An Enlightened Society as explored by Maitreya
Society is the sum of its parts. An enlightened society means that enlightenment is the highest value and everyone is consciously working towards spiritual awakening.
This was the case for the 4,000 years of the last age of enlightenment in India. In this golden age everyone had developed the third body to be responsible and almost everyone had access to the fourth body in meditation. The result was a flowering of creativity, spirituality and social development. There was little violence until the great war at the end of the cycle.
The absence of violence and abuse is essential, but it is not enough. When social and economic injustice exist, conflict is certain to follow. Most wars have been fought over control of land and resources. Ancient India had excessive private wealth, which bred the conflict that eventually led to the great war, the Mahabharat.
In the age of conscious civilization resources will be shared more equitably. There will be no poverty and there will be limits to personal wealth. Everyone will enjoy an abundant and comfortable lifestyle and the gap between rich and poor will be less than it is today. Everybody will be free to choose their work according to individual interest and capacity. Those with greater responsibility will enjoy a higher standard of living. But the difference between the living standard of a manager and a cleaner will not be as significant as it is today. There will be an abundance of material necessities for all to enjoy.
Enlightened ones will monitor those who are entrusted with responsibility to ensure there is no abuse of power. Spiritual growth will be given a high priority. Everyone will benefit from a lifestyle that supports the inner quest for awakening and freedom from suffering. Enlightened ones will meditate with seekers every day in a climate of love, awareness and playfulness.
Soon this utopian vision will be reality and our present violent, greedy and unjust society will be but a memory of the Kali Yuga, the age of darkness.
Maitreya
Amazing is this article. Hindu belief put forward by an India loving western mystic!
Majority of Indians almost everyday of their life think that forgotten era called Sat-Yuga(The age of truth),whereas these hundreds of millions have to live in Kal-Kuga(the dark age) as every day they have to encounter corrupt social and bureaucratic system, to keep oneself and family alive is an every day struggle.
Yes..this so called New age or the age of Enlightenment has dawned in India too…About its impact ask those wholesale commodity merchants, who have recently purchased Mercedes Benz E Class!
this same type of thinking is applied to osho in conservative circles that he is a product of ‘kali yuga’
Kali yuga lasts at least another 400.000 years.
What is new, enlightened monitor. I am on a good way, like a pope?
There is only one way, it’s called “Self – realizing”.
By realizing themselves, realize what’s true meaning of re – spect, better self – re – spect. Reverse look into our Truth of our Self, what’s always available any moment. Re -spect is Samasati. Not rated by an inserted enlightened high prist, but by our own experience of Self realizing, each of us.
Not a society with the claim to be good. Just being aware of once true Self would be enough. For sharing the resources please speak with Deutsche Bank and British Petroleum. The society isn’t greedy, they are ensnared by nice words. Because this greed isn’t part of our Self. At that point they start with the harassment of Humanity, with their Black Magic. No need for a new society, Humanity is fine. Just take out of Power the wrong people, and start relaxing within your Self and OUR existence.
p.s.
My Girlfriend said, should add my understanding of “Respect”.
-Re/Spectator-, Respectator abbreviated to Respect.
May the Watcher the same as my understanding of Respect.
Utterly unconvinced of all this Sat Yoga bullshit!
And also totally unconvinced that there was some past golden age of truth in India.
Also to talk of enlightened “societies” is nonsense. Whilst I would hold it possible that a very small number of human beings actually became nothing, and in that way became special to God, they have all been mercilessly trashed by the generality of human beings!
Even those “societies” that often coagulate around an enlightened teacher are miles off course in terms of understanding her or him…. hence the mess of Rajneeshpuram, and the murders of disciples around Rumi, the break up of Gurdjieff’s Paris commune, and the betrayals of Jesus’ disciples, to name just a few.
This sort of thinking by Maitreya is just utopian wish fulfillment in my view.
Parmartha,
I should have replied earlier because it is a darn good post. So whence this need? This longing for paradise? The utopian quest, whether spiritual or political? The rage for perfection? The hunger that won’t be fulfilled? I’m thinking of people like St. Paul and Lenin. Lenin said, give me 50 revolutionaries and I’ll change the world. He and Paul certainly did. I’m sympathetic to Marxism but not in a vulgar sense, prefer it to capitalism, which I think has failed. These are obviously rhetorical questions. Thanks.
Ah, thank goodness for Maitreya and his crystal ball. I can see him now on the Isle of Mann, peering through the veil that hides the future from us lesser mortals. And what a future it is; a spiritual communist state come theocracy, with everyone sitting around immersed in deep meditation. I can hear the thundering oms zapping through the astral plane, disturbing the ancients as they contemplate the tea leaves in the bottom of their cracked cups. What a load of utter nonzense. Good for a laugh, but that is about it.
My take is the world is already perfect as it is, hellish dimensions included. It is utterly brilliant in its complexity, diversity, karmic mechanistic payback and infinite beauty and ugliness and all the other ying-yangs of life rolling along right on time. I don’t think it was meant to be anything other than what it is right now.
The scales have tipped and it is very unlikely that the human realm will exist in its current form in 500 years let alone a Kali Yug’s worth. We have done and are in the process of doing a first class job of making our planet uninhabitable. As a species we are programmed to survive and somehow, like barnacles clinging to a space navigating liner, there will be survivors. It will be back to basics and due to less thought waves, because of a dramatically reduced global population, life will be more…ehm…enlightened, although not in some kind of utopia neverland as described by Maitreya. We’ll be too busy trying to light a fire. A good meditation if you lack matches or lighter. You don’t need a crystal ball to figure it out…just a TV tuned to an international news channel. Incoming! Wow, look at those IBMs on the horizon.
There was a song by American rock band MC5 back in the sixties. It ran ‘the future is here right now, if you want to take it’. I’m still singing that song and it is far more interesting than Maitreya’s Lobsang Rampaesque future dream…. no doubt a side-effect of enlightenmentosis overdosis,
Lokesh,
Your take reminds me of Cormac McCarthy who wrote The Road, which moved me to tears when I read it. The movie couldn’t measure up? McCarthy is a great writer and has no need to live a simple life on baked beans out in the wilderness. He obviously knows his values, a man with a big heart.
calm down guys….
if you see a car advert with a hottie in the front seat winking at you,do you think if you buy the car you will get the girl,too..?
maitreya is just doing a bit of advaitising
that`s all……
You’re stating the obvious there, Frank. Advaitising was what Maireya’s last post was all about also, trawling for potential clients to fit in his I’m an enlightened master movie. It is a sign of the times when Maitreya has to cast his net in SN’s murky waters. Business can’t be going too well. Hardly surprising when the poor guy is so out of touch he imagines his utopian vision might hook someone in these cynic-infested waters.
Kaliyug is just an hypothetical concept .
BR Ambedakar has written a book called ‘Riddles in Hinduism’ in it he proves that several places the time period of kali yug is different and changed several times.
Osho himself has called this type of thought to be reason for india’s backwardness(back in the 80′s but hopefully its developing now)
It makes you think that ‘good’ was only in the past and future is full of bullshit so better not innovate as it may be a sin because i am contributing to the deformed age of kali
From good arises good .From bad arises bad.
If the past was really so beautiful then how come the present is so bullshit?
probably it could have been used to subversive any rebellion
Ehm…er…because Shree Shantam is living in the Kali Yug?
Tilopa,
Thanks for this post. Ambedakar is a fascinating figure and you would know a lot me about him than I do. Interesting how he became a Buddhist. Wasn’t he also influenced by Kabir? There is a wonderful new translation of Kabir’s poetry. Arvind Krishna Mehrotra is the author of these new translations of Kabir. He is the editor of an Oxford Anthology of Indian Poetry and numerous other works.
This is one of his new translations from ‘The Songs of Kabir’.
I’m waiting for the ferry,
But where are we going,
And is there a paradise anyway?
Besides,
What will I,
Who see you everywhere,
Do there?
I’m okay where I am, says Kabir.
Spare me the trip.
roman,
have you read the “suppressed poems of rumi” by ergin nevit?
i was looking at it the other day.
apparently rumi was the first to coin the phrase “just do it”
re ambedkar.
he was a buddhist,but he wasn`t nearly ironic enough.
i think most of us on jackass news will agree that we like our buddhism a bit more post-modern.
for example “compassion for all sentient beings” has to include a few head-butts,blows below the belt,character assasinations,and left-hand hooks to the ego….
don`t you think?
I think Glasgow kiss is the current expression.
Frank,
Thanks for the reference. I’ll follow it through.
Re Ambedkar, you are probably right.
Camus wrote about ennui, tedium and boredom.
Sartre’s Nausea was originally titled Melancholia.
They didn’t just write teenage existential angst.
I think Camus’ ‘The Outsider’ and ‘The Plague’ are interesting novels. Byron once said, ‘that we are either bores or boring others’. I remember when I first came on this site and we had some laughs about noble lies. It was good fun.
Talk about post-modern buddhists. Remember the famous quote by Donald Rumsfeld US Defence Secretary:
‘Reports that say something hasn’t happened are always interesting to me, because as we know , there are known knows; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns – the ones we don’t know we don’t know.’
What a Master! Never know where you’ll meet an enlightened being in this post-modern world. Those bombs on the innocent will relieve the tedium. When it comes to religious texts science fiction is probably the best that’s around. ‘Watch Tower’ that the Jehovah Witness put out is more exciting than the new age bullshit. I don’t mind the ‘Book of Pearl’ by the Mormons. Not a bad story. Osho could really spin a yarn.
Frank, if you’ve read this I hope it isn’t all too boring. Have you read Ballard’s ‘Why I want to fuck Ronald Reagan’? An exciting read.
Enlightened Society?
It may never happen but the lotus Paradise of Osho can still fill the gap…
My appeal for that….
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
I watched this YT clip for ten seconds. It seems Shree Shantam’s sound recording skills are as underdeveloped as his communication skills. He sounds like a Klingon.
Yes, it seems we had been a hope for our Human future.
As Osho said, you are the last generation to rebel, if you don’t rebel, Humanity will be reduced to a commodity.
But, apparently we couldn’t manage to turn something. Not even our own commune, we couldn’t keep our place. At least many of us managed their lives actually very good. If it was enough in such world by our claim. Open to each of us judging on its own.
Two more Inhuman despiteous New Age Populists:
http://wemustknow.net/2011/12/cesar-millan-with-eckhart-tolle/
“Inhuman”?! Steady on, old boy, I suspect you’ve been meditating too much….
yes ,satyadeva,
make no mistake,the inhuman cesar milan is working with inhuman dogs for the forces of evil.he is clearly a freemason and so are his dogs.
he calls himself the dog whisperer,but that is a cunning cover–he is really a twelve-foot lizard whisperer…
and be aware…
the illuminati have been very cunning in selecting a soft spoken egghead who looks like a harmless garden gnome to destroy the very basis of humanity`s future…
Yes, I must say, their gig made me quite annoyed and provoked an over-exaggerated word choice.
It’s my lack of understanding of dog love and I do not understand the deeper truth, either. That Humanity will be better if people behave more like dogs tails. However, overreacted, shouldn’t have brought this Link.
preetam:”humanity will be better off if people behaved more like dogs”
that is pretty much the manifesto of cynicism,as expounded by Diogenes the cynic (and his dog),
who, according to Osho`s version of the classic meeting, Diogenes` dog laughed at Alexander the Great for his pretensions…..
i`ve actually seen similar myself.
on a south Indian beach where a lot of would-be western yogis show off their moves..
one day,i saw a dog wait patiently for the biggest poseur yogi, (who obviously thought his yogic energy was having a calming effect on the dog,sitting so meditatively,gazing at him single-pointedly like a devoted disciple) to elevate himself calmly and impressively into a full and perfect headstand….
at that moment,the dog grabbed the yogis shoulder bag from the ground and shook it like a dead rabbit.the poor yogi angrily and powerlessly shouting from his upside-down position as the dog detached him from his worldly possesions….
Lokesh, can you request your wife on my behalf to donate some good quality sound recording machine from her lottery win. I can use this to raise some voice in the world of Osho…
I could have asked you also for this favour but i know, you have not got that much money from your book publishing!
that`s what enlightenment and utopian communes are all about—people making personal attacks on each other at every opportunity.
and matreya should know that around here on SN,we are what that great “philosopher”dick van sloterdyke calls “ironic buddhists”…
hey,that reminds me,did you hear the one about the ironic buddhist?
an ironic buddhist walks into a bar…
an ironic buddhist,
actually,an ironic bodhisattva walks into a bar.
he sits down,orders a pint of sake and a packet of pork scratchings…
he then pulls a crystal dorje out of his pocket,and intones a prayer
“may all sentient beings feel compassion and reach enlightenment”
he then glasses the bartender with the crystal vajra and walks out……
Sounds like Saturday night in Glasgow.
Frank,
Nice post. We can all go ad hominen but it can also be funny.
Crossing the desert can get a bit boring.
I’m bored
I’m bored
I’m the chairman of the bored.
Mistakes are made but there are also lots of laughs. Cheers
Yes, true, but the movie rights brought in a six figure sum…so, can’t complain.
Frank, personal attacks on ideological grounds are part of the civilsed world, whether communites or the countries. Evolution lies in the friction.
Countires and societies,which prohibit such acts become like Syria on the top of the pyramid and Osho Resorts on its refined side.
On this platform, Lokesh and me are opponets (Saggitarius and Pisces will always bring different logics for the same thing) but not for a second, enemies.
sounds to me like your venus is in uranus.
Frank,
Liz Greene, a Jungian therapist, has done Osho’s horoscope and she has written about it. I was vaguely interested at the time. One could probably find it online.
Actually Aphrodite/Venus was a powerful deity. Always found it interesting how those of the new age movement talked about the god or goddess within. The Greeks who were polytheists could not imagine a deity being within them. If a young man said Apollo was within him, I would imagine the whole Acropolis blowing up, not just the young man. Some interesting writers say we are in the soul of the world. We all know Venus can’t be in Uranus. They are both planets ie Venus can be in Scorpio. Now there’s a thought. Astrology is an interesting tool. The images are not to be sneezed at.
Teertha, you can come with the early alchemists. To Shantam’s credit I have met some interesting Indian astologers. One was a very good dream therapist, who was a sannyasin. Probably not on this planet any more.
roman,
your venus is definitely in uranus.
heavily retrograde,i would say.
i`m a professional asstrologer,i should know….
Frank,
I guess you should know, being a professional. I’m not into abstractions and charts like you but I find the images in astrology and the tarot interesting. We all know the power of images. As someone said, stick with the image and they move the soul. Metaphorically speaking.
Remember Mr.Hankey from South Park. Now there’s an image.
Spiritual and religious business in India is growing with mind blowing speed. And somehow i blame this on Osho´s organisation; if you don´t bring the intelligent products before the people, people are bound to have quacks and babas.
And also it also shows, books cannot replace the real person. Most of the people will go to any doctor, howsoever unqualifed the person may be rather than buying the Materia Medica!
http://ibnlive.in.com/videos/250290/ftn-are-tv-babas-deluding-the-public.html
Shantam,
I watched the link.
Arthur Koestler wrote that Indians suffered from a Bapu complex.
Do you think there is some substance in this? Can the Bapus deliver the promised land?
these babas are doing important work for humanity.
our old mate freddie neitzsche was onto this one…..
he wondered who could best expose “religious” ideals for what they really are,a blight on humanity?
paradoxically,he found that the answer was… those characters who themselves embody and preach those ideals,for their carry-ons arouse suspicion in the intelligent….
franky sometimes i doubt you are reincarnation of fried-reich cheetah
Daily Mail´s contribution to have a meditative society…
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2133627/Give-brain-break–achieve-inner-peace-easy-guide-meditating.html
The above essay by Maitreya is a good example of what is sometimes called ‘selective history’, meaning, it is not based on any real study of the facts. A parallel example would be Margaret Murray’s 1921 study on Witchcraft, in which she claimed that an ancient ‘old religion’ had been persecuted through the middle ages and into the modern era. When careful study of the matter was finally undertaken (based on surviving trial records) it was determined that there was no evidence for any actual organized ‘nature’ witchcraft faith. It simply never existed.
The same is almost certainly true for the idea of some ‘utopian’ world that supposedly existed long ago. Thomas More first novelized the utopian ideal in the 16th century, but he at least admitted that it was a fictionalized account. Not that there’s anything wrong with the idea of an enlightened society. The whole notion of the Tibetan Shamballa-Shangri-La, Gurdjieff’s Sarmoung brotherhood, the ‘Great White Brotherhood’, or the Rosicrucian Enlightenment of the early 1600s (centered in Prague, via Emperor Rudolph) which was based on the myth of Christian Rosencruetz, the great ‘adept’ who had come to save humanity, has valid philosophical intentions, but when it gets into the hands of modern gurus it tends to get simplified and diluted. The problem, as I see it, is this: gurus get isolated, surrounded only by followers who reinforce their world-view, and so it become easy (and tempting) to indulge in strange accounts of history or prophecy.
Maitreya’s article, though referencing the past, is basically a form of prophecy, ultimately. Osho himself also delved into prophecy at times (as well as strange accounts of history — his take on Jesus, and his ‘burial’ in Kashmir, a known Kashmiri tourist-trumped myth, being an example). It would be interesting to compile a list of Osho’s prophecies. A simple Google of ‘Osho prophecies’ shows many.
Osho did not start giving prophecies until the Rajneeshpuram years. Was this the result of loss of clarity on his part? (Krishnamurti claimed this at the time). If an enlightened master starts giving prophecies, is he losing clarity? What do others here think?
Teertha,
John Hogue the internationally acclaimed scholar on Nostradamus
has interesting things to say about our future. His works are there to be consulted. He is a sannyasin. I can’t remember exactly what he says. My memory sometimes fails me. I do remember someone saying ‘history is a nightmare I can’t escape from.’ Wait a minute… it is coming back! I think it was Murphy, no wait it was Malone from Condom. Murphy lives in Hole. I’ve got it! It was Mr.Joyce. An Epiphany! Bloody amazing how memory works. I think I can remember the pre-patriarchial age when we were all living in matriarchial bliss worshipping the three breasted Goddess. Fatherhood didn’t exist. Didn’t the women around Osho love that little tale. We could only count to three back then and it was a lot better. Is that where the trinity came from? We all worshipped the GREAT MOTHER or was it The GRAND MOTHER? Anyway love your posts.
New Osho book maybe useful to you? Sign a big fat contract with Harper and Collins. Give us something to relieve the tedium. ‘Go for it’ as Frank’s Rumi would say and spare me a dime. Thank good for libraries. All the newspapers to read and then the Osho nursing home. We can all sing ‘There is so much magnificence in the ocean.’ Remember that one? We won’t be able to hold hands in our wheelchairs but we will look about at the snot green sea and tears will slid down our cheeks.
Our longing for paradise will be fulfilled. All is blessed. You have to laugh.
Roman, John Hogue has probably made the best of Nostradamus, but he’s been engaged in a kind of useless, no-win battle. Most prophecies are flat out wrong and never come to pass. John Michael Greer, one of the more rigorous occult scholars, recently put out a very good little book called ‘Apocalypse Not: Everything you know about 2012, Nostradamus, and the Rapture is Wrong’, in which he takes apart the whole field, demonstrated quite convincingly how prophecy is riddled with failure and agenda-ridden distortions.
In my ‘Magi’ book I made the mistake of stating that Hogue was not a disciple of Osho, when in fact (as you mention) he was a sannyasin. I’ve heard him on late night radio once or twice. A likeable and intelligent man but seems to have invested his energies in a pointless direction.
As for your idea of the Osho nursing home, sounds good, as long as it has Canadian beer.
Teertha,
Yes, John Hogue, Arjuna, is a very intelligent and warm person. I’m not into Nostradamus. I’ll try a Canadian Beer. A friend in Toronto also reommends them. Sent through a post but only a part went through, nothing offensive. I’ve had an interest in the whole study of pre-patriarchial cultures for a long time and the research going on in this by archaeologists and scholars. Many claim that female deities existed long before any male gods. The Venus of Willendorf goes back 30,000 years. My previous post to you, when I mentioned ‘The Great Grandmother’ , wasn’t dismissing the old Crone. I always admired the wisdom of my grandmother. To me seems that patriarchy won’t disappear too soon. Are utopias just wish fulfilment, as Freud would say, an old patriarch?. If matriachal cultures did exist, what went wrong? Did they destruct from within as well as from outside forces? Because of certain types of males? The whole area is fascinating. My post also mentioned Nirmala Devi, called herself the mother, a guru who also developed a large following. She has never appealed to me but she was connected to Osho. An interesting history there. She is in the video ‘Lord of the Full Moon’ all ‘blissed out’. Kakar in his book ‘Shamans, doctors and mystics’ says that she was once an apprentice to Osho. Thanks for the reply. One doesn’t have time to reply to some of the posts which are sent.
roman,
there`s a lot of history there.
a quick resume…..
nirmala devi used to hang out with acharya rajneesh.
she later denounced him in very crude sexual terms and publicly denied she had ever had any connection with him.
there was some dispute about this…
the photo that you mentioned was then used to prove that she was a liar.
osho’s story of her was that they had gone to visit muktananda together.
when they came out,nirmala expressed surprise at muktananda`s apparent lack of intelligence.
osho replied something like:
you are right,it shows that any stupid person can become a guru.
nirmala devi got the transmission at that moment and went on to become a guru in her own right.
no wonder “seekers” are so confused when they are following these kind of characters.
and can you imagine these jokers like john rogue publishing books promoting and making prophecies that turn out never to happen?
how do they bullshit their way out of that,after the fact?
you`ve got to admire their sheer front,if nothing else.
or is it just delusion?
my mate dave,the quantum mechanic says
“never under-estimate the power of denial”
Frank,
As we’ve said maybe just bad story telling. Her disciples seem to be middle-class clones, needing a stern mum. All this ‘cooling breezes bullshit.’ A Freudian psychiatrist, very appropriate, farted in her presence when he bent over to touch her feet. He just had a hot curry. There was pandemonium and he was almost lynched. I guess that was crude. Eric Hobsbawn’s ‘How to change the World – Tales of Marx and Marxism’ is cheap and looks interesting. Most of these little essays haven’t been published before. Thanks.
many sannyasin too seems to be middle-class clones, just instead of a stern mum they need a mad daddy. Funny this story of the freudian who farted in her presence. I’m wondering what would happen if someone farted in the presence of Bhagwan Shree Raj. when he was in the body? Somebody know?
Frank,
I heard the discourse about Devi and it was funny. De Nile is a big river and we’ve all had wet feet.
If a master like Osho starts to give prophecies, it probably means he is losing clarity, considering his teaching about “don’t beleive in anything, in any church, any sect, any bible, any veda, just experiment yourself”.
Or it could have been one of his many tricks in order to push his people in every possible way to eventually wake up , like this one:
“…During this period there will be every kind of destruction on Earth, including natural catastrophes and man manufactured auto-suicidal efforts. In other words there will be floods which have never been known since the time of Noah, along with earthquakes, volcanic eruptions and everything else that is possible through nature. The Earth cannot tolerate this type of mankind any longer. There will be wars which are bound to end in nuclear explosions, hence no ordinary Noah’s ark is going to save humanity. ”
Or it could have been simply a way to hurry up his people to buy a new huge property in another country than India so he can drive fast and furious his small collection of R.R.
I heard that Osho called in a public relations chap, who told Osho prophecies of doom are good for business. Mount Fuji blowing its top etc. At least Matreiya is walking on the sunny side of the street, I have a track on Soundcloud just now if you haven’t heard it check it…tomorrow never comes….it contains important messages for all and sundry, I was listening to it his morning….,beautiful.
http://soundcloud.com/luke-mitchell/osho-tommorow-never-comes
nice vibe…
prophecy is probably just bad storytelling.
but it sells.a bit.
those ludicrous nozzadamus books by john rogue sold ok.
altho you do see a fair few of them in charity shops!
By the way, an “old religion” in Europe really existed – never heard about paganism? Simply it wasn’t organized, cause the worship of the Nature cannot be organized the way monotheistic religions are.But it doesn’t mean it never existed. Never heard about the holy inquisition? Who do you think thay had burned for so long time all around Europe and few times outside also? every woman and man who had some knowledge about the use of plants, who go to some places in the forest where it’s believed there is something special, to dance for the full moon, who indulge in sexual activity other than to give birth, were declared witch and wizard, or simply followers of Satan,and got burned.The fact there is such a great denial and dissociation in the western soul from everything that is not rational and untouchable with your hands starts from there. There the basis for the dictatorship like comunism, fascism and finally the anglo-american-israeli globalization, all these systems can never be put into practice without the preparation of the soil (soul) made from the catholic church. In fact catholic means “universal” ,so is there the first attempt to globalize the world in one religion – one new world order – Hitler just developed something that was put into the western mind a long time ago.
YS, you are out of touch, just like Shantam, in regards all this eastern/western mind set. Relevent up to about 30 years ago the idea is now defunct. India is no longer the religious country it was etc. Our planet s now host to a global movement in that everyone worships money. Meanwhile, here on Ibiza we will be having a big healing festival next week with everything from yogis bending themselves into oms and tarot reading sessions, and it is all free. Per head of population this island is probably home to more advaitists than he whole of maharashtra. Yes, but who are you really?
You better start swimming or you’ll sink like a stone for the times they are a changing. (Prophet Bobby)
Personally I think it’s all Osho’s fault.
Yes, I’m aware of the Inquisitions and all the people who were burned. The point I was making is that they were burned for false reasons, i.e., that they were supposedly part of some secret organized faith designed to spread the work of the Devil. There was no secret organized faith, no sabbaths attended by baby-eating, broom-flying witches who were fornicating with the Devil, and there was no Devil either.
Also, most of these people burned at the stake were probably not herbalists, healers, or anything so romantic. Most were probably Christians who had failed to pay rent, bills, had feuds with relatives, etc., and were in turn accused of ‘malicia’, the general term for ‘evil’ or ‘ill intent’ that could be used to prosecute someone. (This was what drove the Salem trials, and the Loudon ‘devils’ when Urban Grandier was burned alive when his only crime was having sex with a nun). The witch-hunters were paid by bounty, so obviously had incentive.
If there’s no Devil, no secret evil organized Underground, then there’s no need for other compensating fantasies, like a perfect Jesus to save the day (or a perfect Baba), or a false history about some perfect past that is soon to be repeated.
We have to let go of fantasies, whether they be of utopia or anything else. The main fantasy sannyasins have had to deal with is the idea that enlightenment = perfection. Osho’s life was testament to what was wrong with that fantasy. We seek such fantasies because we fear our own mortality, and our own warts. Utopia, or apocalyptic prophecies, are so seductive because they seem to rescue us from our personal failures.
“Yes, I’m aware of the Inquisitions and all the people who were burned. The point I was making is that they were burned for false reasons, i.e., that they were supposedly part of some secret organized faith designed to spread the work of the Devil. There was no secret organized faith, no sabbaths attended by baby-eating, broom-flying witches who were fornicating with the Devil, and there was no Devil either.”
Agree with that.
“Also, most of these people burned at the stake were probably not herbalists, healers, or anything so romantic. Most were probably Christians who had failed to pay rent, bills, had feuds with relatives, etc., and were in turn accused of ‘malicia’”
that is just one part. People had lived in Europe a long time before those jews guy come to change the destiny of the western world (in a good or a bad way,i’m not really sure). Do you believe they have no religion, no cults, no mystical practice at all? They have,in many different ways, as polytheistic systems allowed much freedom of spiritual practice,like in India. Problem is that nothing remains from that except some legends, folklore and a few books (for example, The Metamorphoses of Apuleius). By the way, we are going pretty off topic with this and i don’t have academic study so i can’t compete with you.
“We have to let go of fantasies, whether they be of utopia or anything else. The main fantasy sannyasins have had to deal with is the idea that enlightenment = perfection. Osho’s life was testament to what was wrong with that fantasy. We seek such fantasies because we fear our own mortality, and our own warts. Utopia, or apocalyptic prophecies, are so seductive because they seem to rescue us from our personal failures.”
Agree.There may be collective failures as well, since it was a community that fell down,and responsibility was not the same amount for everyone involved. But that’s another story…..or not?
Teertha,
You are reminding me of Miller’s Crucible and he really researched the Salem’s witchhunts and linked them with McCarthyism. Huxley’s ‘Devils of Loudon’ comes to mind. ‘Oedipus and the Devil – Witchcraft, sexuality and religion in early and modern Europe’ is interesting. The author, Lyndal Roper, is a reader in this area at the University of London. Descartes played a role in the elimination of women being persecuted for witchcraft. We know he was a rationalist and he pointed out to the aristocracy that women weren’t responsible for animals dying or water being contaminated because of magic spells. Descartes was part of the scientific revolution but he went wrong with his ideas on animals and other matters. Seeing that we are looking at scapegoating I found it interesting travelling the world as a sannyasin.
I once received some hostile treatment from airport officers in Germany. There are other stories I could tell and we could all share. The scapegoating process is an interesting phenomena. On a more serious topic what’s a good Canadian beer? I’d like a sample before the nursing home.
Before the escapsists were going to Himalayas, now seems like, it is Ibiza. And there is nothing wrong in it..we all make our choices..and these choices become easy to impliment if other people work hard in the bad whether countries and we get the chance to live in Paradise…
I certainly don’t see anything wrong in escaping from normal people like Shree Shantam. They’re so boring…yawn.
Gideon Sundback, inventor of zipper, featured in Google doodle….
Resort manager will ask what is the need to remember dead and gone in some special way…
Are Google originators out of touch with the new thoughts prevaling in the spiritual market?
Any way, let us wait 2031, may be, just may be Osho gets a doodle on his 100th birthday!
Fascinating.
No, it is not. That’s what I often try sharing. My lack of English, don’t get it together as it should be understood.
Each of us is a Prophet. If one comes to know truth by self releasing. A process of understanding, a kind of gras growing. Out of the grass growing even the outer becomes clear, what is true and what is lie. If one urge explore truth at its deepest root, no way of avoiding the outer, because it is not apart, Heaven and Earth. By Realizing our true Self, light becomes obvious and from which place truth rises, and even the shade become crystal clear. Clear like the problem of a wrong oblation, the cause of the trouble.
See it as Teertha, no witchcraft. To me, a political acumen, useful for keeping power in the same Hand. A common trick for fear and control people of these time. Today they use climate problems, Agni V, shall I specify more, that way keeping people believe away from truth. Without those stories, maybe now one would remember Jesus by now. A big big show, or call it Black magic for the Gojim.
Are you on medication for your bouts of paranoia?
A little addition. Grass growes by itself, within the true Self. The Soil is awareness and the fertiliser is Love.
What kind of grass?
Tapas!
healing festival all for free! That’s the kind of thing that i like the most.And also,after the economic crush,i haven’t manage to find a payjob,so osho centers are out of my touch…I agree Osho have much more responsability in the changing of our world than what we normally think.Now enjoy this hippye musical,some of my friends are singing in there….http://youtu.be/yq9qWD64U4c
I like a good rainbow myself. Sweet!