Criticism about Osho (5 posts)

Topic tags: James Swartz, osho
  • Profile picture of Shanmugam Shanmugam said 2 years, 5 months ago:

    I came across some articles of the guy James Swartz who is claiming to be enlightened and teaching Vedanta. I found his comments about Osho very ridiculous. Does anybody know this guy?

    Here is what he says about Osho which shows that he has misunderstood Osho completely:

    ”The Neo-Advaita movement owes a considerable debt of gratitude to the teachings of Bhagawan Rajneesh who rechristened himself as Osho when his bad karma became unbearable. Rajneesh perverted the tantric concept that the essence of every experience is Awareness. Tantra is a very broad concept that applies to every conceivable kind of experience and insists that its practitioners enjoy the same qualifications as those practicing Vedanta sAdhana. But Rajneesh focused his attention on the sexual aspect, not that much focusing was required, and opened wide the gates of tantra to tens of thousands of immature disaffected Western hedonists with his brilliant concept ‘Zorba the Buddha.’ Zorba the Greek was the literary creation of a Greek writer Nikos Kazantzaksis. Zorba was not a bad guy but was he emotional! He was the original party animal: lusty and enthusiastic in his pursuit of pleasure. As is well known the Buddha was a holy ascetic. By wedding the two ideas he provided a clever ‘spiritual’ justification for the unrestrained pursuit of pleasure in the name of spiritual growth. Wags not unfairly called his sAdhana the ‘fuck your way to God’ path. I was once told in all seriousness by a devotee that Osho ‘’gave us permission to do what society forbids us to do.” When he died thousands of his disciples gravitated to a relatively unknown guru”

    I tried to address these comments in my blog ’https://nellaishanmugam.wordpress.com/2017/02/25/james-swartz-a-review-and-critique-by-a-seeker/’.. I think people who have read and understood Osho should do something to remove a lot of misconceptions about Osho. It is so sad that the media has influenced the public opinion a lot and a lot of people think he is a fallen guru.

    I recently had a discussion with a person on a forum who said about Hitler tape. (The tape that had some barely audible comments by Osho which Sheela used as approval from Osho for a murder attempt)… I don’t believe Osho would have given the approval. After having read hundreds of books by Osho and being amazed at his extraordinary wisdom, I don’t believe that a person with such a compassion, awareness and bliss would actually approve a murder. What are your thoughts?

    I also think that the Wikipedia article about Osho shows him in a bad light and needs a lot of editing.

  • Profile picture of samvado gunnar kossatz samvado gunnar kossatz said 2 weeks, 5 days ago:

    Second guessing Osho is like guessing where bitcoin goes next. If you feel like you need to defend Osho in whatever issues your position becomes indefensible. The mind is the thing that judges what it can operate with – and that is not the realm Osho works from. So give it up.
    and Vedanta, well afaics its a load of bullshit. I have visited many vedanta based “gurus” and they all turned out to be fakes. but then again, what do I know … ?
    and finaly: why the fuck would anyone care how wikipedia paints osho? he certainly would not, so why do you?

  • Profile picture of swamishanti swamishanti said 2 weeks, 2 days ago:

    I think Shanmugam is right, the wiki on Osho is unfair . It doesn’t put across the fact that Osho exposed the crimes, and invited the authorities in the investigate, that he was informed of by people who had knowledge of some of the acts but had stayed behind and didn’t leave with Sheela when she fled to Germany.

    It doesn’t mention that it was Osho who first mentioned that he had been informed that Sheela had taken some tapes with her when she went to Germany in the first press conference he gave after she left.
    And no, it is not true (as some have tried to suggest) that illegally recorded conversations cannot be used in a court of law. They can in some US states, and in Oregon there have been several cases where illegally recorded conversations have been played to the jury and used to secure a conviction, including in the eighties. In 1987 there was a case , in which illegally recorded conversations were used to secure a conviction . The defendant tried to argue that the conversations were recorded without her permission and could not be used as evidence. But the court allowed them to be used . David Frohnmayer, the attorney general of Oregon, was was involved in the case which was dubbed “Oregon vs Lizzy”. He had also been involved in the legal cases against Rajneeshpuram, Osho and Sheela.

    And there are several other cases.

    Instead it depicts Sheela as a kind of scapegoat.
    All to do with how it is phrased.
    Certain parts of Ava’s 1995 testimony in the trial of two British women who were in the group have been used , (she was offered immunity from prosecution from the US Goverment if she appeared as a government witness) , but it has been presented to appear as if Osho was saying it was ok to kill people who Sheela wanted to kill. That is not exactly what Ava said , she said that there was a tape that was difficult to hear, so Parambodhi went with Sheela and transcribed it. However, KDs version was that it ‘may be necessary to kill people to stay in Oregon’, and yet another witness in the same trial, Bhogini , said that “ Osho said that “ if Hitler was killed, six million people would still be alive today” .

    So the versions of what was said contradict each other.

    Ava Avalos was offerered a deal in 1985 by the FBI for total immunity from prosecution if she gave them information and acted as an undercover informant for them on the Ranch, which she did until Osho left. She was heavily involved in all,of the plans and crimes of the group.

    But Ava Avalos told the FBI in 1985 that when Sheela had come back from travelling somewhere and had lost a major court case again Helon Byron, a women who sued her , (who she also alledgedly wanted to kill ) she was extremely angry and started telling her group that she wanted to take things into her own hands, this is when she was encouraging trying to encourage them to kill people outside the Ranch , in order to stay in Oregon.

    But Ava Avalos told the FBI that when Sheela was having these discussions, she told them that “Bhagwan was not to know of any of their plans , and if Bhagwan were to find out about anything that happened, they would have to lie to Bhagwan.”

    So it is pretty clear that she was not wanting Osho to know about any of this.

    The other thing is that Sheela also had Laxmi on her hit list, because apparently , she knew that Osho had asked Laxmi to return to India to look for a new commune site. He was fed up with the situation in the US and wanted to return to India . He had already asked Laxmi to return to India in 1983.,

    According to what members of her group also told the FBI , Osho had also sent Sheela back to India in early 1985, to help the search for the new commune in the mountains , but he had also told Sheela that Laxmi was going to be the secretary for the new commune in India.

    This threatened Sheela’s position of power and therefore she wanted to kill Laxmi. Apparently she had a hit list of several people, and seems pretty psychopathic in 1985.

    Laxmi eventually found a site for the new commune in the Himalayas in 1985, in Kullu Manali, and that is where Osho flew to when he returned to India after he was deported. He was expecting to rebuild the commune there but the Indian goverment had been pressured by the US government and refused to renew Osho’s western household staff their visas.

    Parmartha once discussed the Hitler tape on sannyas news.

    He believed that Sheela could have created the tape using the help of her technicians at the Ranch . He got this idea from Maneesha in her 1988 book “Bhagwan: the Buddha for the Future.” It is easy to see that could be a real possibility for someone like Maneesha who lived close to Osho in his household for years and would not ever heard Osho say anything pro Hitler. Unless he was joking of course. Also Parmartha had Osho’s presence with him and knew what Osho was really about.

    Sheela had already censored some of Osho’s talks . Osho had begun speaking to small groups of sannyasins in his house in Oct 1984 and then the video was being broadcast the next day to the rest of the commune.
    There was a discourse that he gave in Dec 1984 where he had criticised her management and the core power group centred in Jesus Grove and said that ‘I will never leave you under a fascist regime’.

    However, Sheela’s group made an excuse that the audio and video equipment had failed during the talk , and the video of the talk was not broadcast the next day as usual to the rest of the commune. The video is believed to have been destroyed.

    Rumours began to spread through the commune that one of Osho’s talks had been censored, and a couple of weeks later, Sheela produced a doctored transcript of the discourse, which had clearly had certain sentences and passages removed and altered. “I will never leave you under a fascist regime” was changed to “I will never leave you in a state of chaos” .

    A month later in Jan 1985 he sent Sheela and others
    back to India to help search for the new commune site but she wanted to return and came back after only three days, making the excuse that there was violence in North India.

    Alledgedly , after the initial meeting which Sheela has called and told her group that they should look for people to murder in order for Rajneeshpuram to survive (summer 1985 ) in her room , it took Sheela three days before she brought the tape back to her group.
    What was she doing in the three days? Perhaps she was mixing parts of different tapes that she already had. Or perhaps she used an old tape she had.

    Other people have suggested that the Goverment could have told those witnesses to say that Osho said whatever he said as part of their deal from total immunity from prosecution.

    I personally believe that it is likely that there was a conversation between Osho and Sheela , but what they were discussing was nothing to do with assassinating anyone outside the commune. It was probably simply a conversation something along the lines of the possibility of a violent attack on the commune.

    And none of the people who mentioned the tape have said that Osho or Sheela were discussing Charles Turner.

    Sheela could have been manipulating Osho to get a response based on the threat of violent invasion. Lots of sannyasins were trained with weapons and defence and that was because there were constant death threats coming in.

    Everyone close to Sheela has said she had become a master of manipulation.

    Osho was joking about Hitler and unfortunately that was ( apparently ) taped and now people think he loved hitler. He had compared Sheela to a fascist dictator already in December 1984 and when she left again he compared her management to a facist regime.

    Apparently he had already compared someone else to Hitler to, that was Deeksha, the Ma who ran the kitchen in Poona One and had a lot of power. People were scared of her and complained to Osho but a Osho used to call her a zen master. Of course he didn’t mean it literally.

    He spoke to her about Hitler but she didn’t get the point. That she was a bit like a dictator.

    Whatever the case, he was not remotely concerned about whatever was on the tapes as he himself was the first person to expose that apparently she had taken some tapes with her when she left to the authorities, and told them and the whole world were Sheela was hiding.
    The FBI have stated on record that “no direct evidence liking Osho to the crimes exist” (after Sheela and several others were sent to prison.) All they had were a couple of witness statements by members of her group who had made immunity deals with the FBI , who had said that they believed that he knew about the acts. However, other members of her group told the FBI that they were not sure that he knew and others that they believed that did not knew.

    But none of them had instructions from Osho and Sheela was the only intermeditary.

    And the FBI stated that ‘none of the information given was worthy of an indictment against the Bhagwan” .

    As far as advaita teachers go, they are two a penny and a lot are confusing states with enlightenment. Especially lots of those who were with Poonja.

  • Profile picture of Lokesh Lokesh said 2 weeks, 1 day ago:

    Jesus,Shanti, what a lot of useless information, although not nearly as bad as the crap posted by Mug Man.
    What’s wrong with you guys? Don’t you have a TV? Suggested viewing MONEY HEIST. Now that is fun. Boom Boom, ciao!

  • Profile picture of swamishanti swamishanti said 2 weeks, 1 day ago:

    Who is Mug Man?

    English tv is pretty shit for quite a while now. There is perhaps one good comedy per week.