Comments on: A Personal Watershed, Sept 19th, 1985

By: Prem Goodnight

Prem Goodnight — Mon, 28 Nov 2011 18:30:27 +0000

http://o-meditation.com/2009/10/18/osho-and-the-16th-karmapa/

By: frank

frank — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 21:51:06 +0000

thanks for clarifying.
it does seem a remarkable synchronicity.
where was the sofa
and the crowd you mention?
in his room where he was giving a teaching,or did you just run into him in the lobby?
did some scallywag sannyasin stuck the picture there while he wasnt looking?

By: Prem Goodnight

Prem Goodnight — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 20:12:28 +0000

frank,
When I say “it was not important whether the story was true or not” I am referring to the story told by Govind Siddharth of his meeting with the Karmapa and what the Karmapa said about Osho. I am saying whether ‘this’ is factual or not was not important to me after seeing Karmapa sitting on the sofa with the photo of Osho propped up next to him. To me, clearly there was some affinity. Cheers!

By: frank

frank — Sun, 27 Nov 2011 14:48:01 +0000

purushottama.
you say:”you can make out of this whatever you want,but for me it was not important whether the story related was true or not,from what i witnessed in my experience there was an affintiy between karmapa and osho”
what are you saying here?
that the story is a poetic flight to express something that you intuited but didn`t actually see?

By: Oink!

Oink! — Sat, 26 Nov 2011 13:20:07 +0000

Well,I`ll guess we`ll never know the full truth about the meeting between the two of them-I wonder if Govind Siddarth is still around to talk about it.
Perhaps he`s enjoying his enlightenment somewhere.
I believe that it is likely that Osho was the reincarnation of a buddhist monk- he seems to have had a great love of Buddha and even said that he had loved Buddha more than any other man-
he spoke a lot on Zen and he also believed that Buddhism was a higher flowering than Hindusim-whether that is true is highly debateble of course.

By: alok john

alok john — Sat, 26 Nov 2011 10:47:59 +0000

That book by John Hogue was awful.

By: Teertha

Teertha — Sat, 26 Nov 2011 01:02:22 +0000

There was also the Nostradamus matter, put together by a non-sannyasin, ironically (John Hogue), ‘proving’ that Osho was the future lord of the world as predicted by Nostradamus. I found in looking into it that Hogue’s criteria he used for interpreting Nostradamus applied with equal measure to Aleister Crowley — that is, Crowley was also the ‘futurelord of the world’ according to those same criteria. Interpretation is so often very funny stuff.

By: Teertha

Teertha — Sat, 26 Nov 2011 00:58:03 +0000

Machiavelli suggested to leaders that they ‘never tell the truth about why they did something, unless it was *useful* to do so.’ I think there’s a slight Machiavellian quality in any good guru worth their salts.

By: Teertha

Teertha — Sat, 26 Nov 2011 00:42:00 +0000

I’m also sure Govind Siddarth was ‘telling the truth’. My point was, it was his *subjective truth* — the ‘truth’ giving meaning by his own mind, which inevitably involves projection, interpretation, distortion, etc.

In other words, he probably did sit with Karmapa, show him the locket, and Karmapa probably did say some things about Osho. But what he meant by those things, and whether or not he truly ‘knew’ Osho and in what way, was something Siddarth largely made up in his own mind. That is, he made inferences and drew conclusions that probably grossly exaggerated the meaning of what Karmapa was communicating.

Anyway, that’s my take, your mileage may (and doubtless does) vary.

Also, as a p.s., I find the idea of a ‘hall of incarnations’ somewhat repugnant, a kind of echo of Roman imperialism and worship of gods and their earthly personalities. Doesn’t fit well with Osho’s teachings about ‘dissolving into existence’.

By: Prem Goodnight

Prem Goodnight — Fri, 25 Nov 2011 22:47:03 +0000

Just to go on the record. I am the one who wrote the above mentioned essay “Osho and the 16th Karmapa” and as I have written I had read the report of Swami Govind Siddharth’s meeting with the Karmapa in Rumtek and also took it with a grain of salt. I am well aware the devotees want their master to be the highest, the best. But as I wrote, I met the Karmapa in the Oberoi hotel in Calcutta and he was sitting on the sofa and next to him propped up was a “Sannyas Magazine” with a picture of Osho beaming out into the crowd. You can make out of this whatever you want, but for me it was not important whether the story related was true or not, from what I witnessed in my experience there was an affinity between Karmapa and Osho. Love is Being. Purushottama.