as Nepal is concerned, in my feeling he is doing tip-top as per the social and political norms of that country.
    Tell me a single westerner sannyasin doing similar thing in their own country.
    Yes, they are leading groups and offer Dynamic or Kundalini as soup and filler…I can understand, without dream groups with quick-fix promises, they will be on dole like me.

    • lokesh says:

      El Chudo simply does not grasp the fact that Osho saw his dynamic and kundalini meditations as very important, or why else have them running for years on end in his communes?

      Meanwhile, El Chudo believes he is involved in an absurd struggle to promote Osho’s legacy, whatever he imagines that embodies. If Osho has such a thing as a legacy, surely his dynamic and kundalini meditations would be an important part of it? Yet Chudo sees this as “soup and filler”. The man’s idiocy knows no bounds.

      • Shantam Prem says:

        I feel sorry for you, Lokesh. You may have a stable relation which more than 75% Osho disciples don´t have.
        Your so-called wisdom pours from that.

        Otherwise, your understanding is below average. You can not even understand the context of my posts – what to say about Osho?

        Next time, show my posts to your wife first. Let her dictate the reply.

        • lokesh says:

          My wife has better things to do with her time. I skip most of your posts, Chudo, because they are generally based on utter nonsense.

          It amuses me when you get all self-righteous about your mumbo-jumbo. That is about as good as it ever gets. An ironic smile on my lips and that is about it.

        • Arpana says:

          “You may have a stable relation, which more than 75% Osho disciples don´t have.”

          Who did the research on this, and when? And when and where was the research published?

          • lokesh says:

            Arps, as I said, most of El Chudo’s posts are mumbo-jumbo. He makes it all up as he goes along to support his warped purposes.

            Another point of interest is El Chudo’s hounding people for their Facebook identity etc. As is clearly evident, he uses whatever personal info you lend him in twisted ways. He is a very creepy chappie and all would do well to avoid letting him have personal info because he abuses the priviledge. He wants to know who others are while all the time not having a clue as to who he is himself.

            • Arpana says:

              Shantam doesn’t sound that different to the Jehovah’s Witness.

              • frank says:

                “Beware of false prophets.
                By their underwear ye shall know them.
                There will be wailing and gnashing of teeth, grunting and flapping sounds near the keyboard…
                But verily I say unto you,
                thou canst take the man out of the chuddies but thou canst not take the chuddies out of the man.”

                Proverbs 17:25

          • Shantam Prem says:

            Why go far away?
            Ask the 5-10 bloggers on this site.
            Then open Oshonews and look at the photos of classified ads. on the left side. Ask those therapists and session givers, how many of them have good family constellation.

            Sannyasins were from dysfunctional families. There is nothing wrong in it. It became blessing in disguise.
            Till now, in spite of all the groups about heart and sex, most of the sannyasins have no stable relation.

            It is a conclusion out of common sense and curious eyes.

            • lokesh says:

              Chudo, it is more likely a case of what your eyes want to see. I know many sannyasin couples on Ibiza who are happy together…some of them are gay, but that is their business. I would go so far as to say there are more sannyasins in relationships than singles on Ibiza.

              I reckon that sannyasins make good partners, because most of them are fine when they are on their own…or San Antonio, as we say in these parts.

  11. prem martyn says:

    ‘Radio Times’ BBC Magazine

    July 2nd

    Afternoon viewing: 3pm – Recommended

    Our favourite ANTIQUES PROGRAMME returns for a brand new season of selling on old but priceless gems with some endlessly repeating programme voice over that tells you all about valuing things you’d forgotten about.

    Today, the programme comes from Ahmedabad, India, where we will be looking at the effects of internecine religious genocide sponsored by Hindu fanatics and its effect on furniture prices and old bits of homespun philosophy…

    In the first programme, our roving reporter, Jenny Smithson – or using her new name, Ma Toadie Credibilia, will be asking the two teams, “Are you out of your mindfulness to pay $500 for someone claiming to be a messsenger on the divan?”

    To tune in to watch, just press the red button and for those who can not hear the programme, read the subtitles kindly provided by our Religious Question Time Team who are known as a great bunch of lads and, erm, meditators.

    Video Assistant: Reg Pickles (Swami Chili Picallili)
    Subtitle Unit: Dhobi or Not Dhobi Productions
    Prime Minister’s Religious Spokesman: Dr Namaste GuruVeda. (Swami Swan Vesta)
    Arun Cake and Biscuit Supplies: Modi and Modi Bun Fighters and Bakery.

  12. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    You seem to be a bit multi-tasking here, Parmartha , that´s why I would like to ask you, how come that a Jehovah’s Witness follower enters this website here, dedicated to sannyasins and fellow-travellers?

    I am allergic to ‘these couples, they did harass me here in Munich years ago
    in the flat I had before this one – strange alliances?

    If you can´t answer this, maybe the moderators can?



    • lokesh says:

      Maddie, that you could take a Jehovah’s witness seriously is a joke. Periodically, these people post on Caravanserai. I find it amusing you do not. Spot the difference.

  13. alokjohn says:

    I must say this has made my day. Now I am going to find the Daily Mail online and have a good laugh.
    Here is the Swami at the beeb

    Actually, I saw him briefly last week. He was giving a similar talk.

  14. Arpana says:

    Just a thought, which is slightly off-topic,
    but I wonder if all that fascistic shit that
    surfaced during the mala and red clothes
    days was an inevitable aspect, in part,
    of us wearing uniforms, especially once
    those new malas were introduced
    (the round perspex malas).

    Lot of arrogance came out on the part
    of wooden mala wearers towards those people.

    • frank says:

      Spirituality is the best game to play one-upmanship with, as there is no actual end product to prove yourself with, as with, say carpentry or guitar playing, or whatever.
      Even the acting skills needed are pretty rudimentary, as we can bear testimony.

      That’s why losers so often win in this game!

      • Arpana says:

        Good point, Frankus.

      • Shantam Prem says:

        And you chased the tail of spirituality your whole life, Shri Mr. Frank.

        Can you tell what kind of profession or job you have did?

        I mean, spending years in India or in Ranch; must have got good inheritance or ‘slum dog millionaire’ tricks.

      • Arpana says:

        The first waves of individuals who came to Osho during the mala and red clothes days (Westerners specifically) had parents who fought in the second world war, that is fathers and some mothers, in the USA, in Europe and the UK; people taking sannyas who’d done national service in the UK, their kids. Same in Europe. People taking sannyas who’d been affected by the draft in the USA, because of Vietnam.

  15. Shantam Prem says:

    There can be a case scenario.
    In the BBC faith meeting, someone asked Swami ji, “In such a big organisation like BBC, many times interpersonal conflicts arise. Sometimes management is too heady, what we should do to resolve this stress?”

    Swami ji looked in the eyes of the Camera and took the breath till his navel and answered, “In such situations, we tend to forget breathing. It decrease flow of oxygen, the life energy, We call this in East, Atmen. So, first of all, breathe for three minutes with the eyes closed and then meet like-minded colleagues. Someone will definitely know who is the best advocate to send legal notice to the closed-headed people.”

    In the field of advice giving, every second person is an expert. Only those experts are called for who have the best PR!

  16. frank says:

    Don`t forget that the ‘Daily Mail’ has no interest in Arun or Osho, they are more interested in using this as ammunition for their ongoing vendetta against the BBC.

    Anyone who believes what they read in in the ‘Daily Mail’ is unlikely to be on the path to enlightenment for a few lifetimes yet…
    except Shantam, of course.

    • swami anand anubodh says:

      The best way to threaten or try to influence the BBC is via their public funding.
      Reading through the online comments clearly shows who the DM are most keen to antagonize – the moaning TV licence fee payers.

      Someone at the DM has trawled through Osho’s work to find what would be most damming when taken out of context.
      They cannot encourage licence payers to boycott the fee directly, as that would be incitement to commit a criminal act, so they do it indirectly.

      Does anyone know if this story appeared in the paper’s hardcopy?

  17. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    Just thoughts, Arpana, when I read this morning your ‘just thoughts…’

    The thought that came by on my side was that having such comments, one can say:

    No outer ‘enemy’ any more is needed in the Sannyas realms – some of us do that kind of work thoroughly themselves.

    I only respond today because the latter quite often came along in my psyche in the last decades…

    Just another unhappy response from my side here – about that.


  18. swami anand anubodh says:

    Sam Lucas (aka The Christian Bodh Ekcuntam)

    I kinda hope he stays around longer than the ‘Three Lions’ did as I need something to keep me amused until the new Prem season kicks off.

    Oh, Btw…

    A previously unseen photo of Osho in Uruguay…

  19. Fresch says:

    For me, it’s clear this article is not against Arun, but against Osho. It’s sad some posts here are as if Suarez was biting his own leg.

    • Arpana says:

      He talks about gay and homosexuality at great length.
      By the look of it, a fat compilation book’s worth.
      Positive contradicting negative and vice versa.

      • prem martyn says:

        He was a closet ‘Daily Male’ reader…

        Contributions, please, to:
        The Sunyarse Nudes Defence fund,
        ‘The Dolly Male’,
        Modi Towers,
        Nepal-ling Really,
        Tunbridge Wells

    • Shantam Prem says:

      It is true, article is against Osho.
      What personal British doctor is doing in Pune?
      He can go home and change the perception.
      Maybe the personal dentist, Dr. Devageet, has forgotten to send his book for review to the Royalty-licker Press.

  20. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    “I kinda hope he stays around longer than the ‘Three Lions’ did as I need something to keep me amused until the new Prem season kicks off.”

    You are cynical, Swami Anand Anubodh.
    And you are not amusing figure yourself.


    • satyadeva says:

      On the contrary, Madhu, I find the photo quite amusing (and, btw, not at all disrespectful towards Osho).

      Perhaps you might need to ‘lighten up’ a bit, now and again….

    • swami anand anubodh says:

      “To make a German feel insecure, tell him a joke.”

      ‘Hari Om Tat Sat’
      Ch 29: ‘Nobody Is Missing Anything’

  21. madhu dagmar frantzen says:

    Maybe the reading of Subhuti’s short comment about “the blessings of English journalism”, from today in,
    could finish giving energy to the whole thing.

  22. Parmartha says:

    This is the Subhuti take on the Mail thing, which Madhu mentions.

    “Swami Anand Arun has had his first taste of the blessings of British journalism, showered with ‘compliments’ by The Daily Mail after giving a recent talk on mindfulness to a BBC ‘Faith Forum’ group of about 50 staff members at the BBC’s headquarters in London.

    Arun can take comfort from the fact that he is in good company. Earlier this year, JK Rowling, author and creator of the Harry Potter books, sued The Daily Mail for damaging remarks made on its website about her hardship years as a single mother. The article about Rowling was hastily removed soon after she filed the libel lawsuit.

    A year earlier, the popular cut-price airline Ryanair sued The Daily Mail for implying that its aircraft were unsafe and that its CEO, Michael O’Leary, was not complying with European safety regulations.

    The newspaper had to back down and settle out of court when it was revealed that the Irish Independent Aviation Authority had given Ryanair the same rating as the safest airlines in Europe.

    Predictably, The Daily Mail’s latest attack wasn’t aimed so much at Arun, who seems to have made a good impression at the Faith Forum, but at his association with Osho.

    The Daily Mail must have relied heavily on Google for its information about India’s ‘divisive mystic’ because it dredged up all the usual misinformation: Osho was anti-Semitic, against homosexuals, drove Rolls-Royces and created ashrams best known for promoting free sex and accumulating large sums of money. Ho-hum. Haven’t we heard this before?

    It was interesting to see how The Daily Mail particularly emphasised Osho’s alleged anti-Semitism, quoting him as saying that Adolf Hitler’s gassing of the Jews was a more peaceful method of killing people than the way Indians were mistreated under British colonial rule.

    It seems that today’s editors of The Daily Mail have forgotten the newspaper’s own notorious history: Lord Rothermere, who owned and guided the paper from 1922 until 1940, was a personal friend of both Adolf Hitler and Benito Mussolini, both vehemently anti-Semitic.

    In the 1930s, Lord Rothermere’s newspapers were the only ones among the British press to advocate an alliance with Nazi Germany and to support the British ‘Black Shirts’ Nazi Party.

    In 1938, Rothermere sent Hitler a telegram supporting his invasion of the Sudetenland and expressing the hope that “Adolf the Great” would become a popular figure in Britain.

    He did the same thing again when Hitler invaded Czechoslovakia in 1939 and went on to describe Hitler’s work as “great and superhuman”.

    The only reason he stopped his public support of Hitler – who by this time was murdering millions of Jews – was because Britain’s Jewish businessmen threatened to withdraw all advertising from his newspapers.

    With this kind of dirty laundry in its cupboard, it’s a wonder The Daily Mail has the nerve to accuse anyone else of anti-Semitism.

    There is a lot more one could say about The Daily Mail, such as its refusal in the 1980′s to support the international sporting boycott against pro-apartheid white South Africa, not to mention a string of successful libel actions against its chief gossip columnist, Nigel Dempster.

    But why bother? Suffice it to say that The Daily Mail, along with many other British newspapers, will never allow its readers to think for themselves, let alone introduce them to a deeper vision of life beyond the sensationalism they are served every morning with their breakfast, as soon as the newspaper pops in through the letterbox.”

  23. Parmartha says:

    Osho said a lot of things. But even a Daily Mail reader should know that he told jokes, and that when asked directly about anti-semitism this is what he said:

    Q: Is it true that you admire Hitler, and that you are anti-semitic?

    I have among my sannyasins forty percent Jews.
    I love Jews more than I love anybody else for the simple reason that they have suffered the most; they deserve the love of everyone. For centuries they have been suffering being killed, burned, raped…everything ugly and inhuman has been done to them. How can I be anti-Semitic? This is how your yellow journalism goes on spreading lies.

    I have made a statement about Adolf Hitler which has been distorted. I have said that Adolf Hitler and Mahatma Gandhi are not very different. Immediately, journalists thought I am admiring Adolf Hitler, comparing him with Mahatma Gandhi. I was simply condemning Mahatma Gandhi — but it seems stupidity has no limits.

    Osho, ‘Socrates Poisoned Again After 25 Centuries’, Chapter 15, Q. 6

  24. Shantam Prem says:

    I go through Daily Mail almost every day. Not because I appreciate their philosophy but it packs all kind of news in one box.

    Surely for the British smug, other than their royal family with all the puppies and WAGS, everybody and everything else is questionable.

    Though my jobs and career prospects would have been much better in UK, I resisted to shift there for the simple reason, it has monarchy.

    • satyadeva says:

      You’d be far better off reading the ‘I’ newspaper, Shantam, which is a tabloid version of the ‘Independent’.

      Minimum of ‘gossip’-type rubbish, interesting, informed articles without brain-dead right-wing or ‘middle England’ bias, global news – and a regular daily quote from contemporary spiritual ‘giants’, often including Osho….

  25. Shantam Prem says:

    Without doubt, Independent is the best newspaper from UK press. I read it, say, once a week.

    Daily Mail daily, where else can see flashing boob photos packed in the news format?

  26. swami anand anubodh says:

    Parmartha wrote: “But even a Daily Mail reader should know that he told jokes.”

    Sadly, your average DM reader is probably the type of person who takes jokes seriously.

    I did some checking and the article did not appear in the hardcopy of the paper as the DM knows anything unexpectedly too controversial can quickly be removed from online (Like JK Rowling).

    The fact is, Osho has a reputation which will always come back to haunt.

    ‘Bhagwan to Osho’ is much like ‘Windscale to Sellafield’.

    Sex scandals will never be bad for business, but for a bio-terror attack there is no workaround.
    Let’s not forget: the article is an attack on the BBC – not Osho. He has just been caught in the crossfire.

    Anyway…for those with a hunger to feel indignation, let me give you something to munch on.
    (And as a bonus, this should interest the Indians and ladies on SN, as this is how an Indian female views Osho)…

    It’s interesting to trawl through the 5 years of comments (Note: She has deleted many of the abusive ones).

    • Parmartha says:

      Given that for “for a bio-terror attack there is no workaround” (as Anubodh rightly points out) it is a compliment to those who took sannyas after 1985 to plunge ahead, despite such an unavoidable history.

  27. Parmartha says:

    Part of me must say this is all politics – yeah, sannyas politics – but politics it is.
    One big danger of ‘sannyas politics’ is that it disclaims any interest or use for politics – a particularly damning paradox!

    Of this particular debate, about the future of the place I once knew as ‘the ashram’, it seems to me rather a sad choice between ‘parties’ with whom I feel little affinity whatever way I look.

    The possibility of an Indian-style takeover associating itself to the recently-elected Hindu Nationalists does seem a poor way to continue Osho’s legacy as I knew it.

  28. madhu dagmar frantzen says:


    “Given that for “for a bio-terror attack there is no workaround” (as Anubodh rightly points out) it is a compliment to those who took sannyas after 1985 to plunge ahead, despite such an unavoidable history….”

    Very simple, Parmartha, they didn´t know about it; as well as most of those who joined the ‘caravan’ earlier and who sometimes had a pretty hard time even when they tried as best as can be with their intuition that something was going utterly wrong, but could neither find a way to communicate it, nor to hinder what was going on.

    The way – decades ago – it comes into discussion is mostly a way not helpful to really dissolve some issues but an ongoing procedure to keep bad vibrations going.

    One of the reasons I feel is that the protagonists who committed utter criminal actions don´t participate (like here) – but this is only one reason.

    One of the others is the immaturity of presumptions or fantasies and projections about issues which again, very, very few here, and presumably none of us, have knowledge about.

    So – kind of shit storms are easily brought on the go
    and that helps nothing and nobody, except some proudly presenting themselves as ‘experts’ in terms of ‘spiritual affairs’.

    What a pity!


    • Parmartha says:

      Well, perhaps, Madhu, maybe not specifically about the bio-terror!

      But many who took sannyas after 1985 knew that the Ranch was a very questionable period, yet still felt the ‘energy’ around Osho in Pune 2, for example, was ‘right’ for them, and took sannyas.

      As for those ‘ordinary’ sannyasins like myself, and I guess yourself, who took sannyas in the seventies – yes, it is true that we did not know anything like this was going on at all until after the event. There was always a feeling of dictatorship in the ’81 to ’85 period, but I and many communards always assumed (wrongly, it would seem) that it was a ‘device’.

      • Arpana says:

        I recall that I felt confused, torn between ‘your fault, my fault’, and generally tending towards ‘it’s a problem with my attitude’.

        Had a conversation with Veeresh at the ashram about the difference between surrender and submission, and in my view those who talked surrender loudest usually meant submit, but I usually ended up with the view that the problem was my attitude.

  29. madhu dagmar frantzen says:


    As far as shit-storming goes and Anthony and others
    German-bashing etc. etc. and find a quote…
    English natives hold the ‘gold-medal-line’ -

    And how narrow-minded that is….