The invitation of a true mystical teacher is perhaps exactly what those who run anti-cult organisations like “Inform”
in the UK say it is. It’s somehow to wrest the ego that constantly protects and defends what it sees as “its” body-mind away. This demands a certain streak of the rebel, and a certain streak of the explorer and risk taker in the disciple to even court such a course. And that is why Masters like Rumi constantly say , come again and again, they know how difficult it is, and they re-invite all those who would strive for it, however intermittantly. The resistance of the ego is very great, and so a genuine teacher has to try all and everything…. and therefore is said to be “very dangerous”. Well in a conventional sense he is, but it is actually the mark of proper mysticism.
The author of “Life of Osho” Sam (Prem Paritosh) ( the book still available from Sannyas News) is one of the few commentators on Osho to highlight the question of “Resistance” to such change in disciples and devotes a whole chapter to it.
Even more controversially he sees even the thirst for organisation, for the plunging of energy into the “Church’ as a form of “Resistance”, hence explaining it’s attraction to those who are actually running away from the real invitation of a Master.
He says
” It’s taken me a long time to come round to it, but I think all these people (the organisers of the Osho church) were resisting Osho just as much as I was (by my drug running). – only they were doing it
in a different way. They were just pretending to agree with what Osho was saying, while deep down they didn’t agree at all. Instinctively they knew something I learned only several years later – when I had a kid: the easiest way to say no is to say yes and not mean it…None of the people heading up at the temporal ashram wanted to go through the kind of crisis Osho was edging everything (and everyone) towards, that death of the self, any more than I did. And who can blame them? Osho’s accounts of what had happened to him were hardly reassuring. “It was all darkness… I was as good as mad…I could not talk to anybody…I was falling and falling…” Who was going to choose to go through with this?
What the people orgainising in the ashram did was say they were working to spread Osho’s ‘vision’ in the world – because that was the easiest way of not applying it to themselves. “Worship is a way to avoid the master” Osho said. ‘By worshipping him you start feeling that you are doing whatsoever you can do. What more is there? You need not change, worship is enough.’ Perhaps this is one of the basic mechanisms of all Churches. Certainly it would account for that phenomenon so obvious to everyone outside a Church, and so invisible to everyone inside it: that they are all such hypocrites.”
So SN readers, what say you?
Parmartha
I am so curious to meet those, who have died as Self and reborn as God, can i have the addresses of few such people?
The problem Shantam is that they do not want to meet you!
They are silent, do not announce themselves and have no address.
‘ What the people orgainising in the ashram did was say they were working to spread Osho’s ‘vision’ in the world – because that was the easiest way of not applying it to themselves.’
But not consciously.
(Excellent piece by the way. So much in it. )
I’m about as interested in being involved with an anti-cult as I am in being involved in a cult, which is to say not at all.
I reckon the problem doesn’t lie in dropping the ego, but rather dropping the mind. This is because by dropping the mind, ignoring it or by somehow seeing one’s self as a watcher on the hills observing the mind the danger of short-circuiting the mind’s critical faculties is always present. Our critical faculties are needed, amongst other things, to help us determine what will benefit us or be detrimental to us. By surrendering to a guru you are, amongst other things, saying that the guru knows what is best for you. In Osho’s case a good example would be when he went through his mass sterilization phase. Young women had themselves sterilized and some doubtless, further down the line, realized they wanted to have children. In many cases those sterilization procedeures were irreversible. By following Osho’s advice they made a decision that affected their lives forever and I am sure some regreted that. Part of Osho’s logic at the time was that the world was overpopulated and didn’t need any more children. This is true in relation to India but not all European countries, where the system is straining to support elderly citizens due to their a lack of young people to contribute into the social system. Of course Osho was promoting the ‘children distract from your spiritual evolution’ angle also. Some will say, myself included, that this is typical guru authoritarianism at play and what is actually going on is that the guru wants the emotional energy usually generated for child rearing to be directed towards them. Look at people’s faces adoring a guru, they look the same as those of adoring parents watching their offspring at play.
Sam’s books is for me one of the best written about Osho. In Poona One ‘resistance’ was a key word. I was often told by the zen mistresses that I was resistant. I was. Not to Osho but to their overinflated spiritual ego trips. In my many meetings with Osho he never even hinted that I was in any way resistant towards his energy. I suffered guilt at times in the ashram game role reality for my so-called resistance. I once heard Osho describe guilt as the most useless emotion, yet their were plenty of guilt trips being laid down in the ashram and all in the name of surrender. A bit of a contradiction, one of many in ashram life in those bygone days. In retrospect I feel good about my resistance to what I now know was often bullshit. What got me through those times was the fact that I have always been rebelious and I saw in Osho’s eyes the spirit of rebellion shining bright…who knows? Maybe it was simply a reflection. Be that as it may I stuck to my rebellious ways and to this day harbour no regrets about my decision whatsoever and I’m quite sure, were Osho still alive, that he’d have had a wee chuckle about the fact that I stood up for what I am and not what some misguided fool thinks I should be.
Surrender is the key to the door of the guru/disciple relationship. The thing is, surrender can take many forms and one’s personal manifestatation of surrender to a guru can be seemingly quite the opposite to that of others. Ultimately what is in your heart counts for almost everything. If you can sincerely bow down at the feet of say a beautiful flower, lover or friend there is for me no difference from bowing down at a super-guru’s well manicured tootsies. It is the act of surrender that counts. While being told I was resistant I was in fact bowing down in my heart to the spirit of rebellion. There is so much more to life than that which the physical eye can see.
“resistance” is also a key part of the whole psycho-therapeutic setup.
when the patient doesnt get along with the viewpoint of the therapist,she becomes “resistant”. the consideration that the therapist,for example, may be a coke-addled,tobacco addicted zealot who doesnt like people and is trying to ram his theories where they dont fit, is not considered!!
the marriage of the resistance factor in psychotherapy and the idea of the resistance of the very ego in the disciple against the master was an absolute disaster.
in retrospect,a crypto-fascist set up was utterly inevitable.
i suppose “resistance” as the sustainer of all problems is just such a simple and powerful all-embracing all-solving idea..
who was it that said….
“every Big Idea is a megalomaniac bent on world domination”
?
Another side to that view point.
Individuals who needed to learn to say no, did! Maybe not
everyone who needed to, but some.
Resistance and let go. Two sides of a coin.
My experience is that the ego or mind, or whatever you will call this movement that is always resisting when the experience feels uncomfortable, does this in the form of pushing it away, therapeuting, wanting to solve it ,joking it away etc.
Or when the experience is comfortable, it wants to hold on to it with various strategies! These numerous positions in order to deal with Life as it comes moment to moment, is samsara. I also used to feel quilty because of my resistance, but how on earth could or can I not be resistant if I identify this movement of pushing away or grabbing as me?? And even if I try not to do that, that’s again another movement, or if I would say, oh, that’s an illusion, that’s another position. The only thing I can do is watch it, and ask the question what is watching?? The 3rd stage in dynamic, who,who,who????!!!
The ways of the mind are as infinite as the grains of sand on a beach. Who is to say that which is watching that which is watching ad infinitum is not some kind of abstract spiritual ego trip?
According to what I’ve learned the witnessing of thought is the first step. If maintained thoughts dematerialize. The next step is to witness that which is watching. When this happens there is no question of asking what is watching because you are it.
I am just about to go for a long swim in the sea. This is the platform for my daily meditation. When swimming I at first try to remain aware of the present. No easy task. After say twenty strokes I am usually caught in some thought/dream dimension a long way from the sea in regards inner space. I return to the present and increase the body’s efforts to a point that I am held in the moment. Once in a while the experiencing becomes total and I am it. The mind claws to hold on like a scared monkey. There is a humourous aspect to this. Not always the case as for instance when one is suddenly gripped by anger and higher chakra burn out. Can take days to recover. Meditation is for me a way of life and well beyond meditation techniques, which have little to do with meditation as such other than being a precursor to the real thing. Time appears to pass and meditation becomes more and more a part of life. I’m a long way from completion…at least I am aware of that…but I do understand that the process is gradual, although I know that completion itself must be spontaneous by nature.
lokesh,
what is “higher chakra burn-out”?
Osho always talked about meditation. I presumed he meant the natural state, being awake. Still, I find it strange that he used the word meditation, as I always saw it more as a doing word ; i.o.w the bliss, silence or oneness to be achieved during or at the end of the meditation. This would last for a while, if I was lucky, and then I would fall into the groggy old self again, until I would get fed up with that and start meditating to feel “better” again! I was always under the impression that bliss, silence, oneness was being awake, and feeling low and depressed was being asleep, and… terribly wrong! This meant I was always in this vicious circle, until some teacher let me see that this is still duality, this wip-wop of being awake-asleep-awake-asleep, and that they are both being witnessed, one isn’t bettter or worse than the other! This was a great insight, it doesn’t mean that the mechanism has changed, but at least there’s less guilt about being on the low side!
Frank asks, what is “higher chakra burn-out”?
I’ll put it like this. I think it fair to say that we are all trying our best to do a good job of being a decent human being, meaning we want to be cool, don’t want to hurt anyone and get on with our lives as peacefully as possible and live in harmony with those around us. I could add more to the list but that creates enough of a picture to be going on with and I think most visiting this site will be able to relate to that, although there will always be exceptions.
So there you are, living out the dream that you exist as a seperate entity, feeling good, hey..life’s a blast. Most days I’m centred around the heart and feel a warm vibe. My wife, for instance, is more hara centred being an old tai-chi practitioner. I find hara vibes a bit heavy but there you go, we all work from different centres in the body mind complex. Personally I always appreciated Gurdieffs three centre vision, but there I am getting away from the point.
Suddenly…Bam! Some almost insignificant incident catapults you into the anger zone. Temprature is rising along with the searing hot flames. The energy rushes into the finer nerve systems of your organism like burning hot lava and that cool, enjoying and celebrating life that you have been working on goes right out of the window and tumbles into hell. Fortunately this no longer happens so much in my life but when it does I can feel burned out from it for days. The effects usually include a heavy gut feeling, off centredness and a general malaise of the soul, wherein external reality loses its shine etc. I call that higher chakra burn out because the fire begins down below and shoots up into cooler more refined energy centres and damages them.
Anger is a biggy for some folks and being a hot-headed highlander in my youth it didn’t take me too long to figure out that I had to sort my anger trip out. Osho’s dynamic meditation was a real blessing for me, as were all the full on encounter groups I participated in. Some people never manage to work through the anger zone. I have one friend who is always boiling in anger just below the surface. He just needs to talk about something he feels passionate about and soon you see the rage in his eyes and the sweat on his upper lip. His face is deeply lined with sharp angles, often an indication of an angry temprement. Anger is a doorway to hell and the sooner you see that the better. Yes, there can be something beautiful in a youthful person’s pur anger, but once you get further down the road it looks plain ugly and undignified, although I can dig the story when JC chucked the moneychangers out of the temple. Righteous!
Maybe it’s time to ease off on the buckfast tonic wine…
That stuff nearly burnt out quite a few of my chakras, I must say….
For me, Resistance has its roots in the Rebellion against the Repressors of truth. Basically, resistance is part of fear. Spiritually, I see Resistance as a kind of confusion, or self-doubt. I would say, Resistance has reality as long one did not realize himself.
The confusion and chaos that causes our resistance has been created before 12.000 years, by a group of Hunters and Gatherers who learned to follow the Hermetic Order and created “Heaven and God”, to control their Human Resources. Moreover, they created the Idea of being a Royalty, the only heavily accepted ambassadors on Earth and worth sacrificing to them. No self-achieved Prophet will ever under their ruling be accepted. We are forced by this group to resist our truth; our true nature is Silence, Celebration and Devotion, our natural trait.
Rintrah roars and shakes his fires in the burdened air,
hungry clouds swag on the deep……..
Once meek, and in a perilous path,
The just man kept his course along
The vale of death.
Roses are planted where thorns grow,
And on the barren heath
Sing the honey bees.
Yeah, the monk’s strange brew. Never been a big fan of alcohol myself. Not enough bounce per ounce, but I am partial to a wee bottle of single malt. Hootz!
Charlie Chakra rides again.
Footprints of contemporary wisemen -
When all the others are looking for profession, book your one way ticket to India. Truth follows those who chase her with the burning passion of youth.
Osho is dead, but many new showrooms offer similar products. No sannyas but Diksha etc.
Free sex is no more a slogan but stuff is still available.
Deep, deep meditation, inner relaxation. feeling of oneness with one and all.
In this relaxed state, when woman looks more than a body, some woman enters the life. She was looking for a mature man who treats her more than a body.
Few months of cross country India, feelings of creating a nest arises. But not in London, Frankfurt or New York. It must be Bayern Bay, Ibiza or Hawaii!
Not difficult. As other than spirituality, the wise couple has also got diploma in India to be street- -smart in a cutting edge world.
Create the home, earn money this way or that. In case of need create win/win business enterprise with friends in “Manali”. Anyway, existence helps those who are searching the way back home.
Swim with Dolphins. Offer insights to the friends and neighbours. Feel wise. One has arrived. If not the last station but quite closer.
When meditation becomes way of life, one wonders, why the hell people are still looking for Mystery in the organised mystery schools!
“Bayern Bay”?
Now that’s a cool place.
Surfing all day in my lederhosen on massive waves of amber fluid…
Blowing didge in an oompha band down by the billabong…
Stooping off for veggie bratwurst in the health food store on the beach…
All-day beerfests with the local aborigines…
Showin’ yer koala to the local frauleins…
ya,gut`tag, mate!
Those were the best days of my life.
Buch of jerry sheilas who don’t know how to tear a tab of a blueie.
I think I know what you are saying but you make it sound oh, so complicated. Resistance is, resistance to love. Crowley’s suggestion was “LOVE UNDER WILL”. Force (if necessary) yourself to love, and watch the resistance. Put on the eyes of love and observe the resistance fade away because the watched knows it is being loved.
If it helps, my sannyas motto is, ‘Love first, always.’ It doesn’t always work but I do my best.
Karima says:
>> The only thing I can do is watch it, and ask the question what is watching??
>> The 3rd stage in dynamic, who,who,who????!!!
Osho called it “A Third Entity”.
Vartan
Dynamic is still popular with some sannyasins on Ibiza. Had a friend pass by yesterday. We call him the ‘Fool on the Hill’ because he lives on top of a wee mountain and rarely goes out. He does dynamic and kundalini religiously. It would appear that the benefits include, feeling good, positive outlook, believing Osho is your master and planning to holiday in Poona over the winter. He is resistant to Bayern Bay because he does not speak German. We all have our problems.
Osho was never too hot on Crowley, who I once heard him describe as being misguided. Osho did not practise any of his meditations himself and it was once generally understood that they were intended as a beginning and not an end. In Poona One, once you’d done enough of Osho’s meditations, you began to work(worship) in the commune, I cannot recall anyone who lived close to Osho doing any of his active meditation techniques. One could conclude that they are for beginners. Whatever gets you through the night. I don’t have any judgements about it one way or another. From my own experience I’d say you risk damaging your knees by doing dynamic for an exteneded period of time, thus making it difficult to bow down at the feet of the master, which could be mistaken by others as a sign of resistance.
Lokesh says: “I don’t have any judgements about it one way or another”. Oh really? You really have been sipping some noxious brew, damaged your tiny brain a bit. If my eyes haven’t been deceiving me, all of your posts have been judgements about one thing or another, one person or another; as with your above judgement: “Had a friend pass by yesterday. We call him the “Fool on the Hill….” Some friend you are Lokes, with a friend like you, who needs to go out and about and meet other “friends”? Kindly, sir, you need to swap places with the “Fool on the Hill”, at the worst you’ll lose your tan.
Baba, you’re mistaken, perhaps I have not communicated clearly, usually Shantam’s department.
For a start, the Fool on the Hill likes the title and uses it himself. Taken from an old Beatles song it is a fine name and very suited to this particular friend who enjoys nothing better than having a chat with the salamanders and watching the sun coming up and going down, not to mention the world spinning round, and of couse he lives on a hill. I love the man for what he is.
I don’t have a tiny brain and you are taking what I said out of context. I don’t have a problem with judging because the way I see it a person who has no judgements often has no values. This no judging thing is a throwback to Poona One days and the people who haven’t moved on from there, the same people who could have made a judgement about say Sheela’s behaviour on the ranch and perhaps if enough had the guts to judge her actions wrong the damage she wreaked would have been thwarted and a whole lot of innocent men, women and children would not have been poisoned.
Your comment is an obvious putdown but I won’t go for it, Baba. Putting others down to make oneself feel elevated is kid’s stuff. Perhaps you need to look at why you take a simple remark and make so many judgements about it. Ultimately it is your business, not mine.
Out of context? I think you have forgotten what you said, a common problem with humans – a very short memory. A famous quote from that famous singer Madonna,”people have a memory span of about 15 minutes”. You are just one of the crowd. What part of not having “any judgements about it…”? Yes, it’s about one thing but then you have the balls to hide behind the statement that “The Fool on the Hill”, uses that name himself, and likes it. An obvious attempt to deflect criticism. Be an (old) man and fess up to your arrogance.
You’ve been busted, pops. Just pointing out your constant “put downs”.
I’d like to know who is responsible for leaving the kindergarden gate open and allowing you access to a computer. Disciplinary action must be taken to avoid Baba straying onto the street and risk being run over by a garbage truck. Mum and dad Svetlana would be devastated.
The following article is unrelated to this post. But Osho clearly mentioned here not to burn his body immediately after his death. Why then his body was burned immediately?.
http://www.spiritquotes.com/osho-on-death-of-a-loved-one.htm
Thank God that reference wasn’t seen at the time. We could have ended up with a preserved Osho in our hands.
When bodies are disposed-of too quickly it always leaves a sour taste. Do you feel He had much longer to live?
Vartan
Yeah, that woulda been weird…
Someone could have done a Damian Hirst and stuck him in a tank of formaldehyde…
“The impossibility of death in the mind of someone living.”
“…Damian Hirst and stuck him in a tank of formaldehyde” – great idea!
Hey, the title of the neo-Damian Hirst `Osho in Formaldehyde` installation would have to be updated to:
“The impossibility of enlightenment in the mind of the unenlightened.”
That would have been what ol` Georgie G called “objective art”, for sure….
If that is true, they even took away his process of dying and we were celebrating and dancing to it…Such procedure wouldn’t surprise me; it fits well within that face of barbarity, destructive against Truth at a line where the enlightened and unenlightened try to gather.
.
According to the link below the quick burning was to hide a case of assisted suicide.
How did Osho die?
http://www.evi.com/q/how_did_osho_die
Vartan
Why then his body was burned immediately?. Possibly to avoid an autopsy by the coroner’s office.
From the above opening piece posted by Parmartha, quoting Paritosh:
“What the people organising in the ashram did was say they were working to spread Osho’s ‘vision’ in the world – because that was the easiest way of not applying it to themselves. “Worship is a way to avoid the master”, Osho said. “By worshipping him you start feeling that you are doing whatsoever you can do. What more is there? You need not change, worship is enough.” Perhaps this is one of the basic mechanisms of all Churches. Certainly it would account for that phenomenon so obvious to everyone outside a Church, and so invisible to everyone inside it: that they are all such hypocrites.”
There has always been this basic problem with transformational work, the dichotomy between the ‘inner’, so-called ‘invisible’ school, and the outer, visible school (which eventually either disappears, or fossilize into churches). Clearly, not all churches have been bad — for example, in the Dark Ages (after the collapse of the Roman Empire), it was the churches (monasteries) that preserved what wisdom there was. Tibetan monasteries preserved their wisdom for centuries, etc.
There are other ways of transmitting wisdom, what Gurdjieff called ‘legominisms’ – wisdom passed on in scrambled form, to be decoded when the time is right. He thought examples of this scrambled wisdom could be found in the Tarot cards, or ancient monuments like the Giza pyramids, Sphinx, or even the game of chess. The ‘Tibetan Book of the Dead’ was supposedly a legominism transmitted by Padma Sambhava, who was a type of 9th century Osho.
Legominisms were part of the ‘invisible school’, the ones who decided that churches don’t work, or at least not very well, susceptible to being corrupted and used for purposes opposite to what they were intended. (Parallel examples being Hegel’s philosophy being used by Marx to justify communism, or Nietzsche’s being used by the Nazi hierarchy to justify extreme nationalism).
I think Osho ultimately wanted his work to be transmitted by an ‘invisible school’ (as opposed to a church) – perhaps that’s why he endorsed the usage of things like an ‘Osho Zen Tarot deck’, giant ashram pyramids, music and meditation, etc., to represent his teachings. But in the end, I don’t think Osho’s ideas or work was ever coherent or organized enough to become any sort of doctrine that could be adopted by some church of Osho-anity in the future. He was too much like Socrates, too much given to free-flowing discourse and dialectic, to ever be successfully ‘organized’ by anyone. So Paritosh’s point, while interesting, is probably nothing to worry about, because Osho planted a natural ‘self-destruct’ device into his own work – that being the impossibility of truly making any sort of system out of his teachings. And if there is no system, there can be no real church.
When there is no living master, neither there is a living community around, end result will be the mind -set of Sw. Bodhi Vartan, finding the cause of his master´s death through some paragrpah in the net.
AQnd the answer of Lokesh shows, man has not seen the climax scene. Like in the Indian movie theatres, he went for a pee in the last minutes, thinking soon all the guys will rush towards the stinky wall!
Well Shantam, perhaps you saw the so-called climax scene but even if you did it obviously didn’t do you much good. You are still apparently in competition, for what is anyone’s guess. And you still come away with your racist bullshit, something which Osho would never have condoned, because it is such basic conditioning and yet you can’t see past it.
You say, ‘When there is no living master, neither there is a living community around.’ If you truly beleived that you’d drop your whole resort trip…but you don’t want to believe that, because then this stupid crusade you are on would have to go and you don’t want that because it gives you the false impression that you are somebody. Giving your life substance from external crusades only shows that you have not come to realize the real revolution is an inner one. Had you come to that point you would not be bothered with any of that crap. You praise Teertha’s essay, although you miss the conclusion: ‘I think Osho ultimately wanted his work to be transmitted by an ‘invisible school’. I agree with that and it is happening, but like old Bob Dylan’s song goes, ‘There’s something happening but you don’t know what it is, do you Mister Jones?’
The joke is on you, Shantam.
And the answer of Shantam shows, man has not seen the climax scene. Like in the Indian movie theatres, he went for a pee in the last minutes, thinking soon all the guys will rush towards the stinky wall!
And being present at final stage of climax scene he came and went on back of hand in rush of self-induced joy!
Frank, forgive me if I mistake what you are implying, but is it honestly your learned opinion that Shantam is a chronic masturbator. I’m shocked!
Lokesh, not at all, I take him very seriously.
After all, not only is he a self-proclaimed reincarnation of Shiva Shanker, also he is an adept in the ancient Chinese art of huan-kin….
Maybe all that eso-exo religious stuff is over-egging the pudding and all wisdom is legoministic…?
Whatever they call themselves or whatever aim they claim to have,
intelligent people will transmit intelligence.
Stupid, ignorant people will transmit stupid ignorance…
Simples!
You appear to have forgotten the role of Shantam’s chuddies in all this.
Perhaps I’m missing something. I’m aware that Shantam wears chuddies but is he some kind of Lego auto-erotic freak also?
I think that could be what Gurdjieff called lego-onanism….
“And if there is no system, there can be no real church”,Teertha concludes his beautifully written essay.
Sometimes I wonder, why people get piles with the idea of Organised form, symbolically called Church.
Only some fanatic will think, small retail and organised sector cannot survive together. One should be either pro-abortion or anti-abortion. In a very insane world, right of citizenship will be given only to those who are vegetarians or follow a certain dress code.
Osho is unique in a way, as He tried to bring self-service superstore model in the single-item-based religions…It was working perfectly well.
If you are allergic to Kirtan, simply take your friend in Popular Heights and make loud love…
If you don´t want to participate in the evening meditation as many will sing Happy Birthday, Osho, just don´t go. No schoolmaster is making the attendance…
But the reverse has taken place just 20 years after Patriarch death. The whiter than white bosses have attendance register to control, which of their students and workers are not coming to the evening meditation….
“’I think Osho ultimately wanted his work to be transmitted by an ‘invisible school’. I agree with that and it is happening!”
Shri Lokesh Ji Maharaj….
v/s
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
Da Vinci was an Indian sketch – Goodness Gracious Me – BBC Comedy
“’I think Osho ultimately wanted his work to be transmitted by an ‘invisible school’. I agree with that and it is happening!”
Teertha, the great
v/s
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
Santa is an Indian
Swami Santa ji is produced before the court on the charge of murdering his wife.
Swami ji has not hired an advocate.He is quite capable to argue his case.
He pleades, ” No Sir, i did not kill her but redeemed her soul. She was doing too much meditation to be free from ego and the wheel of life and death. I fulfilled her wish”.
To impose one´s own mind over any incident is not difficult.
The humbug idea, “I think Osho ultimately wanted his work to be transmitted by an ‘invisible school’”, is one such.
People are adament to impose their Gurdieff, their Ramana, their Punja on Osho. It fits with their life style.
I know so many clever Indians, who will never say, ‘Business has gone bankrupt.’ On the contrary, logic will be, ” Brother, I have done enough, Now I want to concentrate on meditation with my master”
I must admit, I do agree with you on that point, Shantam.
I once knew a guy who tried to be a lawyer, he said.
I don’t think he had the brains and gave up and went to concentarte on his meditation with his master.
He tried to become a bigshot in some religious organisation, but he never got anywhere with that either, he was just too dim.
He just couldn’t see it.
It was pathetic, really.
Frank – you’re talking about Shantam, no?
I don´t doubt that somekind of Invisible school is not existing. Life itself is a school where every incident is a lecture sent by the department chief of Correspondance course.
99.99999999998% humanity does not even care whether someone like Osho is alive or dead. They have really no interest in his visible and invisible school…And I say with my hand on the heart, even these people are being directed and guided by some Invisible school.
In my eyes, some ego suck will think himself as part of some elite invisible school. Rest are all Masses…!!
The Osho Zen tarot deck is the best-selling Osho title of all, isn’t it?
I`ve met quite a few people who have it and even do readings for money with it, and they have no clue who Osho is/was.
That’s gotta be “invisible” teaching.
Some say that that’s just book/mind-learning and those people haven’t really experienced the real Osho energy, not having been near the man.
There is is a strong counter-argument to that, of course…
Thanks for that, Shantam…Your ejaculations on sannyasnews play a valuable part in the invisible transmission of legoministic teachings…
(not a lot of people know that).
Yo…
Get down on the streetless street…
Out in the world where they turnin’ up the heat…
We the underground legominist elite…
Almost invisible, keepin’ it discreet…
We deep in the Maya and in da buddha ‘hood…
Samsara is Nirvana…
Mmmm…good….
A invisible school, like the Tale of Hans Christian Andersen: “The Emperor’s New Clothes”.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Emperor%27s_New_Clothes
Or as in the “The little Prince”, if the elephant isn’t visible, it does not mean it’s not an elephant.
You never know…
The elephant could be a hierophant….
I think the discussion has missed a little, Paritosh, in self-criticism when he was writing the book, used to say his “adventures” with drug running were escapist, and in particular, escaping Osho’s energy field. He lived during Poona One in the huts by the river and sometimes rarely went to the ashram. I can say this with a little authority as Paritosh and I spend innumerable Saturdays discussing, and with me helping him with, the text of “Life of Osho.”
It was not “surrender” to those who ran the organisation (in whom he also saw escapism), but his unwillingness to simply be there in the ashram, for example at discourse, and amidst Osho’s energy field.
I don’t think he felt that this was some kind of simple matter of “surrender”, even in Poona One. Any which way, not surrender to those who ran the place. Just that he went around missing the full blast of Osho’s energy as the mind had provided him with the excitement and money of drug running, which in later life he felt took him away from what he had come to Poona for in the first place.
He himself always used to say that surrender over simplified things on all points, it was just too simple a paradigm, and to use his word, “lowbrow”!!
A lot of the characters I’ve come across, most practised in telling others to surrender, sounded to me as if they were telling the other to submit to them.
Such a lot of hidden power trippers went on, go on; certainly hidden from the power trippers.
As a guess, sounds like Sam was a bit of a pothead, who probably needed to ease off on the chillums.
The whole “surrender” thing may have been a red herring if he needed to surrender to sobriety….
But whether you lose the plot on dope,
or on a power trip supporting felonists in the name of surrender,
or indulging fantasy ego-trips about becoming an egoless disciple…
Everyone has to journey into the shadow/underworld/fantasy world.
It’s all good…
Important thing is to make it back…
(like the prodigal son).
You’ve excelled yourself to day, Frank.
The rap and the pun.
Awesome.
lmao
Thanks.
And I`d like to give a special big-up for all you legominists out there….
Speaking solely for myself, the idea of surrender never played in Pune One, though it did in a small way when I was a commune member during the Ranch period. Pune One just seemed a wonderful playground, and certainly only card-carrying fully supported “workers” seemed to be brushed by anything like surrender edicts. But I noticed that when push came to shove, many workers would just slip out of the ashram and go to the beaches of Goa. My overriding impression of Poona One sannyasins is that there were 90% very street wise and would not buy into such a trip.
It would be good if some of these people that Lokesh mentions, like people heavily encouraged to have sterilisations, etc. would/could post here. I only met two women who had done this, and they both said ultimately it was their responsibility.
Grateful for anyone who can correct me, but I always thought that male sterilisations could in almost all cases be reversed ?
Clearly, no-one should have been put under any pressure in this matter, and anyone making such a decision must make it alone.
I have no stats, anyone know what the general population sterilisation figures are in the UK ? I know that in India there were always rumours that sterilisations were taking place in the general population involuntarily after abortions, and also at one time the gov. of India gave monetary rewards for those having sterilisations? Was that true?
Just exploring, the issue as some seem to be saying here, should not be dodged.
Poona One was duty for me.
Catch-up time.
Get all my homework done, that I had failed to do for years.
Nose to the grindstone.
Although I did lighten up towards the end , after a dutiful spell of dynamic every morning when I was working. lol
My stuff. My numbers.
Then back in the West. Nose to the grindstone.
Duty, but most of the individuals I knew were a
pretty austere, disproving bunch.
My stuff.
Got past all that, and now, I am this happy-go-lucky, jolly individual you all know and love.
good point you make P., though as i mentioned to Lokesh in my above response, people have a memory span of about 15 minutes. don’t you remember those “good old days”? The general mentality at that time was to surrender and not challenge the structure that Osho himself set up and that whoever was in charge(different departments) was there for a reason, a reason only Osho knew, and therefore better not question or challenge anything they may ask of you. same was the mindset at the Ranch. That’s why the shit got out of hand and hit the fan. Very few challenged the way things were, and the people issuing the edicts. Those that did for the most part, were told to leave, and staying for the long term, either at the shram or the ranch was top priority. I knew of one fellow, maybe you know him, goes by the name of Hendrikus today, he owns a landscaping co. in Seattle, a skinny dutchman, a bit wound up, but a nice guy in general. He basically told the top dogs to fuck off and that he was there for the old man not for them. They left him alone, never bothered him again. Both at the shram and ranch i saw many come and go, many just couldn’t deal with the up tightness and seriousness of either place. Regarding the “forced” sterilizations, you can include abortions in that broad category. Pregnancy was verbotten. Most decided to turn a blind eye to all sorts of stupid behavior, perhaps “illegal” behavior, all in the name of surrendering to the master and people running the temporal structures created around him. those 90% who might have been street wise, most left their street mentality when they walked into the shram/ranch.
Timothy Leary didn’t always get it right either as in ‘Killing a policeman is a sacred act’. But he was right on the money when he said, ‘think for yourself and question all authorities.’
Of course, the idea of thinking in any way was completly a no-no around Osho. Thus many people’s critical faculties were short-circuited. Let’s hope that some of us learned our lessons well from those bygone times and pass on to the young people who cross our path that which we have learned.
Baba says, ‘Very few challenged the way things were.’ I can’t agree with that entirely. Many, myself included, challenged the way things were by giving it a complete miss. Of course you can say, yeah, but what good did that do? Well, for a start, wars would be eradicated from the face of this planet if there was a unanimous decision not to take part in them. Very unlikely that will happen, I know. But even though Osho had very little good to say about Gandhi, Gandhi knew the power of passive resistance and as history shows, it worked in his case.
Never mind questioning authority, challenging authority is the way to get things changed if needed.
When I say, “very few challenged” things, I mean maybe in the dozens, and by people already living at the ranch, not outsiders visiting.
I lived there for 14 months and for 99% living there, they kept their mouths shut, and didn’t want to end up like Shiva, who Sheela publicly condemned and told all Osho centres to shun him and his friends and supporters. I was there for that meeting. I said before and repeat again, almost everyone who wound up living at the ranch for any great length of time did just about anything and followed all rules so they could stay there “forever”.
P- there were studies done after the ranch debacle, as to why so many educated individuals joined the Rajneesh group, supposedly over 60% had advanced degrees from a university(masters or higher). The university of oregon Sociology dept. in 1986 is one that comes to mind.
60% had advanced degrees! If you believe that you will believe anything. I have hundreds of sannyasin friends, from many walks of life, and maybe 3% have masters degrees (if you are lucky). That bit of propaganda was exposed for what it was years ago. Completely inaccurate.
Where do you get that 3% from? In your guesstimate maybe. At least I can cite some controlled studies done, you just brain-farted a number. 3 is your lucky number, I suppose.
Going by Baba’s mundane comments we can rest assured thet Baba was not amongst the 3%. It was not difficult to figure out.
They may be mundane, but at least they’re honest. You must be a good magician, pulling numbers out like pulling aces out of your arse.
“You must be a good magician, pulling numbers out like pulling aces out of your arse.” Oh dear, cliched metaphors as well. Looks like Baba is on a downward spiral. Happy crash landing and get well soon. Suggested reading, Alice in Blunderland.
The Ranch was a different trip.
But the Poona One ashram….Looks like you were in a different place to me, Baba. Loads of streetwise sannyasins remained streetwise, that’s why so many left the work programmes and hightailed it down to Goa when it came too much in whatever way.
There was also another group, many very enterprising, who found all sorts of self-employment, and came and went totally according to their own lights, and simply missed the ashram work trips altogether. It was only through the so-called ashramites that any policies around behaviour could be enforced. But even there, many left and gave up being workers.
Were you really around in Poona One, Baba? I agree at the end, from around mid ’79 to ’81 things became a little more conventional cos those who were being reached by that time were not street people anyway. But mostly they never became workers, and just enjoyed the cheap groups, and the playground that the ashram provided.
“…just enjoyed the cheap groups, and the playground that the ashram provided.”
That is simply the best part. Respect.
That you believe these were the ‘best parts’ as you put it, says little about anything except yourself.
probably true;exactly like the 90% of what you write,dear Lokesh.Did you notice how much repetitive you are,on enforcing the concept”Lokesh is an independent seeker and doesn’t need any stupid dependence from any master,especially osho,and by the way he is also a good swimmer and enjoy an happy life in Ibiza even at an old age”?
P – I took sannyas in ’79 at the ‘shram at the wee old age of 20. Stayed for about 4 months (dry season). Went back the next year (December 1980, till Feb.1981). That’s when the shift to America started, I had heard rumours prior, that a big move was in the works. The game changed to suit American tastes and culture, but I thought that was selling out ’cause of what I understood from what Osho spoke about, being genuine and not acting like sheep. Why change to suit a bunch of idiots and their psychotic habits? But the info I read was about a few years after the fall of the ranch and about the ranch residents, not the general world-wide sannyas population.
The characters at the ranch comprised mostly of Americans, with our habits and psychosis. Many who left did so because they could not adjust to the hard work and long hours, along with keeping one’s mouth shut and not making any waves, especially with Sheela.
I had a particularly nasty run-in with her, she, in my opinion was on a psychotic trip and if she had a gripe with you, out you went. The only way you could get away with disagreeing with her was if you were very wealthy and a big contributor to Osho and the ranch. She even sought out big donors and tolerated their “uniqueness”.
Hasyo comes to mind, she got away with her criticisms of Sheela just because she had big money and connections to other big donors.
All of that being said, I had a blast at the ranch for the most part, kept my mouth shut with any criticisms I may have had, and just worked and played every day.
I think when one is on the wheelchair, foot-in-the mouth disease becomes almost a blessing in disguise, as what Yogis do after arduous work, sitting giant on the wheelchair can easily bring his foot to the mouth.
Frank has earned it.
About Stephan Hawking, I can´t say.
All you people in your fifties and sixties –
So harsh about people young enough to be your kids, your grandchildren virtually.
Even Osho was younger then than most of you are now!!!
Yes, baby boomers, born between 1945 and 1960, have a very high opinion of themselves, unjustified IMHO.
Here is a journalist on my generation:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2055497/JEREMY-PAXMAN-Baby-Boomers-selfish-generation-history.html
I was born in ’50.
It’s a disgrace, they all just sat around taking drugs, having sex, having a laugh and hallucinating all over my carpet…
I don’t know what’s happened to the world…
My dad fought the Germans, ran an empire, worked 25 hours at the mill every day, came home and got up to go to work before he had gone to bed, and used beat us to sleep with his belt every night…
But we were happy!
ecxellent article.The generation who’d brings the biggest amount of mess and distruction and pain to the world in the whole history,and give the bill to pay to their childrens.I’m thinking on how my generation and the ones who follow will ever find a way to make them pay……….haven’t found a decent solution yet.
Actually we haven’t find a way to kick them out of the chair even.
The comments that follow Paxman’s article bring some perspective to it.
There’s a line in a Grateful Dead song, ‘When life looks like easy street there is danger at your door’. Things are cyclic, good follows bad and bad follows good. Meanwhile, if you want to blame someone, blame the modern politicians for letting the potential for a better planet slip away with their short-sighted and minority-serving policies. Not that blaming anyone will get you anywhere, better to read a few Osho books where you’ll find some pointers to transcending the whole shebang.
We spend our lives dealing with the consequences of our own past actions, inactions, the past actions and inactions of others. Not something that’s only happened because of baby boomers.
Well I am sympathetic to the general thrust of the article, though I do not necessarily agree with every word. I agree with Paxman’s description that most of us are selfish, self-absorbed and solipsistic. As to modern politicians, well the baby boomers did vote for them.
Least bad of available options.
Paxman’s article might appear ‘reasonable’, esp to those with an adolescentish ‘I hate the older generation’-type axe to grind, among whom you, young sannyasin, have often appeared to stand. But really, it’s pointless looking for any particular “generation” to blame for the world’s ills, the sources of it all go back a very long way, right to the roots of our individual and collective malaise. One might even cite western intellectual materialism itself, in which we’ve all been immersed since birth, as a fundamental cause.
While I’d never undervalue the brave contribution of the people who endured world war 2 – on both sides – the truth is that on the whole they, due to what had gone before, were deficient in and apparently blind to many aspects of humanity, ie were psycho-sexually repressed (not to mention a certain, er, shall we say, deficiency in love) – which it was the fate – karma, if you wish – of the post-war people (eg sannyasins!) to bring to the surface and attempt to resolve. Not such an easy task and no wonder we’re currently in such an unholy mess!
Moreover, young sannyasin, what were and are the real, underlying, bottom-line causes of war? If you really look deep into this, you might find something far more real than the allegedly cataclysmic errors of the ‘baby boomers’ to be angry about.
Of course the real origin of every problem in the world is,at the end,a lack of awarness and understanding.
But i agree with alok john:how many people where singing peace and love during the 60/70′s? And how many of them later vote for Reagan and the Bush family? More than one,apparently.
Anyway like a friend of mine say:” to take the right decisions in life you need experience.Problem is,to make experience you need to take the wrong decisions”.
But when i think how many talented people of my generation spend the best years of their life on studing at university,just to find out they will never manage to buy an house,when before even the last idiot manage to find a job and make a decent life,well……
Young sannyasin said : “when before even the last idiot manage to find a job and make a decent life,well……”
I am in England and I think you would have to go back to the 60s for this to be true, largely because many women were not in the labour market. Since the early 70s there has been moderate to high unemployment. Many clever vulnerable people, including me, never had careers. Most old sannyasins I know do not own property, and have had variegated careers to say the least.
Yes, my guard stood hard when abstract threats
Too noble to neglect
Deceived me into thinking
I had something to protect.
Good and bad, I defined these terms
Quite clear, no doubt, somehow.
Ah, but I was so much older then,
I’m younger than that now.
Bob Dylan, of course…Positively 4th Street?
The video cannot be shown at the moment. Please try again later.
A Dylan Song though.